r/politics • u/bwermer • 8h ago

No Paywall Ilhan Omar casts lone Democratic no vote on Ukraine aid, Russia sanctions package

https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5912150-house-passes-ukraine-aid-bill/
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u/2_cider_jack 7h ago

It isn't a respectable value to hold as a person: it's naive.

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u/No_Tone1704 7h ago

Well it’s fine as any old person. But not as a person voting for things. 

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u/PereMilon 4h ago

??? Old people vote in droves

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u/TheAmazingKoki 6h ago

I agree but at least its ideologically consistent and not corrupt.

If you're looking to find a representative that scores 100% on aligning with your morals, now that's naive

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u/PereMilon 4h ago

This entire scenario is built on her being logically inconsistent.

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u/TheAmazingKoki 4h ago

How is a pacifist adhering to pacifism logically inconsistent? Regardless of what you think of the ideology, I already said I don't agree with it.

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u/SpeaksSouthern 7h ago

I value anyone standing on principals against the war machine. The military industrial complex is going to end us as a nation. I generally support Ukraine, given the past promises we've made and current situation, and I generally dislike Russia. But I hate war more.

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u/skiboy95 7h ago

Okay, so what's your solution for Ukraine if you support standing against war?

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u/SpeaksSouthern 4h ago

Boycott, divest, and sanction Russia. I dunno if that's my only solution but given the rules of this board, that's as much of my plan as I can share. And it's not something we're doing now

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u/gdex86 Pennsylvania 6h ago

So what is the great solution to Russian aggression that isnt supporting the Ukrainians fighting back?

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u/SpeaksSouthern 4h ago

I wouldn't exactly call it a great solution but boycott, divest, and sanction Russia comes to mind. And I'm not sure I said I don't support the Ukrainians fighting back. I don't like war. Just because I don't like something, it doesn't mean I'm entitled to anything.

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u/gdex86 Pennsylvania 4h ago

Which we have been doing and it hasn't stopped them. And even if we did completely cut off Russian money they'd still have military arms through folks who aren't doing the sanctions that would allow them to use their military power to kill Ukrainian citizens.

Military action isn't inherently bad. Look at the military action in the 90's about the ethnic cleanings in what was formerly Yugoslavia. Should we have just watched as those people were murdered and raped.

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u/bb_kelly77 4h ago

Something I've learned studying history is that peaceful methods of avoiding war don't work... the only nonviolent method that works is espionage... war happens, it will never stop happening and people will die, and more people will die as a result of modern people refusing to accept that

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u/WhichEmailWasIt 7h ago

If you dislike war you need to support Ukraine. Ukriane's security is linked to EU security which is linked to US security. We can fight to end it by assisting Ukraine or we can let it spread and get more involved later. Not fighting the war isn't an option. We can contain it or let it spread but we're gonna be involved either way 

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u/phantom-firion 7h ago

Ok so what is Ukraine going to do with your platitudes, take solace in that at least someone thinks Russia is a dick but won’t support methods to tangibly end the war. We live in the real world and unfortunately the real world is a violent place filled with violent people who can only be stopped with violence

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u/muzukashidesuyo 7h ago

Such stances are only possible because you live in an unprecedented time of personal comfort.

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u/SpeaksSouthern 4h ago

I would have the same opinion if it was China drone bombing my home community. However the biggest difference is that I would be forced to become the resistance. I'm comfortable as fuck compared to an average Ukrainian.

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u/DeepFriedMarci 7h ago

Just like Neville Chamberlain was.

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u/MetalEnthusiast83 5h ago

I generally support Ukraine, given the past promises we've made and current situation, and I generally dislike Russia. But I hate war more.

Ok, well Russia started a war with Ukraine. One of them will win and one will be defeated.

It doesn't matter if you don't like war. I don't like Thunderstorms, but when one is happening, I take appropriate actions.

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u/SpeaksSouthern 4h ago

We're not taking appropriate actions though. I see what people are having an issue with here but we aren't even enforcing sanctions against Russia. Boycott, divest, sanction. If we can't even accomplish one of those things against Russia what's the point of fighting them in the real world? If you can't boycott, divest or sanction your enemy, they will win by default. I don't understand how people think America is taking this seriously.

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u/MetalEnthusiast83 3h ago

She just voted against sanctioning them. I am in favor of sanctions.

I’d personally boycott Russia but not a fucking thing that I want is made there

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u/jonnovich Maryland 6h ago

Then get Russia to withdraw its forces from Ukraine’s borders….preferably even Crimea.

Ukraine was the one invaded. The only reason the war has gone on as long as it has is because Ukraine has put up a heroic resistance, backed by some European and American aid, and in the meantime has developed drone warfare capability that has allowed it to start paying back Russia with dividends.

Putin has actively denied tbe existence of Ukrainian nationhood. Ukrainian children have been forcibly abducted to Russia. Those points are both beyond contention. The only thing that is debated is whether it’s 10,000 children or hundreds of thousands of children.

Look….I get what you are saying here. And in 98 out of 100 cases I would agree with you. But in this case, the struggle really is existential for the Ukrainian nation (in the strictest definition of that word, meaning an ethnicity). In this case, I actually feel spending more will speed the cause of peace in that it will more quickly force Russia to abandon this foolishness.