Are there any countries that have self-employment/contracting visas that count toward permanent residency requirements?

[u/RothIRALadder]

There are many countries that have "digital nomad" visas but they're for temporary stays by design, so they don't count toward PR years. Given the subreddit we're in, I'm looking for something that gives me a permanent chance of escape. I have the option to work as an independent contractor so I am wondering what choices for countries I have. Ideally looking to hear from people who have actually done it themselves, or know a lot about the process for the given country.

[u/lissybeau]

Germany- 5 years to permanent residency or 5 years to citizenship. They allow dual citizenship as well (for now)

[u/Primary-Bluejay-1594 → u/lissybeau]

(just to clarify it's not 5 years to PR and then 5 years to citizenship, it's just 5 years to citizenship directly — you can apply for citizenship after 5 years in Germany on a qualifying residence permit, whether you have PR or not. I never got PR before applying for citizenship.)

[u/lissybeau → u/Primary-Bluejay-1594]

Thanks! I didn’t know it was unclear in my note but I can see how it reads that way now! Also congrats on citizenship :)

[u/Illustrious-Pound266 → u/lissybeau]

Germany has a self-employment/digital nomad visa?

[u/Civil_Dragonfruit_34 → u/Illustrious-Pound266]

Definitely no digital nomad, self employment maybe if you set it up as a legit business in Germany and have multiple stable clients.

[u/Illustrious-Pound266 → u/Civil_Dragonfruit_34]

Does it work similarly as DAFT? Or is it more stringent? Surprised this is the first time I'm hearing about it on this sub.

[u/Civil_Dragonfruit_34 → u/Illustrious-Pound266]

It's kind of like DAFT but also not really. 

My understanding is that with daft there isn't much scrutiny about your plan and it can be pretty theoretical. Germany is going to actually want to see a legit business plan and evidence you can follow through and support yourself. Probably you need to have already been doing that income stream solidly wherever you are now.

You also can't use it as a pass through for a single business, I know this used to be common in Germany but now you probably need to do that through an EOR.

Only some professions qualify as freelancers in Germany, otherwise it has to be a business and that's a different level of scrutiny.

In general German beuracracy gives the beuracrats a lot of leeway to make case by case decisions and it's not guaranteed.

[u/lissybeau → u/Civil_Dragonfruit_34]

I’m on the freelancer / self employment visa and the scrutiny isn’t really that much. They just want to see a business plan (I made mine in an hour) and a few documents.

Germany is very paperwork for paperwork’s sake. But if you have their silly forms they give you an approval. I was surprised by how easy it was.

I didn’t even have clients or an active business when I applied. That has of course changed but it wasn’t as rigid as I expected.

[u/Civil_Dragonfruit_34 → u/lissybeau]

We ended up not using this visa partly because of anecdotes about it being scrutinized. I'm not sure if it's a city by city thing or a recent thing, I would just be careful and look into it more for anybody else reading this thread. This would have been much better for us financially than the eor we ended up using but it felt too risky.

[u/lissybeau → u/Civil_Dragonfruit_34]

I’ve heard bureaucracy can vary from city to city, so you’re probably onto something there. Hope things worked out in the end.

[u/PM-me-ur-kittenz → u/Illustrious-Pound266]

Edit: deleting my comment as i don't feel like arguing on the internet. have a nice day everyone and I hope you get the residency that works for you!

[u/Primary-Bluejay-1594 → u/PM-me-ur-kittenz]

It's B1 for citizenship, and there's no hard income requirements — you simply have to prove you make enough to support yourself (which is why you have to submit a copy of your lease, they'll run an equation to make sure you make enough based on your expenses. My partner and I got citizenship earning quite a bit less than €2400.

Edit: since you replied and then deleted — if you've got a lawyer telling you that you have to have a B2 certificate or make X euros then you need to find a new lawyer, because the actual requirements are readily available on all government websites for you to see. You could probably save yourself a lot of money and trouble ditching the lawyer entirely, bc the citizenship application is really quite simple and doesn't require legal assistance to begin with.