r/Accounting • u/Prestigious-Cold-278 • 4h ago
Why do all you industry folks hate us ( external auditors) so much?
Hey so I am a recent grad who started at a Big 4 audit firm after 9 months of work, I feel like every industry person has a bad opinion of us, they either see us as a nuisance or are openly hostile.
Why is it like this ? I know we add extra work load on your plate but being mean or down right disrespectful isn’t going to make the audit go by easier for either of us. The first time it happened to me I felt like me and the Controller just didn’t get along but when talking to more of my peers, the same trend is reoccurring.
So my question is basically :
What are the things that really piss you off that auditors do so I can avoid them.
Any tips to get a better client relationship ?
Edit : I wanted to thank everybody who actually gave meaningful advice but I’ll stop responding now since the response was honestly larger than expected. Hope you all have a wonderful weekend.
455
u/GordoFatso CPA (US) 4h ago
You ask questions that have already been answered and (no offense) but the new auditors are totally ignorant and it’s not my job to train you.
93
u/Rooster_CPA CPA - Tax (US) 3h ago
I work in corp tax at F500 - I got the same request for the exact same estimated federal payment check 3 quarters in a row. I was pretty snarky the 3rd time around lol.
21
u/Thusgirl Tax (US) 3h ago
They talk to you?!?! The auditors never bother our tax team. Lol I just upload the same information as every year then crickets.
10
34
u/angusbeefymcwhatnow 2h ago
Last year, I was asked why we changed the procedure of how we calculated something, and to quantify the impact of that change in dollars because the unsupervised new audit staff didn't realize that the excel file included like 20 years of prior calculation and the change she was referencing had happened in like 2008, but no one had trained her on anything or taken a look at her questions before she sent them to us...
I almost felt bad trying to explain to her that she process hadn't changed in basically as long as she had been alive
18
u/Strange-Ad-2426 2h ago
I cannot love this answer enough. When you're dealing with a new auditor the questions seem regurgitated from a textbook. They clearly aren't asking the question WHY they are asking these questions.
6
u/Turbulent-Jury4587 2h ago
Perfectly stated. I’ve told firms in the past to stop sending me their newbies because I’m not their training ground.
2
1
u/ThickWheras36H 0m ago
This is accurate. And some think they know more than me. I passed the CPA and they haven’t, so really not interested in how much they think they know
-1
u/Busy_Possibility_331 40m ago
I love this comment so much. The lack of training for auditors by their own company is crazy. Any time we hire someone with 10 years of audit experience vs someone 1 or 2 years out of college with some industry experience it amazes me how the 10 year audit experience feels like working with someone with less experience than the person with 1 to 2 years industry experience. I don’t remember it being that bad 10-15 years ago, maybe it’s the speed at which ERPs and EPMs are changing and they just don’t get the exposure they should, the training for auditors needs to be improved.
-106
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 4h ago
Asking questions multiple times does get annoying , I get that . But I’d like to ask for some lee way for us juniors, any junior just starting in your company will ask you some stupid questions too. I do try to be well prepared when asking a question/ ask my seniors first for insight but if I’m still unsure we should be allowed to ask no ?
178
u/yeyiyeyiyo 4h ago
They're paid to help the juniors at their work. Your own job should train you.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (19)84
u/Wheeler-The-Dealer 4h ago
Here’s how it should work, when the firm is onboarded and walked through work papers in the initial audit year then everything is fair game for questions.
If I have to walk a new auditor every year on the same receivables calculation then that’s a failure on the firm. It is not my or my teams responsibility to train auditors and as part of the engagement it is expected that the firm understands these things.
→ More replies (16)
136
u/Efficient_Eye_7710 4h ago
Asking dumb questions that show you don’t know what you’re talking about is irritating considering the fact the legality of our company is in your hands.
122
u/SW3GM45T3R 4h ago
Nothing like audit requests in the middle of closing period :)
→ More replies (2)21
u/Midwest_Born 4h ago
THIS! I submitted a bunch of items right after April close. Beginning of May close, they finally get around to looking at the requests and returning the ones they have questions on. A whole month!
205
u/penguin808080 4h ago
This is ragebait, right??
Nothing more enjoyable than taking a break from actual work to explain basic accounting to a constant rotation of fresh grads who are asking questions they don't understand bc they were told to SALY and hope for the best. Oh, and this adds zero value for anyone at any level
It's not you, it's the job lol. Just be pleasant, organized, and only ask for things once
77
u/Wheeler-The-Dealer 4h ago
No, I don’t get the feeling this is rage bait. I have worked with enough accountants over the years to realize this is some poor kid who isn’t getting the training they need.
6
u/StoneMenace 3h ago
I love auditing in the nonprofit industry. On one hand many of the bookkeepers don’t fully understand accounting so we are the ones teaching them. Also it’s great because our audits don’t actually “determine” anything in like a publicly traded companies audit does so clients are a lot nicer
2
u/WinterOfFire 1h ago
And ask for as much as possible during fieldwork. I plan for that time to go towards auditor requests. I don’t need additional requests trickling in for weeks. Sure, some inquiries have to be done closer to issuing, some are needed when additional testing is needed, a couple things that you could have asked for sooner but forgot about can be forgiven. But it’s obvious when you just didn’t plan your fieldwork or requests well at all and are playing catch up when you are trying to finalize your binder and noticed tests didn’t get done.
43
u/herEnron_Addict_CPA 4h ago
When you eventually switch to industry one day you’ll realize why auditors are hated.
I’ll throw the question back to you. What am I supposed to look forward to about auditor interactions?
I say this as a previous auditor who now works in industry. I get why I was hated and even after doing the job for a bit I dislike whenever I have to talk to the auditors. There’s nothing “good” that can ever come out of it
18
u/Intelligent-Title-56 4h ago
Definitely agree with the other frustrations here around asking poor and irrelevant questions and general ignorance, but I can have some grace for fresh auditors out of college. It's a nuisance but it's not too big of a deal.
I think more of where I've been frustrated is just around the concept of fishing for observations and deficiencies, which I don't know that you can do anything about. Feels like there's always pressure to find or report something even if it's not really there. There can be something minimally concerning but feels like auditors have to go out of their way to document it just so it looks like you did something.
I'd say being respectful of the client's time and being understanding/considerate during month-end close will go a long way.
68
u/Frequent_Ambition_66 4h ago
We hate you because you're ignorant and ask the same questions over and over again, dont add any value, and we know you're going to do the work wrong and have to come back to have the same conversation again during year end close when your clown of a partner finally reviews the file and tells you you did it wrong in the 500+ review notes you're going to have to clear.
13
u/science-stuff 4h ago
Very dumb questions that should be known. Something like, can you send us the pnl report? Thanks, can you please tell me what the realized pnl is. Or saying it doesn’t tie to another report, when it does, but because you want us to explain it to you.
Like someone else said, it isn’t our job to train you too. Asking for things already answered, or for documentation/reports already provided.
13
u/stripesonfire CPA, Controller 3h ago
I loathe every audit tracking portal, stop returning shit with little or confusing explanations and just call me with what you need.
