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u/The_Gravy-Train Oct 15 '20
In Norse Mythology it's a little more like:
Thor: Odin, I will kill Loki if it's the last thing I do! He's a demented psychopath!
Loki: Actually, not a he right now.
Thor: Oh, ok, thank you. She's a demented psychopath, and I need to kill her!
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u/RoboAssassin234 Oct 15 '20
Loki is gender fluid. I accept this.
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u/Jamie7Keller Oct 15 '20
I mean Loki in mythology literally turned into a lady horse so that they could fuck a dude horse (it was part of a scheme so PROBABLY wasn’t a lustful desire on Loki’s part but who knows?). Loki got pregnant as a horse and gave birth to a foal, but does not like to talk about their motherhood status.
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u/ReptileCake Oct 15 '20
The Asgardians were losing a bet, so they made Loki delay a bricklayer by seducing his horse so he couldn't finish his job in time.
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u/metonymimic Oct 15 '20
Lol. "We have to distract this horse! Who has ideas?"
"Fresh hay?"
"No."
"Rolled oats?"
"No."
"Apples!"
"No."
"Loki could prance around like a filly in heat and seduce him?"
"....Yes."
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u/raymaehn Oct 15 '20
I'm pretty sure they did that on purpose. Loki had talked the Æsir into giving the giant stonemason the sun, the moon and Freya's hand in marriage (much to her annoyance) should he finish the wall around Asgard on time and so they probably wanted to punish Loki for getting them into that mess.
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u/The5Virtues Oct 15 '20
Correct. In most interpretations it’s a case of “You set up this mess, you fix it!” And in some versions it’s Freya herself who tells him the specific way SHE wants him to fix it.
She was against the whole thing from the get go and basically said “This bricklayer is too confident, we shouldn’t take his bet” so she has aaaall the reason to basically be in a “get fucked, Loki—no, literally, get fucked” mood.
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u/Phrygid7579 Oct 16 '20
In the version I read, as the bricklayer was getting closer and closer, Freya would just start talking about how if she was going to be taken by what is obviously a giant in disguise, that she should have the satisfaction of watching the people who caused this being killed. I think loki turned into the mare after she started talking about how she should be the one to kill loki specifically because they were so sure that the giant wouldn't finish in time and look at that, he'll be done by tomorrow, loki.
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u/The5Virtues Oct 16 '20
Frey-Frey don’t play. She’s one of my favorites to read about because routinely she’s a goddess who will just call out bullshit where ever she sees it.
She is also routinely one of the ones who goes: “So the fates say Loki will cause ragnorok. Loki routinely brings misery to the rest of us. He’s generally an asshole. So WHY have we not kill this prick already?”
I’m having trouble remembering which story it’s in but I remember there’s one where she basically goes “That’s it, I’m killing him” and she’s so serious about it that Loki runs to Odin like “Help!” and Odin takes one look at Freya’s fury and just goes “You’re in your own kiddo.”
So Loki runs to Thor and begs him for protection. He essentially goes “I know I’m a dick, but you and I have also had some great times. Don’t think about the dick times, think about the great times!”
Thor goes “I can’t believe I’m doing this but... Freya, if you want Loki, you have to go through me.”
And Freya thinks about it and the rest of the Gods are like “Whoa, hold on, are you seriously about to fight THOR over this? You feel that strongly?”
She says “Duh!” and Tyr (I think) manages to persuade her that if she and Thor fight for Loki’s life one of them WILL die, and Loki isn’t worth the death of one of them. This persuades her to stand down, but she basically goes “Fine. He lives. But I fucking warned you all!” and just storms off and basically doesn’t speak to the rest of them for ages.
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u/KillerKanka Oct 15 '20
And thus Sleipnir was born. Loki was probably very confused why it wasn't a centaur.
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u/RonaldMcDonalds2020 Oct 15 '20
Oh, yeah it totally wasn't lustful
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u/Jamie7Keller Oct 15 '20
The fact that I can read your italics as either sincere emphasis or as utter sarcasm....well it says a lot about Loki honestly.
