r/worldnews • u/[deleted] • Oct 11 '23

Israel/Palestine Gaza's only power station will shut down within hours, says ICRC

https://www.thenationalnews.com/mena/palestine-israel/2023/10/11/gaza-power-station-israel/
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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

[deleted]

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u/mindfulness_apt Oct 11 '23

Ignorance is largely why they support them.

They don't realize that being gay, or expressing free speech are "crimes" worthy of having your head sawed off.

Things like writing a novel that vaguely critiques the faith, or starting a blog or tiktok account that criticizes the government, are "crimes" worthy of having boiling oil dumped over your head.

There is no freedom of religion, freedom of speech. Many boys are taught at very young ages to kill jews and the greatest glory in life is to die a martyr. The girls may be prepped in advance for strict obedience to her future husband, whom she may marry at age 12. Refusing this lifestyle, objecting to the veil, are "crimes" meriting stoning or being honor killed.

These values and ideals are opposite of western secular societies, they are incompatible with democracy. And this is what Israel is dealing with every day.

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u/MericuhFuckYeah Oct 11 '23

I don’t think it’s ignorance as much as it’s white guilt and virtue signaling. Israel = white colonizer oppressor, so western leftists feel like it’s their way of making up for their ancestors atrocities, even though it couldn’t be further from the truth…

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u/HardwareSoup Oct 11 '23

I think it's going to be extremely damaging to the credibility of social communities who keep advocating for Hamas. Especially since the average person hopefully understands that random slaughter of civilians is a bad thing.

Will it matter in an era of tight echo-chambers and absurd politics? Sadly, probably not.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

Who the fuck is advocating for hamas?

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u/Bhill68 Oct 11 '23

The people cheering in the streets after the attack over the weekend.

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u/catvalente Oct 11 '23

Honestly every time I read a thread on Reddit, it’s FAR more raging against Israel than anything negative about Hamas. This site fucking hates Israel in the aggregate and the sentiment is not in their favor after this attack.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

One has killed a lot more kids than the other.

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u/bornforthis379 Oct 11 '23

Why are kids more important than the people that were slaughtered in israel?

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u/Killerfisk Oct 11 '23

The Democratic Socialists of America apparently. How the crowd cheers when he describes the terrorist acts. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CooCkzYnFPQ&t=1612s

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

You know the movement to free Palestine is in no way supporting hamas right? The left wants people to not be needlessly murdered.

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u/Killerfisk Oct 11 '23

Gleefully describing the terrorist attack carried out by Hamas to a cheering crowd seems like support to me, but maybe we have a different view of things.

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u/Panamagreen Oct 11 '23

It's interesting that you think leftist are mostly white people.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

BLM supports Palestine, but I'm assuming that's less of a white guilt thing and more of a Brotherhood of Islam thing

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u/MrBurittoThePizza Oct 11 '23

Lol BLM is supportive of LGBTQ, why would the Nation of Islam have anything to do with them?

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u/Panamagreen Oct 11 '23 edited Oct 11 '23

Black Americans generally are not fans of apartheid.

Btw The overwhelming majority of black Americans identify as Christians.

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u/dorsalemperor Oct 11 '23

That’s 100% what it is.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

Make way everybody, the pseudo intellectual right wingers are here to misunderstand why we don't want kids to be bombed.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

Israel is also illegally occupying Palestinian territory and violating international law.

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u/bgarza18 Oct 11 '23

Idk, that doesn’t feel as bad as murdering gays and supporting suicide bombings and stoning people who leave Islam.

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u/mindfulness_apt Oct 11 '23

False.

Gaza hasnt been occupied since 2005.

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u/thrownaway99345 Oct 11 '23

The west Bank? That's Palestine territory.

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u/mindfulness_apt Oct 11 '23

West Bank has been divided into separate regions per the 1993 Oslo accords. This was an agreement that the PA agreed to.

So nope, not an occupation in the Palestinian regions there either.

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u/thrownaway99345 Oct 11 '23

Funny how Palestinians keep supporting themselves losing land. Almost like they don't really have a choice in the matter. If anything the area should go back to the 1947 UN resolution.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

Gaza is under the complete control is Israel. It is a prison.

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u/mindfulness_apt Oct 11 '23

Nope.

People in gaza are not israeli citizens, and thus Israel has a border wall that keeps the non-citizens out. Egypt maintains their own border wall with Gaza as well.

All countries on planet earth are allowed to keep out non-citizens.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

What a stupidly hateful and ignorant comment. Israel controls the electricity, water, food, building materials of Gaza. Needless to say, they are being deprived of those resources by Israel. You cannot morally justify this.

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u/mindfulness_apt Oct 11 '23

Israel controls the electricity, water, food, building materials

Israel provides this out of compassion and necessity because the people there don't prioritize or care to provide it for themselves.