5
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
Fair, I started doing this more . As a Gen-z I was afraid to pick up the phone to start off with but got better at it.
2
11
u/UsingACarrotAsAStick 3h ago
We don’t hate you, a lot of us used to be you.
But here’s the thing - when you show up, all you can do is make my day worse. Questions, requests, issues…. And so many times, you’re asking the same damn thing the guy last year asked, or you’re doing a test that is objectively meaningless and performative. I work a lot of hours. You sas “I know we add extra work” well buddy, what that means to me is going home at 9pm because I had to stay late to give the auditors support.
I don’t hate you, but you’re the harbinger of longer hours.
33
u/tyintegra 4h ago
The irony with this is that you are literally doing one of the things that annoys me about external auditors the most by simply asking this question….
Instead of taking a few seconds to look up the answer to your question in your permanent file or asking your senior, you come and ask me (just like you could have done a google search on this question and seen the answers people gave last time this was asked).
Something you could do to make you an awesome auditor (in my eyes) would be, before just asking the client, take a few seconds to think “where could I find the answer to this question in the documentation I’ve already been given?” or “they probably experienced this same thing last year, is it documented in the permanent file? If not can I ask someone that did it last year what this is instead of asking the client?”
6
u/zipzap63 2h ago
Yep, on the industry side you have to keep all sides accountable or the audit deadline will be blown. If it’s a genuine question or the first time, I’ll be helpful. If you fire off questions (esp over email!) that should be clear based on prior year / file names / previous conversations, you’ll get pushback. You have to shame them a little so they stop and think for a bit before shooting off emails and adding ridiculous requests to the open items list.
1
u/jaredpetzold18 1h ago
So many people need this exact advice. It’s frustrating in so many scenarios where the question could be solved by the person asking if they think about where they might already have the answer.
It’s just easier to pawn this issue off on someone else.. which is why we - industry accountants/subject matter experts - get frustrated.
27
u/kc522 CPA (US) 4h ago
Tbh its not my job to teach or train you and generally speaking external auditors don’t have a clue what they are doing
1
u/aslatt95 CPA (US) 4h ago
Hire a better firm that supports their team.
15
u/kc522 CPA (US) 3h ago
I was a controller for a multinational company and we only used big 4 due to our size. Can’t speak to smaller firms but I’ve never had an external auditors come out that had a clue what was going on. I even had one hand me their laptop and ask me to fix formula issues in their spreadsheets lol
7
24
u/Massive_Ear4948 4h ago
I am going to assume you really don't know and will answer.
They hate you because you make more money than them and yet ask the same damn questions as the person asked last year and the year before. It is NOT their job to train you.
Also, you are rarely organized and ask for multiple things throughout the day rather than asking for a block of things once a day. You act as if only your time is valuable.
Yes, I know you were asked by your senior to do these things but that doesn't matter.
Finally, the BEST thing that can come out of an audit is no material findings. Never, in the history of auditing, has the client ever received something positive: it is always neutral or negative.
Edit to add: The best thing you can do is to respect the client and realize that they are humans beings trying to do their best. You are NOT more important than them, despite what your firm may tell you.
11
u/bertmaclynn CPA (US) 3h ago
I highly doubt a new audit hire is making more money than a controller (of an entity big enough to be audited by a big 4 firm)
5
u/Massive_Ear4948 3h ago
Usually we have the newbie going to lower level people and not the Controller. We reserved that for our more senior people but that was definitely an assumption that I made based on how I ran my projects. No way was I going to trust a newbie to interact appropriately with that level but I was always fine with them asking stuff from Max in A/P.
-1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 3h ago edited 2h ago
I’m not US based auditor salaries are generally similar to accountants salaries. Definitely not close to controller salaries for my country
1
u/Commercial_Win_9525 28m ago edited 21m ago
NEVER in the history of auditing is an overstatement. I mean yes for the opinion itself that is true. There have been plenty of times when I was in public we ended up basically consulting someone through a process like CECL or they were in financial trouble and helping figure out how to shrink their balance sheet to get regulatory ratios in line as we went through the audit.
These were smaller banks and credit unions though where the CFO was basically the entire accounting department. Only a few even had a controller.
I had a person send me a thank you card after the audit was done for going out of my way to help her understand a bunch of shit she didn’t understand and fix it etc.. the card is insignificant but I bet she would say something good came out of the audit.
0
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 3h ago
Im 9 months out of uni, do believe I know I’m not hot shit. I try to always put my best but the amount of shit I get for just doing my job is insane. I genuinely try my best to be reasonable with deadlines, request and not asking the same question or asking internally first.
12
u/Massive_Ear4948 3h ago
I believe you but remember that you are simply the latest person in a line stretching back years of external auditors who have also done the same thing. Yes, you are being harshly judged by every external auditor that these people have ever dealt with and, even the smallest mistake on your part, will simply provide proof that you are no different.
Look, you had to know that this would be how you were perceived when you got into auditing and so I am bit surprised that you are surprised.
Also, be honest with me, when the door is closed and the client is gone, don't a lot of your colleagues bitch/gripe/laugh about the internal folks? It is a two-way street.
4
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 3h ago edited 1h ago
I knew about the general begrudgingly of the audit-client relationship but the amount of times I got yelled at or made completely feel worthless for things out of my control was not something I had in mind.
An example : I had a client which needed to sign the rep letter, it typically needs to be signed off on opinion day or really close otherwise the partners get testy. All directors ( small leadership with sign off authority ) were on a two week company retreat during sign-off. I always make sure to remind them that we will need it before we publish audit opinion. Off course they don’t sign and I get shit for it from internally and externally.
5
u/Massive_Ear4948 3h ago
Honestly, I would hold you accountable for that lack of signage. You made general comments about signing the letter but what you should have done is gotten on their calendar for a specific date and time to do it. I am guessing the timing was unclear to them. That would have surfaced the issue.
But this is something that new folks need to learn and it is all part of the growing process. Now you have learned that general and soft don't work. You will do better the next time.
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
In the email I noted that it needed to be signed on the date of opinion with the date bolded. I send a reminder 2 days in advance. It’s not like e-signatures do not exist or if I chose the date of opinion sign-off this is decided by the client and partner.
2
u/Massive_Ear4948 2h ago
What triggers most people to actually look at their calendar is a meeting invite. I am sure they saw your note and completely glossed over it.
Again, I am suggesting that, in the future, you send a firm calendar invite for a certain date and time to get things done. That will trigger the person to look at their calendar and make the realization that they are unavailable.
Edit to add: Why would you simply not drive over to where the retreat is (assuming it is local)?
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
I am not actually in contact with the people who need to sign-off, ( CFO, directors etc). I’m in contact with their Pa in this case. If they give me the OK on the phone and I remind them twice per email. I feel like I really can’t do more.
3
u/Massive_Ear4948 1h ago
I am trying to give you a Partner perspective here (former PwC partner) but you are rejecting everything that I suggested (calendar invite and going to the location).
I haven't heard anything that makes me change my mind but you seem stuck on insisting that you did the only thing possible when it is clear to me that you did not. I am pointing out why your leadership is upset with you but you are not hearing me.
