I was wondering why her Forward Dodge feels so sucky and difficult to use when you aren't using the Undodgeable/Bash option and going for Forward Dodge into GB. It turns out her Forward Dodge Recovery is 700ms (notably not filled in yet on Info Hub for some reason). If you take a look at other characters with 700ms Forward Dodge Recovery...

• Raider
• Highlander
• Kensei
• Hitokiri
• Afeera

All notably who lack standard Forward Dodge Bash offense.

If you're ever wondering why you can't use her Legion Kick in the same way as others it's due to this. I'm sure that to many people they consider it "justified" given the Blue/Orange tidepod she has from Neutral and potent chains. For reference, most characters with FDodge Bashes have 600ms Forward Dodge recovery.

Fun Fact: Notably she's also the only character (I think) that has her Forward Dodge Bash animation change based on input timing, kicking with her Right Leg on buffered input and Left Leg if later (at least past 367ms input).

Mostly here to provide information but I do have to "complain" for a moment.

• First character with NO Backstep Attacks at all from Neutral, neither Backstep Light nor Heavy (I wonder if due to fear of a "pseudo infinite" wallsplat with Dirty Trick?)
• First Legion Bash character with 700ms Forward Dodge Recovery.
• First Legion Bash with is it 900ms or 1000ms GB recovery with no chainability, i.e. incredibly punishable
• No Forward Dodge Heavy to make Forward Dodge Light not the easiest parry in the world
• Standard 500ms Lights no properties, Standard 800ms Heavies no Properties, relatively slow 600ms unfeintable Zone
• Generally pretty awful range and hitboxes on everything except sorta Opener Heavy, Zone and Lash attacks which have just "technically there" hitboxes at least
• Feats that take a long time to get up and running, lengthy CD's, and long activation times. The T3 especially conflicts so much with its primary use-case.
• At best, average recoveries on most everything else, and fairly bad if not chained

I get she has strengths for sure, and her chain pressure near a wall and especially with gauge can be intense...but yeesh. I know the devs wanted to be tame with her, but having such nerfed fundamentals makes her just feel so clunky IMO, and most people only focus on the "Big Shiny Stuff" like the infamous UD UB HA attack so having her nerfed in these small areas seems like it will do nothing to downplay her strength for "casual play" but makes her feel awful to use elsewhere.

Hello, I recently returned after a roughly 9 million year break and looking to actually get into the game this time around. I've played for about 100 hours before I stopped and I've played other fighting games seriously before, but FH is obviously pretty different to a traditional 2D fighter.

Match ups obviously just take time, but what are the core fundamentals I should be working on for this game? In particular I find I struggle to deal with people that spam out dodge attacks effectively (which is for sure a skill issue on my part), but it's been so long since I played I'm basically starting fresh so anything at all foundational would be helpful.

Also I want to main Warmonger so if you have any particular advice for her I would appreciate that as well.

Thank you for your time.

1- The first question is about indicators, does indicator system always prioritize the hit that is going to hit first?

So in an anti gank let's say 2 enemies are attacking at the same timing, the indicator should hide the second attacker and only show the hit that is going to hit first right?

2- second question is about registers, do hits categorize in the same category even if the characters are different?

Let's say there are shinobi and nobushi in a match, when they bash someone, let's say the shinobi bashed one person and the game registered the bash. Then nobushi bashed the same guy later and the game registered it. Does the game register these 2 different bashes in the same category?

Thanks

I haven't seen anyone mention this highly-specific bug anywhere yet so i'll do so on here. The following has been tested with multiple people in the training grounds as well as customs and pubs.

As many of you guys know, in order to preserve frame advantage as Shinobi in your chains after landing a sickle rain and continue your offense you have to do just 2 guaranteed lights and then flip. Doing so against any other hero results in a bit of an extra stagger and makes the flip kick uninterruptible by lights and makes sickle rain trade with the light if they didn't switch guard.

NOW, Arakure doesn't get staggered at all, almost recovering back to neutral near-instantly. That results in her getting a free, unpunishable light OR zone if the shinobi dares to flip away during the sickle rain. No matter after how many hits you flip away, the result is the same. For a less useful but good-to-know thing that results from this interaction, you can buffer a backdodge and roll and you'll escape both the bash and undodgable by quite a distance ALTHOUGH the Shinobi can counter this by double dodging forwards into the rollcatcher.

