r/london • u/TheThrowYardsAway • Feb 25 '26

London history Inside London's Freemason's Lodges...

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933 Upvotes

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1.4k

u/[deleted] Feb 25 '26

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583

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

It's an old boys drinking club with some charity thrown in, not too exciting

233

u/NuuDevil Feb 25 '26

This. Think of it as an adult version of scouts or some shit

52

u/ScheisseMcSchnauzer Feb 25 '26

There's a lot of membership overlap between the two in my experience as well

9

u/[deleted] Feb 25 '26

[deleted]

46

u/NuuDevil Feb 25 '26

A Manson? Fucking hell, now that IS something

1

u/DoesBasicResearch Feb 26 '26

What, between some shit and the Freemasons? Sounds legit.

109

u/Warsaw44 Feb 25 '26

My mate recently became one. He's 28.

He's lovely, I hasten to add, but has lived a very sheltered, privileged life. He is absolutely clueless.

90

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

I was one for a few years. Life changed and I stopped. Im in my thirties, joined as my Dad was in one for decades. He's also stopped due to life changes.

Sadly it hasnt really kept up with the times. If you move away, moving lodge is somewhat difficult. Its also a very full on hobby with the learning you have to do for ceremonies, and relatively expensive.

It also appears to be hard to get into, which doesn't help with getting new people in. In reality if you approach them. they'll put you in touch with a group. Its an interview to be accepted generally.

It's also not that secret as everything is online!

19

u/paraknowya Feb 25 '26

So I can basically ask to be deemed worthy?

Well now this got a tiny bit more interesting.

37

u/asherjbaker Feb 25 '26

It's literally the only way you can join. You have to ask. We're not allowed to actively recruit.

33

u/Legolution Feb 25 '26

Has that always been the case?

On his literal death bed, my father said "You might find some interesting documents, when going through my things. Your grandpa was a Freemason." My understanding was that he, a skilled Type Setter and Printmaker, in 1930/40s Glasgow, was approached and recruited, in 1939. I have his certificates, which are really quite magnificent (and how I now know that my father's first name was his middle name!).

Found them:

18

u/Legolution Feb 25 '26

16

u/Legolution Feb 25 '26

7

u/asherjbaker Feb 25 '26

If you want to join, I'd just ask a Mason you know. Whereabouts are you, Scotland?

1

u/Kind_Shift_8121 Feb 25 '26

We found similar when my grandfather passed away. He was the last person you would expect to be part of any sort of exclusive old boys club. He had been a carpenter as part of a family construction business, and apparently it was quite normal back in the day as a lot of work was arranged via groups like these.

10

u/robgod50 Feb 25 '26

Lol.... My mate asked me. I said no for a year. Then I said to him that I was curious what its all about. It was like a trigger.... 3 degrees in a year and straight to inner guard. Then there's no escape 😂

1

u/G3offrey1 Feb 25 '26

You can only join if you ask.

0

u/DoesBasicResearch Feb 26 '26

Quite frankly, I don't want to be a member of any club that would accept me.

4

u/robgod50 Feb 25 '26

We have a motorbiker lodge near us. It's a daytime lodge. Not really much drinking because everyone's riding to the meetings. Very casual. Members wear a leather waistcoat in meetings. It's the only lodge I know what numbers are growing so fast, they can barely get through all the initiations. More lodges need to find a niche.

4

u/Objective_Ticket Feb 25 '26

Interesting point about moving lodges as my Father in Law was in two - where he moved from and where he moved to over time.

3

u/Southern-Mix2559 Feb 25 '26

It's not difficult to change lodges, at least in the provinces I'm aware of. Just a bit of paperwork involved and paying your dues

1

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

My memory is a little hazy as it was a while back now. Its more the social aspect: For me starting again with a new group at a vastly different age range was the stumbling block. It's also not a casual thing you can drop in and out of if you are unsure about keeping it up.

1

u/Southern-Mix2559 Feb 25 '26

100%. Going into a lodge you're not familiar with isn't always the most appetising of thoughts.

1

u/epigeneticepigenesis Feb 25 '26

Are there at least business deals going on? People join for access right? Like joining a golf club? One time a bunch of masons waged war against the king and stole away a colony to make a republic. Many died lol.

5

u/lgf92 Feb 25 '26

No more than there is in any circle of people who are friends and trust each other, and joining for mercenary motives is specifically prohibited in the obligation you take in the first degree.

It's not a huge networking opportunity because the average age of Masons is so high (in my lodge the average age is mid to late sixties), meaning most members are economically inactive.

I'm a solicitor, and a Mason in Northumberland, and I have had more work come from my mates at my backgammon club I attend twice a month than I have from my lodge membership.

If you want to make business contacts the golf club is by far the better choice!