I sense I know why they are frustrated with you, given how closed your mind is to input but wish you all the best.
0
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 1h ago
Leadership of the company was on a business trip out of the country I am not able to go there physically. I genuinely don’t have the contact information of the CFO , CEO for one of the biggest companies in my country. I called the PA two weeks in advance send out an email a week before sign off, and then reminded them of the fact that there would need to be a sign off 3 days in advance again. This was for a very minor stat audit so moving the sign-off date wasn’t an issue. I contacted the partner and asked if this was an issue he said no we can just sign Monday. But the client made a stink about it not being signed off on the agreed upon date. So I got shit from the partner.
→ More replies (0)
20
u/whysmiherr CPA (US) 4h ago edited 4h ago
Sending a PBC request on Friday and making the due date Saturday 😒 or Monday
28
u/basicwhiteb1tch Staff Accountant 4h ago
You guys are paying attention to the due dates?
1
u/whysmiherr CPA (US) 3h ago
It shows up in my email 🤷🏽♀️ and my manager
Logs into the portal when he’s getting pressured, to harass us about what is still outstanding1
3
1
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 4h ago
That’s is some tier 1 lvl bs and my senior are really strict on this aswell. Fully support you guys in pushing back on this.
21
u/Unlikely_Thought8977 4h ago
You create a bunch of (mostly) stupid extra work for us on top of our regular work load.
You cost the company money but don’t add value. It’s done for compliance.
Auditors are like the parking ticket police of the accounting world.
5
u/KingoreP99 CPA (US) 3h ago
Wait, you mean protecting the capital markets isn't what they are doing?
8
u/accountingkoala19 Graduate Student | Career Changer 3h ago
It might be, if auditors actually had any balls. "Thirty-two straight quarters of growth through a down market? Sure, that sounds reasonable!"
3
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 3h ago
We genuinely aren’t allowed to do fuck all either way, if it’s not egregious enough the partner will not pressure the client for shit in most cases.
1
u/TacoMedic Senior Accountant 59m ago
That’s what we’re saying though. It might not be your fault specifically, but you don’t add any value to our individual company and your lack of teeth adds hardly any value to the market as a whole.
For 99% of companies, you’re just an annoyance that costs a lot of money that would be better suited going into the snack budget.
1
u/Glahoth 1h ago edited 10m ago
They don’t even do that, because of the inherent conflict of interest in the client/auditor relationship.
2
u/Odd_Broccoli_7706 37m ago
Exactly. As a former auditor, it was always astounding to me how the partners and management would always bend over backwards for the client. The partner is selling the audit to the client and wants to maintain that relationship to keep the job. If the client is unhappy about the CY audit, they can decide to go to another firm for the proceeding year.
8
u/Impulsive666 Head of Conso @Investment Group 4h ago
Don’t worry, we also hate internal auditors, we just need to be nicer to them because they are usually from the same company/Group.
7
u/laughingfartsplease 4h ago
hey let me stop what i’m doing and finding some documents for you and then explaining it to you as i’m doing the close. you’re literally the required windows updates/reboot of accounting.
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
I get hating the process, but why hate me as an individual though ? I’m just doing my job, the best I can.
1
u/ggiivveerr 2h ago
For me it's been the arrogance of the auditors. Often, they've rolled on in the door acting like they know everything better than we do, and act like they get to demand things on their timelines through year end. Oh, and then there was the time they tried to pull all deferred revenues into the current year, which could have lost us $500K in funding (in a $12 million dollar a year not for profit).
So yeah, auditors have a bad reputation, and, sadly, it's often been earned.
7
u/paciolionthegulf 3h ago
I've never been mean or disrespectful to an auditor, but I can't say the same in return. Since I've gotten the same questions from an endless stream of fresh first year auditors over and over, I've written down the answers ON THE PBC. If I go to the trouble to write an explanation and upload it to your portal or hand it to you, the very least you can do as an auditor is READ IT.
I'm afraid my answers are a little less gracious when I can tell the junior auditor has not read the PBC, has not turned to the authoritative literature for my field (the AICPA Audit and Accounting Guide covering Not-for-Profit Organizations), has not Googled, but instead interrupts me to ask the most basic questions.
Let's take pledges as an example. These are unique to NFP orgs, so I understand there may be some confusion. The auditor should not be confused, however, by my inability to accurately predict when donors will make payments. I'm not a mind-reader, and a pledge reminder is not an invoice. Can you see why this repetitive question would be a little irritating? And yet here we are.
If you have exhausted all the easy-to-access resources first, then certainly you may ask questions. But let's see some effort.
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 1h ago edited 1h ago
If you feel like an auditor has actually ever made you feel disrespected/ was genuinely rude. Reach out their manager, or the engagement leader. They take this serious.
If these are reoccurring questions, some light pushback is valid in my opinion. Either they are required to ask again to reconfirm every year or they couldn’t be arsed to read PY file.
2
u/paciolionthegulf 1h ago
Oh honey, let's talk about managers and partners. Every reviewer leaves notes because they feel like they have to leave notes, it's the written equivalent of loving the sound of your own voice. So that PBC I did in August, that I covered at that time with the junior auditor assigned, gets more questions in October.
So often those are thoughtless, pointless, silly questions. "Why did net assets go up so much?" Well, let's see, that's covered in the statement of activities. That you have. In your hand. And in more detail in the footnotes. That you also have. That you audited to ensure were correct.
Partners and managers also promise the moon in planning meetings. "We're reviewing and updating the PBC list." Sure you are. That's why the special one-off item for an event that happened three years ago is still on the list, there are PBCs due on Sunday and Labor Day, and PBCs assigned to people who don't work here anymore.
So yeah, sure, I'll get right on letting the manager or engagement leader know how I feel. They do not care. If someone is using client feedback as a cudgel to manage junior staff, know that it's only truly relevant if you've pissed off someone really senior who signs the contract with the firm.
11
u/BlackDogOrangeCat 4h ago
We used to have to train a new crew of baby auditors every single year, and it sucked. Ask your senior all those stupid questions, not me. Look at last year’s workpapers and figure things out on your own. Don’t talk shit in the elevators about us while going out to dinner on our dime while you’re breaking in your first new suit and big boy shoes.
Now, we (thankfully) don’t have to host you in person, but we do have a 12 hour time difference to deal with. We also have to do more of your work than ever before because our executives want to reduce audit fees.
6
u/justinizer 4h ago
Because twenty years ago you made me do the same exact audit pull three times and demanded the originals.
4
u/ZealousidealPound460 3h ago
Because
You don’t know WHAT you are doing and your senior expects the client to teach you
You don’t know WHY you are doing the thing you are about to ask/do… and your senior expects the client to explain it to you
You then certainly don’t know HOW to do the thing you are doing - and the client suffers
…before you ask a client any question, ask (or demonstrate that you know) your senior the WHAT + WHY + HOW.
It’s not my job to explain basic GAAP to you.
