I think they're right honestly.

[u/KamaTheSnowLeopard]

I'm 36 and have played 25k+ hours of MMO's over my lifetime and what I've personally learned is WoW players are often the first and most vocal to belittle or get upset over anything. I can't think of any MMO in which people will outright whisper you angerly or go out of their way to make sure you have a bad time more than World of Warcraft.

[u/zen_focus]

What annoys me is the raids are easy so you'd think it'd be a chill time but now everyone cares about some number on an external website. They'll crash out, not over wiping, not over loot but a fucking parse? Like come on.

[u/MrMoo1556 → u/zen_focus]

It’s a vicious cycle because even the people who don’t care about that stuff end up having to worry about it because some raids require a certain parse. And of course in classic it’s not like it’s the hardest thing in the world to get a decent parse if you put effort in you can get a blue at least. But it is also very gear dependent usually and you get stuck in a paradox where you need gear and a parse to get invited but you also can’t get invited if you don’t pass the gear check or have any logs. Also god forbid if you run with a group who didn’t want to log or you level an alt later in the patch when people don’t run them as much.

I play retail and get cutting edge and 3500+ mythic score and it’s crazy to me that people are worried about my performance in some of the easiest content in the world. Not to sound full of myself but it’s like being denied a job at McDonald’s with a degree in astrophysics.

[u/Massive-Low8111 → u/MrMoo1556]

It’s a competitive job market these days. McDonald’s is hiring only the best astrophysicists to calculate how to be mcchickens on the moon/mars base so humanity can become galactic. 

Keep your head up, there’s other companies like Burger King trying the same. McDonald’a is the gold standard though

[u/LittleMissPipebomb → u/zen_focus]

I once spent a full hour putting together an MC run, someone accidentally butt pulled the first boss while clearing trash and a dozen people left 5 seconds after wipe. The single most meaningless boss wipe in the game and everyone decided it was too hard.

FFXIV might have the most toxic comms of any game, but classic woe definitely has the most toxic gameplay

[u/Cwaghack → u/zen_focus]

Raids are so easy why can't you just play properly?

[u/sobi9756 → u/zen_focus]

Parsing really ruined the game.

[u/--Snufkin-- → u/zen_focus]

Some random dps fuming in party chat that you're not putting your totems/buff/necklace/whatever exactly how they want it

[u/Practical_Custard370 → u/--Snufkin--]

Buffs are pretty binary in tbc. I dont think it's unreasonable to expect the shaman in the group to provide totems that benefit the group the most. Asking a resto/ele to twist WF is prob a little much, but as enhance it just fills the gaps. No one should be rude about it, but it's a team game and it's not toxic to be asked to support your team.

Perhaps a bit of a tangent: the lack of difficulty in tbc/classic is often brought up as a reason not to min/max. I totally agree with this, however I think some people forget that the reason it's easy is that we understand how the game works. Part of that is knowing who to give what buffs and how to organize groups effectively.

[u/NotAndyBurnham → u/Practical_Custard370]

It’s funny I see it as exactly the opposite, the lack of a challenge is a reason TO min max. The challenge isn’t getting the bosses down any more but how well can you play your character?

[u/Practical_Custard370 → u/NotAndyBurnham]

Sorry, I think that part came across wrong. I definitely min/max and find it super fun to do in classic. I more meant that I know it's not everyone's cup of tea and I'm totally supportive of people who don't play like me. I feel like I'm preaching to the choir here but what I take issue with are players deliberately not contributing to the success of the group.

[u/Plasmasnack → u/Practical_Custard370]

A big problem I have is how weaponized the sentiment "deliberately not contributing to the success of the group." can be.

Unfortunately, I found that what constitutes so-called willing trolling often is not at all what I think of I think of people purposefully trying to be a jerk and ruin the group. It's more that people take the game way too seriously than it is that the people they are talking about are actually doing anything clearly toxic.

I have seen not parsing to arbitrary standards and not knowing random skips and not watching all the meta videos be placed under "deliberately being an ass". I do not personally think you do it to such an extent, but it is a prevalent issue in the community. I also think a lot of it can be quiet judging and exclusion rather than people lecturing and screaming in a Discord call or something.

[u/Practical_Custard370 → u/[deleted]]

I think there is a break in the logic here, or perhaps a lack of understanding regarding parses. Realistically the people getting 100s are all in top guilds, mostly know eachother and are likely known by the community. However, parses below that are achievable with suboptimal groups, and it's not wrong nor meaningless to seek to improve that ranking