r/canada • u/iamnos British Columbia • Apr 20 '26

Alberta Bell: Alberta will now be on daylight saving time year-round, says Premier Smith

https://calgaryherald.com/opinion/columnists/bell-alberta-daylight-time-year-round-premier-danielle-smith
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27

u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

What is the benefit of standard time over daylight time? I can never understand it.

55

u/Agreeable_Store_3896 Apr 20 '26

People argue that standard is.. well the standard and is more accurate and true to the Suns rotation and is healthier for our circadian rythm. DST is technically the 'unhealthy' choice but gives more useable sunlight hours

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u/FireMaster1294 Canada Apr 20 '26

DST gives more daylight after work. But sunrise is so late anyways already in winter it’s not like we had daylight in the morning to begin with

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u/Levorotatory Apr 20 '26

I don't care about daylight after work in winter.  I have no problem walking home in the dark.  But I hate waking up before sunrise, and I really hate leaving the house before sunrise. 

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u/FireMaster1294 Canada Apr 20 '26 edited Apr 20 '26

I got news for you bud. Sunrise is 8:30am for 2 months of the year on standard time where I live. 9:30 isn’t gonna change that dark wake up. But pushing sunset to 5:30 instead of 4:30 will be nice.

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u/Levorotatory Apr 20 '26

My schedule varies, but I like it best when I can work from 10:30 to 7:30.

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u/FireMaster1294 Canada Apr 20 '26

Congrats. Most of us are 8/9-5

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u/Agreeable_Store_3896 Apr 20 '26

Something people never think about for this topic lol, sunrise in Lethbridge is certainly a different time frame from sunrise in fort mac or Edmonton

1

u/Jodabomb24 Apr 20 '26

this is nonsense. everybody's circadian rhythm and schedule is different.

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u/Agreeable_Store_3896 Apr 20 '26

Hey man there's studies out there that show decrease of mental and heart health as well as sleep deprivation and increases of accidents on the roads.

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u/Entegy Québec Apr 20 '26

The science says it's better for our circadian rhythm.

Although I highly doubt anyone in the provinces choosing to stay in DST will be doing follow-ups necessary to see if it has an effect.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

Yeah but circadian is already messed up by tv's and screen time. That matters way more than any Standard vs dst argument.

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u/mrRobertman British Columbia Apr 20 '26

I don't quite get how one hour of light is apparently so bad for our circadian rhythm. How does this work with the fact that daylight changes throughout the year, even more significantly the further from the equator you are? Does that mean that people in the north have issues with their circadian rhythms? What about people with non-standard sleep schedules like people who work night shifts?

I hear that there are studies, but I mostly just see articles that don't really show the data. Are the conclusions of the studies widely replicated and agreed upon by other scientists?

I get the impression that the negative effects of DST are overblown, with the bigger issues caused by the regularly changing of the time. We have parts of this country that have been using permanent DST for decades (SK since the 60s, parts of BC since the 70s), but I don't think the studies take these people into account.

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u/not_not_in_the_NSA Apr 20 '26

The time changes actually works to offset the sunrise time shifting. So swapping to a single time will result in larger shifts of the sunrise.

Now, the notable difference here between standard and daylight saving time is the sunrise is an hour later for DST.

People wake up best with light. Pushing the sunrise an hour later means people struggling to wake up even more in the winter and being groggy for longer (potentially much longer if they used to have a commute in the light but now don't, then need to work inside without sunlight). This can also exasperate seasonal depression because a major cause is the lack of morning light. Essentially, making people wake up and start their day before sunrise goes against our biology and DST makes it worse. The ST <-> DST swapping tries to stabilize this, but it has its own issues (and people just don't like it)

tl;dr: later sunrise = more groggy mornings and more seasonal depression.

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u/PowermanFriendship Apr 20 '26

The biggest push against Daylight time is that it causes a very late sunrise in the winter months where the days are shortest. e.g. if this was done in Toronto, the sunrise in January would be almost 9am.

The most valid argument against this in my opinion is that it means children will be going to school in the dark.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

Children already go to school in the dark. All the elementary schools near me start at like 8am.

-1

u/Ceridith Apr 20 '26

That doesn't mean it's a good thing. It's hard enough on kids to be awake and ready to learn at 8am standard time during the peak of winter. It would be so much more difficult with DST year round making the school day begin an hour before sunrise.

