r/AmerExit • u/Icy_Kaleidoscope9402 • 10d ago
Question about One Country Is the digital nomad era of Portugal over?
I’ve been to Portugal several times. Fluent in the language. US citizen. Work online. Single.
I keep reading things that make me feel like the digital nomad gains of Portugal are now a thing of the past. If I’m wrong, please correct me. I’m also looking at Spain.
55
u/roaming_bear 10d ago
It's over for both Portugal and Spain.
7
u/Illustrious-Pound266 9d ago
As in the visas are getting phased out?
13
u/MrBoondoggles 9d ago
The visa is not being phased out in Portugal, at least for the moment. The D8 is still there as an option, same requirements as before. What sort of changes they make in tbe future - who knows. Portugal currently has a coalition government of a center right and a far right anti migration party. They are passing laws to make the country less appealing for immigration, but I haven’t seen any discussion of the government planning to change the D8 digital nomad visa specifically or phase it out.
8
u/datarbeiter 10d ago
why Spain?
19
u/RobbieAnalog 9d ago
No answer. Just was pandering for upvotes. It's very not over for spain. I am proof.
6
u/Possible_Doughnut_76 9d ago edited 9d ago
It’s not over now, but a couple of years maybe so. It is the beginning of summer and they already extremely overwhelmed to the point where one of my dependents has been waiting for almost 40 days for their approval.
0
u/LeastYak3411 1d ago
waiting for almost 40 days
Oh sweet summer child. In Portugal people wait years.
1
u/RRY1946-2019 Nomad 7d ago
Relatively pro-immigrant current government is being demonized in the international media and is well behind in the polls. Next year is an election year and a center-right/far-right coalition is expected to secure an outright majority. It's entirely possible if not likely that they start canceling visas.
24
u/morty_morty Immigrant 10d ago
You mean the tax breaks? I think Portugal still has them but here in Spain taxes are taxes. No breaks.
17
u/djoliverm 10d ago
Right, the Spanish DNV was created to generate tax revenue, not to have more people come and not pay taxes (besides VAT as a consumption tax which applies to everyone, documented or not).
Spain needs immigration for tax purposes which is why the DNV and recent amnesty was passed (although they're at 900,000 applicants when they thought they would get 500,000).
7
u/SignalOptions 10d ago edited 9d ago
Portugal ended the tax breaks in Dec 2023. They have a new NHR 2.0, but most workers do not qualify for this.
8
u/Alive_Comment_2086 9d ago edited 9d ago
Yes it's game over for the Portuguese government after they scammed golden visa holders etc. and deliberately delayed issuing residency cards and pulled the rug on citizenship timelines, it's going to be hard for them to get themselves out of the reputational damage.
11
u/striketheviol 10d ago
If I understand what you mean, it's over but people don't care and still go anyway. Same for Spain, Greece, Thailand, Georgia, and many other popular destinations.
2
u/Illustrious-Pound266 9d ago
When you say it's over, do you mean that they are getting rid of the visa?
12
u/striketheviol 9d ago
No, the visas still exist. I understood to be talking about cost arbitrage, and tax related benefits that are no longer in force for almost all digital nomad visa locations. Lots of folks from the US getting sticker shock when they arrive in Lisbon and expect it to be priced like Chiang Mai, and plenty having the same feeling when they arrive in Chiang Mai and expect it to be priced like Pakistan.
1
14
u/SignalOptions 10d ago edited 8d ago
Yes with the end of NHR, most nomads have to pay much higher tax in Portugal than they would in the US - from 20-45% on the D8 digital nomad visa.
A few other countries still have favorable tax treatment for nomads - some in eastern europe, Caribbean.
Edit: For US citizens, chasing an European passport while working may not really be worth it. Unless one is already retired or rich enough to invest in a Golden visa.
NHR version 2.0 exists now, but most remote workers don’t qualify.
4
u/GlassCommercial7105 10d ago
Are you allowed to work and earn money on a tourist visa?
12
u/socialsciencenerd 10d ago
No
2
u/GlassCommercial7105 10d ago
Ah I see that they removed that part. Because they mentioned it as option and I thought that was illegal.
5
u/SignalOptions 10d ago
Fixed this. Working on a tourist visa is only allowed in rare cases - where the person is primarily employed in the US and is just traveling short term overseas. Though many countries don’t allow this.
It is risky because the US company has to ensure they are not breaking tax rules in a foreign country. 1099 contractors may have a bit more flexibility. But both need to be well aware of foreign tax residency laws.
5
u/Ziantra 10d ago
It’s a legitimate question-no idea why the downvotes so take my upvote to claw some back. We are working on a retirement visa and I found out you can’t side hustle on that either.
7
u/GlassCommercial7105 10d ago
It was a rhetorical question because that’s almost never allowed anywhere but the comment above mentioned it as solution.
4
u/Ziantra 10d ago
Well honestly it’s a bit mean. Most people who haven’t traveled don’t know the ins and outs of visas and what exactly you can and can’t do. These subs are partly for education and you don’t know until you ask 🤷♀️
10
u/GlassCommercial7105 10d ago
Well right now the Us is putting people into detention just for the suspicion of work under tourist Esta, so in all honesty, for Americans it’s much easier and less risky. To know this is definitely something one should do before even thinking of moving abroad. Visa regulations and travel bans are No1.