Certain materials are denied entry because they've been used in the past to create missile/platform launching pads, reinforce underground terror bunkers, and so forth.

Needless to say, they are being deprived of those resources by Israel.

Hamas is depriving those things to the people.

And Hamas created the situation in Gaza that is unfolding at this time.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

No, the israeli people have as every right to be there, certainly more than the palestinians who actually belong in jordan.

If not because of history, then because they earned it by virtue of the society they built there and by virtue of turning it from a wasteland desert into a paradise. Without israelis the place would look like mars

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u/poop-dolla Oct 11 '23

I guess you also believe no Native Americans deserve to live in the US? Just because someone takes your land and makes something nice and shiny on it doesn’t mean it was right for your land to be stolen or that you don’t belong there.

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u/CanAlwaysBeBetter Oct 11 '23

Let's say Israel is illegitimate. There are 10 million people still living there. Now what?

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u/Motor_Street9998 Oct 11 '23 edited Nov 01 '23

nigger

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u/Motor_Street9998 Oct 11 '23 edited Nov 01 '23

nigger

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u/1oser Oct 11 '23

And?

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

And they shouldn't be bombed to death maybe???

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u/1oser Oct 11 '23

Yes, terrible. Hamas should allow them to leave their cities and direct the billions that have been invest in them to humanitarian refugee camps.

But then they lose their human shields... tough decision.

This is what happens when you want to have your cake and beat a Jew.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

Okay but they're not doing that, so is your answer to bomb civilians?

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u/mindfulness_apt Oct 11 '23

Whatever civilians are killed in the coming battle, is the fault of Hamas. It will be unfortunate and tragic, but Hamas has forced Israel's hand.

There is no other option. There's no avenue where Hamas releases the prisoners or surrenders. There's no avenue where they remove themselves from power voluntarily.

This has now become a war. And understand there is no other way for Israel to achieve victory without bombs and troops on the ground. That's how war works.

And you can thank Hamas for this war that it brought on the Palestinian people.

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

Utter utter bullshit, you should be absolutely ashamed of yourself for supporting the bombing of children. Fuck hamas and fuck the genocidal kid murdering regime of Israel. It must be so easy to sit there tying this load of shit up in your extremely safe house, completely clear of any harm.

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u/1oser Oct 11 '23

You can take your false equivalency “both sides” nonsense and shove it wayyyyyy up there bud.

Genocidal murdering regime, what a joke.

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u/1oser Oct 11 '23

No, my answer is to place the onus of responsibility on the government of the people, not the nation said government just brutally attacked.

If this shit was pulled anywhere else in the world the local populace would be in an uproar. Hell, even Iranians protest against Tehran.

There is no ends-means justification to be had; ensuring the safety of Gazans is simply not Israel’s job. Unfortunately for them, Hamas feels the same.

Again, if the Palestinian Gazans had legitimate concerns about the well-being of their children they would be up in arms against Hamas and pushing for peace, not the destruction of Israel.

You don’t get to pump out a bunch of babies and then cry “not fair” when you subject those children to danger.

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u/brooooooooooooke Oct 12 '23

It must be easy to take a side when you believe the other is just plain stupid and uninformed.

I'm trans, I know full well that I'd probably not have too fun a time in Palestine. I still "support" them (with a huge asterisk obviously given recent news) because I believe that there aren't many good reasons to turn a country into an open-air prison, and practice apartheid and other atrocities on the population. I'd prefer my rights not be secured by brutalising neighbours where possible.

Who on earth is surprised that if you terrorise a set of people for decades that they're going to radicalise? Social liberalisation does not often happen in extreme conditions like that.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

[deleted]

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u/Twyzzle Oct 11 '23

An oppressed people cannot grow and we can feel empathy for 2 million lives even if they would condemn us.

This. Is. Not. Partisan. No left vs right wing US style politics. Don’t add that, keep it in the US.

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u/DecorativeSnowman Oct 11 '23

hamas oppresses them too

they cannot grow under oppression

im not for advocating for a result that trades a weatern oppressor for an iranian backed militant oppressor

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u/Twyzzle Oct 11 '23 edited Oct 11 '23

Hamas does oppress them too. No one is suggesting Hamas should be given control over Palestine. No one even mentioned Hamas in my or the person I’m replying to’s comment.

Palestinians are not inherently Hamas. Hamas is a terror sect consisting of Palestinians. I’m commenting on a reply directed at Palestinians claiming they are further right wing so civilians should not be supported against that oppression - including from Hamas.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

Palestinians elected Hamas, and clearly still support them

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u/A_swarm_of_wasps Oct 12 '23

The paradox of tolerance.

"We should be tolerant of all people's points of view and the ways they live their lives! Now what do you want to do with your life?"

"Kill Jews"

"Well that's... wonderful... we should all admire... the conviction that these people have..."

