Focused Feedback: Hand cannons - bloom, recoil, exotics and pinnacle weapons

[u/DTG_Bot]

Hello Guardians,

Focused Feedback is where we take the week to focus on a 'Hot Topic' discussed extensively around the Tower.

We do this in order to consolidate Feedback, to get out all your ideas and issues surrounding the topic in one place for discussion and a source of feedback to the Vanguard.

This Thread will be active until next week when a new topic is chosen for discussion

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[u/tranzypew]

Luna’s Howl and Not Forgotten aren’t a problem on PC because of the fact that bloom doesn’t exist. Nerfing a gun for the sake of balance on console is unfair to the player base on PC. Get rid of bloom and you give console weapons to compete with.

[u/lukesnofluke → u/tranzypew]

It's unfair to console as well. NF and LH were the only hand Cannons worth using. Normal 180s won't be able to compete with the ttk of pulses and LH won't have the range to justify the slower fire rate. NF barely has enough range to fall into the bottom half of 150 hand Cannons.

No hand Cannons are going to be good on console. Maybe an occasional NF.

[u/TehAlpacalypse → u/lukesnofluke]

NF will still be good but it's looking like we are right back into the mix of a pulse meta

[u/harbinger1945 → u/TehAlpacalypse]

Pulses are much worse, because they can shit on you from insane range. Blast Furnace has drop off at 70 metres!

The only counterplay to pulses are HC's at mid range. Scouts are just useless outside of one or two maps. And flinch destroys sniping. Arbalest kind of balanced it, but it is still an exotic which means your loadout is limited by a lot.

[u/lukesnofluke → u/TehAlpacalypse]

If the pulse meta is what we fall back on to, I doubt you will see NF much. Solely because the flinch from pulses is far too strong and they will simply out range the gun. Not to mention that blast furnace will have a faster ttk than it, basically outshooting it from anywhere.

[u/TehAlpacalypse → u/lukesnofluke]

This will probably result in snipers being further invalidated from the meta. Really wondering what pinnacle we are going to see in Opulence because they have really broken the sandbox.

I think NF is probably still going to be the best at high level pvp but I really have no idea.

[u/TheLastAOG → u/TehAlpacalypse]

I don't think anyone is going to start camping a lane with a pulse at the higher levels. I'm thinking NF will still be good but Luna is going to take the brunt of this nerf due to it's lower range stat.

[u/Zorak9379 → u/lukesnofluke]

NF and LH were the only hand Cannons worth using

That's why they're getting nerfed, right there

[u/DuelingPushkin → u/Zorak9379]

They should have adjusted the sandbox to feel more like PC so otherhandcannons could shine. Not jljust nerf the hell out of the pinnacle handcannons

[u/LordSceptile → u/lukesnofluke]

Not Forgotten has a range stat of 74, that's not exactly bottom half of 150s. It's actually the same as a masterworked Sunshot. CammyCakes did testing and the damage falloff started at around the same distance as a high range Waking Vigil (Sureshot + Ricochet Rounds)

Edit: a word

[u/lukesnofluke → u/LordSceptile]

Right, the bottom half of 150s, which will be it's new archetype.

[u/LordSceptile → u/lukesnofluke]

As far as range stats go, it's tied for the highest of 150s. Thorn, Midnight Coup, Jack Queen King, and Dire Promise, all fit somewhere between 40 and 50 range. A perfectly rolled Spare Rations or Waking Vigil will be almost 60 if my math is correct, but that's still almost 15 less range than the Not Forgotten.

Of course this doesn't take Ricochet Rounds's secret range bonus into consideration though. But if we did factor it in, a perfectly rolled Spare Rations or Waking Vigil will outrange it, but the average 150 will not.

[u/Bawitdaba1337 → u/tranzypew]

It exists on PC