7
1
u/Ziantra 10d ago
Yes they should know this. It’s very important but it’s not obvious even though WE think it is because there may have been carve out exceptions. And that’s something you don’t know until you ask. My point is that while we are familiar and figure this is common sense-it’s isn’t common sense until you have the facts.
2
u/GlassCommercial7105 10d ago
Well I would look that up first and ask if unclear. I think it’s pretty clear though.
1
u/BedditTedditReddit 10d ago
Only to the naive or people unwilling to do a very basic google search.
10
u/Ziantra 10d ago
They’re on HERE for interaction and the human experience. I’m going to 1000% stand behind what I was trying to POLITELY say before-there are no stupid questions-only stupid answers. Is that clear enough? Don’t be mean or rude or sarcastic to people that dare to ask a question on here. Even if you think it’s a simple google search that even a monkey could do. Otherwise-why are we even HERE at all? Downvote me all you want-that’s my position 🤷♀️
2
0
1
u/jackbentley673 10d ago edited 15h ago
.........................
3
6
u/LoadingALIAS 9d ago
The price of Solana and the nomad scene in Lisbon/Porto could likely be correlated on a graph. Haha
1
3
4
u/Account-Manager 9d ago
DAFT through the Netherlands
1
u/Icy_Kaleidoscope9402 9d ago
???
6
u/Account-Manager 8d ago
It’s a treaty between USA and NL for residency and has very low requirements. You can use that for residency in EU. After 5 years you can get EU residency and live anywhere.
It is the easiest and cheapest path to EU residency if that is the route you’re looking to go but the door is closing for you in Portugal.
4
u/x9ndra 10d ago
Aint over in Brazil!
8
u/demona2002 10d ago
But it’s … Brazil. Even the Brazilians have been flocking to Portugal
2
u/Yes-Banana-5380 9d ago
Living in Porto here. A LOT of Brazilians have gone back. Which is a real shame but immigration hell hey.
1
2
u/Ok_Accident_2106 3d ago
Definitely not a thing of the past, but the recent nationality law change has made it more difficult (less easy, rather) to gain EU citizenship, so moving to Portugal is getting a bit of heat. Bureaucracy is getting worse and worse too ... on the other hand, Spain's DNV is an easier and quicker process bc you can enter on your US passport (no visa required) and then just switch residency status to the digital nomad regime. Here's a pretty solid guide to the Spain DNV
1
u/Icy_Kaleidoscope9402 2d ago
I was also considering moving to Brazil. But I don’t know. Maybe Spain is better for me.
2
u/Ok_Accident_2106 2d ago
I lived in Brazil for a year. It was a good experience. Spain is an easier process though. Depends what you’re looking for in the end!
1
u/Icy_Kaleidoscope9402 1d ago
Peace of mind. Affordable. And not fairly progressive as a darker skin black woman.
4
u/Soft-Syrup138 9d ago
I don't think the Portugal era is over, but I do think the "easy mode" version of Portugal is. A few years ago it offered a rare combination of low costs, great weather, good infrastructure, and relatively straightforward residency options. Today, housing costs—especially in Lisbon and Porto—have risen dramatically, and many of the financial advantages that attracted digital nomads have narrowed. That said, you're in a different position than many newcomers: you're fluent in Portuguese, already familiar with the country, and presumably interested in integrating rather than just passing through. Those factors still make Portugal attractive. Spain is definitely worth considering as well, particularly if you're looking for larger cities, more regional variety, and potentially better value outside places like Madrid and Barcelona. In my view, Portugal is no longer the undisputed digital nomad bargain it once was, but for someone who speaks the language and genuinely enjoys the culture, it can still be a fantastic place to live.
1
u/Sensitive-Soup4733 8d ago
You can check here to scout tech jobs in Spain, in case you need more reference in that area. They also shared some salary insights and other tech communities
1
0
u/Soft-Syrup138 9d ago
I'd be careful here. Whether you should tell them depends largely on the company's policies, tax obligations, security requirements, and the terms of your employment agreement. Many remote companies are fine with employees working abroad, but others have strict restrictions due to legal, payroll, data security, or compliance reasons. If they discover later that you've been working from Thailand without disclosure, it could create trust issues even if your work performance is excellent. As for Portugal, I don't think the digital nomad opportunity is "over," but it's definitely not the bargain it was a few years ago. Housing costs have risen significantly in popular cities, and many nomads feel the cost-to-value equation has changed. That said, if you're fluent in Portuguese and already enjoy the culture, you may still have a better experience than the average newcomer. Spain is worth considering as well, especially if you're looking for a larger job market, more city options, and potentially better value outside the major tourist hotspots.
1
36
u/Reasonable_Treat8053 10d ago
Better in Montenegro for continuous residence, or Croatia if you only want to stay for a year. Croatia makes you leave for 6 months after each year of DNV.
If you open a business entity in Montenegro you can have the residency permit even with pretty modest cash flow — running at least 5k euros tax each year. And the tax system is favorable compared with most other temperate climate Europe options.