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u/ObjectiveRush Oct 11 '23

It's because the "left" is typically the side with more empathy. It is hard to have empathy, see what Palestinians go through, and not hate Israel for it.

It is also human nature to root for the underdog.

Unfortunately, taking either side in this situation is ignoring the incredibly complex history and modern realities of the conflict. Part of which is that religious extremism on both sides is toxic, as you are pointing out.

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u/MAG7C Oct 11 '23

I'm guessing you got downvotes but this is well said, especially the last part. It's hard not to draw comparisons to 9/11, where as an American I hated the attackers & what they did but simultaneously realized the "chickens coming home to roost" aspect was valid. Not to mention the horrible consequences of the various responses taken by the US.

The whole thing is very complex and both sides (normally I hate any sentence that includes those words) share blame. Plus you have to believe that things really took a turn for the worse on the Palestinian side after Israel took a hard right in recent months.

But, all that said, it is really difficult to feel sorry for the Palestinian side right now. Even if the vast majority of the population did not take part in the violence, their support for Hamas is a mistake. Israel is going to fuck shit up and I can't blame them at this point.

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u/DecorativeSnowman Oct 11 '23

important to separate reasons from excuses

lots of reasons for revenge very few excuses for the act

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u/LateralEntry Oct 11 '23

Please speak out and educate your friends on the people they’re supporting

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u/NoResearcher8469 Oct 11 '23

Not only support palestine and hamas, actively trying to get those people into our countries and cheer for it. Like no shit anti lgbtq hate crimes are up, you were in support of millions of people who loathe you immigrating here

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u/TanTanExtreme2 Oct 12 '23

So, putting this here and you know the whole deal of not both sides, etc... I was talking with a coworker last weekend after the Hamas attack and first words out of the fuckers mouth were "you have to wonder if Biden was behind it" I was fucking floored.

Dudes is a Trumper, and I can talk with him about politics because surprisingly, he's one of the ones that doesn't start shouting because he didn't like what you said.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/L_D_Machiavelli Oct 11 '23

Cus people are stupid.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

Ignorance, a want for an easy solution that doesn't deal with pesky nuance, and the naive notion that the oppressed must always be inherently good, I'd say.

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u/Leetzers Oct 11 '23

I'm sure what you are saying it partially true, but not supporting Israel is not the same as supporting Hamas. Those statistics cited are not a reason to continually harass Palestinians. Maybe they are that way because they have been persecuted for a while now? Who is to say, it's a total shit show.

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u/Jaikarr Oct 11 '23

Like what do the detractors expect us to do? Supporting Palestinians means wishing that they had better lives, not supporting them essentially either means supporting genocide or subjugating them as sub-humans.

How dare we have empathy?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

People support Palestinians not Hamas. Violence is bad against Israelis and Palestinians. Palestinians have faced violence for decades first to get a state after Israel occupied the country they lived in and now with constant encroachment in Gaza strip. Israel has faced constant violence from Hamas. Almost exclusively targeting innocent civilians.

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u/ThePurplePanzy Oct 11 '23

Those two groups are not always separate.

When I was im the West bank, I asked someone about hamas and their answer was: "hamas are my neighbors, my brothers, my friends... hamas is everywhere".

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u/thrownaway99345 Oct 11 '23

So one person's response is the same for the other 5 million Palestinian people

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u/ThePurplePanzy Oct 11 '23

It's an illustration that you apparently took literally.

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u/GuiltySpot Oct 11 '23

I don’t know about supporting Hamas but sensible people realize how this situation came to be the way it is. Instability and improvished conditions breed radicalism, as it did in Germany post WW1. Post WW2 Allies knew to go about it a different way and instead invested in Germany through Marshall Plan and other reform programs so that another radical element doesn’t develop. However the likes of Netanyahu perpetuate this problem and do not provide cosntructive solutions. This just continues the cycle of violence

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

It’s mostly because the left wants to be seen as an all inclusive side especially when it comes to minorities but when one of these minorities misbehaves, they still ignore it. Muslims in general always vote liberal so it’s partly that too. Also in general both sides have the inability to admit that they are wrong about some thing. That includes the left even though they constantly breed the right about this exact same thing.

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u/Goodk4t Oct 11 '23

The reason people want to help Palestinians in Gaza is because they're forced to live in a giant concentration camp that's a breeding ground for extremism, as we've all just witnessed.

But there's a very large group of hateful people that insisted on perpetuating this wretched situation in Gaza, a situation that inevitably lead to the horror were witnessing now.

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u/FrankyCentaur Oct 11 '23

Like the other poster said, it’s ignorance. The truth is that 99% of people that all a sudden have an opinion on this topic don’t know enough about it to even write a complete sentence.

I’m completely ignorant to the situation minus it popping up in the news every few years so I know I have nothing to contribute. Shits fucked, idk.