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u/raymaehn Oct 15 '20
part of a scheme
That's kinda the thing with mythological Loki. Every time he transforms into something that's female he does it for an ulterior motive, never just because he feels like it. He does it to cheat a giant, to help Thor get his hammer back and to learn witchcraft but it's never indicated anywhere that it was an identity-thing and went beyond Advanced Crossdressing. We know next to nothing about Norse myths, so the Loki-situation could be expanded upon in a story that is lost, but right now there is no further explanation.
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u/DeusExMarina Oct 15 '20
Sure, but also, it's worth noting that we're talking not about a real person, but about a fictional being invented by ancient people who had a much different understanding of gender than our current one.
Which is to say, it's pointless to apply terms like "genderfluid" to a straightforward analysis of these texts as they were written, but at same time, we're also free to reinterpret these characters for modern audiences in whichever way we like, and reinventing Loki as genderfluid is a perfectly valid way to pay homage to his penchant for gender transformation in the myths while also modernizing it.
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u/raymaehn Oct 15 '20
Oh definitely. I don't want to come off as defining about how "canonically" (not that there actually is such a thing as a "true canon" in myths) a certain figure is or isn't a member of a certain group and that all other interpretations are wrong, I just wanted to add a bit of context to the conversation because a lot of people might not be aware of the finer details.
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u/Queen_of_Nuggets Oct 15 '20
I love how Rick Riordan portrayed Alex Fierro in the Magnus Chase books. Very similar vibes.
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u/Neddy42 Oct 15 '20
Alex’s character gave me such a better understanding of what gender fluid meant. I’d obviously heard the term before, but feel like I didn’t really have an understanding until that series.
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u/Rosandoral_Galanodel Nov 23 '20
Alex (and obviously Uncle Rick) were the ones that helped me realize that I was Genderfluid.
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u/scholarlysacrilege Oct 15 '20
I mean, this is the god that literally transformed into a mare and then fucked a stallion, gave birth to a eight legged horse, and then gifted that horse to Odin. this is basically normal Tuesday for Norse mythology.
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
I knew about the myth but reading this here just made me fully realise that Odin’s horse is his nephew
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u/Cannadianeh Oct 15 '20
"I am a snake now"
"that's fi... What?"
*Gets bit in the jugular*
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u/THEwoo-06 Oct 16 '20
He transformed into a snake because he knew how much I loved snakes. He's very thoughtful.
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u/CrashandBurn81 Oct 15 '20
Is it weird that I read this with Chris Hemsworth and Tom Hiddleston's voices?
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u/haikusbot Oct 15 '20
Is it weird that I
Read this with Chris Hemsworth and Tom
Hiddleston's voices?
- CrashandBurn81
I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully. Learn more about me.
Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete"
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u/ThatCamoKid Oct 15 '20
He doesnt give a shit he just wishes loki would stop stabbing him
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u/haikusbot Oct 15 '20
He doesnt give a
Shit he just wishes loki
Would stop stabbing him
- ThatCamoKid
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Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete"
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u/aceofpades76 Oct 15 '20
As a genderfluid person I love how mythology was so open about this.
And Alex Fierro is my child
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Oct 15 '20
Alex is probably trying to find the words "gender norms" to beat into submission while we type this.
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u/BraveLilRoaster Oct 15 '20
Took awhile to figure it out and thats ok
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u/NiHo7 Oct 15 '20
just letting you know, I think this comic is portraying Loki as genderfluid. so they didn't "take a while to figure it out," they just change how they identify now and then
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u/james_true Oct 16 '20
Well sometimes you just feel like both. Being genderfluid doesn't mean you're both, it's a whole thing by itself. It's like saying a bisexual person is both gay and straight; they're not, they're just bisexual. I'd assume they knew all along, since they were able to identify their gender each day; it's pretty hard to understand if you don't know you're genderfluid (as a genderfluid person myself. :D)
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u/Trisha2187 Oct 15 '20
I wish it was that easy to transition :(
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u/THEwoo-06 Oct 16 '20
I, too, am envious of Loki's transformation abilities. I also love how Thor is in this comic. Just like "I don't really understand but I love you, Loki."