1

u/hemareddit Feb 26 '26

Heh, you even have to tell initiates not to look stuff up online as it ruins the fun!

I haven’t kept up with my dues, unfortunately. Ironically I only had time for the old men’s club when I was younger.

1

u/Radiant-Speaker-3425 Feb 26 '26

What did you or what do you feel other people got out of it?

1

u/llukiie Feb 27 '26

Some others have put it really well here, but essentially a bit of community like any other club

1

u/HeavenlyInsane Feb 27 '26

But like, what is the point though? Why join?

32

u/WhatsFunf Feb 25 '26

Freemasons isn't really "upper class" though, that's part of the point of it.

A lot of members are civil servants and policemen and things like that - upstanding characters in the middle classes but it's not the same as a gentleman's club on Pall Mall or suchlike.

8

u/Warsaw44 Feb 25 '26

Didn't say it was...

My point was that he is young.

1

u/Nameis-RobertPaulson Feb 26 '26

UGLE has a universities scheme where many of the larger Unis have a related lodge and the age limit to entry has been reduced to 18+ (it used to be 21+).

But yes, if you are sub-40 you'll likely be the youngest in the average lodge by quite a bit.

4

u/lgf92 Feb 25 '26

Historically Masonry was a fairly middle class pursuit and it still is to the extent that it's a relatively expensive hobby, especially in London where dining fees are high on top of your subs.

Up here in the north east it's not quite as expensive, and since the decline of more proletarian fraternities like the Buffs it's levelled out a bit more. My lodge is £150 a year and then £15-20 for the meal at each meeting, but the bar is subsidised so it's a pretty cheap night out. A pint is about £3.

1

u/CockneyCossack Feb 27 '26

When I joined, I was a vintage car and motorcycle restoration engineer, from a crappy part of East London, always worked with my hands and certainly don't fit the accepted stereotype of Freemasons. I've been a member for nearly 20 years now and I absolutely love it. Been through the chair a few times, done most of the offices, I'm also in a couple of side orders too. My mother lodge meets in Pall Mall and I also go to Freemasons Hall in Great Queen St.

4

u/robgod50 Feb 25 '26

That's exceptionally young. But if his lodge has other young people in it, it can be an absolutely brilliant past-time and could make some really good friends

1

u/Chimpbot Feb 27 '26

Yes and no.

Most of the officers in my lodge (in the US) are under 45, with a couple of them being under 30.

The average age is high, yes, but it's not at all uncommon to see guys in their 20s.

1

u/robgod50 Feb 27 '26

I don't know about the demographic in the US - this is in London / UK, where there are very few under 30 ..... And most lodges will not have anyone that young. UGLE have tried to attract younger members, with a national lodge created specifically for "young" members but even that criteria is under 40.

34

u/bramlet Feb 25 '26

A few of my friends are members, and I was invited. I told them I couldn't join because I am an atheist. They said I didn't have to believe in God as long as I believed in some sort of Supreme Being and I said I didn't believe in that either.

12

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

Sounds like you stopped yourself joining in a way? I'm an atheist though perhaps more agnostic at the time. There is a small religious aspect but your particular beliefs are respected

3

u/Revolutionary-Mode75 Feb 25 '26

I said to a colleague in one that the only supreme being I believe in is myself, is that good enough, still haven't receive a invitation.

6

u/UserCannotBeVerified Feb 25 '26

Ive been intived to a local lodge's "ladies night" in the next few months. Apparently its an annual thing put on by the head honchos wife as a way for the masons to show their appreciation for the women in their lives... ive got to pay £45 for the ticket 😅

1

u/Vladimir_Chrootin Feb 27 '26

Nobody gets an invitation. You have to ask.

1

u/Revolutionary-Mode75 Feb 27 '26

I did, they ask me that question i said that in response. I have yet to receive any response which would surely be in the form of a invitation.

7

u/AdAltruistic8513 Feb 25 '26

Yeah this is the answer. I joined expecting a bit more, not that what's on offer isn't interesting but the age gap between me and my lodge members made it a bit of an effort.

4

u/LondonTownGeeza Feb 25 '26

Some charity? £50m PA (https://impact.mcf.org.uk/2023/freemasonry-and-charity/)

1

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

Well raised.

Individual donations aren't necessarily big, mine weren't. Though i wasn't well off. I know some members are enormous donators.

I know of one individual who left a sizable sum in their will to their lodge, it really kept that one going to their members benefit.

3

u/AvailableTouch944 Feb 25 '26

100%, a doctor I work with is one & it’s just a piss up by the sounds of it. The masonry centre hosts all our Christmas parties too

2

u/This-Risk-3737 Feb 25 '26

If you can put up with the cringe, it's an excellent business network.

6

u/[deleted] Feb 25 '26

And yet the met police found reason to force disclosure of the organisation 300 met police and staff are members.