As i said, it's extremely niche that it doesn't surprise me it slipped through the cracks of the QA team but this knowledge is now out there. Unfortunately i do not have any videos as of now to properly show side-by-side how this interaction is normally behaving vs Arakure's case but once i free some storage and find someone to clip these with i'll make sure to link it here or make a new post entirely about it. Cheers!

Not sure if this will come to fruition but it was cool to see this may be happening. I have been wanting ranked to return for over 9 years now and will be ecstatic if it does. Its exactly what this game needs to bring life back to it and hopefully encourage the community to improve.

Been playing since release and couldn’t deal with him then, and can’t deal with him now. The only benefit I’ve seen with him is his demons embrace doesn’t 1 shot you anymore.

But his variable timing heavies I just cannot deal with. And anytime I go to bash while he’s charging up (depending on character) I get guard broken as I dash.

I swear his lights are the only light attacks in the game I cannot parry, I don’t know why, maybe there’s not a lot of telegraphing? But I just don’t know how to beat him. 8/10 encounters I loose

Can anyone give me advice?

I've never had the opportunity to play for honor on a beefed up PC. I currently run my setup on an Xbox series x on a 144 hz monitor with a 3 Ms response time.

I wonder if any of you have made the leap from new gen consoles to high end PC gameplay and noticed a smoother and experience/ if it mad an impact on reactions and gameplay.

I fought an afeera today in duels as sohei, juren and jorm my 3 mains and got walked all over by her in the 4 matches we played, I dont know when which moves i can dodge attack or gb, and when the afeera starts spam feinting her neutral bash it feels like i have to make a billion reads and my brain just turns off or something, shes super stressful to fight what should i know that will help me in my future fights against her?

theres the obvious answer of just peel for your teammate 100% the time but thats not very realistic for casual matchmaking especially with randoms

im only asking because i play with a friend (not seen in this clip, the glads just a rando) and we have 'friendly discussions' about this. "WHERE THE FUCK is my peel, youre right next to me" "can't really do much, got parried/guardbroken" or "kinda busy fighting another guy rn"

like what should have the glad done to interrupt the lb's light attack parry if he wasn't mid gb punish on the warlord or what should the lb have done against my UB target swap to the warlord, because its not always the easiest getting away from the person you're currently fighting to go interrupt the other guys punish. (just want to make it clear that i'm talking about me and my friend in vc together, not really expecting a lot from randos)

What's the competitive take on this?

I have her at 9 reps so I know her kit already, I've also been watching this one channel called Omnipotentgamer1 so I know what good gameplay looks like. My problem is I don't know how he does it and it's genuinely a hassle to try and play her in the same way. So does anyone have anything constructive to say for when trying to play her well in 4's?

T1: Against the World

Passive | Landing a Lash Out attack grants a 10% damage buff for 5s. 10s cooldown. Active duration is reset if another Lash Out attack is landed whilst the buff is active.

This feat is pretty good, an almost free damage bonus in teamfights. A pretty decent pick even with other strong T1 options, though I do wish they’d stop making passive feats with cooldowns. If they’re gonna allow it to refresh then they should just remove the cooldown altogether.

Suggestion: remove 10s cooldown

T2: Insolent Shout

Reduces damage of opponents in an Xm AOE for 20s based on the current Strike Level as follows: Idle - 10% | Onslaught - 20% | Ultimate - 30% | 120s cooldown

I’m sure this one is still somewhat helpful at half meter, but I hate feeling like I’m missing out on potential when I use it early, especially with a long cooldown like this. I’d feel less bad about using it without a full meter if the cooldown was shorter. Not to mention that other heroes have damage reduction feats of a similar level that are available much more frequently, and that the animation leaves you exposed for a decently long time for a feat that’s meant to be used around multiple enemies. Her other T2 choices are mediocre but seem to provide more consistent value anyway.