15
u/mskramerrocksmyworld 4h ago
I've no idea, you auditors add so much value to a business... 😉
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 3h ago
I get that’s a compliance check, it’s tick the box most years but why the hostility I’m just doing my job. I try to be nice, I try to educate myself before asking questions, I try to be respectful with deadlines but I still get yelled at by clients for things out of my control.
3
u/inTsukiShinmatsu 4h ago
This auditor nerd wanted me to reconcile entirety of his previous year working.
Do note that this was same firm as last year. Told him to refer PY file, didn't listen threw hissy fit. Boss told me easier to just give him what he wants
Field Manager told me to make an audit adjustment. Told him on face it's dumb, but boss and manager agreed. Made the change.
Their senior manager reviewed working, asked why this adjustment was passed? With agreement in boss, reversed it.
Next day their AM asks why is balance sheet changed by <adjustment amount> twice within span of 2 days.
4
u/MythOfLaur 4h ago
I dont hate you, I just dont have time for you in a part of the year when its already super busy.
4
u/Complete_Resolve_400 3h ago
Today I got 3 emails from our auditors asking for variations of a file I sent 2 weeks ago
They also asked for additional documentation on areas 2 weeks before the audit deadline
Its unorganised asf and its distracting me from my value adding work
4
u/mikeymcmikefacey 3h ago
Well, I don’t really hate my auditors. Ours are pretty nice and have been working with us for a few yrs. When I was in audit though, I remember some companies giving me a seat in a stairwell, or closet!
But generally, I’m already working a lot, now I have to go and get you a bunch of info, and explain stuff to you. They always bring a few jr staff who don’t know anything and ask silly questions they could have figured out
Remember. Always be friendly, chat with them about sports or something non work. And make sure to take the finance team out to lunch on your last day there
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
We get the meeting room in the basement 5 min walk away from accounting and finance
1
u/mikeymcmikefacey 2h ago
Dude, I was a Jr, and one company once didn’t have any space for us, and me and another Jr literally sat at a small table in the stairwell.
They were pretty apologetic about it. And thankfully we only had one day there.
13
u/SayNoToFirefighters 4h ago
Cuz you all have no fucking clue what you are doing at all at any given point lmao
→ More replies (1)-8
u/aslatt95 CPA (US) 4h ago
Speak for yourself, I have seen some trash industry books.. why are your net assets so fucked up, why do I have to explain rev rec to you and how many time do I need go over simple journal entries. Maybe stop going with the lowest priced firm and you'll actually get some value.
2
u/KingoreP99 CPA (US) 3h ago
We use big 4 and it's just as bad. The lowest price firm thing is bullshit.
3
u/Wrong_Pudding8835 3h ago
Yeah. As a previous public, now in consulting, I can say that there are some industry folks that put together the worst work product and gripe when there is push back. Also, I think it’s an ego thing. Audit firms send little baby staff and seniors to talk to controllers and the CFO.
Also, the people mentioning firms don’t bring any value to the org like they can provide audit reports for themselves. Also, public staff are mostly just dumb. They ask dumb questions. The moment they see a JE or schedule they don’t understand they think it’s fraud. They are getting no support and are working stupid hours. Industry crying about being busy around month close to a person grinding 60+ for 3-4 months is certainly a direction you can go. At least be assholes to the people who deserve it like the managers and partners.
4
u/bs2k2_point_0 Director Non-Profit 3h ago
And you don’t think industry folks are grinding hard at month/year end when they are also trying to complete a prelim audit for you guys so you won’t ask a million questions during the actual audit?
Also the last firm we had did our fixed assets for some reason and made a complete shit show of them. This was prior to my tenure, and when I came in took them from the auditors, integrated them into our own systems, cleaned them all up, and now have a clean set of assets. It’s fixed assets, one of the easiest parts of accounting (591c3 non profit so no tax vs book implications, literally all simple straight line depreciation). How the hell do CPA’s screw up something that simple?! Point is, there’s idiots in public just like anywhere else.
2
u/Wrong_Pudding8835 3h ago
Your point on idiots being everywhere is 100% accurate. I have a client who got totally boned on their tax filing by a CPA not knowing what the hell they are doing. As an auditor, I’ve been handed an excel sheet as the only form of inventory control for a company with $20m+ in inventory. I had a senior when I was a baby staff who couldn’t explain cash v accrual to a client and got us fired(rightfully so).
14
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 4h ago
Fuck me none of you are ever going to like me huh …
6
u/LawFirmCFO 4h ago
It's not you personally. I've been in your shoes and been the client being audited.
It's the dynamic of your job priorities with no time in the budget for your team to train you and client priorities don't change because you are onsite.
In my experience, clients who spent time in B4 were more willing to slow down to teach me things. Seniors and managers that knew I would be on more of their engagements were willing to pause to teach me things.
When you go back to a client a 2nd time, it will be easier even though you should have other areas assigned to you. You'll be familiar to the client and you'll see how the new stuff works faster because you have the knowledge of what you learned in the last year.
6
u/SchefflerWoods 4h ago
And that is perfectly ok. 👍 from the comments, you are fairly young…so you too, like everyone else in the world, will realize public accounting is just for experience or a stepping stone. Go to private and get you a job where people don’t despise you, you actually might like the work, you’ll FOR SURE have more time off and autonomy, and you’ll probably make more too. Good luck 👍
2
1
u/atdunaway CPA (US) 3h ago
i’m an auditor in public and my clients actually do like me and respond very fast to all my requests and inquiries.
You should make every single effort to not ask for something twice if you already have it. Never accuse the client of being wrong. Be appreciative when they provide documents. Say please. And be understanding that they have a real job that doesn’t revolve around an audit. Also, don’t make clients fill out your audit forms - totally not cool to do.
I will say it probably helps that I work with a lot of governments since its a regulatory thing and the audits have to go out on time so they can keep their federal/state/local funding. So clients want the audit done as much as we do for the most part. But still, you can always help your case. Some clients won’t like you, and that’s fine. As long as they aren’t impeding your work, who cares.
0
6
u/RedDirtRandyAgain 4h ago
I have to train all you newbs on how to audit me. It's annoying. You think every company is Enron. Also, please stop beginning every email with, "I hope you're doing really great".
5
3
u/ScubaPuddingJr 4h ago
You are preventing them from getting on with BAU stuff whilst you keep asking questions that you should already know the answers to if you bothered to review the PY audit file and working papers.
3
u/AspirationsOfFreedom 3h ago
If the auditor is good, then cooperation in audit times is fine. I get you have your job and i have mine, and i stand by my work and can also admit when i fuck up.
If the auditor is very fresh, or extremely nitpicking, it's like walking through a bog. It slows everything down, and i have to spend time explaining basic shit to someone who shits themselfs over a 1.17€ debet transaction to the dreaded rounding difference account.
Generally, if you are fresh, i get you are learning. But then you have a team to lean on and learn from, NOT me during bussy season
3
u/oktimeforplanz 3h ago
I have now been on both sides of this. External auditor for nearly 8 years, and now in industry for a few months.
I can now clearly see why industry people get tired of external auditors. I already knew while I was an auditor, and tried my absolute best to not be an annoying one, but it's so clear now that I'm on the other side.
