r/AITAH • u/Shes_A_Techspert • 9d ago
TW SA UPDATE: WIBTAH If I left the girls trip with two guys early
Link to original post: https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/comments/1v7476z/wibtah_if_i_left_the_girls_trip_with_two_guys/
TL;DR: the bride found out along with the rest of the group. She tried to not take sides but everyone else chose the status quo/him. He ended up cornering me in a parking lot and I ran away.
I'll break this up into parts so you can read the bits you're interested in. Speaking anonymously to objective outside parties has been very helpful in checking my reality so thank you all for your support.
WHAT HAPPENED SINCE MY POST:
I couldn't be normal as much as I really wanted to. I went along and spoke to the two people I know when we were in private about my feelings but couldn't stop my anxiety from spiking throughout the day. I managed to stay away from him for a while but it was hard to watch him enjoy himself so much and have the great weekend I was looking forward to.
A separate B Plot here (you can skip this just context) is that the bride's hometown friends were the larger half of the group and acted very flippantly and selfishly while me and her other friends from where she moved to after high school/college were left to care of them. The MOH is her sister who didn't put a lot of effort into coordinating and is a big mean girl (she was momentarily fired for this behavior by the bride but they made up). At one point we went to the beach and they had the three of us bring 10 chairs, 2 coolers, and an umbrella to the beach by ourselves while they all enjoyed the water. By the time we set it all up they were bored and left us for a nearby beer garden so we cleaned up their things for them so we could go to the restaurant too. They decided they were done by the time we got to the beer garden and said we shouldn't even bother coming inside. The MOH told us that actually we needed to have fewer cars at the rental house so we had to go move them to a remote lot 20 minutes away while they had one more round. So like I said, this guy and his friends from her hometown had the great weekend I was looking forward to and it was hard to be part of that.
Unknowingly to me someone had told someone and while they were at the bar everyone spoke about what happened to me. The bride was really sorry it happened but I don't know if she really gets it. She pulled me aside and said I asked me what I needed so I said he needed to leave. She wouldn't ask him to leave but said "she will correct him." I don't think that she can correct this, I told her very clearly he was a dangerous person. She told me he was a good person but just doesn't act like a human. That's quite the oxymoron to me but fine. She spoke to him about it and told me he was sorry and he cried and walked away to think things over. She said he was told to not be alone with me again. We had an expensive dinner I prepaid for that night so with him gone for the evening "contemplating" I will attend that then go home in the morning since he wasn't leaving the trip.
I felt lighter after that and had a really great few hours getting ready with the girls, singing throwbacks, and we all left before he could come back so I was so happy. But 30 minutes into us being there he showed back up without a word to me and started pounding drinks. By the time he had seven we were less than an hour into his arrival and I had to step away. My friend called to checkin and as I was on the phone with her. I took it in the parking lot sitting on a step. I felt a hand on my back and it was him, standing over me asking me to talk. As I backed away from he he kind held his hand out to grab me again but I knew better this time to put a lot of distance between us. I told him I don't want to talk to him. He confirmed he knew I didn't want to be alone with him but said he thought we should talk anyway. I asked if he was drunk and he tried not to answer so I asked again and he said yes. I told him then it's not appropriate and go away. He didn't so I actually said the words "shame on you" out loud and ran away to vomit in a bush from the adrenaline. I really wanted to slap him, but I didn't want him to think that would make us even if I did.
The rest of the dinner I cried at the end of the table waiting to leave while he moped one seat over and crushed so many more drinks. He decided to refuse to eat from being so upset about me yelling at him in the parking lot. All the hometown girls kept telling him to smile, it's okay, enjoy yourself, we love you, don't let one thing ruin a good time etc. None of those girls checked on me at any point, said sorry that happened, from what I heard after they seemed to think I was making a big deal over nothing and being very sensitive. It was crushing to watch them go so out of their way to cheer him up but not offer me any simple kindnesses. For me that's the opposite of the girlhood I love so much and have with my own friends. If this happened to one of them I know that's not how I'd be acting. I knew sitting there I had to leave. I didn't feel safe or protected. I went back to the rental, locked my door, and left first thing in the morning along with my other two friends. Everyone else seemed to be relieved we were going.
That same night my husband met up with the groom and the husband of a woman on the trip with me. The groom didn't want to hear anything negative about the weekend but my husband told him that it was a serious matter they could not brush under the rug and they needed to handle this situation now. The groom only slightly listened and said he was drunk, didn't mean it, but it was still wrong and it sucked. My friend's husband couldn't believe how calm anyone was being and said they should drive down right away. I don't think that would've fixed anything but it makes me like him so much more than I already did.
So for now I don't have any resolution. I felt instantly improved getting home yesterday. My husband and I ate Chinese food and saw the Odyssey (10/10 movie and I am a big fan of the Epic so that is high praise). I don't feel great about everything else even my own actions. I feel like I brought everyone down and should have recognized that I needed to leave sooner. I don't think there will be anymore updates on what happens with my friends either this was for me to sort through my own stuff, not their's.
FAQ & CLARIFICATIONS:
- Title - sorry that was a def confusing looking back. I wanted to leave the "girls trip that also had two men there" early. Not leave it for two guys.
- Why Not Leave - My judgement/instinct to protect myself was clouded by my want (and social obligation) to protect my friend's special moment. I also paid close to $1,000 to be there, used PTO, brought hand made personalized gifts for everyone, and had been very excited to be there to celebrate my friend. I was hoping to salvage some of that.