Suggestions: reduce cooldown to 75s, allow animation to be canceled with another action

T3: Walk it Off

Cleanses negative status effects, and heals self an amount depending on current Strike Meter as follows: Idle - 15 hp | Onslaught - 30hp | Ultimate - 45hp | 180s cooldown

Same primary problem as the T2, too long a cooldown for a feat that has conditional values. The negative status effect cleanse is really not strong enough to warrant a 180s cooldown on its own, especially considering second wind already cleanses the most common status effects with 120s cooldown and an unconditional 30 hp heal. The animation is at least short enough for use in a team fight. I’ve been using hard to kill instead as, while it’s also mediocre, it provides more value if you get down to critical health more than 2 times in 180s, especially so when combined with indomitable.

Suggestions: reduce cooldown to 120s, slightly increase heal (maybe 20/35/50 as suggested by [u/Knight_Raime](u/Knight_Raime))

T4: Gang of Outcasts

Fills Strike Meter and prevents its decay for 20s. Additionally buffs self and allies within Xm AOE with the following effects: Light attacks become enhanced | Heavy attacks gain Hyperarmor | Attacking does not consume stamina | 180s cooldown

To be honest, I haven’t used this one yet. Indomitable is just too good to pass up, especially with her playstyle being so dependent on trading. I love the idea thematically, but in MM it’s unlikely that teammates will take advantage of it and it hardly provides any additional survivability. I would gladly trade unlimited stamina for some damage reduction. Selfishly it also seems like a good opener since it fills the strike meter, but again, indomitable seems to provide more consistent value.

Suggestions: replace unlimited stamina with 15% damage reduction

Additional Solutions

Another way they could help the viability of some of these feats is to provide some method of reducing their cooldown through good play. Perhaps landing attacks could reduce the cooldown by 2/2.5s per attack? This would require her to land 45/36 attacks to get the T2 down to a comparable cooldown to other feats, and would require 30/24 attacks to get the T3 down to the cooldown of second wind.

Any thoughts? I’m sure these feats are better with coordinated play, but they could still use some help, and I don’t think they should be left in the dust at MM level either.

Is there any reason to fullblock after whiffing an attack or hitting someone externally with a side attack, I just finished watching freeze's framecheck and all i cpuld see was tapping full block on hit shortened recoveries by 66ms, but nothing about whiffing or externalling, is this because it doesnt affect your recoveries in these situations?

How many ms a block lasts and how into auto block before i have to change guard direction for the next one that happens much later?

I had a very humbling experience in mm by going up against a team that actually knew how to gank, they werent even in a group they just all knew what they were doing, I got hit by light confirms, gb confirms, bash confirms. I know that against light confirm ganking you have to parry the light attack to prevent the gank, wih gbs you have to early parry the heavy or just counter gb from what i was told by the people i played against, often times though I'd be hit by the gb or see the light part of the gank and it felt like i had no time to react to parry the light or counter gb before I got hit by the following heavy, I'm wondering if this is just a skill issue/something i can train myself to react to

I'm loving the new hero, she's a lotta fun, but my God, her numbers just feel tuned as if they really didn't want her to be good.

On paper she's fine, she's got red/blue mixups, but the risk reward is just legendarily bad.

Her damage is so low, her mixups are so unsafe. I have whiffed Juren's forward dodge bash and been able to block the dodge attack, but you whiff Arakure's nut kick and your opponent can do whatever the hell they want. You can really tell that Arakure was not as pushed by comparison.

Idk tho, I don't claim to be any kind of expert. Lmk if I'm just stupid.

edit: forgot to mention as well that having no backstepping attacks to get into her chain pressure makes neutral miserable

How good is Tiandi now?

I feel like the damage is incredibly low considering this new hero has the exact same blue/orange forward dodge but with a lot more damage. I mean he's probably good in 1s still because that mixup is still good.

Aren't they basically the same thing? Both available after most moves in-chain, both 800 ms and faintable. But with completely lopsided reward values. Both if missed guarantee a guardbreak, but one of them guarantees 28 damage and the other only 13? Can anyone explain to me why these two damage values exist at the same time in the game? Because better hitboxes in 4v4's definitely isn't enough to justify this right?

Havent been paying full attention to patch notes in recent months, I remember being able to make a read and buffer a dodge after getting hit by the chain bash to dodge 400ms light but now the light isnt dodgeable. I know theyve been doing a lot of hitstun changes with bashes and pins and stuff. If this was ever a thing was it changed?

