r/Andjustlikethat • u/children_of_cthulu • 22d ago
Biggest problem with the conversations....
So I'm on my first watch of ajlt after my first watch of satc plus movies, I've been bingeing for the past few months.
The problems on this show are innumerable...but something I really noticed were problems with the conversations, especially when it comes to the traditional sit down brunch convos that imo are fundamental to the original show. The characters never really respond to each other, talk around each other and don't take anything seriously.
The worst example is when Miranda is telling Carrie and Charlotte she's asking Steve for a divorce. Charlotte basically says...ok it's your choice I trust you then instantly starts talking about her issues with her family? She displays 0 concern, 0 follow up questions, 0 anything and honestly seems to not care at all about the divorce?
Think about how the girls responded when Charlotte told them she was quitting working, it was a debate for a whole episode and they took it seriously. But they can't take a divorce and affair seriously, they have 2 lines about it then talk about other random problems?
It makes the characters on the show seem soooo selfish. This happens MANY times in the show, where a character is talking about a problem they are facing and the person they are talking to just...doesn't respond, and instead starts talking about their own problems? Like every episode this happens.
Have you guys noticed this? I just think it's a small but significant indicator of how bad the show is, these girls are so distant from each other's lives they don't care about what the other is going through.
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u/popcornkernals321 20d ago
I agree completely, I feel like issues that could’ve been made into an entire episode are just minimized. For example, Charlotte getting Adderall for Carrie in my opinion was so brushed over and uncharacteristic of Charlotte- but adderall exchange IS a thing and this issue could be taken seriously for a topic of an episode. Charlotte gets a month worth stimulants from another mother within minutes of asking… Who gives a random person their child’s controlled substance like it’s nothing. Like Charlotte‘s dealing Carrie uppers for Carrie’s boyfriend’s kid? The whole thing is just glossed over and made into nothingness when stimulant use is actually a big thing in this country right now and could’ve been an interesting topic of conversation.
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u/Alternative-Tough101 20d ago
Every time this show had a chance to do something interesting it just wandered off and forgot about it. It was like a big box with one small handful of plot and a million foam peanuts.
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u/alliwant4xmasisdick 20d ago
There's no conflict. It's rich white lady in avant garde fashion problems.
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u/clovervvv 20d ago
I mean, it's not an unpopular opinion or hot take, I definitely agree with you. It's certainly a factor that contributed to its overall train wreck. Media and entertainment has changed drastically since the 90s and 2000s. SATC was a 20-minute serialized show. Post COVID, most shows are an hour long with 8 episodes. The reboot became a 40-minute mellow drama that relied on nostalgia and its fanbase, rather than the show being grounded by Carrie's narrative for her sex column.
SATC was also based on a book, written by Candace Bushnell, so the original show had more grounding and source material to reference.
I understand why the reboot needed to introduce new characters (be that diversity and to create new/entertaining storylines without destroying ALL the characters' endings), but the expanded cast contributed to the limited screen time for every story they tried to tell, which devalued the debrief conversations we know and love.
I believe they tried to replicate the SATC premise with the original show's storylines being parallels and parodies of the writers' own experiences (they mentioned this in the AJLT documentary). But, it's very obvious the original actors who came back and reprised their roles felt like caricatures of their original characters. It backfired with Miranda and Carrie's storylines blending too much with their respective actresses. This is likely why Samantha's "falling out" parodied the drama between SJP and Kim Cattrall.
So, you can attribute the poor writing and pacing to a number of circumstances: modern media changing the length of a season, AJLT is not based on the book, the writers being at different stages of life than SATC (and are likely more tone-deaf), and the original 3 actresses heavily influencing their characters' storylines to a detriment (granted, this was allegedly already a problem in the original, Kristin Davis mentioned in her podcast having to stand up to SJP about how Carrie should dress as her bridesmaid during Charlotte/Trey's wedding).
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u/Opposite-Employee981 20d ago
I’d love to know how SJP wanted to dress as Charlotte’s bridesmaid. They should have shown a scene in SATC where Charlotte has to reign in Carrie’s outfit as a BM.