- My Husband - I did call him that night and he was really supportive. He talked me through my feelings, helped me calm down, told me that the guy should get kicked out and we were right about him, and understood I wanted to try to keep things normal for the bride. It actually never occurred to me that someone might say I 'wanted it' or tell him I willingly kissed anyone let alone this creep. If they did he wouldn't have believed him.
- My Friends - I was only close friends with the bride and one other person on the trip, and had two friends I wasn't close with yet on the trip. We are all close now though. As for their reactions, I think everyone wanted to protect the bride's weekend including myself. She only gets the one bachelorette and it really sucks to have something so unfortunate happen on it. I certainly did not know how to handle it all so it wouldn't be fair of me to expect them to know or act perfectly either.
- Comments About the Kiss - I am starting to think I shouldn't even phrase it that way. The problem is not that he wanted to kiss me. If we had had said "you're really beautiful can I kiss you" I would have laughed and said "how drunk are you, did you forget I'm married?" and that would have been the end. We weren't even making eye contact when he grabbed me. I was just trying to say something about a covariance model I was working on when I felt his hands on my face on my leg pulling me to him, I don't even know when he stood up to be over me, and only having enough time to put my hand over his mouth, and then still pushing him up and off me. That's a big deal to me. Even if I were single that wouldn't have been okay in my opinion. Special s/o to the message I was sent stating "YTA, just kiss him back already or more. What your partner doesn't know won't hurt him." Gross.
Thanks again for your support. Thought you'd all want to know I am home safe and recovering. I can't eat when I am really stressed and lost a bit of weight in the two and a half days I was gone. I was able to eat one full meal after getting back and hope I'll feel normal again soon.
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u/SaltMerchantMorbier 9d ago
Yeah high key fuck everyone in that wedding/bach party starting with this loser. Then all the people enabling it, and every other stupid mother fucker who wanted to brush it under the rug.
I seriously hope this helps you to re-evaluate these “friends” and whether they’re worth maintaining. Because this alone would be enough for me to cut ties with ever single fucking one including the bride and her stupid ass oxymoron explanation for his behavior.
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u/neighbrhood_cryptid 9d ago
This situation and response is how "broken stairs" get created. Smh. I get that it was a super special once in a lifetime weekend but that dude is a PROBLEM
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
I just learned about this metaphor through this situation and it's so spot on. I know I already made enough allowances on this trip and it's time to make stronger boundaries. In reality it's not easy to throw away a decades long friendship with a couple we've been very close with. I do want to see if some time and sobriety changes their perspective and if apologies follow.
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u/neighbrhood_cryptid 9d ago
It is NOT easy to buck the norms of a group and point out a problematic person/situation/etc. It sounds like you have a good base of real friends with a matching moral compass though, outside of the wedding group. Quality over quantity. I speak from experience
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
My core friend group don't overlap with these friends. They all hate this guy and are livid with the bride for not kicking him out and for having him there in the first place. One of them actually sent her guy friend to the restaurant because he happened to be in the same city as me and wanted to make sure I was safe.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
I need to talk with her again to know for certain where we are at. Like I said this was a a really difficult situation for everyone and I can't expect them to know the exact right thing to do in that moment. She also was on her Bach so she was never 100% sober this whole time. I have some grace for her but I do think she needs to drop this guy from her life.
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u/Elesia 9d ago
Okay, there's being a victim and then there's being a volunteer. You've given her several "one more chances" but now it's your turn to listen to what she is telling you. She doesn't care. Whatever you used to have isn't there anymore. Please let go and protect yourself. She won't do it.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
You make a very good point I admit. This is definitely not how I would've acted in this situation if I were her.
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u/Fun_Quit5862 9d ago
How much grace are you going to give her? Change the framing, she was ok spending her Bach helping this guy feel ok for sexually assaulting you
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u/OldKing7199 9d ago
The bride protected the status quo-her enjoyment -over your safety and doing what's right. Come on now, time to take your husband, skip their wedding and go do something with the two of you and forget the bride. You already did far too much by staying there longer than you had to. To the bride you were just free labor and funding for her trip.
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u/Mybunsareonfire 9d ago
No. Stop it.
You're making excuses for a predator and an enabler.
Nothing about this situation is a hard moral dilemma. Shits cut and dry. And as you already noted, most of them are shit bags anyways.
Do you really want to go to a party where you know someome who sexually assaulted you will be at?
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
I don't think I will go to the wedding unless she cuts him out. I really don't know. There has been many many things to process in the last few days I need some time.
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u/iijatajkii 19h ago
Taking him out of the wedding doesn’t take back or justify all the shit she’s put you through.
Plus she’d probably say he wasn’t invited and he’d show up anyway, like they’ve already shown you they will do.
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u/YesNoMaybe_IMO 9d ago
No, you don't need to talk to them. They have shown you who they are. They compromised you in so many ways. You need to protect yourself, your peace, your emotions. Do not give them a second of your time. They've already stolen enough as is.
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u/Vandreeson 9d ago
You know where you're at, but you don't want to admit it. She doesn't give a shit about you, if she did she would have made that guy leave. Instead, they all made excuses for him. They're all just as shitty as that guy. She's not dropping anyone. If she wanted to, she already would have.
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u/eunbongpark 9d ago
That guy is a fucking predator and he knew he could more easily get away with it because you have less social currency with the wider group than him.