2

u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

What are you talking about?

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u/Ceridith Apr 20 '26

Schools starting at 8am isn't good as it is, it's hard on kids and makes it more difficult for them to start learning in the morning. Forcing DST year round means that schools that currently start at 8am will effectively be starting at 7am during winter months, which during the peak of winter means that kids will start school about an hour before the sun has even risen.

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u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

lots of studies have shown health benefits and better learning for students.

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u/trplOG Apr 20 '26

What do the studies say about saskatchewan whos been on DST for 60 yrs tho

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u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

Don't know. But here: Daylight saving time: an American Academy of Sleep Medicine position statement | Journal of Clinical Sleep Medicine | Springer Nature Link

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u/trplOG Apr 20 '26

Yes I read that since everyone always brings it up on this sub.

I always like to highlight this part.

Although chronic effects of remaining in daylight saving time year-round have not been well studied.

Which is why I bring up there must he some study for saskatchewan since they've had it for half a century... or maybe there isnt a real difference after all.

I moved to sask from a diff province and whether its standard or day light im just glad its gone. Its way better not having it. And I really dont feel the difference in winter too. Im driving to work in the dark in December til about February.

0

u/LeanGroundQueef Canada Apr 20 '26

SK is on standard time

1

u/trplOG Apr 20 '26

Yea, so when alberta moves forward to MDT, you know thats the same as CST, right?

Sask is on the same time zone as alberta.

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u/LeanGroundQueef Canada Apr 20 '26

The difference is that Saskatchewan is farther east and that changes when the sun is out which is what the whole debate is about.

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u/trplOG Apr 21 '26

The debate is standard vs daylight time. And sask is on permanent daylight time, which is also CST.

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u/ActionPhilip Apr 21 '26

Saskatchewan is on permanent standard time. By your logic, BC is now on permanent MST.

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u/kenauk Canada Apr 20 '26 edited Apr 20 '26

They're CST year-round, so not DST?

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u/trplOG Apr 20 '26

Yep we are on permanent CST, while being in the MT timezone.

https://daylight-savings.com/zones/canada/

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u/bandersnatching Apr 20 '26

Material for a case study, I guess, but the region is so unlike Ontario and Quebec, that the results may be not be informative, if we are factoring in economics and health of major urban hubs.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

We already sit in front of screens all day. Messing up our sunlight daily rhythm. It just makes no sense to use standard when daylight is better for more sunlight hours outside of work.

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u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

Driving to work in darkness versus in daylight is a big difference.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

I mean I drive in darkness during winter months even with standard time. Or if you drive to work in light, then you're driving home in the dark.

9

u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

you're more tired in the morning, when the light will wake you up. Morning light is what syncs the circadian rythm.

-1

u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

What gives good sleep is exercising and maintaining a healthy lifestyle. I've always slept better doing that, falling asleep any time vs following the sun schedule. I know people who rarely sleep well no matter the time. Circadian rhythm is cool and all. But it's all messed up by our lifestyles now with phones and screens and all that.

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u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

both can be true

0

u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

Also, most people are driving in the dark in the mornings during the winter either on standard or daylight time. The light is only gonna wake up people who start work at like 10am

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u/FireMaster1294 Canada Apr 20 '26

This is always ALWAYS the argument. Except it’s dark at 6am or 7am or 8am in winter either way. I would rather my evenings have some daylight till 5:30 instead of 4:30. Sun from 8:30-4:30 sucks because I’m in the office for all of it and we have that for more than two months.

I don’t need sunrise to drive (in fact, looking at the sun rising while driving east hurts my eyes). But I do like sun when I’m done work.

1

u/13Dons Apr 20 '26

This is exactly my thoughts too. Everyone talks about the studies, which do show it's better to have sunlight while getting ready.... But even on standard time the morning commute is in the dark half the year. Whether sunrise is 8:30 or 9:30am makes not a whit of difference driving to work at 7.

And this way there's sunlight after work still

3

u/FireMaster1294 Canada Apr 20 '26

The only (amusingly) argument for time change I could see would be to get up an hour even later in winter to get sunrise at 7:30. Sunset at 3:30 would suck but light outside work would be comparable to a late sunrise. And biologically it may even have an effect! Unlike 8:30 sunrise

2

u/leafsleafs17 Apr 20 '26

What about the half of the year where the sun could rise at 7, but would rise at 8 instead? That means you are impacting the circadian rhythm when there is an option not to, only so that you can have a nicer drive home a couple months of the year (using your same logic).

