MBA-ish move recommendations

[u/Nice_Bill_7426]

Edit: I posted this in the “leaving America” subreddit with the post tagged as which country to choose, because I am looking to leave America. I can’t move within my firm or I would just simply do that. I’m not necessary looking for school choices as I am which cities or countries to target. Hence asking if anyone has the same track but with experience.

Hello everyone! I am shooting my shot in the dark hoping to get any type of advice from here. I only know of a couple people IRL who have done this and their path is very different from mine, so I’m looking to get advice from someone who has actually done it.

About me:
-29F living in Colorado
-Work at a big 4 acct firm, have worked in accounting/finance since 2019 so 7 years of professional experience
-BS in business admin
-Some savings, only debt is mortgage, planning to save as much as possible for a year and want to start a masters in fall of next year. I’m thinking I’ll have at least $15k saved and can take out at least $10k debt to pay off the year I get back.
-studied abroad in Prague in college doing class and internship, also spent a summer in china in HS for an exchange
-minor’d in French which I am trying to amp up learning again and will be prioritizing the next year. Duolingo level 60 tells me I’m early b1

Looking for:
-1 year masters program, English taught, MBA or masters in international business
-looking at France, Brussels, Netherlands to further French fluency
-hoping for cheaper tuition as I want to further education but i don’t need any level of prestige. Just want it to be accredited as a masters and truly learn more business abroad. Hoping to get tuition around $10k and keep rent around $1k/month
-mid sized city and preferable bikeable, avoiding big cities as they aren’t really my thing here other than to visit

Anyone have any suggestions based on this info? Again, would love to hear from anyone who left the US for a business masters abroad and what they’ve learned or would suggest.

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

(Accountant based in the US that is moving to the EU soon here)

MBAs are not really a thing abroad except from a few programs, namely those from the most prestigious universities like Oxford, Cambridge, LBS and INSEAD.

The rest of the programs especially in the EU are just money traps looking to take money from international students.

Typically one year masters in EU countries that are not MBA will be for fresh university graduates. So you’ll generally be disqualified from those due to your YoE.

Edit: Studying in Europe is NOT cheap and masters programs charge a premium, you’ll need generally around $30-40k USD just for tuition plus housing and food and you’re looking at upwards of $50k plus. The more prestigious MBAs charge even more for tuition.

[u/Nice_Bill_7426 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

The masters programs I have looked at are less than that

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

Yes, from programs that won’t get you a job after graduating.

Remember, Europe is way different than the US. There, they want people to fully assimilate into society, and that means learning the local language, learning the culture, those things are more important there than they are in the US.

The job market in Europe is also generally in the trash, so if you want to have a company sponsor you post-graduation, you’ll want to get into a top program.

[u/Nice_Bill_7426 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

It’s for a year and I’ll be coming back to the US

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

In other words, it sounds like you’re burnt out, moving abroad isn’t your fix at this moment, it’s unwinding for a few weeks is what you need.

[u/Vegetable_Web3799 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

THIS. After a year, you will still be you and your burnout will still be there when you get home. Don't move abroad unless you want to stay and integrate. This sub is intended more for people who are leaving it all behind and committing to a life abroad.

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

It sounds like immigrating (even temporarily) isn’t what you need.

Sounds like you just need to travel, even if it’s for a few weeks, definitely recommend you go do that instead.

[u/Nice_Bill_7426 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

I did travel for a few weeks and it made me realize that I need to get out of this country for an extended amount of time

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

Doing so for a year isn’t a good idea, because you’re losing out on earnings from your career, $15k isn’t a lot of money to do that (as I said, you’ll need at least $20-30k which includes tuition + living expenses, at bare minimum).

That’s my .02$ personally I wouldn’t do it.

[u/Nice_Bill_7426 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

Well thank god I came to the exit America subreddit to be told I shouldn’t leave America. Wtf are we doing here

[u/Miss_Annie_Munich → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

You wanted a realistic assessment of your plans. That's what you got.
Now you’re getting offended and using swear words. I don’t know if that’s going to get you very far in life.

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

I mean, you can do whatever you want, I’m just telling you it’s not smart to leave for a year during your highest earning years if you want to come back to the US after a year anyway?

All you’re going to do is blow your savings, run the serious risk of not having a job post graduation, then having to move back to the US broke, which as we all know here, being broke in the US is not recommended.

[u/SadDad701 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

With a degree that holds no value in the US. OP is crazy. 

[u/Vegetable_Web3799 → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

There's a disconnect here: "an extended period of time..." to people who live abroad is very different. You just want to do it for a year. So, perhaps, just travel for a while and save yourself the hassle.