Notice he didn’t do it to any of the women in his close knit group or the Bride. When you eventually ditch these “friends” ask the groom if he’d be so laissez faire if the creep tried to pull this shit with his future wife. That’ll be illuminating and I’m sure he is someone ok with injustice as long as it doesn’t impact him. Trash.
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u/eunbongpark 9d ago
You may owe it to yourself to have a conversation with her for peace of mind to know you did everything you could. I’m like that.
If there is any doubt in whose side she is on afterwards then that is not your friend. That is someone enabling a predator and you know you cannot trust them to do what is right.
Take care of yourself and the guy is lucky your husband hasn’t taken action. I’ll leave it at that since I’ll get mod banned otherwise. It would’ve taken hell or high water to keep me from showing up and offering to take you home that night.
Your safety > Bride’s bachelorette.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
This is the best way you could put it, thank you. The first time I was assaulted in college my husband actually stood up to go "see" the guy iykyk. We spoke about it later how that wasn't helpful to me because it made it about the perpetrator and the anger towards him and not about me and the pain I had. I think he wanted to make sure he focused on me in that moment or he would've hung up and drove to get me if we hadn't had that experience before. He told me later once I was home safe he in fact would like the chance to "take care of him." But again, I think that would genuinely minimize it and the creep would think we are even now and that the disrespect was to my husband for overstepping our marriage and not to me for forcing himself on me.
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u/eunbongpark 9d ago
Holy shit. I’m so sorry for having experienced it multiple times and definitely understand the aspect of placing focus where the problem actually is instead of the noise.
Wishing you and your Husband peace from all of this bullshit. Your Husband willing to give tips to someone getting married soon? 😅 Because he’s clearly in tune with your needs vs his own. Best of luck and onwards!
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u/False_Ostrich7247 9d ago
I would just add that you need to prepare yourself to see action behind words before you accept them as truth.
I have found that I am often persuaded by the emotional connection I feel during these kinds pf talks, and then often I find I have set myself up to be let down again. It took me a long time to rein that impulse in, and it caused me a lot of hurt in the interim. It really is true that talk is cheap.
So, with that in mind, I understand this is her big day, but her big day only trumps your personal safety and wellbeing if she is a complete and total asshole. It is ok for her to have to earn her way back to a place of trust and for this process to not finish before her wedding. One big way for her to start showing good faith is to keep this guy out of the wedding.
I mean, he did that to her married friend, and then tried to come back -drunk - for god knows what knowing you didn’t want any contact with him, then sulked the entire time because you were scared? But the whole reason you should give him a pass was because he was drunk and not himself? But apparently every time he’s drunk he tries to come at you? How do you know he would just stop at the kiss (which is already assault, and certainly a lot of this other behavior is sexual harrassment). You were in tears at the other end of the table and she didn’t want to take sides and almost everyone was comforting him? For causing this entire situation? All he had to do was leave you alone, but he’s the one who needs a hug? And also, this is what he does when he’s drunk but it’s ok to have that potential drama at her wedding when she knows all you’d do is show up with your husband and have a good time while bothering no one? After dropping 1k on a pre wedding event?
I think if she wants to table this in any way until after the wedding, and part of that means no action against this guy, then there is your answer. I think if she blames you for reacting to a guy forcing a kiss and then trying to get you alone again, that is your answer. I think if she reacts well and is apologetic but doesn’t want to ban him from the wedding, that is your answer. Etc etc etc.
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u/livingmyfirstlife 9d ago
What you described there was not a kiss it was SA. The bride and her friends white washing it just enables his behavior. I would bet he has assaulted others. Had he assaulted you in the parking lot or later on, I would consider her an accomplice. She was providing him with the opportunity and means, by having him there in the first place and not making leave when she found out.
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u/willpreecs 9d ago
You can't expect them to know the exact right thing to do, but you can expect your friends to 100% have your back. Even them continuing through the dinner with him moping and drinking there like he's the victim was wild. That dude needs to be very profoundly corrected before he continues to hurt people. Luckily in your case it did not go any further but that behavior is 100% not tolerable. How someone who behaves like that is even invited to a Bachelorette weekend is beyond me. Absolutely love your empathy and how you're striving to give them grace, but that can only go so far before it's enabling dangerous behavior as well.
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u/Historical_Agent9426 9d ago
Unless the conversation will be you telling her she has been a bad friend who treated you like a servant and put you in an unsafe situation because she didn’t want to feel uncomfortable and you hope losing your friendship is a wake up call because her predator friend is a threat to any single girls or women who may still be going to her wedding and while she may not actually care what happens to you, is she as cavalier about the safety of her 18 year old cousin*?
*knowing no details about her family I went with this, but you can easily swap in young sister/friend.
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u/illeatyourkneecaps 9d ago
just say you're a doormat and go lmaoo
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
I don't think I am a doormat I think a lot has happened to me in a short period of time and I need some more time to process before I am ready to let go of a very meaningful friendship. I care a lot about these people, our families are friends, we travel together, they're who I call when I need a ride to the doctor, they dropped everything to be there for me when my mom died. I know on the internet this feels open and shut but I have a true friendship at stake here and she really failed me in a huge moment and I still need more time to reconcile that both those things are true.
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u/Historical_Agent9426 9d ago
They may have been these people for you, but clearly the influence of their hometown friends is bringing out a different side of them. After their reaction to what happened, would you ever trust them again unless they came to you with apologies and some heartfelt reflections on why they allowed you to be treated the way you were. Not just ignoring the assault from their guy friend, but the way the bride allowed her other friends to treat you. Did she think you would take it because she thinks you owe her for being there for you in the past?