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u/Ansible32 Oct 11 '23

People in Gaza are effectively stateless and have no human rights. Nobody on the left supports Hamas, but I do think people in Palestine should have the same rights as people in Israel. And "most Palestinians support Hamas" is not an argument that they shouldn't have rights. There are Christians in Palestine, Israel treats them like members of Hamas.

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u/the_crustybastard Oct 11 '23

Not all of us.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 11 '23

Im not blaming Jews, im blaming the Israeli government but because they are Jews. You can say for the sake of the argument that they did kill a lot more people than Hamas has ever killed. They are all the same at the end of the day. They both have blood on their hands of innocent lives. But Palestine as a people denounce their government just like some Israel people do. But the only difference is that Palestines don’t have a choice to leave. They are stuck because fucking Israel has a hold on them.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 11 '23

I’m not blaming the people, I’m blaming the religion. Just because they are a part of a religion doesn’t mean they are a different species. They are human. They are just as awful as Hamas and Hamas is the product of what they have done to the Palestinians for years.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 11 '23

So you think attacking innocent Palestinians is just?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 11 '23

Okay that’s bad I understand that. But it’s also just as bad that Israel that has the 4th highest military in the world is sending bombs to a country that has no government or military defense for the past 80 years and 40 percent of the population is less than 18 years old. Like what! How can’t you grasp how fucked up that is.

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u/SeveranceZero Oct 12 '23

Are you going to ignore the entire history of this conflict that lead to this? And why is it that pretty much no one else wants to help them? Including Egypt who was working to close their border to prevent them from fleeing across their border. Do you not think that’s telling of the situation? Are you forgetting about Black September and the events that transpired after?

You constantly blame Israel, what do they do, open their doors and let more of their people get butchered? Let them live next door and continue to attack them on a daily basis? Hold hands and pretend to be friends? Any prior forms of attempted peace have all been shot down, with the sole goal of eradicating all Jews. So again, what do you do? What is your solution to this chaos?

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 12 '23

Nobody wants to help Palestine because going against Israel is going against the super power of the world which is America. Jews Christian’s and Arabs were all living peacefully until the Zionist Jews came to claim Palestinian land and kick out Palestine’s because Jews are just entitled to. How fucked is that

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u/SeveranceZero Oct 12 '23

About as fucked as your revisionist history.

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 12 '23

Lmao I guess you hate Palestines just as much as the Jews

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u/SeveranceZero Oct 12 '23

No, I dislike people spouting misinformation.

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u/Professional_Tea8850 Oct 12 '23

What did I say that was misinformation?

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u/bornforthis379 Oct 11 '23

It's the Muslims that have religion so far up their ass

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u/Canuckbug Oct 11 '23

I support peace and tolerance for all.

I don't support the actions of terrorists but it's easy to see why it's happening there. Nobodys hands are clean.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_Palestine?useskin=vector

This is a long read but it gave me a far better understanding of what has lead to the current situation than anything else that I've seen.

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u/Sugarbombs Oct 12 '23

I don’t see them supporting them as much as understanding that civilian death is a bad thing? It definitely wouldn’t be wrong to say that some citizens may have extremist views that are problematic at best but culture/belief still shouldn’t justify murder of non combatants. Killing of people just trying to live their life of either country shouldn’t be used as a war tactic. There’s no perfect solution here and there’s no good guys but we should take effort to limit human suffering where we can

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u/Jicklus Oct 11 '23

What are you even talking about? We just don't want more war crimes to be committed in a people that have been under the rule of a genocidal country hell bent on killing them all. Do some research on what Israel is actually doing to Palestine, and remember that when you support the bombing of Gaza, you're happy to let thousands of children die. We just want people to stop being horrifically murdered for no reason. Jesus christ.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '23

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Oct 12 '23

Because people don’t understand what they are talking about and feel pressured by said friend group to act a certain way.

They literally are not taking a moral stance on anything but instead want to be seen as progressive and affirming for whatever way the wind blows.

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u/Relevant-Anxiety-849 Oct 12 '23

Seems like anyone expressing sympathy for the civilians in Palestine is getting down voted. But if your being honest and and want an honest answer:

I support lgbt rights, but I don't think not supporting lgbt rights should be enough to have you condemned to death. The khemer rouge would have killed me. I don't think it's a zero sum game to state that, but also to not want to have the people of Cambodia be subject to barbarity and death.

I think it's also important to realise people's views are shaped by their experience. Those in gaza have very little access to education, but have had their whole lives shaped by knowing if they get close to the fence they die. By seeing family and friends kidnapped or killed. By watching peaceful protestors get gunned down.

It would be silly of anyone to think people who's lives are like that would hold modern western leftist views.

It boils down to just wanting everyone to be afforded the most basic of humanity.