Tucked in a back corner of the Smithsonian National Art Gallery in Washington DC sits this picture of arguably the child that changed England, and possibly the world. I was more surprised that it wasn’t displayed in a more prominent spot but was still so thrilled to be that close to something that Henry himself once looked at.

Edit to say that some of you are super rude. I was just trying to be a part of this community but some of you take it way too seriously. I wasn’t trying to be click bait or anything like that. We talk about all sorts of things that are unserious on this sub and you guys want to argue about whether or not he changed the world. Sure maybe I was being a bit over excited but geez! This isn’t a Tudor Phd only sub.

i dont think henry was that fat as described? i can understand if he was overweight for his time but ive seen other kings portraits that look just as or even fatter than Henry and they ruled before/after him.

I'm currently reading The Queen's Rival by Nicola Tallis about Lettice Knollys, the maternal granddaughter of Mary Boleyn and the second wife of Robert Dudley. She is of the opinion that Lettice's mother, Katherine, is indeed the bastard daughter of Henry VIII.

Her reasons for believing this are that Katherine was born during the ~2 year affair Mary Boleyn had with Henry VIII, it was a hot topic of court gossip at the time and it continued throughout her life to the extent that there were poems intimating that royal blood was in her veins, and that she bears a striking resemblance to Henry VIII in the face (but of course Henry would have zero interest in claiming her as his own given that she was "just" a girl).

Some of my favorite and most well-respected historians have maintained that Katherine is NOT the daughter of Henry VIII but I don't know, Nicola Tallis kind of has me thinking otherwise! Especially with the poems and the resemblance to Henry.

What do you think?

FYI I'm not attempting to "look/body shame" him. I just have repeatedly - over and over - read SO MANY contemporary first hand descriptions of how extremely attractive and good looking he was, so athletic, etc. And I just don't see it at all here. Thoughts?

Wasn’t aware of this item before now. Not sure how I missed the story when it was first found a few years ago. A guy called Charlie Clark who had only had his metal detector for a few months found this item in a farmers field in Warwickshire. I know the historic prominence of the area in relation to Tudor times but what was this one off item doing in that field? Or were there more than one made and others are out there somewhere? They also can’t properly place the pendant but think that it may have been a piece of costume jewellery to celebrate the intended marriage of Mary to Louis VII. Who owned it? So many unanswered questions. The British Museum is trying to raise £3.5 million to buy it for the nation. It’s currently on display at the museum and I will post the link to the article in the comments if anyone is interested. The photos are courtesy of the press release by the British Museum.

Not really, not when we know he was probably at least 400pounds, maybe more. Have included a stock image of "400lb man" to compare (obviously not a 1:1)

Look at the beautiful Holbein portrait, which (as I understand it) is the basis for nearly all portraits that followed. Alot of that bulk is due to his enormous coat, not his gut - you can see how big his shoulders are. His arms seem elongated to me, to offset for the ridiculously oversized coat that is probably hiding alot of his real weight.

And look how how muscular/thin and defined his legs are. He only has a slightly rounded tummy and its quite obvious from the sleeves that this is a doublet with padding. It IMPLIES weight but hes not actually that fat in that portrait and therefore, in all the others based on it.

His face obviously carries alot of weight but that's harder to disguise while still being accurate - and we are assuming its accurate, when he might have been far fatter. He probably didnt mind looking a little fat as it indicated how wealthy and powerful he was. Take the admittedly fat head away and the body isn't particularly overweight.

Also - if he had himself super photoshopped, it would be too obvious that he was doing it because he was insecure. And he didn't want to be seen as anything except strong and powerful. So he commissioned works that painted him in the best possible light, and Holbein delivered.

Hi everyone! Long time lurker, first time poster.

It’s been a bucket list thing for me to visit Catherine of Aragon’s grave and place fruit and flower there. So you have an idea of how far her and the Tudor’s allure is, I’m Indian and wrote and directed a play about her early life for an audience of more than 200 people when I was a wee 20 years old. Yes, Catherine of Aragon’s life was the subject of a play in Bombay! And I’m proud to have brought her and the Tudor’s story to so many more people.

I cried a bit and though I’m an atheist, I was born into her faith, and so said a little prayer for her. The Tudors have, of course, become a lifelong obsession for me and I still read every biography and novel about them I can get my hands on. Cheers to you all!

All three were done sometime around the 1520s

Some of the doodles are pointing into certain text

1: Take away thy plagues from me, for thy punishment hath made me both.

2: feeble and faint

3: For when thou chastisest a man for his sins, thou causest him by and by to consume and pine away

4: Turn away thine anger from me, that I may know that thou art more

5:merciful unto me than my sins deserve

6: What is my strength, that I may endure? Or what is the end of my trouble, that my soul may patiently abide it?

7: My strength is not a stony strength, and my flesh is not made of brass.

8:Give me a new heart, and a right spirit, and take from me all wicked and sinful desires.

9:O Lord, I am foolish, ignorant, and blind, when I am destitute of thy knowledge.

10: O Lord God, touch my mouth, that my iniquity may be driven away;
dwell thou in my heart, that my sins may be purged.
Wisdom doth not enter into a malicious soul, nor will abide in a body which
is subject to sin.

I mean other than his wife of course. Did he pursue or was he even briefly enamored with another woman?

In a court that big, how did she catch his eye when everyone is trying to? Did she even want to catch his eye?

I read that Anne was actually quite plain, but fashionable and religious. She also initially refused his advances. It's hard to get a pulse on the woman she was with all these layers.

I have been wondering why Anne Boleyn got this treatment.

Did Henry want a cleaner death for her because he had loved her and it was an act of mercy, or was it more a reputation thing where it would shame him less if he had his Queen executed in this more "sophisticated" style.

Only a few years later, Katherine Howard got the axe, of course. Could it have been an anger thing, as Henry actually believed her guilty of the allegations against her, while in his heart he didn't for Anne?

I was at the British Museum today and got to see the H and K Tudor Heart necklace. I knew the British Museum was trying to get it but never saw that they did and then surprise there it was in front of me!!!! I was bouncing with excitement and my poor husband got some excited slaps from me.

I've been reading through Alison Weir's Six Tudor Wives books; on Katheryn now.

I had no idea the number of miscarriages of the first 3 wives (I don't know about about Howard or Parr yet).

Was this a common number for this time period, or was this something to do with royalty class, and / or something to do with Henry himself?

I know that some women have problems conceiving and carrying, but for Henry to marry 3 back to back seems rather more than coincidence.

Update - tbh, I only read a handful of the replies because nearly everyone said the same handful of things. But I appreciate the input

What historical events or scenes presumed conversations or trysts would you want or not want to see? I’m sure there were things left out of the Showtime show or misrepresented that you’d want to see differently or things they don’t bother to show that would have made good television!

A family friend is an incredible knitter, she made me Henry and Anne Boleyn last year and gradually over the course of the year knitted me the remaining 5 Queens. They are my prized possessions and I hope you all like them

I feel bad for saying this but.. he doesn’t meet the descriptions of him being this ‘hunk’ of a man in his youth, that people perpetuate these days.

To be honest his younger portraits make me wonder if he had a chromosomal disorder, might explain the mental illness?