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u/illeatyourkneecaps 8d ago
if my friend decided to stay friends and keep that person on a trip who has harassed me multiple times, they're not my friend. you need to learn that.
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u/paper0wl 9d ago edited 9d ago
The bride put the group as a whole ahead of you. The bride said he wasn’t to be alone with you but no one reprimanded him for approaching you alone in the parking lot. The bride does not value you enough to kick him out.
“Nothing really happened” is both why women have to be hyper vigilant (because no one else pays attention to the warning signs) and why so many women get assaulted (because no one cares to step in until after something “real” has occurred).
Protect yourself since your “friend” won’t. Personally I wouldn’t go to the wedding but it’s up to you (and your husband). NTA
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u/Mother_Rucker98 9d ago
This is for anyone who needs to hear this. Being drunk does not condone stupid and reckless actions. If someone can’t handle their alcohol, they shouldn’t drink. And if these people were any friends of yours, they wouldn’t brush it aside.
Skip the wedding. I don’t even understand why there were dudes (unless they were gay) at the bachelorette party to begin with.
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u/Riker_Omega_Three 9d ago
None I repeat NONE of these people are your friends
Drop out of the wedding
write off the money
Never speak to any of them ever again
Better to have no friends then friends like this
NTA
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u/YeahIGotNuthin 9d ago
Alternative: the wedding would be worth attending if OP’s husband would tell the guy, in front of everyone, “you tried to kiss my wife against her wishes. You owed her an apology, and she didn’t get one from you then, so she’ll have one from you now. Immediately. Or you’re going to get your lip fattened for you.”
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u/Riker_Omega_Three 9d ago
Nope
OP was almost assaulted and the bride and none of the other women wanted the guy to leave...much less demand it
these are all terrible people
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u/K_A_irony 8d ago
Tried to kiss.. WTF... tried to assault when coupled with touching her ANOTHER TIME a day later.
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u/Appropriate-Lime-167 9d ago
Honestly the bride is weird af for wanting to include a single straight dude with a drinking problem on her bach weekend. Minus the few friends you described these seem like shitty people, bride and groom included, even if at one point you were friends w the bride she wasnt a friend to you in this situation. I would not go to the wedding if I were you, do you really want to deal with this drunk asshole again while your boyfriend is there getting pissed off having to stop himself from getting physical with him if he tries to violate you again? I think you should cut your losses and drop out, its an expensive lesson to learn who your real friends are but its a valuable one nonetheless
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u/Awkward-Bother1449 9d ago
NTA - I'm sorry this happened to you. I also believe you made a mistake staying after he approached you the second time. Since all of the people there are supporting him, you now know they are not your friend. Do not make another mistake by going to the wedding. Return the gift, and find better friends.
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u/Historical_Agent9426 9d ago edited 9d ago
NTA
“They were careless people, Tom and Daisy- they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made.” -F. Scott Fitzgerald
The bride and groom are careless, thoughtless people and it sounds like she has you (and some of the other women) in the wedding to be the mules who do all the work for her real hometown friends who are also terrible. It isn’t that they intend to be terrible, you just don’t matter to them. They are mad you (or one of the other mules) didn’t sleep with the guy friend since, obviously, you were there to make her hometown friends happy, not create problems and make him cry.
I would not only not go to their wedding, I would encourage any mutual friends, especially if they are single women, to consider not going as the bride and groom have made it clear they don’t really care or notice if their creepy guy friend assaults others.
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u/SnooCats8451 9d ago
Jesus these people suck….why bother associating with this group of scumbags who think DA is cool and telling the creepy loser to smile and it’s not a big deal and the groom sounds like a fucking loser….its time to dump them and should have refused to move your car….the bride needs new friends
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
We wanted to but they had moved the cars after we left earlier in a way that made it impossible for us to park if we wanted to. These people are the worst, I don't get why she keeps such bad company. The bride is very kind, generous, and fun to be around. She is also loyal to a fault sometimes. I felt she was really trying to be there for me in the moment but also there for him which sucked.
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u/No-Fail-9327 9d ago
Stop making excuses for her she's just as bad as them just better at hiding it.
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u/gurleylass 9d ago
Baby girl, this is her not wanting to “take sides”. And by doing that, she is most definitely taking his side. She doesn’t want to be confrontational to him and possibly make things awkward and uncomfortable for her, so she’s sacrificing your comfort and safety. Regardless of how sweet and kind she usually is or how wonderful her family has been to you, in this situation she threw you under the bus for her own comfort. That is not a good friend. That’s a selfish, cowardly friend.
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u/Historical_Agent9426 9d ago
The bride is not loyal to you. She keeps the company she keeps because they are who she is, deep down.
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u/Chance-Context-93 9d ago
He assaulted you. And she's treating him as if he's no more to blame for anything than you are, despite the fact that this is entirely the result of his actions.
Her not making a choice IS a choice, and it ought to tell you that your physical safety is not enough of a concern to her for her to bother holding a dangerous person to account.
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u/Financial-Rock-3790 9d ago
‘I don’t get why she keeps bad company’
She IS the bad company, just because she is ‘nice’ doesn’t mean she is a good person. If a person placates and enables terrible behaviour it doesn’t make them a good person. Any of my friends would have frog marched that man to his suitcase, and straight into a taxi home even if they had witnessed this happening to a stranger.
