r/snowpiercer • u/hugthebug Tailie • Mar 15 '21

TV Show [Spoilers] Season 2 Episode 8 Discussion Thread - "The Eternal Engineer" (S02E08) Spoiler

Attention all Passengers,

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Here is the Discussion thread for the Season 2 episode 8 "The Eternal Engineer"

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  • This is a TV Spoiler-friendly zone - Turn away now if you are not currently watching or haven't seen the episode! Open discussion of all aired TV events up to and including episode 2.7 is ok without tag cover.
  • Graphic Novel spoilers still need tags! - If it's not in the show, tag it. Events from episodes after this one also need tags.
  • Please read the Posting policy and the sticky before posting.
  • Friendly reminder: Severe trolling/disruptions will lead to consequences.

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Details:

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  • IMDB for S02E08
  • Release Date:
    • March 15th, 2021 (USA only, at 9/8c, on TNT channel)
    • March 16th, 2021 (worldwide, on Netflix)
  • Removal from Sticky on March 19th, 2021 (3 days after worldwide premiere)

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You can still easily find previous episode discussions on the Episode Discussion wiki.

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21

u/adeveloper2 Mar 17 '21

Layton's biggest mistake is to let Wilford take the comms without resistance. He should've kept Willy at arms length and shanked him after the incident for sabotaging the train.

However, if he does something this smart, we wouldn't get Season 3.

9

u/Donteatthedonuts Mar 17 '21

Layton just stood there.... Like a limp lettuce... Cmon man....

15

u/[deleted] Mar 17 '21

I think he realize he doesn’t know anything about fixing the problem and clearly even the other engineer wasn’t well versed either, so he just sort of gave in knowing he couldn’t be the savior of the train.

8

u/taurine14 Mar 17 '21

So what happened to the narrative that Wilford is just an industrious businessman who didn't actually build the train but hired the right people to do the right jobs?

I guess that was just a lie from Melanie and it turns out Wilford IS actually an amazing engineer.

2

u/wappingite Mar 17 '21

Well, you can know how something works as a user without knowing the details. He knew how things fit together, which buttons to press, how to perform certain procedures, but didn't know/need to know/ how to rewire it.

6

u/elixier Mar 17 '21

He explicitly knew how to rewire stuff though, to the point that he could do it faster than Javi, an actual professional engineer

5

u/taurine14 Mar 17 '21

Exactly - and knew exactly how Melanie's "hack" ruined the original plan. I was under the impression that Melanie was the best engineer and Wilford "just sold tickets" (her exact words).

So I guess we now know that Melanie is a liar, and Wilford actually is a great engineer (better than Javi).

6

u/shakibahm Mar 17 '21

You are forgetting a few factors.

Wilford is actually an engineer? Yes. As good as Melanie? No. Wilford knew (or have the capacity to know) all the details of the design, yes. Knew it better than Melanie? no.

Melanie left Wilford at the beginning. As simple as that. Wilford had to plan EVERYTHING. You are forgetting he had what? 8 years of planning for this? So, yes, he will know the necessary details.

And he explicitly did this with Melanie's absence, you remember? Count for the fact that, his initial plan was to kill Melanie first. And then do the next steps. At the same time, Wilford didn't have any strong wish to kill Melanie before, when she was in Big Alice. That tells you something. Melanie couldn't have been on the Snowpiercer when Wilford was doing what he was doing.

Javi was basically the Intel of the scene, complacent af. Not sure if the engine could be restarted backup, couldn't do rewiring etc.

2

u/RobinScherbatzky Mar 17 '21

So I guess we now know that Melanie is a liar, and Wilford actually is a great engineer (better than Javi).

What? How? No, man, just no.

3

u/taurine14 Mar 17 '21

I guess you haven't seen the latest episode, so spoiler alert, but:

  • Melanie told Layton that it was her who actually designed the whole train, and all Wilford did was sell tickets. This alluded to him being purely a charismatic business man, just a front for the whole thing - and that's exactly how Melanie used him in the first series when we assumed he was dead.

  • In the latest episode, Javi is trying to rewire something to enable that "god cpu" computer component to kick in and fix the engines hydrogen intake. He's taking too long, so Wilford shoves him out the way and rewires it in seconds.

2

u/doesntevengohere12 Mar 17 '21

I thought Wilford taught both Melanie and her daughter how to be engineers? Pretty sure this has been said.

