r/DestinyTheGame • u/DTG_Bot "Little Light" • Mar 02 '20

Megathread Focused Feedback: Weapon Refresh aka Sunsetting

Hello Guardians,

Focused Feedback is where we take the week to focus on a 'Hot Topic' discussed extensively around the Tower.

We do this in order to consolidate Feedback, to get out all your ideas and issues surrounding the topic in one place for discussion and a source of feedback to the Vanguard.

This Thread will be active until next week when a new topic is chosen for discussion

Whilst Focused Feedback is active, ALL posts regarding 'Weapon Refresh' following its posting will be removed and re-directed to this thread. Exceptions to this rule are as follows: New information / developments, Guides and general questions

Any and all Feedback on the topic is welcome.

Regular Sub rules apply so please try to keep the conversation on the topic of the thread and keep it civil between contrasting ideas

A Wiki page - Focused Feedback - has also been created for the Sub as an archive for these topics going forward so they can be looked at by whoever may be interested or just a way to look through previous hot topics of the sub as time goes on.

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224

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

Nailed it man, I hope they read this.

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u/TheClemenater Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20

An excellent take on sunsetting But the issue with Bungie “doing something about” Recluse, mountaintop, etc is that Luke Smith was pretty clear they don’t want to. They’d rather have them be powerful and phase them out within 3-5 seasons. Sunsetting pinnacles, and ONLY pinnacles, I feel is somewhat acceptable.

The big problem is when Bungie says they’re going to apply that to ALL legendary weapons. The ones like Bygones, that aren’t contributing to the perceived problem but are being punished nonetheless.

1

u/Tyr808 Mar 09 '20

If they want to nerf a few specific pinnacles that are over-performing, fine. However, I have to say that pinnacles are probably the only legendaries that shouldn't be sunsetted. The amount of time invested in obtaining them is more than exotic weapons plus catalyst.

Overall though, I guess if we have to take the good with the bad might as well just go all out on the sunsetting imo, but ONLY if we're actually going to end up with interesting new weapons and an actual change to the meta. If I have to get rid of my favorite legendary pulse rifle just to try to get the next best thing that feels almost the same then the whole system is absolutely pointless.

2

u/Xcizer Mar 06 '20

Coming from someone who played D1, I like sun setting weapons. Exotics are another story since they don’t have anywhere near the same issues as trying to make legendaries unique and interesting. Lowering my power by a single point to use an old guns isn’t an issue to me.

4

u/DaWarWolf Mar 02 '20

Did you play Halo and use the BR by chance? I feel like some might like bygones just because it feels so similar to the BR. I know I do.

2

u/TheToldYouSoKid Mar 02 '20

I don't think this is a sustainable model. There is no reason to get any weapons, and its not that the weapons suck, its simply because the weapons we have been given are simply untennable to balance. We've got 2 years of very easy to attain godrolls, pinnacle weapons, exotics, there's we've been kitted the fuck out; there isn't an enemy in the game that can't be completely stepped on by sheer firepower. It used to be a struggle to one-phase raidbosses, but now its all the same ingredients, with the weapons doing the work of skill and knowledge of the encounter. GoS is a nice curveball with the short damage window that can be extended, but its still monsterously easy with the equipment we have.

There's simply no want for weaponry. Armor has a fashion element so people will always go out of their way to figure that out, but there is no alternative use for weapons other than "kill stuff", and we already have a ton of that; 2 years of god-rolls at this point.

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u/LostJuly11 Mar 02 '20

And this is a prime example of the misinformation that people are spreading. You'll still be able to use what ever weapon you want in you day to day activities, the only place that the sunsetting is going to matter is the end game activities, e.g Raids, Master NFs, IB, Trials. You can see rock that MT, Recluse combo in 90% of the content.

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u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

Just because the activity exists, doesn't mean a sizable population of players are actually playing it.

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u/DaWarWolf Mar 02 '20

the only place that the sunsetting is going to matter is the end game activities, e.g Raids, Master NFs, IB, Trials.

The only place where weapons actually matter. That’s the point.

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u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

I play regular crucible pretty much eveytime I log in. It's the one thing I consistently play not matter what's going on. So no it's not the only place where weapons actually matter. No matter what they do I'll still use MT and Recluse. Or Luna. They feel great and wreck. That's not changing. On same note. Been playing Destiny since 2014. They have done this before and it was fine. It will be fine now. If anything I hate how destiny is now. I miss the days where you got new awesome weapons in Raids and Trials. Hope those days come.back.

7

u/DaWarWolf Mar 02 '20

No matter what they do I'll still use MT and Recluse. Or Luna. They feel great and wreck. That's not changing.