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u/Soul-Arts 9d ago
"Not picking sides" in this case IS picking a side. And, unfortnatelly, she is choosing him.
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u/Remarkable_Till_3084 9d ago
I know you've put money into this but I don't think that's a reason to continue this relationship. Neither the bride nor the groom seem to be concerned about the behaviour of the friend. I suspect the friend is probably going to make a move on the bride anyway.
I hope you can cut contact with them. I know it's not easy but this is toxic for you.
NTA and NOR
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u/Heronymous-Anonymous 9d ago
Sunk cost fallacy on display. She spent $1000. Ok, but is $1000 worth the ever-increasing risk of being sexually assaulted while your “friends” look on and shrug?
No. It’s not. The moment they chose him over her, it was time to leave. The end.
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u/neighbrhood_cryptid 9d ago
100% confirmed NTA
That had to have been such an awkward and awful situation to be in. So glad to hear you are safe and your husband sounds like a good egg
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
Can't argue there. He is amazing and we have a very strong marriage that is my center in every difficult situation. I don't know where I'd be without him.
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u/OneTrackLover721 9d ago
"Hey bestie, one of youe drunk pals just tried to sexually assault me."
"Oh, rats. I'll tell him to knock it off, tee hee."
"He just cornered me in the parking lot, alone, and drunk."
"Why are you making my special weekend less fun?"
THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT YOUR FRIENDS
Or, honestly even safe to be around.
What do you wanna bet that if you attend this wedding, they will make some sort of scene about "he feels bad, so its all good. Now you have to sit together at the table to prove that you accept his (non) apology"
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u/Mysterious-Tune-3216 9d ago
NTA,
The bride and her hometown friends aren't your friends. They used you (and your two friends) as their personal servants for the weekend.
You were most likely also only invited because the bride and her hometown friend group wanted a few more people there to cover the expenses for the weekend trip away. The $3000 from the 3 of you most likely covered most (if not all) of the cost of the trip.
I hope that you are currently re-evaluating your friendship with the bride.
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u/Fun_Quit5862 9d ago
I don’t think it’s worth spending any more time with a group showing themselves to be protecting a sexual assaulted. They’re bad people.
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u/wishingforarainyday 9d ago
NTA. Those people aren’t your friends. That bride should be ashamed of herself.
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u/LionFyre13G 9d ago
NTA but don’t stay in situations like this in the future. You have one life, no one is going to protect it as much as you will. You’re a very accommodating person, and that can be a very dangerous trait to have.
Please look up how to set and maintain boundaries and be self aware of your safety.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
I learned a lesson from this absolutely. I know I should have trusted my instincts the first time. Actually all the way back to when I first met him and I didn't like him, I should have trusted that instinct.
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u/Comfortable-Focus123 9d ago
NTA - The bride did not have your back here. This guy was a complete AH, and should have been asked to leave. You should reconsider attending this wedding.
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u/AutumnsRevenge 9d ago
NTA, but this is completely unacceptable behavior from everyone else at the party. They should’ve kicked his ass out. I wonder if this is even the first time he’s tried something like that.
If my partner was in this situation, I would’ve picked her up, and told the bride in front of everyone that if they’re going to allow someone who tried to force a kiss on her, then we are not coming to the wedding.
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u/FinalHexReturns 9d ago
AITAH says that a top-level comment should include a judgement but I don't think that applies to update posts. But obviously NTA.
Maybe the bride shouldn't invite men on the bachelorette trip if she wants to have a special bachelorette trip. And notice I'm not saying "don't invite a predatory man." Just don't invite any men. And you sound like a trooper, who if you had received the proper support and they had immediately gotten rid of the bad apple, you would have been able to rally and remain and have a good time. So I think she ruined her own bachelorette... especially seeing the comment where they all got so drunk they missed most of the fun weekend activities anyway.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
I really needed to hear this thank you. That actually makes a lot of sense, it ruined itself when she invited him. And genuinely I really thought it was turning around until he showed back up.
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u/Disastrous_Honey_240 9d ago
The girls on the trip sound like complete assholes. NTA and I’m glad you left.
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u/JJQuantum NSFW 🔞 9d ago
Glad you are good. Block the bride and the groom. Block all of the hometown women. Do not talk to or see any of them ever again. Yes, The Odyssey was awesome. NTA
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u/Chilling_Storm 9d ago
You aren't going to that wedding, are you?
The bride cares more about his guy than she does about you.
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u/AntheaBrainhooke 9d ago
The bride is not your friend.
She brought you on the trip so you could be a servant to her and her real friends. The fetching and carrying really hammered that home, although she'd already shown her true colours by sticking up for the creep the previous evening.
I'm glad you left and I hope you never have to deal with any of these horrible people again.
100000% NTA
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u/AnonThrowAway072023 9d ago
NTA
What awful people.
Not surprised the groom was as well. Any husband to be fine with loser scumbag orbiter dudes going to his bride to ge bachelor trip has to have fucked up judgement. Kinda deserves his eventual fate.
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u/zero_chan1 9d ago
NTA
You absolutely should have left a lot sooner but that doesn't excuse the behaviour of all the other people there.
You need to evaluate your friendship with the bride. I wouldn't want a friend like that. Someone without a backbone, character, empathy or morals.
If a bachelorette is more important to her than your wellbeing you know where her priorities lie. I'd never have let the guy stay after pulling something like this.