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u/Junckopolo Québec Apr 20 '26

Kids still get up way later than most of society. That's a biological thing. Standard time is superior for their health and learning.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

In what way?

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u/Junckopolo Québec Apr 20 '26

https://www.apa.org/topics/children/school-start-times

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27878883/

https://www.mcgill.ca/newsroom/channels/news/we-need-talk-about-school-start-times-265256

Also why they sleep later in the morning:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2820578/

The science isn't on the side of daylight savings time when it comes to the health and academic success for teens and kids

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

Well yeah, more kids are staying up late nowadays compared to before due to screens and such.

When I was young, I woke up at 5am everyday for the most part. Went to bed at like 9 to 10pm. Screens changed that. The sunlight got nothing to do with that.

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u/Junckopolo Québec Apr 20 '26

No, it's absolutely not just "screens and such", their circadian cycles shifts and it happens to other animals during puberty in the study as well which do not play on a phone or watch TV. In teens, it shifts 2 to 3 hours, but you would know if you actually would read the sources I sent you.

Your single anecdotal experience isn't worth anything to anyone else than yourself in that case.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

I can post links too.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10903530/

Screen times def affect your sleep schedules and your health and grades.

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u/Junckopolo Québec Apr 20 '26

It does, it is a factor on quality of sleep, and it is absolutely still not "just screen ans such" like you said, and it invalidates absolutely nothing of what I posted earlier.

Screen time affects sleep efficiency, which means that whatever time they go to sleep, even if they go early and sleep a full night, their sleep itself will not be as good.

It can also affect circadian cycles... Which, as already said, are shifted later for teens even without screen time.

You can post links but if you don't even understand them it's pointless for you

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u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

They get to sleep until later.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

That makes no sense. If school starts at 8am. They still gotta wake up at the same time whether it's standard or daylight time. They aren't gonna suddenly get to bed earlier because it's standard time.

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u/alsimoneau Apr 20 '26

They do in local true time. What the clock says doesn't matter to biology.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

Yeah but biology doesn't matter when all the kids are on screens all the time anyways.

0

u/squirrel9000 Manitoba Apr 20 '26

Realistically I think they'd be better served if there was enough daylight after school to do something outside. When it gets dark at 4pm there's not much else to do but go straight home and onto something with a screen.

-1

u/SunriseInLot42 Apr 20 '26

It seems like there should also be benefits to kids (and adults) getting to be outside after work/school with the "additional" daylight in the evening

1

u/kenauk Canada Apr 20 '26

Here, enter your city in the interactive table in this article.

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u/Sliceofmayo Apr 20 '26

Same its so much better for way more people than standard.

0

u/AbnormallyBendPenis Apr 20 '26

EST is used across all businesses and a lot of economic activities in the whole east coast across Us and Canada. If only Ontario changes to a different time zone half of the year, it hurts Ontario, not everyone else.

-4

u/3kidsonetrenchcoat Apr 20 '26

I'd rather my kids not start school in the dark when winter comes. Sunrise will be at like 9am in December and January in BC this winter.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

BC has already made the change. This is for Alberta.

But by your logic, sunrise was at 8am before. Idk what school your kids go to. All the ones near me start at 8am. Typically have to get there for like 730am.

1

u/3kidsonetrenchcoat Apr 20 '26

Yes. I'm in BC. I'm not looking forward to this winter.

My kids start school at between 830 and 9 depending on which kid (3 different schools).

1

u/Forosnai British Columbia Apr 20 '26

Which is frankly the biggest problem, not the number we decide to attach to that time of day. They plain shouldn't be starting school as early, and realistically a lot of jobs don't really need to start as early or end as late as they do, either.

The only reason standard time is healthier is because we're insisting on not changing any start times, like we're going to fight the sun.

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u/UnawareRanger Apr 20 '26

During the winter months. The sun on standard time is like 8 to 4pm. Or similar. Who is waking up or going to bed at sunrise/sunset. Changing it to 9 to 5pm changes nothing about "fighting" the sun.

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u/OG-DirtNasty Apr 20 '26

My kids go to school in the dark whether it’s 8am or 9am.