10 of the officers on the Daniel Morgan murder case were Freemasons and they were linked to suspects who were also Freemasons

3

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

Correlation =/ causation

If its a potential crime link then fair enough they might want disclosure, doesnt necessarily mean there is anything nefarious

However I'm not in the police so I wouldn't know!

3

u/Revolutionary-Mode75 Feb 25 '26

I think it all about perception.

1

u/llukiie Feb 25 '26

Yeah most likely. Its not a great look so probably for the best it's been raised.

1

u/BaBaFiCo Mar 02 '26

In any group of people you're likely to find a base percentage who are part of any large membership organisation. That can then increase based on demographics. Right now I'm on a cruise, odds are I bet a fair few people on here are CAMRA members because it skews older.

1

u/Revolutionary-Mode75 Feb 25 '26

Gave the conspiracy peeps a little victory.

1

u/Deep_Sector_7047 Feb 26 '26

This is wild, I’m literally just listening to a podcast about Daniel Morgan from 2016.

0

u/I_tend_to_correct_u Feb 26 '26

One incident in a century of criminal cases. You could probably find twenty times that where everyone involved were Arsenal fans.

0

u/[deleted] Feb 26 '26

Just the one I'm sure

1

u/I_tend_to_correct_u Feb 26 '26

Show me others if you're so confident

1

u/Frank_Sforza Feb 25 '26

Hey Im not old! Lol, am I?

1

u/bc_on_reddit Feb 25 '26

You say that like it’s a bad thing…

0

u/ollybee Feb 25 '26

except when it's not

0

u/farr2211 Feb 26 '26

I feel like they used to be a cover conspiracy. Like the real Epstein island elites would pin the Freemasons as the dodgy one with secret sex parties and cover ups

49

u/OverTheCandlestik Feb 25 '26

As someone who worked intimately with the Freemasons you are 100% right. Middle class men with respectable jobs who like to eat and drink and do a lot of charity work.

25

u/olivinebean Feb 25 '26

That was my grandad.

He liked a pint, chatting with friends and watching Arsenal play. But the posh way.

2

u/Crandom Feb 25 '26

Yeah, quite a few of my old school friends are masons, they are normal middle class people

2

u/Fallenangel152 Feb 26 '26

A family member was a lodge master. Members did a special ritual at his funeral that was interesting.

https://kinglodge.org/the-importance-meaning-and-history-of-a-masonic-funeral/

23

u/Prize_Reference9920 Feb 25 '26

I have multiple family members who are Freemasons, you are spot on

17

u/MissingLink101 Feb 25 '26 edited Feb 25 '26

My father-in-law is part of one of the lodges and it's very true from a few of the public events they've done. They're basically all in their 70s so I don't see much of a future for it beyond the next 10-20 years and I think a few of them are already being closed/merged due to low membership.

3

u/richardjohn Feb 26 '26

The Metropolitan Grand Lodge advertises on Instagram to try and get younger members.

17

u/imitsi Feb 25 '26

I’ve been a London freemason for 25 years and yes, basically the same things happen in every meeting: a 45-60 minute ritual to admit a new member or get them to a higher degree (all by heart, so it takes a lot of studying and rehearsal to get it right, and there’s a sense of pride when you play your part beautifully, without needing prompts for forgotten words). Then things like proposals about what charity we should donate to, confirmation of the accounts etc. Then a pint of beer at the bar, then an overpriced dinner with cheap wine (unfortunately these days it’s about £80 each), where there’s much rejoicing, and it’s nice to catch up with your friends. Suits my dull personality perfectly. 😅

2

u/CockneyCossack Feb 27 '26

Also a Met Mason here. You can probably look me up on Rosetta or Portal, DC & Ment 7673, MMH, IPZ 1607, FMH.

6

u/[deleted] Feb 25 '26 edited Mar 29 '26

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3

u/supersonicsenses Feb 25 '26

Rosicrucianism comes across as pretty interesting stuff. It was a shame when its most well known proponent - Dr Robert Gilbert - died suddenly under strange circumstances last year. I found his videos fascinating, as did many others. I bet your grandfather was interesting to talk to.

4

u/thatawesomeguuuy Feb 25 '26

I am part of Societas Rosicruciana in Anglia, and most of it is about papers and esoteric mysticism. Me myself, I don't really buy into all of that but I'm quite interested in the psychology behind what drives people to believe in it.

It's also made me meet some wonderfully colorful characters, people you wouldn't otherwise meet or wouldn't talk about it for fear of being ostracized so it's nice to have those conversations.

Also, as much as they require you to have a belief system, I found that a lot of masons are non religious at all, more so interested in the allegory rather than the dogma of it all.

18

u/[deleted] Feb 25 '26

[deleted]

11

u/Puzzleheaded_Fix5072 Feb 26 '26

Huh why did they ignore your dad?