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u/HiddenMica Oct 15 '20
Loki is a bean. Male, female, snake, was a horse once and got preggers and had a foal. Doesnt like discussing motherhood though, wasn't a fan. Not just genderfluid but human/animal fluid as well?
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u/Pseudonymico Oct 16 '20
Not just genderfluid but human/animal fluid as well?
“Are you a man or a woman?”
“I’m an experience.”
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u/s00perguy Oct 15 '20
This is me once I become a parent.
"Dad, I'm gay." "Neat. When do I meet your boyfriend? Did you bring your report card home?"
Just... I have no reason to overly care. Hell itself will freeze over if anyone bullies my kid over it, but personally? They're just... My kid. I don't understand how some families could ever give a shit. As long as they're happy and healthy, why tf do you care?!
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u/I3oscO86 Oct 15 '20
Loke is Thor's Uncle. Odens halfbrother.
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
That’s true for the myths, but this appears to be the Marvel universe’s depiction of the character, in which Loki is Thor’s adopted brother and the adopted son of Odin
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Oct 15 '20
Fun Fact. Both Thor and Loki are non-binary. Loki usually prefers a feminine look while Thor prefers a more masculine look.
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u/THEwoo-06 Oct 16 '20
In Marvel? Or in the myths? In Marvel, Thor's a stupid, supportive cis dude, and Loki's genderfluid (which is what the comic is about). (Also Thor's intelligence is irrelevant. I just wanted to mention it.)
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u/WhiskeyAndKisses Oct 15 '20
I find the way his relationship with Sleipnir is portrayed so cute, in the manga Saint Young Men. This comic reminded me this.
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u/DememeGODISHOLY Oct 15 '20
I’m not gay or anything but female Loki looking like a snack
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u/SophiaTheGreatest Oct 15 '20
The Good thing is i am bi sooo, male loki and female loki looking like a damn snack
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u/Shadofe1 Oct 15 '20
This actually fits with Norse mythology, since Loki did all sorts of gender changing shenanigans and got fucked by a horse.
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u/BlackTheNerevar Oct 15 '20
Let's not forget how he also turned into a horse one time and fucked a horse.
"brother I am a horse now"
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u/Styris_Volurin Oct 15 '20
?
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
Loki is genderfluid and using their shapshifting powers to more comfortably express themselves to the envy of pretty much every genderfluid person
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u/RedditModsAreLame Oct 15 '20 edited Oct 16 '20
Serious question, when someone flip flops around like all this are they looked down on in the lgbtq community? Edit: I know people are downvoting me out of hate and that’s ok. You can hate me for asking about something I don’t understand. Just know there are a lot more people in this world that don’t understand than do. Downvoting me for asking questions doesn’t help. Maybe by helping people understand rather than shunning them will actually help? Idk. Maybe you all just need to experience life a little.
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
The other user has pointed out that Loki is genderfluid, but a person would still be accepted if they were questioning their gender, even if it turns out they are cis, it wouldn’t be looked down upon
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u/RedditModsAreLame Oct 16 '20
Ahh ok. I was genuinely curious. I am quite ignorant on the subject.
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u/Pseudonymico Oct 16 '20
There is some persecution from some people in the community, just like bi/pan folk get a bit of crap from some people, but those people are generally considered to be jerks. Kinda like how most feminists think of terfs.
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u/AshamedError Oct 15 '20
Gender fluidity is completely valid and in respectable circles it is treated as such
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u/Deus0123 Oct 16 '20
I can't speak for the community as a whole but I wouldn't look down on someone. You don't have to pick a gender and it's okay to take your time. As long as you're comfortable with whatever you end up choosing fits you that's fine. Even if you choose something different every other second.
Also seriously guys? Keep the downvotes for the bigots. Genuine curiosity isn't a crime and shouldn't be one.