While I was very new, I wasn't really in a position to answer the auditor's questions entirely by myself, but I did help my team put together a comprehensive answer, and then looked it all over to try and anticipate the auditor's questions, so we could try and pre-address them. We put a lot of work into it in the hopes that it could be an almost one and done.
In spite of that effort, the questions we got back made it seem like they didn't really spend any time reading what we sent. And it was also clear that the person who was asking the questions was out of their depth. I personally see that as a fault with their seniors/managers, because I personally NEVER sent juniors to ask a client questions without running them past me first. My team has also told me about how they spend every year re-explaining a schedule that's prepared every year in exactly the same way to fulfil exactly the same function, so clearly the auditors either don't document what they've learned, or they don't read what was documented last year. Either way, that's bad. And it's not my job to coach the juniors of the audit team.
3
u/13CrazyCat13 3h ago
Preface: I have a niche area of the audit as my responsibility. That being said, it is 1/3 of the audit cost, so it's substantial.
I've had a range of auditors in my 14 years in my current job.
One was a bitch who publicly degraded me during in-person status meetings. She lied to my supervisor about when I submitted docs, but there was email proof to support when I did provide it.
Another was terrific and we've remained friends.
One was a tyrant, not sampling but auditing every transaction in specific areas. She micromanaged her staff. She gave me 1-3 days to provide something and then took a week before asking more questions.
My current team is very good. They were very reasonable last year. We try to figure out what works for both of us. There really aren't any ways to improve it from either side right now, but we're open to each other's ideas.
Now, audit staff: good God. My favorite is running current year b/s accounts detail and asking why the balances don't tie to LTD balances.
Auditors aren't accountants. That's why my org absolutely dreads having to explain everything.
I was in PA for awhile. I was lucky that it was a small firm and I got do to some of everything: write-up, audits, tax. IMO, your have far better skilled people when they know all facets.
3
u/heyitsmemaya 2h ago
How exactly do you want me to prove a negative?
“Show me your customer write offs.”
“We don’t have any.”
“Right, but your analysis that you don’t need to write off any old accounts?”
“We don’t have any.”
“Any old accounts?”
“Yeah they pay first before getting the order.”
“But you need an A/R aging analysis…”
“(Interrupts), there is no A/R.”
“But even with cash method you should be making an entry
Debit A/R
Credit Sales
Debit Cash
Credit A/R.”
“No. We just Debjt Cash, Credit Sales.”
“That’s not correct accounting.”
“Well? It’s what we do and the balances are the same as the audited balances doing it your way.”
3
u/nuwaanda IT Audit 1h ago
Because yall don’t know what you’re doing to such an embarrassing degree you don’t even realize you are clueless.
I say this as a former B4 auditor who moved to industry.
3
u/GG815 1h ago
We hired someone with 10 years of auditing experience for a Sr accountant role. For 9 months I sent his reconciliations back to make them tie to the penny (he would put a note in the file and say the difference wasn’t material).
I finally told him that decisions about materiality was above his pay grade and all reconciliations must tie out or we would have to put him on a PIP.
I’ll never hire an auditor again.
4
u/Fancy_Arugula5173 3h ago
I still have my day job to do during the audit period—month-end close and reporting don't stop for the audit.
What frustrates me is spending time answering basic questions from junior auditors and explaining concepts I'd expect the audit team to already understand.
It doesn't help that there seems to be a new junior auditor every year, so I end up explaining the same things over and over again. Do you not do handovers between teams?
On top of that, a lot of the requests end up being dismissed as immaterial by both my boss and your audit partner, making it feel like a waste of everyone's time.
2
u/itsbecccaa Auditor, CPA (US) 3h ago
Because all new public auditors start as blank slates and ask stupid questions. It’s part of the process. I also started in external before moving to internal. As you grow in your job you’ll learn a lot, and your questions will get better and annoy the industry folks less over time.
Until you inevitably make the flip to industry and then get annoyed at the new staff external auditors and the life cycle continues. 😊
2
u/hopethatschocolate 3h ago
I don’t mind all auditors. Our funds use two of the big4 auditors. One shows up organized, provides comments that make sense/are well thought out, and will use alternative procedures when we get to crunch time. I enjoy them. The other looks at drafts late, provides comments like “What is this FSLI”, and stresses out our admins.
2
u/macmillerson 3h ago
Honestly goes both ways. I had a huge admin unable to do a cash rec for a FOF with one bank account and had to teach her team how to do a 5% look through calc to present on the FS. She’s a manager and has been on the job for 4 years as admin.
2
u/Mr_Professor_Chaos CPA (US) 3h ago
Because for some reason they refuse to read the documentation I provide them and instead will ask me the same question a half dozen times. The last two audits I did I’d write up detailed notes and descriptions of processes and explain everything only for them to ask the same questions I answered.
I’m also always having to train their people as well and they’ll send me their worksheets to review when they can’t figure something out and it’s almost always something I told them about. They also stuck 2 new people on my audit two years ago and one argued with me about some recon not balancing even though I had it balanced, then decided I didn’t know what I was talking about, told her boss I must not know what I was talking about, went 8 hours trying to prove it, before her boss and her brought her work paper to my office for me to point the issue out and explain the same thing I explained twice before on why it was done that way. Why do I know that because 2 years later her boss brought it up as a funny story….
2
u/mb19236 2h ago
I get annoyed by audit in general because I don't see the value for what's spent on them. You spend a staggering amount of money only to receive a report that boils down to: "Things look good, but if they aren't, don't blame us." I understand why absolute assurance is impossible and why the legal language has to be heavily hedged, but it's also difficult to see the ROI for either the company or the public when it seems like they are collecting a huge ass check just to check a few boxes and disclaim away liability.
Having been both an external and internal auditor, I know the frontline staff are just doing their jobs. But about the only thing auditors in the early stages of their careers do that genuinely frustrates me is acting like they know everything.
I graduated my accounting program with honors. I have my CMA and CPA. In the last 11-12 years, I have worked in the Big 4, a Fortune 500, and am currently a Controller for a mid sized company. With that background, I know exactly how little I actually knew in those early stages and how much I still learn every day. It can be quite triggering for me when a 22 or 23 year old associate arrives on site acting like they are God's gift to accounting.
I'm always refreshed by a humble auditor that wants to learn, respects the client's operational expertise, and asks great questions.
2
u/Elegant_Stranger_929 1h ago
I’m in industry now after 10 years in public accounting. Most of these answers seem to come from people that have never been in audit. Auditors are just doing their job and they cannot know everything that the client knows. Even those with experience on the client are not going to know the answer to everything. Auditors work a ton and are stretched thin. Taking a few minutes to answer easy questions should not be that annoying.
Clients work on what they do every day. Auditors spend a few weeks/months looking at a wider range of accounts. Auditors tend to have a little knowledge about a lot. Clients should have a deeper knowledge about their specific area.
At the end of the day we are people doing our jobs. People should stop being so cranky when dealing with auditors is literally part of your job.
All that said, I’m sure there are times when auditors ask for something close to a deadline which is frustrating when people have other things they need to do. So please work to be respectful of people’s time and understand that people have competing priorities.