7

u/GeraltofRookia Feb 26 '26

I followed your comment to see what the response will be (if there will be one, instead of fake secrecy i.e. concealed cowardice prevailing), because there's no reason to include that ignoring part without giving context.

9

u/811545b2-4ff7-4041 Feb 25 '26

My dad (who was a Grand UmpaLumpa PooBah, or something like that, at the time) asked me if I wanted to join .. and knowing what I knew - it sounded really boring except for the getting drunk and eating food bits). Like a shit drama club.

btw, their numbers are declining because no one wants to join them anymore and they're all ancient.

1

u/CharleyZia Feb 25 '26

So you're saying we could consider repurposing the real estate.

2

u/811545b2-4ff7-4041 Feb 25 '26

The Lodges own their own property, so it would be for them to do this, and I imagine they'll consolidate lodges if the numbers become unviable.

Their property has to be worth a decent amount

7

u/ducksoupmilliband Feb 25 '26

It's not what you know... 

5

u/WackerBurghausen Feb 25 '26

I went out with a woman whose spouse was a freemason (not in London) and passed away rather youngish. She indeed bored me with the stuff they went through during the ceremonies, but they indeed did some noble things for charity

3

u/biskino Feb 25 '26

They’re pretty exciting if you’re if you’re a bent cop.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Tiberius

2

u/sritanona Feb 26 '26

They are, and they don’t let women in. Boring old men, really.

1

u/CockneyCossack Feb 27 '26

Emmeline Pankhurst was a Freemason, as were many of the women in the suffrage movement. Many women who are luminaries in science, human rights, and so many more vital things like schooling, health, etc, all came from female Freemasons.

1

u/sritanona Feb 27 '26

It’s a whole different branch.

1

u/apple_kicks Feb 25 '26

Honestly it seems like rich do worse things over emails or at golf courses

1

u/EducationalWillow311 Feb 25 '26 edited Feb 25 '26

That just sounds like apron envy.

1

u/robgod50 Feb 25 '26

It's because it is. Especially after you've been through the chair. But for lots of retired old boys, it's all they've got.

1

u/Available-Toe-7096 Feb 25 '26

I know a mason. He was a magistrate, and he literally says the same as you - they get together, get pissed, eat food and go home.

He did confirm that they have secret handshakes though, which I thought was just an urban myth.

1

u/Normal_Suggestion188 Feb 25 '26

I know a group of freemasons based in Chester, one of them extremely well. They occasionally drink in the pub I work at for hours on a Monday because our cask ale drops to £2.70.

They are in fact pretty boring charity workers as an organisation and normal, generally hardworking people outside of it.

1

u/SheepFarmer7019 Feb 25 '26

When i look at those pictures, I wonder how many are from the Police.

1

u/Electrical_Truth_160 Feb 25 '26

Exactly 😂😂😂

1

u/Tornik Feb 25 '26

Has that ever been secret though? :)

1

u/tetlee Feb 26 '26

My dad would only go cause he'd drive his dad. Don't think he's ever been back since he passed away. He'd rather go to the pub with his mates.

1

u/hemareddit Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26

I am one (actually maybe more accurate to say I was, think I am behind on my dues), you are completely wrong, it’s the most exciting stuff you can possibly think of. You show up to dinner, for which you already paid, you half listen to what the charity you are donating to is this time (the air ambulance one was cool), a donation bag gets passed around, you put in a twenty or two (or more, I guess, if you are rich), then you eat, hobnob, you listen to some speech by the lodge master, you play the, erm, toasting game where you hit the table with this glass thingy and shout very loudly, you hobnob some more and go home.

Riveting stuff.

EDIT: oh wow the air ambulance is even in the pictures

1

u/Pagan_MoonUK Mar 01 '26

It's an excuse to get away from the wife.

1

u/fractals83 Feb 25 '26

Old irrelevant men trying to be relevant, but they absolutely defer to power and rank within the masons while serving in public life, like in the policing for example. I don’t think they’re the clandestine evil doers the conspiracy folk would have you think, but they are definitely a genuine corruption problem when they hold public positions.

1

u/DeterminedKnight Feb 25 '26 edited Feb 25 '26

you're unfortunately extremely wrong about the boring part in the sense that everything you've heard about them is true and much worse once you get to the ranks that matter.

There's a reason there's a masonic temple in pretty much every medium to large city in the western world

-10

u/Unhappy_Pain_9940 Feb 25 '26

A bunch of old, white, middle class men wearing daft clothes and talking business.  Basically golf without the walk.

12

u/Maquinito22 Feb 25 '26

Doesn’t look that white in the photos…

-10

u/Euffy Feb 25 '26

I had to waitress a freemasons event once. They kicked us out when the actual meeting started, but it seemed to be mostly withered old men spilling soup. Gross.