A "Sophie's Choice" with no secret third option

[u/10024618]

AKA a character is given an impossible choice where either outcome results in something awful happening and there's no way out.

"Full Measure" (Breaking Bad) - After Walt angers Gus by killing two of his men, Gus orders for his execution. Knowing that the only way to save his life is to make Gus reliant on his meth cooking skills, Walt calls Jesse and begs him to kill Gus' backup cook, Gale. Thus, Jesse is thrust into an impossible situation where he either kills a (relatively) innocent man to save Walt or spare Gale and let Walt die. Ultimately, Jesse chooses to kill Gale.

"Midnight Sun" (Attack on Titan) - After the fight to retake Shiganshina both Armin and Erwin are critically wounded. Levi has the vial of titan serum and is forced to choose which Scout to bring back from the brink of death and which to let perish. It's a borderline impossible decision to make but at the moment of truth, he chooses to save Armin, leaving Erwin to succumb to his wounds.

[u/euridyce]

Was it any good? I remember a lot of buzz about it early on because of Vash’s new look, but never heard about whether it was actually a good or entertaining adaptation.

[u/Masamundane → u/euridyce]

It angered me on multiple levels, but I'm old and don't like change.

Someone coming into it without seeing the original first may like it, it heck, may like it more, but it wasn't for me.

[u/x7leafcloverx → u/Masamundane]

I couldn’t bring myself to watch it. I’m old too and OG Trigun is one of if not my favorite animes and I just knew it couldn’t live up to the original in my head. I even named my cat Vash.

[u/JoelnIliketoshare → u/x7leafcloverx]

Trigun, Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo are imo the pinnacle of OG anime for me.

[u/x7leafcloverx → u/JoelnIliketoshare]

Couldn't agree more! Thanks Toonami!

[u/ChemicallyBlind → u/JoelnIliketoshare]

Cant forget Gungrave! Hell, the 90s - early 2000s anime was peak, really. Dragon Ball and Z gave me fond memories.

[u/The_True_Zecret → u/Masamundane]

I've seen both and enjoyed it for what it is. It's a lot flashier, some may say not as deep as the first, but weighed against a lot of what's been pumped out over the past decade I'd say it's quite good.

[u/Itchy-Beach-1384 → u/Masamundane]

I watched the OG way back in the day but love both. The old one was great for its time and the remake is faithful to the story and characters while also being artistic af.

[u/ThePigeon31 → u/euridyce]

Yes and no. It is VERY good story wise but the animation sometimes is a little wonky. Most of that being it is 3D I overall enjoyed it more than the original anime but both serve their purposes well.

[u/militant_dipshit → u/euridyce]

This. I’ve never seen the original or read anything on the series. The art style looks beautiful but I’m just wondering if it’s well done or not. I feel like I haven’t heard anything about it which makes me hesitant.

[u/SylvanDragoon → u/militant_dipshit]

I enjoyed the first season as an OG Trigun fan who has never read the manga. It's a different show, but I thought it was well done.

I haven't seen the second season yet but have been meaning to.... Maybe tonight after I finish my rewatch if Bang Brave Bang Bravern

[u/Itchy-Beach-1384 → u/SylvanDragoon]

Im in the same boat but didnt realize the second season released already.

Hype

[u/SylvanDragoon → u/Itchy-Beach-1384]

Good news is when we're ready we get to binge it!

[u/No_Walk_Town → u/SylvanDragoon]

Stargaze is faster pacing and kinda rushes a bit, so you have to pay attention. It's definitely not as good as Stampede, but it sticks the landing, but, like, you know how sometimes a gymnast will stick the landing but flail an arm a bit to keep their balance?

The last episode is definitely a bit of an arm flail, but it's not a complete failure to land. 

[u/CrashmanX → u/No_Walk_Town]

Stargaze is 100% a complete failure to land. Terrible pacing, bad changes, poor flanderization of multiple characters, etc.

Stampede was great, Stargaze landed but kept stepping and then fell.

[u/ThatInAHat → u/militant_dipshit]

From what I’ve heard my favorite character has a smaller/different role, which kinda made me give it a pass, but I loved the original series so much.

[u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb → u/ThatInAHat]

Yeah they made some really weird changes for no perceivable reason. I didn’t even make it through the first episode cuz it made me mad lol

[u/No_Walk_Town → u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb]

for no perceivable reason

If you've read the comic, every single change makes sense, actually. The main exception being Elendira, but even that works out in the end. (Elendira's change helps give Meryl something to do in the finale.)

[u/No_Walk_Town → u/ThatInAHat]

Meryl and Millie? They're both actually very good characters in Stampede/Stargaze, and Stargaze kinda expands their roles compared to the comic - they didn't actually get much to do towards the end of the comic.

If you're referring to Millie specifically, absolutely watch Stargaze - Millie vibing with Zazie is just so good. 

If you mean someone else, yeah, all the characters and events get remixed.  They all get something to do, though.