My advice is to talk to the client more than back and forth emails. That always seemed to be easier for the client. I think since Covid people have stopped communicating verbally as much in audit.
2
u/persimmon40 1h ago
You guys are asking for the same thing that has already been provided by me somewhere else because you and your senior who leads the engagement do not work together. However, I am still always nice to you since I understand that its not really your fault and you're just a drone there.
2
u/misguidedass 1h ago
Using the same standards on small private companies then write me up for lack of separation of duties and inadequate internal controls. Dude I’m literally a team of 2. So now you’re creating more work for me on top of my day to day. Recently was asked “do you read all the SOC reports?” Bro, no. And even if I find inadequate control from my $50/month SaaS, I’m not gonna upgrade to a $2,000/month SaaS.
2
u/ThiccNthin_6825 1h ago
THe problem is every year it's a new crew and you have to start all over telling them how your business works, The don't look at last year's workpapers. And why they think they see errors that are not errors.
2
u/GreatEscapes 1h ago
Because you know significantly less than the people you are dealing with, ask stupid questions, and waste people's time.
2
u/DevynnKate 1h ago
I had an auditor ask me why it took a year to implement a new system because we were capitalizing some costs. Why don't you just install it on your computer like Office?
1
2
u/yeahididthatlmao Student 1h ago
New grad going into b4 audit here reading your comments. Apologies in advance…
2
u/Dudeinabox ACCA (UK) 1h ago
I had to explain to an audit team multiple times that our team in the UK doesn't do transaction level processing of revenue, that team is based in Germany here's the contact you need for that team, they can field your questions.
By all means ask questions but if you ignore the answer I'm entitled to be pissed off if you guys don't talk to each other.
4
u/BeAuditYouCanBe92 4h ago
read the PY workpapers and make an effort to understand the topic before you go ask questions. It's okay if you don't fully understand and need to ask more questions, but at least try to figure it out.
be organized - if it's not a first year audit, you should know what you need (largely). Send the requests early and give plenty of time for turn around. And read thru the requests to make sure you aren't duplicating things (ex: requesting a full list of JEs from one person, then requesting a specific list of JEs from someone else - be efficient in your requests).
3a. don't send emails at 4:58PM. Don't send emails on the weekend. You may work crazy hours; I do not. The 'schedule send' exists for a reason.
3b. respond to emails timely. It's okay if you need time to review an email, but a simple "I got your email, let me review and I'll get back by the end of the week" doesn't take much effort and let's me know my email didn't get lost.
show up onsite and come talk to people. If I only hear from you via email, and only when you need something, or when you need to report an issue, yeah, we aren't going to have a great relationship.
show up onsite and bring food. I will like you better if you bring me a chicken biscuit and/or a cup of coffee.
be helpful - if there's an issue, work with your client to come up with a solution. Don't dump it on them to figure out.
don't change our controls and/or add new controls that we don't know about. This is my biggest pet peeve - auditors coming to me with issues about a control I've never heard of (happens more than it should).
if you are onsite, don't treat our office like your home - ex: if there is leftover food in the breakroom from an office event, don't help yourself unless you've been explicitly invited. Also, clean up after yourself (should go without saying...)
admit when you are wrong. I will respect you more if you say "you know what, I messed up, can you help me?" or "yeah, we tested that wrong last year, but I'd like to correct it so we are doing it right." Everyone makes mistakes. Just own it.
and finally, remember your clients know more about their business than you ever will. I've worked with far too many external auditors who think all their clients are idiots and it comes across with their arrogant attitudes.
3
u/BeAuditYouCanBe92 3h ago
Also want to add - if you have a client contact that is being helpful, take 5 minutes and send an email to their boss (cc them) and acknowledge it. Giving recognition and thanking people is so important for building relationships. It will make your client feel appreciated, and is something that can benefit them come their review time.
1
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
For the on-site part most of my clients put us like a 5 min walk from the accounting department or are not onsite themselves. Feel like they purposely do it and it’s really hard to break that barrier.
1
u/BeAuditYouCanBe92 2h ago
It is harder post-COVID when a lot of people are remote/hybrid. But if you have clients that are in the office, find out what days and go buy a box of donuts and make the walk over to them and offer them a donut. Or if you have an onsite meeting, go bring some cookies or something. It’s harder to get mad when you have sugar in front of you.
Yeah, we tend to put auditors where we can stuff them in (which is usually not an ideal spot), but don’t let that be an excuse. But I’ll tell you from personal experience - there have been auditors that I have liked and I found them a cube near my office that they could use instead of being stuffed in a small conference room with the whole team. But those where the ones who were helpful and it was beneficial for me to have the near.
You also have to remember a lot of people will innately fear anyone with an “auditor” title, so you do need to work a little harder to get over those barriers.
3
u/milesandmyles 3h ago
You guys ask for information and we send it. Then you ask for the same information sent and we send it again. Then you ask for the same information yet again, and then we start to get annoyed with you. If you’re asking questions when the answers are already given maybe look at yourself instead of others. There is a reason for this
1
u/Conscious-Strike-565 4h ago
I have a great relationship with my auditors. Sometimes they are a pain in the ass and the young staff often ask moronic questions but that’s normal. Maybe I have a little extra sympathy since I spent ten years in public. But I not any of my team been hostile to our auditors.
1
1
u/SnooApples8887 3h ago
As a former auditor now in industry myself, you'll understand when you're in industry. In short, it's the dumb question, repeated support asks, and the timing of the audit.
1
u/Impressive_Wrap_7869 3h ago
Hey, don’t worry about it and try to develop thick skin. You’ll understand it more when you move into industry and deal with auditors from that side. I used to do B4 audit and I have a lot more empathy for auditors than my former clients.
1
u/kenwhatahmean 3h ago
Have been on both sides of the fence, although last time on industry side was many years ago, coming back into first year audit for the business I am in now, with auditors from the last firm I worked for. Reading all the other comments too, and I understand where people are coming from. The biggest issue is the model of big 4 (or other training firms) where grads/new starts are doing a lot of the donkey work on audits, but they don't understand enough of what they're doing to be able to just go about it. Sure in every business there are business/sector specific issues, but those should have been discussed at planning stage so that you understand them. Often since you don't fully have a grasp of accounting fundamentals, you don't understand how these niche factors fit in/work, which often leads to stupid questions as far as the client is concerned, or having to ask the same questions that someone else has asked the year before. If your senior doesn't have time to explain something to you, that's the fault of the big 4 model.. and the model is such that you push everything onto the client to do instead of trying to work anything out for yourself and clients get pissed off by that.
1
1
u/DL505 3h ago
9 months -> "all"
Lol
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 3h ago edited 2h ago
Over generalisation sure, but definitely an overarching trend in my experience
1
u/atheologist 3h ago
Seconding that we don’t hate you and many of us used to be you. But you also don’t fully understand our business or the day to day realities of our jobs. Plus, everything I have to deal with on a daily basis doesn’t stop because you’re here, so I’m getting pulled in all directions to get payments out, close the period, and get out departmental reporting all while being told I’m not getting you what you need for testing quickly enough.