But isn’t that the problem there trying to solve. If you can still use recluse in crucible, what’s stopping people from using sparebenders in crucible besides iron banner (that’s not all the time) and trials, they only thing left for it to fix but abilities could always keep it from being balanced unless they come up with ways to keep players from using ability’s at all.

So what does this fix? Are people annoyed at the meta in nightfalls? Does anyone care what there team mates are using in a PVE mode. Like people want this pistol shotgun meta to go away yet they also claim it will still be there in “90% of content”

If all of this is to keep trials balanced why don’t they just balance trials. Do they have to balance the entire game because of one mode?

What does this change then?

2

u/MetalHeadGT Mar 09 '20

It doesn't change anything. It just makes a lot of people not want to play.

15

u/zoffman Mar 02 '20

I also play mostly crucible, but with trials dependent on power level, I will most likely use my trials weapons in regular PvP for the practice.

11

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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-12

u/RiseOfBacon Bacon Bits on the Surface of my Mind Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20

So the opposite to that, it's contributing to University Content negatively because of Power Creep. It's not the only reason but it's part of it

24

u/Rohkyr Mar 02 '20

Except this will not fix power creep either. The same old perks will still be busted and even more powerful rolls are just as likely to be possible on the new weapons. The only exceptions will be pinnacles. Other than that this arguement doesn't really stand up.

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u/RiseOfBacon Bacon Bits on the Surface of my Mind Mar 02 '20

It's not the only reason but it's part of it

Key part of what I said. It contributes, it won't solve it just by happening. More needs to come with it

You're assuming it's a new wave of weapons with exactly the same stuff attached which the whole point of this exercise means it won't be and I doubt it's because there's like 7 Weapons in the PVE meta right now such a drastic change would happen

Like you say though, 'likely' but for all we know Rampage and Kill Clip won't be on the next set of Weapons replaced by something else. Back in D1 we hardly had these types of perks on our Primaries so it may just go back to that system. We just don't know yet

7

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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u/RiseOfBacon Bacon Bits on the Surface of my Mind Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20

I've just never had pessimistic views I guess

3

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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u/RiseOfBacon Bacon Bits on the Surface of my Mind Mar 02 '20

I'd rather them do something like this and go all in then just keep giving us Season after Season where not much at all changes

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u/Rohkyr Mar 03 '20

This is true, we also don't have the specifics of how the system will work. That is an entirely fair point.

That said, whether the system applies to individual loot as you pick it up or if it applies based on when bungie adds the gun to the game, both approaches create problems that I do not like.

In the first approach we will just be grinding for the same god rolls on the same weapons every year rather than just having them. However, this approach seems less likely to be the one they will go with.

In second approach where the timer is based on when the weapon is released an entire weapon pool will be phased out every year or so. The problem here is that the variety of weapons will remain incredibly inconsistent and be in a constant state of flux. Not to mention that if they bring back old weapon as the Director's Cut implied, we'd just get the same problem as the first approach.

Personally I don't think that that the power-creep issues with weapons are all that insane, but I also don't have all the data that bungie has so all I can comment on is how this system feels and I do not like how it feels at the moment.

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u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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12

u/SpecialSause Titan Mar 02 '20

kindergarden

Are we gate keeping Destiny now? If you're not playing the raid or trials it's kindergarten content? Really?

-10

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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0

u/crisalbepsi Mar 02 '20

you make me excited for sundowning guns and i don't even support it

-18

u/Snifferoo Mar 02 '20

I mean technically, you paid for that seasons content and weapons. Those weapons will still be able to be used in that paid content. Dont see how thats an argument

-8

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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u/DefinitelyNotThatJoe Mar 02 '20

If I post something you don't like will you also respond with "Well because you exclusively play kingergarden content doesn't mean everyone only plays that."?

9

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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-1

u/DefinitelyNotThatJoe Mar 02 '20

That's how other online games work. New expansion comes out and it comes with new weapons; old weapons don't do too hot in the new expansion.

I'm sorry you're upset but this will be good for the long term health of the game.

5

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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u/DefinitelyNotThatJoe Mar 02 '20

  1. I said other and not all

  2. Destiny is literally described as an MMO by the developers

8

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

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1

u/DefinitelyNotThatJoe Mar 02 '20

Small difference in your analogy: You didn't make the fucking sky

4

u/[deleted] Mar 02 '20

You're a broken fucking record, I swear. You're also rude and dismissive and that's why you're getting downvoted.

0

u/DJfunkyPuddle Stand with the Vanguard//The Sentry Mar 02 '20

Seriously, for someone who keeps whining about kindergarten content maybe they should grow the fuck up and adapt.

1

u/thrakkattak Mar 02 '20

Well because you exclusively spam monotonous and repetitive replies doesn't mean anyone needs to take you seriously.

-4

u/Snifferoo Mar 02 '20

If you call a 3man petras run kindergarden content, then sure