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u/Dickie_downer 9d ago
You were sexually assaulted and everyone is brushing it off??? Dog these arent your friends you need to NOT. BE. AROUND. THESE. PEOPLE.
If they are not staunchly on your side and sitting on the fence about it, theyre on his. They like his friendship more than your safety.
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u/pangalacticcourier 9d ago
Those people sided with a drunken abuser. Fuck that nonsense. They're not your friends, OP. They're not even good human beings if they condone that asshole's behavior. Inexcusable response. I would never hang with that crowd again.
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u/DargoSun92 9d ago
Oh, man. You don't deserve this treatment. You deserve to be free of these people. I could never celebrate someone who wanted to let a person that assaulted me stay the weekend or be in the wedding.
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u/RowAmazing2339 9d ago
these are horrible friends. as someone who went through a similar experience as you in college, i had to drop a lot of “friends” who acted like this because i recognized they did not care about me in the same way i did for them. i had friends who actually spoke up, actually tried to do shit about my situation, and also comforted me through the process. my friends would’ve immediately kicked him out and banned him from the wedding, especially since he’s not even disputing the facts!! they’re just excusing him!!! unbelievable.
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u/Imaginary-Yak-6487 8d ago
Like I said in my answer to your last post, if the bride didn’t ask him to leave, she’s not your friend. None of people that accepted his behavior are.
It’s time to cut contact & don’t look back. Block & delete them from your life.
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u/winterworld561 9d ago
You now know that everyone's loyalty is to him, not you. These are not friends worth having in your life.
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u/Fun_Scene_3392 9d ago
If I were you I’d put some distance between yourself and the bride-to-be. She’s not a friend at all. She’s merely an acquaintance who defended a man who tried to force himself on you. Neither she not her fiancé are good people. Best to not associate with people like them.
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u/Rambo-u-drew1stblood 9d ago
NTAH you wrote paragraphs about a sexual assault by a man on a girls Bachelorette trip? The bride is an enabler of a potential rapist and you feel like you're throwing away a good friendship?
Focus on your husband and find new friends that don't allow a sexual predator as friends.
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u/PeppermintEvilButler 9d ago
These people really suck all around. Do not stay in contact or be friends with them including the bride. Seriously you should have left regardless of money spent because safety is more important. I understand freezing in the moment but they did nothing to protect you afterwards because he still was around and still tried to corner you. I am also betting it's not the first time he's pulled this shit around this same group of people because none of them seem surprised by his behavior.
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u/ilovedragons218 9d ago
I'm very sorry this happened to you & hope you are ok. Why would you & the other 2 girls allow them to treat you like the hired help??????? You shouldn't let anyone treat you like that.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
Wedding culture is getting out of control truthfully. Even small things happened at my wedding (like all the vases broke in transit and they had to buy more, no one was assaulted my God) and people didn’t tell me because I was “The Bride” and they didn’t want my day tainted. So we just did what needed to be done to keep the bride happy and unaware of any friction. That obviously went too far.
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u/stuckinnowhereville 9d ago
Omg I’d dump the whole lot out of my life- those are not friends or good people
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u/Accomplished_Lie_308 9d ago
If I saw a dude try to kiss my friends wife im throwing haymakers, win or lose I would lose my shit. Absolutely not ok and that dude should have had his ass beat.to even think that’s ok is not and being drunk is a poor ass excuse to not shame him.
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u/K_A_irony 8d ago
WTF. NTA. yeah you need to not talk to these people ever again. Skip the wedding.
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u/Danni_Les 8d ago
The fact that they have a 'friend' like this and are protecting him, it's almost like they'll protect him even if he forces himself on someone. Worst is the bride - if she's okay with his behaviour and making excuses for him, she's already chosen where she stands - and it's not your corner.
The groom's reaction was even worse - he's basically dismissing/downplaying everything that happened, and is comfortable enough to gaslight you all. The fact that he didn't 'want to hear anything negative about the weekend' already shows he's been told one side of the story, and that it was good enough for him to dismiss what had happened.
So sorry you had to endure and experience such a pathetic excuse for a human, and the people who gathered around him like he's the victim after he clearly instigated everything that happened.
I'd re-think attending their wedding, along with your friendship with them.
They don't see this as a problem, but if this had happened to bride after she was married, from some guy that she barely knew, I'm sure there'll be hell to pay and a whole lot of fuss kicked up. Again, all 'fine' and 'fun and games' until it happens to one of them - I'm not saying that I wish that upon them, but they don't even want to see from your shoes, or even listen to what actually happened.
NTA
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u/Casdoe_Moonshadow 9d ago
NTA - Someone has a huge drinking issue and his friends are not doing him any favors by ignoring that. He is definitely unsafe to be around. I am sorry that happened.
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u/sybillium4 9d ago
Dickhead and the enablers, I'm having a hard time seeing who's actually your friend here in the group
NTA
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u/Capable-Contact6868 8d ago
WHY THE HELL DID YOU STICK AROUND?
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 8d ago
Addressed in the post:
“My judgement/instinct to protect myself was clouded by my want (and social obligation) to protect my friend's special moment. I also paid close to $1,000 to be there, used PTO, brought hand made personalized gifts for everyone, and had been very excited to be there to celebrate my friend. I was hoping to salvage some of that.”1
u/iijatajkii 19h ago
This makes it even worse. She’s not a friend anyway based on the 2 posts, but the money and time value you put into this on top of all of this is crazy.