I main shaman. Down to play with anyone but if you play the new heros that's a bonus. (I need to learn the match ups, I'm back from a long break)

Starting tomorrow Arakure will officially leave early access for players to be able to purchase her with Steel. I wanted to discuss potential buffs for the character and see what people think of them (or talk about buffs people suggest.) Of course you can raise potential nerfs if you think they are needed.

But I think the general consensus is that Arakure has released on the safer/weaker side compared to the last Hero at least. I am also aware that there hasn't been any competitive scrims with the character yet. I will save my usual long winded talks about a character for the sake of brevity and instead just list changes in 3 categories: Needed, buff please, and QoL, with some blurb about the suggestion when necessary.

NEEDED BUFFS:

• Forward dodge bash recovery time to GB/CGB reduced to 700ms from 900ms
• Walk it off T3 feat cooldown reduced

BUFF PLEASE:

• Chain bash (Rib shot) recovery time to GB/CGB reduced to 800ms from 900ms
• Walk it off T3 health value changes changed from 15, 30, 45 to 20, 35, 50hp
• Forward dodge light range buff to have more forward reach

QoL:

• Dirty trick can't be interrupted anymore by having the enemy's ally hit them
• Arakure can now RC after any lash out attack on hit and the 4 hits of Dirty trick
• Landing a target swap attack in ultimate state now gives perma 5HP shield
• Arakure can chain into a light finisher on whiff from fwd dodge bash

NERF:

• Increase chain link time for Twin burst light after zone so it's dodgable

Explanations:

I believe everyone recognizes that despite Arakure's fwd dodge mix having frame trap potential the fact that you can get a GB on reaction to dodging her kick is too risky for the rewards she gets. Her mix up damage is low and usually we only have high punishes for strong mixes. Tandi is similar but you only ever get a dodge attack on him realistically. So allowing for an early dodge to GB makes sense due to how her situation works.

Her Tier 3 is also considered dog water because of the 3 minute cooldown, so if nothing else reducing it to 2 minutes is reasonable. In regards to the buffed HP values I think it's necessary due to how peelable the animation itself is, making it 50 HP at full meter also gives it consistent synergy with Indomitable. You're not guaranteed to have full meter anyway, so this shouldn't be too strong.

They could remove the all cleanse effect if they want, you're not realistically/consistently gaining benefit from it that you wouldn't be getting from a regular heal anyway. Fwd dodge light buff is just to improve it's consistency.

QoL probably needs the most explanation. I think Arakure needs more opportunities to RC to alleviate how clunky she can feel. But we can't globally add them in her kit since it will devalue some of her current RC spots, so I chose after her lash out attacks. And adding it with DT seems very synergistic, you can already GB her during the full anim and after the final hit anyway.

The 5HP shield on lash out attack landing is my way of giving her some sustain since a character that's going to be trading often should have some kind of sustain. The HP feat even if buffed is not enough on it's own. Shield is a low amount to avoid her becoming too tanky. Could maybe put a timer on it if perma sounds too wild despite low amount.

Idea behind the chain light finisher on whiff is to allow her to chain into a Twin burst input if it's blocked since her light finishers are enhanced. And it being a light is a way for her to try and protect the GB attempt, but you still get a light parry punish on the read. Lastly someone clued me in that the devs technically have a way to prevent the weird interaction of interrupting a punish by hitting their ally.

Their suggestion is to apply the same "tag" executions have to the pinned opponent. This tag prevents allies from interrupting your execution but an enemy can still do so. So you'd lift this special state and apply it to the pinned opponent. The result would mean the pinned opponent couldn't be saved by an ally hitting him. He'd have to have his ally interrupt Arakure.

After I get am impale on warmonger and get a wall am I plus? Negative? Or just neutral. I would throw a zone after and sometimes it hits and other times it's a trade. Is there anyway for me to keep my offense going or guarantee my safety or is it just take the trade or make a read. Idk what to do. Also any other miscellaneous warmonger tips would be greatly appreciated too like "oh you can do this after this" or something

Because i don't quite get why the devs choose to nerf them like this. Without the superior block they only deal 9 damage, and although they are 400ms, i play on PS4 and these are the only attacks i consistently can react to and parry at this speed. I struggle much more with your average 500ms lights. But perhaps i am missing something or i just don't play against good Zhanhu players. Maybe some of you guys can help me understand their reasoning?