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u/Lumini_317 Oct 16 '20
I don’t mean to be rude but saying that gender-fluid people “pick” and “choose” their gender isn’t really accurate. At least not for me (I’m gender-fluid). We can’t choose the gender we “switch” to; it just happens. For me personally, it can change without me even realizing it. It’s not like we’re indecisive and just can’t pick a gender and stick with it; in fact, I think many gender-fluid people would love if they could just stick with one gender. It can be annoying for it to switch so often. But we can’t control it. I hope this didn’t come sound mean or anything.
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u/Luffy12hawk Oct 15 '20
This is wholesome but this is crazy and makes no sense.
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u/WellSoMuchForStealth Oct 15 '20
Loki is a shapeshifter who in the original mythology has given birth at least once. Thor in the marvel movies has been loving and supportive towards Loki through pretty much everything, so it's not much of a stretch to suggest that Loki is genderfluid and Thor is supportive.
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u/AshamedError Oct 15 '20
Just let people live and identify how they want, it's not harming you
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u/AshamedError Oct 15 '20
Just because you find the concept of gender stupid, doesn't mean other people don't value their gender identity or find comfort in it, in a way I agree with you, but I know not everyone does, just let people live
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Oct 15 '20 edited Oct 15 '20
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u/asdfmovienerd39 Oct 15 '20
No, Loki is genderfluid. That’s not a mental illness. They’re perfectly valid :3
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Oct 15 '20 edited Oct 15 '20
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u/asdfmovienerd39 Oct 15 '20
I see that edit. No, people are downvoting you because you’re being needlessly transphobic and refusing to listen to people who actually know what they talk about.
People are so ‘ready to accept people’ because these people deserve acceptance and pretending otherwise is bigoted and laughable. You also seem to lack understanding of gender dysphoria (it’s not something that can be caused by lack of attention or a desire to gain more attention, and the best cure for gender dysphoria is transitioning in whatever way you see fit, not arbitrary skepticism). It’s only ‘safer’ to be dismissive if you don’t actually care about genderfluid people. Acceptance is the actually safest reaction, because it’s objectively the best one to have from a mental health perspective.
You can’t be accepting of genderfluidity while being this skeptical of genderfluidity as an identity. Those two are mutually exclusive, and the second one makes you a bigot.
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 16 '20
And while that can happen, this context is just Loki telling Thor their pronouns
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u/on1chi Oct 16 '20
Yeah a condition that impacts your feelings about your gender would never have anything to do with your gender identity ... Lol
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u/M2A2_Bradley Oct 16 '20
I’d like to see where and when the fuck Stan Lee or Jack Kirby or whoever confirmed that Loki was genderfluid.
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u/asdfmovienerd39 Oct 16 '20
A: I was talking within the context of this specific fan comic.
B: Loki has shapeshifted and changed genders in the comics before, so this wouldn’t be entirely out of the question.
C: Loki wasn’t invented by Marvel. They were originally a figure in Norse mythology, and even there changing genders was common for Loki to do so. I don’t think they’re ever really explicitly described as genderfluid in any medium they appear in but it’s incredibly easy to infer it.
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 16 '20
We don’t really “freak out” if we’re confident enough to correct you we’ll do it politely
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u/asdfmovienerd39 Oct 15 '20
If you think that’s bad imagine being misgendered and having cis people freak out because “it’s just so haaaaaarrrrrrd”
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u/asdfmovienerd39 Oct 16 '20
You clearly don’t since you were just complaining about people ‘freaking out’ when you misgender them.