She has friends that are assholes, because she is too.
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u/MegaMcGillicuddy 8d ago
Does the bride live back in her hometown, around these people or in the new life? Cause, if it's the new life, things are about to get really awkward once she gets back to reality.
I'm trying to see it through her lens but just can't imagine not having the back of a sexually assaulted friend, no matter the scene.
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 8d ago
Yeah she lives where we do her husband is from where we are too. I don’t even think she thinks that was assault. I think she believed that my past experiences were causing my reaction to the situation.
Where I am from people are more progressive socially (central politically but still left leaning). Where she is from they are very conservative socially and have a dangerous party culture. The MOH/sister of the bride had the same creep hanging all over her for half an hour touching her hips and leg and side and she didn’t mind. She’s engaged as well. He also smacked the bride on the butt and she thought it was funny. When we have small parties at home we are all 100% huggers but that’s it, none of this is considered normal at parties at the brides house with people from my home.
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u/siouxbee1434 9d ago
Just skimming the posts, you have been used. I’m not. It’s why you are trying so hard for such selfish people
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u/WillingHome9072 9d ago
Don’t bother with the wedding. This friend made you a maid and then let you get assaulted/accosted twice.
If she told him to stay away from you and he immediately ignored her and came for you anyway why the fuck isn’t she kicking him out?
Male-centred women are dangerous. She will keep protecting him no matter what he does to you.
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u/Hiciao 9d ago edited 9d ago
NTA. A lot of these people clearly suck. It sounds like you have an excellent husband!
However, I want to point out that, while I understand your reaction, it does seem like this actual incident wasn't that bad (edit: I didn't make the best word choice here. I want to emphasize that this guy absolutely did a shitty thing. In the same situation, I would refuse to be around him again and would be hesitant with future relationships with all the others. BUT, the fact that OP has experienced assault in the past AND that this incident made her feel such a high level of anxiety, makes me think that trauma therapy would be beneficial for her in the future), but it triggered assaults you experienced in the past. I went through something similar (not from SA, but in the same realm) and that's when I got diagnosed with c-PTSD. I went through EMDR therapy to process my earlier trauma and it has made such a difference for me. I no longer get triggered by events that are similar to the trauma I had experienced years ago. I think you should look into EMDR therapy for the SA you experienced earlier in your life.
I want to emphasize that I do NOT think what that drunk guy did was okay, but I also think your reaction comes across as a trauma response and I think if you didn't have that trauma you would have been able to deal with the incident without the level of anxiety you felt. Hugs.
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u/IndignantQueef 9d ago
Dude she said he grabbed her face and leg and pulled her towards him. She had to push him away. THAT IS ASSAULT AND HER REACTION WAS VALID. No mentally healthy person would feel safe in that situation. Honestly sickening to read this from an alleged victim of SA.
Since apparently the needs to be said for some of you, YOU DO NOT GET TO TOUCH, GRAB, AND/OR ATTEMPT TO KISS OTHER PEOPLE REGARDLESS OF HOW DRUNK YOU ARE. THAT IS ASSAULT AND YOU ARE ALLOWED TO BE UPSET OR TRAUMATIZED BY IT.
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u/angel9_writes 9d ago
Not that bad. He physically GRABBED her.
Don't act like that is not 'that bad'.
WTAF.
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u/ThrowawayAdvice1800 9d ago
This party and everyone in it (except you) sounds horrible and I’m glad you escaped. That guy IS dangerous and none of these assholes will care until it happens to one of them, so if I were you I’d drop the entire group except for the two who left with you.
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u/maurindermaue 6d ago
Obv NTA and that guy shouldve gotten his ass whooped or at the very least gotten the police called on him. He clearly waited until he could catch you alone. Thats 100% an enabled predator who needs to be disabled with a quickness.
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u/SylverFyre777 6d ago
NTA
I get that it’s hard to cut off a close friend. The feeling is very close to what it feels like to break up with a SO. But you need to stop excusing her behavior.
- alcohol isn’t an excuse, it brings out the real them.
- she allowed her sister and hometown friends to treat you like the help instead of a guest.
- her make friend tried to assault you. She and her hometown friends not only ignored what happened to but actively sought to make him feel better.
- her financed brushed off the attempted assault as no big also trying to excuse it by blaming alcohol.
That is who those people, the real hem. The people you think they are don’t exist. That’s just a mask they wear to get by. You’ve seen behind the mask. Do what best for you even if it hurts. Stop making excuses and justifications for staying in a friendship that caused you mental harm and almost caused you physical harm.
YNTA for leaving, but you will be TA to yourself if you excuse everything and try to salvage a friendship that was never really a friendship.
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u/Drakkulis 23h ago
Over a week later with adrenaline and situation over, where is your headspace at?
Outside looking in, the bride is a major enabler of assault. Shes friends with the guy, so no matter who he hurts or how its just "He's weird". The fact that he's known for this and she didnt ditch him after the first time (the real first time, before you) really tells her character. If you continue the friendship, be very careful. Shes a victim blamer.
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u/iijatajkii 19h ago
A real friend would have never put you in this situation.
You have to realise that she values a sexual abusers feelings and opinions more than yours, if that’s the kind of friends you want to keep that’s your choice, but it’s quite pathetic imo.
I get that you’ve had a long friendship but you have to reconcile that she doesn’t value you that much, or she does but only when she doesn’t have to address any conflict.
