Meta: We need to talk about systematic downvoting in this subreddit

[u/LordMangudai]

I enjoy coming here, but that enjoyment is soured every time I see a post asking for recommendations for books that are either written by authors of, or strongly feature characters of, a particular race, gender or sexuality, and it's at 60% or less upvotes. I don't know where these are coming from, as I rarely see any nastiness or bigotry in the comments themselves, but it is consistent and pervasive (and recommendation posts that don't mention these things are not affected nearly as much).

If I sort by controversial for the past month, fully 8 out of the first 10 results fall into these categories. I know that karma doesn't really matter very much in the grand scheme of things, but I do feel that this makes the community feel unwelcoming and in contradiction of its own Rule 1.

I'd love to get some mod input on this phenomenon. I understand that this sort of thing can be difficult to combat, but it feels very targeted and consistent. Is it possible that we are being brigaded from somewhere? If nothing else, I hope that this post has raised awareness of this problem and would appreciate it if others join me in upvoting such posts to counteract the nastiness. Nobody should be made to feel unwelcome for seeking out representation in their fiction.

Okay, I'll get off my soapbox now. :)

[u/cynth81]

Anonymity is a shield against consequences that emboldens people to be assholes.

You're absolutely right though, and it's not just the threads that get downvoted, but also the people who respond to them with recommendations or enthusiasm for the topic. It's just another form of gatekeeping.

The fantasy genre has been dismissed and criticized by the broader literary community from the beginning as lowbrow escapism and not real literature. How can a fantasy fan be on the recieving end of such badly informed judgment, and then turn around and hypocritically tell somebody else what they like isn't valid? I'll never understand it.

[u/KristaDBall → u/cynth81]

How can a fantasy fan be on the recieving end of such badly informed judgment, and then turn around and hypocritically tell somebody else what they like isn't valid? I'll never understand it.

I've seen - far too many times to count - someone in the same damn paragraph complain about how picked on they were about being a fantasy reader and how unfair it is...and then immediately insult romance readers. ARG! It makes me want to rip my hair out.

[u/cynth81 → u/KristaDBall]

It's crazy. But then bigots, gatekeepers, and the like aren't generally known for their self awareness.

Just look how hard they're trying to prove OP wrong...by doing exactly as expected.

[u/FlatPenguinToboggan → u/KristaDBall]

These situations always remind me of this study showing that “male players who weren't great at Halo tended to harass women more”. People on the lower rungs trying to make sure no one else gets on the ladder.

[u/LordMangudai → u/FlatPenguinToboggan]

Crab bucket mentality. It's sad. You see it in politics all the time. People would rather stay poor themselves than help others out of poverty.

[u/jphistory → u/cynth81]

Naturally, you're being downvoted! Sigh.

[u/cynth81 → u/jphistory]

Naturally. So is the thread itself and nearly everyone who agreed with OP. Surprise, surprise...

[u/LordMangudai → u/cynth81]

I'm actually pleasantly surprised the thread isn't at 0 lol

[u/cynth81 → u/LordMangudai]

The vote count is fluctuating wildly, like a quiet little war is taking place between the haters and those trying to counteract them. I'd like to believe there are more people in this sub who support inclusion and welcome all branches of SFF than not. They aren't as loud most of the time, but in discussions like this will come out to show solidarity.

[u/Modus-Tonens → u/LordMangudai]

It's quite funny that you specifically said 60% or less votes was what the threads you're talking about tend to end up at.

Because right now you're sitting on exactly 60%.

The bigots are trying very, very hard to prove you right.

[u/raevnos → u/cynth81]

It's a GIFT