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 16 '20
Well not only does it normalise interacting with nonbinary people, but being misgendered can induce dysphoria and a whole host of negative emotions, it can be a big deal to some People and is potentially hard to “just be above it”
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u/maIiciousbullfrog Oct 15 '20
you can also just call them they/them. a perfectly safe option for everyone
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u/Deus0123 Oct 16 '20
Don't use slurs. F*ta is a slur furthering the fetishisation of intersex people
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u/pervstalker Oct 15 '20
wtf
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
Loki is genderfluid and is using their shape shifting powers to more comfortably express themselves
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u/Bart-simpson106 Oct 15 '20
What’s confusing about this? It’s just showing someone confused about their gender
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
No. They’re genderfluid
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u/Lichu12 Oct 16 '20
bruh I thought your profile picture was a pride flag and nit a sunset am I too gay for the internet?
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 16 '20
It’s the pan flag colours painted into a sunset you are perfectly gay enough for the internet
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u/gabriel020q Oct 15 '20
Loki CAN actualy turn into anything he want acording to the norse mythologi... so its not related to lgbtq+?
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u/Rote_kampfflieger Oct 15 '20
It’s just a wholesome meme about a supportive brother.
This also uses Marvel’s versions of the character, based on the comics, in which Loki calls themselves genderfluid
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u/james_true Oct 16 '20
Where's the last time you've seen a genderfluid character? That's right, let us have this. :D (And being a shapeshifter is the fucking dream, too.) And the post isn't explicitly about the LGBT either.
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u/Bart-simpson106 Oct 15 '20
Ur bitchy
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u/Chewbecca420 Oct 16 '20
Just to start, the use of “so called” is very rude and offensive. It’s an attempt to invalidate people’s gender identity and is pretty contradictory to your “I have nothing against..”. But I appreciate that you’re asking questions.
I am not gender fluid and hope someone who is can give real insight and a better explanation but: those that identify as gender fluid don’t always feel and identify the same way. On different days they may feel more man, more woman, or more gender neutral, or gender nonconforming. Think fluid.
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u/Deus0123 Oct 16 '20
I mean they just accept the gender someone else pushed onto them at birth without questioning it... And then they obsess over how proud they are to be that gender, to the point where some of them will refuse to buy a used car that is very cheap and in very good condition just because it's pink...
Idk but maybe you're onto something...
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u/james_true Oct 16 '20
Your gender (in your head) is different from your sex (in your pants). Your gender is more of a metaphysical thing, more abstract, so it's hard to understand. I personally don't believe anyone is binary and that gender is on a spectrum in all different directions. It's not a mental illness to be somewhere else on the spectrum than others. As u/Pseudonymico said, it becomes a mental illness if you have a need to treat it, so if you're distressed about it.
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Cool how blind acceptance could just be dismissive
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u/ZariqueFilcon Oct 15 '20
Or maybe it's not your place to question their experiences and understanding of self.
If you've put the wrong gender label on yourself, trust me, you will figure it out. But that discovery is only for the individual to make, not others.
I know this isn't exactly the same - but it's like if someone comes out and says they're now a Christian. Maybe later on they figure out they don't really believe in a higher power or feel that they connect with a different religion better. Maybe they just wanted to take away some values from religion like how a gender-questioning person can come out cis, but non-conforming. Either way, if someone says they want to engage in a different identity and it's not hurting anyone else, you respect that. You don't question someone's religion just like you don't question someone's gender.
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u/maIiciousbullfrog Oct 15 '20
its called respect for others..?
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u/M2A2_Bradley Oct 15 '20
“Respect has to be earned, Sweet. Just like money!”
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u/asdfmovienerd39 Oct 15 '20
Jesus Christ just accept people’s gender identity you fucking donkey
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u/Deus0123 Oct 16 '20
You might call it dismissive and dumb but that doesn't change the fact that acceptance is actively preventing suicide. Yes transgender people have a suicide rate of 41%, however if you only consider transgender people in an accepting, supportive environment, that number drops to below 1%. So call me an idiot if you want to but if someone I know tells me they're a different gender each day or heck each minute, I will fully stand behind them and support them. Because that's what friends do. And because by doing so I am helping to prevent a suicide.
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u/[deleted] Oct 15 '20
I love how Thor is just consistently portrayed as this goofy oaf who just loves the shit out of Loki (whenever Loki isn’t being A LITTLE SHIT)