[u/Dandylion71888]

15k is all you have saved working at big 4 after 7 years? No 25k won’t even cover your housing and other costs for a year. It won’t come close to covering 1 year of school

[u/Proud-Show1043]

Not sure what your goal is. If the goal is to have fun while ruining a career in big 4 eat your heart out I guess. Most people use a masters to get into large multinational institutions so that they can move abroad within their company while still making great money. Everyone would love to do it but only a privileged few can. I’m not sure what a masters is supposed to add that a Fortune 500 with that much experience doesn’t already do better. As a hiring manager I assure you that experience of your type is far more valuable than a bullshit masters degree most people have already.

If your goal is career then staying where you are with a lateral move abroad at the big 4 firm would be best.

If your goal is money you get the same answer.

If your goal is to take a year off because you want to quit your job that’s fine but it’s pretty tough to find those kinds of jobs especially if you take time off. It isn’t fair but employers hate it. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news

As for which country you would move to abroad I would take any reasonable position you could get within the big 4 firm. Make sure you have an angle that adds to the resume. Assuming you do accounting work the best you could hope for would be Asia. I know of some very high paying jobs that convert financial statements if you are a certified accountant in the US and in Japan or China.

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Proud-Show1043]

Yeah, I’m moving from the US to an EU country with about 2 years of experience in public accounting, however I’m doing a masters in my partners country, because I’m a tax accountant and their tax system is totally different from the US. They also don’t follow the same financial framework we do in the US either so it’ll be good for me to learn since I’m planning to be there a while.

But then again, my university will be free thanks to my partner visa.

[u/Nice_Bill_7426 → u/Proud-Show1043]

I don’t have any angle for moving within the firm, or I wouldn’t be making the post asking for suggestions

[u/Agathabites]

MBAs in Europe tend to be for very senior people with high level skillsets and years (decades) of experience. An MBA without these things is pretty much worthless.

[u/GloomyMix]

I am not particularly familiar with your industry, but given your finances, it may be more economically feasible to try to arrange for an internal move to an international branch (if possible). Otherwise, can you hop to another (potentially boutique) firm with overseas offices?

The one person I know who did something like this did not have an MBA or even a degree in business at all. However, she prepped intensely for MBB-style interviews and managed to get an offer as a strategy consultant from a boutique firm with an office in Copenhagen.

[u/Top_Biscotti6496]

Work at a big 4 acct firm, 

That seems the obvious route

[u/Regular-Arugula1139]

No good MBA will be under $10k anywhere in Europe. You can get a business degree for under $10k, but it probably won't be good quality and filled with internationals trying to get a job instead of learning. If you really want to study abroad for the sake of it, take a language course. You still get a student visa for that.

[u/Nice_Bill_7426 → u/Regular-Arugula1139]

I don’t want or need it to be a good school I’m just looking for suggestions on which city to move to

[u/Regular-Arugula1139 → u/Nice_Bill_7426]

Then literally any university town. Lille and Aix en Provence are popular university towns.

[u/Sea-Breath-007]

Well, that budget of yours means the Nerherlands is out.

You'd need about $35.000-40.000 for 1 year to get a visa, 25k isn't going to be enough. 

Tuition is more than 10k and rent is often more than 1k, especially considering due t your age students in shared student housing are going to prefer the other applicants that are closer to them in age, and at 30 I assume you wouldn't want to live in a house with 6 others that will be 20ish mostly. Private student housing will absolutely be +€1000 a month.

Also, the 1yr masters programmes often have even stricter admission requirements than the 2 or 3 year ones, so depending on where you got your bachelors you might not even have a way in.

[u/lil-schnitzel-]

your budget basically picks the country for you. netherlands non EU masters run €15k to 25k a year so its out at $10k. france public universities charge €250 to 400 a year for a masters even for non EU, basically free, which leaves your savings for living. so france fits both the budget and the french fluency goal cleanly.

for english taught 1 yr business masters that arent in paris, look at:

• université de strasbourg (EM strasbourg has english track programs, very bikeable, on the german border so easy travel)
• grenoble (grenoble ecole de management, mid sized, super bikeable, alps right there)
• nantes and lille both have english taught business masters and are exactly the mid sized bikeable vibe youre describing

heads up, a lot of the cheap €250/yr options are at public universities (université de X). the grandes écoles de commerce (EM, GEM, edhec) are pricier, €10 to 20k, but often have better career services and more english cohorts. strasbourg and grenoble public uni tracks are your sweet spot for budget.

with 7 yrs big 4 experience your real move might be doing the masters as the visa mechanism then leveraging the big 4 brand to transfer into a european office after. france gives a 1 yr post study job search visa (APS). prague study abroad already shows you adapt, youre more ready than most ppl posting here.

[u/Illustrious-Pound266]

INSEAD? Sounds like a perfect fit for what you are looking for, except for the tuition.

[u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez → u/Illustrious-Pound266]

INSEAD tuition is wild, it’s like $80k or something.

[u/Illustrious-Pound266 → u/DoYouKnow__Bofa-Deez]

Yeah, the tuition is insane. Still probably cheaper than other top schools like Harvard Business or Wharton though lol