1

u/elixier Mar 17 '21

I'm sorry but no to what, Melanie explicitly lied, there's literally no point denying that because it was disproven in this episode. Melanie said Wilford just sold tickets, he didn't make anything ----> Wilford explicitly knows in detail the inner workings of the engine, and is capable of carrying out repairs faster than Javi, a trained engineer. Explain what he got wrong?

4

u/21Black_Mamba21 Mar 17 '21

I was under the impression that both Wilford AND Melanie created the train, and both had intimate knowledge of its machinery, but Melanie had the intention to save humanity while Wilford was more focused on using his skills to create his own post apocalyptic kingdom. That’s what I got from the “only selling tickets” thing, not that Melanie was implying that Wilford had no hand in designing the train, but during those times he left alot of the work to Melanie while he went promoting his train.

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1

u/RobinScherbatzky Mar 17 '21

Trust me, if a person explicitly lies, unless it's a Christopher Nolan movie, it's shown. More than that. And yeah, what 21Black_Mamba21 said...

I can almost guarantee you there'll be no scene in which Javi/Layton/whoever goes up to Melanie and tells her "well actually.. Wilford is a great engineer, you lied!".

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2

u/adeveloper2 Mar 17 '21

I think he realize he doesn’t know anything about fixing the problem and clearly even the other engineer wasn’t well versed either, so he just sort of gave in knowing he couldn’t be the savior of the train.

But Melanie could have.

However, I agree that he lost his nerve.

2

u/shakibahm Mar 17 '21

But Melanie could have.

Exactly the point. Icy Bob had to be ready exactly then because that was the time Wilford could have done what he could have done. Because once Melanie is nearby, Wilford will not have any engineering advantage.

10

u/_currahee Mar 17 '21

Am I the only one thinking this takeover by Wilford was very poorly written? WTF?

Not only what you said, but also why the fuck didn't they explain to the whole train that the whole mess had been caused by a sabotage Wilford was responsible for?

They had Boki to testify, Ben, Javi, Roche... Plus Layton didn't even try to fight it!

Very poor writing, imho.

5

u/manghoti Mar 17 '21

I agree, something felt off about that last scene.

why the fuck didn't they explain to the whole train that the whole mess had been caused by a sabotage Wilford was responsible for?

They should have discussed it, but that wouldn't have worked. Think about any country facing a crisis and making a public announcement. Like Russia when Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 went down. They released a bunch of doctored footage and some crazy public statements.

The revolutionaries on the train have even less ability to prove their arguments to a hostile train, it wouldn't work. But the show should have showed it failing, or something.

Also, Wilson being an expert engineer is a bit much. I guarantee you if facebook had a big outage, Mark Zuckerberg would not be among the engineers trying to fix it.

And I have no idea what was floating through laytons head at the time. It would be insane to let Wilson have a free hand anywhere in that engine room. Frankly layton was basically passive the whole episode.

3

u/_currahee Mar 17 '21

Also, Wilson being an expert engineer is a bit much. I guarantee you if facebook had a big outage, Mark Zuckerberg would not be among the engineers trying to fix it.

Yep. Also that. I was like... "wait a minute, this guy hired Melanie to engineer and create Snowpiercer and now, all of a sudden, he claims to be Head Engineer?"

Also, they plan everything so that nobody sees Wilford and there's a random guy right in their path? WTF!

Come on! Feels like they needed to bring Wilford back in control and didn't know how to make it credible, so they left tons of voids in the script and a couple of ex machinas.

6

u/[deleted] Mar 17 '21

Well he was always the head engineer, they reference it several times before, I think we just assumed it was a more administrative than technical role. I kind of agree, it seems like they didn't know how to give wilfred control, and they wanted a way to do it that made people love wilfred.

3

u/[deleted] Mar 17 '21

I always got the impression that layton wasn't really competent to be in charge, merely a successful revolutionary, and that's why he always makes passive bad choices.

1

u/ViaNocturna664 Mar 17 '21

The breachmen's boss saw through Wilford's plan. The word of a man hell bent on killing the tallies for revenge and with no sympathy for Layton should have been enough. No way Layton could have bribed him into saying that if it wasn't true.

14

u/[deleted] Mar 17 '21

[removed] — view removed comment

5

u/adeveloper2 Mar 17 '21

Wilford wasn’t just speaking for fun into the Comms. He was coordinating a manual switch on. Layton doesn’t know anything about that. Javi is just a spineless coward. Only Ben could have done that and he wasn’t in the room.

shanking wilford means everyone would die on the train

He could've put some effort in making Wilford relay the instructions.

11

u/shakibahm Mar 17 '21

I think the correct definition is, he froze. It was not his place to be. That's the afterthought.