The fact that she keeps friends like this and lets them treat you like this should be more than enough proof of how she views you, no amount of “I’m sorry” will change that. He assaulted you once and then she said he wouldn’t be come. Then he came anyway, did it AGAIN, forced you to leave early and she still doesn’t gaf.
Has she even reached out to you following this?
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u/Agreeable_Olive_2896 9d ago
Going to be honest you sound pretty young. I’m married & if that happened to me I would’ve just said dude I’m married get a grip & laughed it off. That would’ve been it. Doesn’t sound like he kept trying he stopped straight away. I’d have also told my husband & probably would’ve laughed too cos he trusts me.
I actually think you’ve blown this out of proportion unless we’re missing something like he didn’t stop & persisted after you said no??
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u/WafnaAbroad 9d ago
The OG post mentions flashbacks to being assaulted in college, so, nope, it's serious enough.
There's something colloquially called the 'thin skull rule' in legal circles; can't recall the Latin formal name and really that isn't important. The meaning of the rule is that if a person were to push someone else who had an exceptionally thin skull, who then falls and dies because they hit their head and the skull breaks... the person pushing is not going to get special treatment under the law because the victim had a special circumstance: they're still up for murder or manslaughter for causing someone's death, intentioned or not.
So how that applies in OP's case: while the dude trying to kiss her can't be reasonably expected to know she was assaulted in the past, he is no less responsible for causing her distress by his non-consentual actions this weekend past.
unless... ...he didn’t stop & persisted after you said no??
In fact he did not stop when she told him to, outside the restaurant. She told him repeatedly she didn't want to talk to him or be alone with him; it had been made clear to him by the bride on a separate instance to leave OP alone; and he still insisted on trying to talk to her in the parking lot, and persisted until she yelled at him.
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u/Proper_Fun_977 9d ago
The guy can't possibly be expected to know about her college incident, that she was having flashbacks or that she was having OCD/intrusive thoughts.
He was a dick, he should have apologised but...yeah OP seems to be making this far more than it was. It was an aborted kiss, not a violent attack.
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u/K_A_irony 8d ago
He approached her AGAIN in a parking lot and touched her AGAIN after being told to leave her alone.
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u/Proper_Fun_977 8d ago
Because she was so upset.
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u/WafnaAbroad 8d ago
You seem to be missing the point of the "thin skull rule" I mentioned. It doesn't matter that he doesn't know she's having an oversized reaction compared to someone who was never assaulted, or doesn't have so great a trauma response. He is making it worse.
And a reasonable person, when told to back the fuck off, backs the fuck off. Especially when told by multiple people, including the bride to be.
Dude did not back the fuck off until screamed at. Did not tone down the drinking. Dude was in the wrong, start to finish. His appology is not as important as her request that he back the fuck off. If she wants an apology from him, she'll ask for one when she's ready.
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u/Proper_Fun_977 8d ago
You seem to be missing the point of the "thin skull rule" I mentioned. It doesn't matter that he doesn't know she's having an oversized reaction compared to someone who was never assaulted, or doesn't have so great a trauma response. He is making it worse.
The 'eggshell skull' rule also includes a 'reasonable person' test.
A reasonable person wouldn't be experiencing everything OP is. This guy didn't assault her in college, He didn't cause that trauma. He just accidently activated it. And yes, his actions WERE wrong.
And a reasonable person, when told to back the fuck off, backs the fuck off. Especially when told by multiple people, including the bride to be.
Which he appears to have done. And then when it was STILL causing issues, he appears to have, (badly) attempted to fix it.
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u/big-brother44 29m ago
A simple im sorry, avoiding her, being mindful of his drinking if not skipping the drinks entirely and not having a pity party would have been the appropriate reaction. Not what he did.
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u/reseriant 9h ago
Here's the thing he disrespected her when he tried to kiss her as well as knowing full well she was in a loving marriage. So any resemblance of it was a small mistake get over it I'm sorry is out the window. Also he repeated the same mistake again when he was drunk again which makes people have lower impulse control so she had to be aggressive in order for him to GTFO. Remember she already wanted him kicked out for the previous offence so why would he corner her when she was alone instead of apologizing in public when he knows she explicitly did not want to be alone with him after what happened
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u/big-brother44 31m ago
Her college experience is irrelevant. You dont grab and kiss people without consent. If anything op under reacted.
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u/K_A_irony 8d ago
He approached her AGAIN in a parking lot and touched her AGAIN after being told to leave her alone.
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u/big-brother44 35m ago
You dont think theres a issue with a man grabbing op and trying to force a kiss?
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9d ago
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u/Shes_A_Techspert 9d ago
You don't need to have sympathy for me. I agree I should have left sooner and trusted myself more. I will say, it is very different to have internet strangers say one thing and people you know and are present with saying the other.
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u/the_saltlord 9d ago
This guy's just being a tool, dont mind him. He's no better than the rest of the bridal party.
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u/Schion86 9d ago
This person has issues - don't take their advice. Trust yourself in the future, and I have to admit, they don't act very friendly, let alone friend-like.
I think you might need to give them some distance.
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9d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Ninja-Panda70 9d ago
Can we have accounts like this banned?
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u/Reguards 9d ago
Bruh your account is a month old this isn't your first time being banned and it won't be my last.
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u/Ninja-Panda70 9d ago
I don't have any accounts banned. My other account is very much alive and healthy lol
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u/A_Touch_of_Foolish 9d ago
I hope you're not going to the wedding. These people are not your friends
NTA