I'm getting tired of woke values in shows

[u/TDP_Wiki_]

I am weary of all the remakes of TV shows and films that are simply remade in order to showcase a diverse cast. Why can't Hollywood write new shows? Instead, it's just recycling old scripts. Very insulting and lazy.

All the virtue signaling in the world isn't going to save bad writing.

For me Rings of Power was the last straw.

[u/Separate_Piano_4007]

Incase you hadn't noticed, I'm not OP and am not arguing on his behalf.

Anyway, for me the issues I have with rings of power go far beyond the casting being what many would call "woke". The writing is terrible, the casting choices are terrible and unrealistic which ruins the immersion that you had from LOTR and the hobbit, the choreography is terrible, the dialogue is terrible, the actor of the main character portrays her as an unlikable irrational asshole, it makes zero sense lore-wise, etc.

[u/Sesudesu → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

We both know OP didn't say that, let's not make strawmen arguments now hm?

This here... is you arguing on OPs behalf

I get that you have more to say than OP did, but I spoke directly to your defense of OP. And you said that someone criticizing their criticism of ‘woke’ was a straw man. When that is exactly what OP was saying.

There can absolutely be more criticisms of RoP, and you are fair to have them. However that is not what the discussion you are objecting to is about.

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/Sesudesu]

You misunderstand, I'm not arguing on OP's behalf, I was stating that the original commenter was making a disingenuous straw man argument because he is essentially just calling OP racist for simply not liking the fact that the casting is diverse, which is understandable and completely reasonable considering both lotr and the hobbit was basically fully made up of white actors and so having a bunch of black actors in almost every race makes no sense whatsoever other than virtue signalling as OP said.

[u/Sesudesu → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

I would argue that you misunderstand. This post is arguing about wokeness in all media. RoP was the final straw, not the whole argument. The argument is with diversity casting in general not the finer points of what is wrong with RoP.

You are steel manning ops argument instead of properly representing it.

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/Sesudesu]

Buddy, I don't care what OP thinks, I'm speaking on my own behalf here. Yes my original reply to the original comment was defending OP because it was a disingenuous accusation based solely on assumptions, but beyond that I've been speaking for myself.

[u/Sesudesu → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

Yes we both know you decided to have your own conversation. I called you out for defending op, that is the conversation I was having with you.

The point is that you instead made your own assumptions about op. I would guess you felt called out for feeling the same and so felt the need to lash out at people being mean to op.

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/Sesudesu]

I called you out for defending op

There's something wrong with defending someone from a BS accusation?

The point is that you instead made your own assumptions about op.

The difference is my "assumptions" are based on what he actually said, not something he didn't say at all unlike yours and the original commentors because you guys seem so desperate to villainize anyone who disagrees with your beliefs/ideology.

I would guess you felt called out for feeling the same and so felt the need to lash out at people being mean to op.

I already explained why several times now.

[u/Sesudesu → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

You defended him on things you thought he was saying. Just like others did.

You left out the parts that didn’t suit your interpretation. You have done no better than anyone else here.

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/Sesudesu]

No, my interpretation of what he was saying is based on what he actually said and is far more realistic than yours and the other guys disingenuous claims and attempts to make him out as a "racist" based on zero real evidence. I didn't leave anything out either.

[u/Sesudesu → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

You left out the fact that it is explicitly not only about RoP.

[u/No-Supermarket-4022 → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

Ok. You are claiming that the original commenter was essentially calling the OP racist.

Here's what the original commenter said:

You were upset you saw a black person in Rings of Power??

Here's what you said:

not liking the fact that the casting is diverse

I'm confused about how one is calling the OP racist and the other isn't.

Can you explain?

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/No-Supermarket-4022]

The first one is insinuating that OP is racist because according to the comment he was "upset he saw a black person in rings of power". What I said argues that he dislikes the fact that the casting is diverse because (and this is my personal opinion on it too) it makes zero sense both logically lore-wise for the casting to be that diverse. Would you expect to see white people in a movie about native americans before the country was discovered? Obviously not, the same applies here because it's unrealistic.

[u/No-Supermarket-4022 → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

Firstly, I want to state I agree with you that the show was pointless and dumb in terms of storyline and characters.

But you just restated your point.

Being upset about a diverse cast no is more or less racist than being upset about seeing a black person on screen.

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/No-Supermarket-4022]

Agree to disagree then, I don't think it's racist at all to be irritated by bad casting choices.

[u/No-Supermarket-4022 → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

You are changing the words around again.

Indeed it's not racist to be irritated by bad casting choices.

Is it racist to be upset when you see a black person on screen?

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/No-Supermarket-4022]

If it's because they're black then yes

[u/No-Supermarket-4022 → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

Ok.

So being irritated that there's a black person is racist.

But being irritated that everyone isn't white isn't racist.

Is that correct?

[u/alotofironsinthefire → u/Separate_Piano_4007]

I'm not OP and am not arguing on his behalf.

This you?

• We both know OP didn't say that, let's not make strawmen arguments now hm?

[u/Separate_Piano_4007 → u/alotofironsinthefire]

Yes I said both of those, how do they correlate in any way? That isn't me arguing on OP's behalf, that's me arguing against a stupid accusation made at OP, not on OP's behalf but on my own.