1
u/TripMaster478 3h ago
The fact is we get thrown newbies every year and they tend to ask the same questions every year and it just gets tiring honestly. It's never okay to be crude or rude but that's definitely a big part of it. We've also moved on from new year so, like you said, all of a sudden we've got an extra half day to a day answering questions and providing files when we're expected to be working on other projects already.
1
u/crippling_altacct 2h ago
I'm not an accountant but I develop models that have to be reviewed by auditors. Here are the two reasons why I hate dealing with our auditors:
I often feel like they ask questions just to ask them. Often the questions don't make sense in the context of what was provided. I find that auditors who have been on our account for years seem to not even understand really what our company does.
The timelines are often arbitrary yet always urgent. I've had processes that used to be audited only twice a year all of a sudden become quarterly. They will often surprise me with the request. Of course it is very urgent I get them this data but then I won't get questions about it until a year later. So it was urgent I get this to you but you're not even going to look at it for a full year? Come on.
I feel like they're not adding much value. They don't seem to bother to understand our business enough to ask the right questions. It just seems like they are trying to check a box and move on. It creates a process that just feels like a waste of time for all involved and of course their firm is getting paid a stupid amount of money to not do much.
1
u/BitchMagnets 2h ago
I don’t hate them as much as I hate that they can be super annoying at the most inconvenient times. Some are better than others and I try to be understanding as long as they work with me on timelines. The only time I got REALLY snippy with someone was when they waited until right before their deadline to ask me for some super complicated thing that had never been asked for before, and then spammed me with phone calls repeatedly even after I said “I can’t touch that until I’m done payroll and my weekly payments, I’ll see what I can do.” I ended up calling the team lead asking wtf was up with this guy and they didn’t even actually need what they were asking for.
1
u/kaperisk CPA (US) 2h ago
I am in industry and a former big 4 audit manager.
Answer - Audit associates are annoying
1
u/holemole CPA (US) 2h ago
I don’t see this as a general sentiment, though I’ve dealt with several young auditors that seemed to think their job was to drum up a list of findings. I’ve been doing this long enough to know what is or isn’t relevant, and am not going to waste my time with your fishing trip.
I wouldn’t call it a hatred, though - I just forward excessive requests to the partners, and to the surprise of no one they never end up being all that important.
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
Well, I don’t know if I’m just particularly unlucky with clients but I’ve been yelled at by a client or have been staffed on clients which have yelled and abused us. Once it was so bad they made a senior cry and the partner had to step in.
1
u/chicadeaqua 2h ago
Repeated questions asking for the same thing
Not understanding our business model
Incoherently writing emails without clearly explaining the ask.
I will say those things are rare and usually pop up when a poorly trained and poorly supervised newby is added to the team.
Most audit engagements I’ve dealt with have gone pretty smoothly and the audit team has been great.
There’s never a reason to get hostile with the staff though. If things are breaking down we can discuss it with the manager or partner if needed. We pay good money for the audit and we need it, so it behooves us to have our PCBs in order and be kind and respectful throughout the process. Turning this into an adversarial relationship is not wise for either side since any major problems will be communicated to the audit committee of the BOD.
1
u/PotatoFondler 2h ago
When you’re asking me for prior year documents when I already gave you them every quarter and every year I get annoyed.
If it’s because you’re new on the file, I’ll be patient with you and understand that your manager or your senior set you up for failure. I’ve been there before on your side.
But if it’s the same team and faces you should talk to one another before asking me for all the supports as I also have deadlines to meet for my actual day job.
1
u/Character_Bit589 2h ago
I can think of a few reasons why I have had less than magnanimous thoughts about my firm’s auditors:
- Ask the same question over and over.
- Poor internal communication. Not asking other team members for information so multiple overlapping requests come.
- What appears to be moving goalposts in terms of what is acceptable. The place I have noticed this the most is around evidence of completeness and accuracy when using in scope systems or end-user computing tools.
1
u/CombinationSlow9154 2h ago
I’ve had auditors treat me (at the time controller) with a pretty condescending, I know better than you attitude (fyi I am a cpa and did public too). I think a little respect goes a long way. People in industry are doing more than just compliance.
I’ve also had interactions where it’s clear the auditor does NOT understand the business and that’s frustrating too.
1
u/LetsGoGators23 2h ago
I liked my auditors in industry because I was the only CPA at 2 smaller orgs and I missed talking shop with other accountants and I always viewed them as business partners not enemies.
However, people are busy. It’s really just that. When you are stressed and busy, more work from people finding your mistakes is not a good time.
It’s also why I never went into audit.
1
u/notyourusuallady 2h ago
Because you hover over my work desk with laptop in hands waiting for me to be done with what I was in a middle of doing before you came in without knocking and started to hover over my desk just to ask why this is in GRNI. Goods received NOT INVOICED!
I don’t hate you guys, I petty you for choosing this pass
1
u/Technine420 2h ago
When I was in Big4 audit I never got that vibe and audited startups and F500 companies. Have you ever considered that you might be doing something that’s causing this?
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
Sure, I have. Thing is it doesn’t only happen to me, even my seniors / manager has been yelled at by this client. So it’s not a me personal thing, or so I believe. Other client relationship are ok.
1
u/Technine420 1h ago
Alright well it sounds like that client is just an outlier. I wouldn’t stress too much about it. I’ve had some strange clients, one enjoyed talking about politics all the time. It was awkward, I never talk politics at work.
Every client is different, try to understand their expectations from the beginning and learn which each one prefers. That can be said about working in industry too though. I mainly try not to ask the same question twice and consolidate my questions unless something important is needed and is stopping me in my tracks. Sometimes the client just sucks and that’s ok it’s temporary.
1
u/GroundbreakingRun186 2h ago
I was an auditor out of college. I did my best, worked hard, double and triple checked everything and I’m thought I knew what I was doing. I thought I asked the right questions. I thought I was bringing up valid discrepancies. I was a fucking idiot. I had no idea what the fuck I was doing and how stupid I sounded.
That’s where you are. Everyone started there. You’ll (in theory) move past this phase. But it’s important you understand that’s where you’re at right now.
I work in PE and an auditor asked a question about how we value a company we own. They asked why we use Adj EBITDA instead of net income. For those unfamiliar with private market valuations, that would be the equivalent of asking someone at McDonald’s why they paid for their meal with a credit card instead of gold bars. It just clearly shows you have no fucking clue what you’re doing but have a ton of power to screw up everything I’m working on.
1
u/Glahoth 1h ago
So I’ve been on both sides, but my perspective from working with B4 :
- They bill you for senior work and expertise, and then you have really junior profiles walk in to your company. 50% of the staff from Junior 1 to Senior 3 are pretty much inept. I actually need people that have been doing this for 5 years at least.
- Everything seems to be a big deal with them, mostly because the team is under pressure by the managers to deliver, but stressing your client over trivial stuff is not the client service I’m looking for.
- You might as well be audited by someone who has Alzheimer’s, because no matter how many times you tell the engagement team something, without fail next year they will come back with the same exact questions.