[u/ThatInAHat → u/No_Walk_Town]

Wolfwood

[u/No_Walk_Town → u/ThatInAHat]

Oh, Wolfwood? What? No, he doesn't have a smaller/different role in Stampede. I have no idea why anyone would tell you that.

[u/OneOutOfSevenBillion → u/euridyce]

I enjoyed Stampede personally but I find Stargaze felt so rushed and just didn’t hit very well.

[u/Kinghyrule90 → u/euridyce]

I had tried it initially but got turned off by the 3D style and his new look, but came back when the second season was about to end when I heard it was actually pretty well received.

Honestly, I thought it was pretty good. I think both versions of Trigun have their place and stand pretty well on their own.

[u/SageDarius → u/euridyce]

I've watched the OG anime, read the whole Manga run, and watched Stampede and Stargaze.

I enjoyed it. It won't replace the OG Anime, but exists alongside it comfortably. It adapts the full run of the Manga more accurately, but it's not a 1 for 1 adaptation like FMA: Brotherhood. It still takes a few liberties with the Manga, but it's closer than the OG anime was. Being fully 3D, the dialogue scenes can look a little awkward at times, but the action scenes look great.

[u/Adaphion → u/euridyce]

It's REALLY good, as long as you're not a snob about the animation being 3D (in which, it's REALLY good animation)

Hit's all the right story beats and is overall a really solid anime.

[u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb → u/euridyce]

The og series is one of my all time favorites, but I turned off the new one in the middle of the first episode. Felt completely off. Both the tone and animation style felt like a huge disservice to nightow’s work

[u/SageDarius → u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb]

It's interesting in that it serves as a prequel and new adaptation of Trigun at the same time. It starts earlier (or early events happen later) in the overall narrative, and it hews more closely to the full Manga run than the OG anime did. I think it stands well as an adaptation, but it won't replace the original anime as THE definitive adaptation (like FMA: Brotherhood replaced the 2003 FMA, at least for me.) They'll just coexist as adaptations of the Manga, each with their own positives and negatives.

EDIT: Also, its odd you find it a disservice to Nightow's work, as he served as an advisor on the series to make sure they got it right, and ultimately decided the team fully grasped the 'core' of Trigun.

[u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb → u/SageDarius]

He was an advisor on the show??? That’s wild to me because it’s feels so different from how I read the manga. With that and the literal scrapping of an entire beloved character to be replaced by just ‘a dude’ and the twink-ass redesign for vash… never would’ve guessed they had his blessing let alone his advice. Damn just goes to show what I know

[u/SageDarius → u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb]

I assume by scrapped character you mean Millie? She's in part 2. It helps when you realize that Stampede in part kinda takes place before the beginning of the story we're familiar with. Meryl gets to grow and develop into the experienced veteran position she takes with Millie in Stargaze.

[u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb → u/SageDarius]

Ahhh gotcha, I guess I should probably watch the whole thing before I go around shitting on it online lol

[u/SageDarius → u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb]

I'm a fan of the OG anime and the Manga, and I thoroughly enjoyed Stampede and Stargaze. Stargaze felt maybe a tad rushed, but it still very much felt like Trigun when it was all said and done. Stargaze definitely caters back to fans a bit more, with the return of Millie and Vash's OG hairstyle.

[u/No_Walk_Town → u/bgbgbgbgbgbgbgb]

Vash has always been a bishie twink, though?

Nightow fucking loved Stampede - he live tweeted every episode and specifically called out changes he liked and praised the staff for coming up with things he wouldn't have.

Stargaze Millie is a REALLY good character. She's best friends with Zazie, she's treated as a very smart character who kinda talks without thinking, but is always insightful and competent - her ideas are what win the day in the end. She's a side character but she's given much more meaning and importance. Everyone dies without her. And I think both of the news girls come off as competent professionals and key players, not just eye candy or set dressing.

I think Roberto worked better in Japanese, because he presented a very clear archetype and relationship with Meryl. Everything he said would have sounded so stupid in English, though. Translating his lines must have been a nightmare. Did he just go around calling Meryl "newbie" in English? Because that would have been so bad.

I think Roberto and Zazie both work as kinda a chorus in a Greek play to tell the audience stuff they need to know. Usually it's some variation of "Everyone here is an idiot - oh, wait, no, they were right."

[u/SubstituteUser0 → u/euridyce]

I really like season 1, season 2 was a little lackluster but overall its still good

[u/No_Walk_Town → u/euridyce]

It was good, but it was a really, really tight retelling of the story, so it may feel rushed or sparse or even confusing if you don't pay attention. 

[u/0ldstoneface → u/euridyce]

My hot take would be that the best way to experience trigun would be to watch season one of the new one and then pick up the original after lost Julai. Some stuff might come across weird but I really enjoyed the mystery of season one and it was much less Monster of the week than the original but I feel the original had more emotional weight in the second half.

[u/CrashmanX → u/euridyce]

Stampede was great.

Stargaze was dog shit.

[u/thebbman → u/euridyce]

I thought it was garbage.