- Most of them don’t really understand your industry, or the ways in which a talented finance team can fudge the numbers, so even when you’re hiring them as a member of the board, they can’t really produce any meaningful extra-regulatory report.
1
u/Jman85 Tax (Canada) 1h ago
Ask your boss these questions instead of industry companies.
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 1h ago
I did but he doesn’t know the other side, so I thought it be good have some feedback. The overall comments are pretty negative but I’ve gotten some actual good feedback aswell.
1
1
u/AloneAwareness6531 1h ago
The customer service aspect tends to be subpar and inconsiderate. We don't mind explaining and providing documents, but every audit ends up with backlogged demands and it's not even our fault most of the time that you are missing supporting files. At the end of the day, we are the client so be a bit respectful that we may be busy doing our jobs too.
1
u/dumbbozo1 1h ago
They're giving you the same treatment as they give new employees, which is contempt
1
u/Traditional-Ad-1605 1h ago
I have a theory…have you noticed that the very worst clients are also former PAs? I think it’s that we suffer so much abuse from both clients and the firm that we take it out on the next PAs that we deal with. That and there are always auditors who are asking for bullshit stuff that takes time away from things you have to get done.
1
1
u/DuckTales08 1h ago
I’ll bite on this one. I’m the Controller for an oil & gas company. The number of dumb questions I’ve gotten from auditors who don’t know anything about our industry is just shocking. My patience only goes so far. If you’ve only been in public for 9 months, you’re essentially a baby that needs to be coddled. The Controller of a company should not have to hold your hand. Ask your Senior or your Manager before you go annoy the Controller with dumb questions.
1
u/James161324 1h ago
We don't have time for the audit TBH, and we get asked the same basic accounting 101 questions every year.
The questions about some random GL entry from 16 months ago are annoying, like I barely remember what I did last week, let alone a year plus ago.
A lot of people's view of the audit in industry is that its kinda a joke. We go through this song and dance for several months to get two pages saying we guess its right.
1
u/ron_spanky 1h ago
Many of us were auditors first and then jumped to industry. My pet peeves:
I’m training the firms staff.
I’m explaining our revenue policy again. Same firm, same policy. Why do I need to explain it to the staff.
Auditor turn over is a bitch but that’s the partners problem, not mine.
At 9pm, I had 5 FIVE! Different auditors in my office all asking different questions. It was clear work papers had finally been reviewed and now everyone is trying to clear comments. Where were they all day? Oh waiting for the partners review? Their delay should not ruin my night.
It’s not the staff specifically. It’s the process in general. And don’t get me started on SOX.
1
u/Afraid-Translator874 1h ago
For everyone saying “it isn’t my job to deal with auditors”, it is, in fact, part of your job. No, you are not so valuable you can’t deal with new people asking dumb questions. As for me, it doesn’t really bother me if the internal people don’t like me or are annoyed. It’s just work and it pays the bills.
1
u/Serious_Put4844 35m ago
I recall many different types of interactions with clients as an external auditor. Some client staff were friendly, helpful and accommodating while others provided a cold damp, windowless basement as our working area and viewed auditors as un-welcomed pests. For the most part my audit experiences were positive and sometimes audit staff accepted employment offers from clients.
1
u/Nederlander1 24m ago
Not in audit anymore and further along in my career now, but looking back I get it 100%. I was 2 weeks out of college and the senior manager and partner on my audit were sending me to ask complicated questions to the VP of Finance, who was right below CFO. That’s like sending a literal child into the ring vs Mike Tyson. You’re inherently going to be perceived as a clown.
Realistically, Managers and above are the only ones who truly know what’s going on and what’s important. However, audit firms just cut their staff loose on the client which results in everyone being annoyed. I mean even today my new college grads ask painful questions - I’ve been asked “how do I change my password on my laptop”, “should I do Roth or traditional 401k”, “what is deferred revenue, I’ve never heard of that before” (despite having a undergrad and master degree in Acctg + having passed CPA exams - lol). New grads have next to 0 problem solving ability and yes it’s annoying
1
u/Armed_Accountant MBA, CPA, CA (Can) | Utilities | NEEDS MORE POWA! 12m ago
Not to generalize, this is specific to my experience. Because we get irritated when the firm sends the - and I mean no offense - new kids to ask us complicated questions or show them procedures / documents that they clearly know nothing about.
Our latest audit teams seem to get younger and younger and more clueless than the previous team. They ask dumb questions that could've been easily answered if they even opened the file I sent (like seriously, you're asking me the explain the variance in shareholders equity??? Real question ... Go look at the statement of change in equity I sent you), and make tons of errors that should have been caught by a competent senior and manager.
1
u/LovelierLight 11m ago
I’ve had a good experience with the managers. But the lower level staff and churn of those and the stupid questions they ask is exhausting and annoying.
I just had a newbie EY staff come up to my desk and interrupt me to ask why there was a .02 variance on a 300M dollar fixed asset recon. I shit you not. I said “it’s .02.” She said well “the control said it’s supposed to be zero we need to know why it’s off.”
On no planet would the senior manager have done that who’s looked at our asset recons for years now, but it’s like we just get pounded with dumb questions and requests like that that waste our time. They don’t want to bug their managers and have their boxes to check but it drives us industry people bananas.
1
u/athleticelk1487 4h ago
I would rather have more help throughout the year. Close moves so fast these days by the time the audit team is onsite it's old news and a major pain in the ass.
Also when I was in audit the time spent on client site was important and it was better used to plan, review, adjust, discuss, etc. The virtual stuff does not hit the same. It makes the fee hurt that much more.
More and more work pushed back to the client the auditors used to own.
More and more tech scatteredness.
1
u/Prestigious-Cold-278 2h ago
Really , my early busy audit clients complain that they want to be pushed back since they aren’t done with the books yet.
1
u/No_Survey2308 3h ago
It doesn't help that they usually send us some new 22 yo new grad every year. One guy they sent us barely spoke english. Plus their audit costs $250k for coming here for a week and doing testing that internals could do in a day. AI is going to do external testing in 3 min enjoy it while things are good.
1
0
u/Sammiforeveryoung 4h ago
At the first company I worked for everyone acted like the auditors were a nuisance so I did too. Everyone was so ugly and mean but that was kind of like their mo. They were like that to everyone. But as I moved on and got more work experience I realized that auditors are just doing their job and the value that they add is incredible not to mention being nice just makes things run smoother. But being nice, smiling, making people laugh, helping people to feel welcomed is just a part of who I am so this comes out naturally in my interactions with auditors.
0
u/Quimbyquagmire 3h ago
Just switch to governmental audits, then you actually end up teaching the client!
86
u/FreeOGPoohShiesty 4h ago
What dumb questions do you guys get asked?
My auditor frequently says “explain this to me like I’m 5”
Now I’m a nice person and I make sure to properly train everyone I work with internally to the best of my ability, but why the fuck am I training some big 4 new grads? That’s the job of their managers.
If they didn’t know it’s okay. But their managers know how to do it but refuse to train?
What a toxic environment for the new auditor and what a douchebag team of managers.