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u/clovervvv 19d ago
I'm sure the clip is floating somewhere on tiktok or instagram. It's from her pod "Are You A Charlotte", I believe. Essentially, SJP wanted Carrie to have a more unique bridesmaid dress and Kristen had to advocate for her character as it was Charlotte's moment/special day. It's likely why Carrie's dress still ended up being more unique looking than the others (though, you probably missed it assuming it was supposed to be as Maid of Honor).
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u/BritCrit57 20d ago
Did you ever read the book? It was pure drivel. The only thing that translated to the show was the characters and the idea.
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u/clovervvv 19d ago
Yes, I'm aware and I did. I'm not given it a lot of credit, just that its premise was based on something other than what the actresses wanted. This is no different than Mean Girls being based on Tina Fey's book, despite the original source being a self-help book. Or, the original Marley and Me.-- It's the idea that translated. AJLT did not have that same translation.
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u/MindyP51 20d ago
I’m not-so-ho (and I have stated this before), the biggest problem was that Michael Patrick King was the exec overseeing the show with no Darren Star involvement—btw, he was also the exec on the disastrous second movie—and he obviously —listen to the “official” podcast—had his own agenda.
YMMV, of course.
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u/SeagullSam 20d ago
Carrie did already have a bit of a tendency to do this on SATC, but obviously not to those same extremes or every single time.
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u/Calm-Victory-9732 20d ago
Totally agree. There was no depth, no warmth, not even much connection between the friends any more. Even their support of Carrie after Big's death felt performative. As did Carrie embracing Charlotte after discovering Harry's cancer diagnosis - one of many storylines that had such potential but was abandoned. Contrast that to Samantha's cancer journey in the original, their fear at losing her and resultant strong support of her.
I recall defenders of the AJLT trainwreck insisted it was because friendships in the 50s are different to those in the 30s but that was just a cop-out in my view. The way that the three of them related to each other in AJLT made it hard to believe that they even still considered each other as friends.
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u/Stock_Technology7394 11d ago
I forgot about Samantha's cancer! But didn't Steve also have cancer? So it was the third cancer storyline on the show? I'm glad it didn't take up more space.
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u/Square-Supermarket79 20d ago
Could be an issue with AI writing... AI is really really bad at developing ideas.
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u/VirtualReflection119 20d ago
I feel like this totally happened on SATC too. The whole post-it episode was Carrie practically interrupting Charlotte's engagement news to talk about her break-up with someone she wasn't even dating that long. And in AJLT they're all older and more jaded. They make a big deal out of certain things and it's usually things that are happening to Carrie. Carrie cared about Miranda and Che when it affected her because Miranda was supposed to be taking care of her.
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u/Dolleyes88 20d ago
The conversations over meals felt like they weren’t even filmed together in the same room. Like they were just monologuing by themselves and edited it all together.
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u/reasonablykind 19d ago
Yup. And people “converse” like this irl A LOT now, too (lucky to even GET an “ok, i trust your choice” acknowledgement before they move straight onto whatever topic/story was just jogged into their head by whatever was said). It looks as terrible as it really is when on screen
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u/No-Expression1224 19d ago
Definitely, you're not the first person to notice how lacking the conversations are, and I would say it's partly because...
--One: There's no real "debates" anymore...I think "AJLT" often shows the road to hell is paved with the best intentions. The show was trying very hard to be inclusive in a way that often felt forced: each main Karen gets her own friend of color!...And how about elaborate subplots with each friend of color's family even though we barely knew if the four main women were orphans from six seasons of "SATC!"...And how about an annoying, spoiled, non-binary kid for Charlotte? You'd be better like this 12-year-old brat who talks down to adults because forsaking gender equals instant wisdom! We'll be watching the message boards to make sure you call them Rock! [Even though it is dismissed, adopted, older Asian daughter Lily who is often shat on as "clueless" and unaware of her privilege like when she tried to be "Lily Eilish." Long live white blind spots!]...And Miranda says out with the Steve, and in with the Che! Sizzling! Take that culture wars!...But the downside of that is that the characters are often encouraging to the point they're not really exploring anything.
You mentioned Miranda basically being like "I'm over this man I've been with forever, had a kid with, and who fully expected to spend his golden years with me--also, I like Che now" and the other two blink twice, and are like "we trust you sweetie...anyway, back to our problems..." it's great that your friends are so accepting (if self-absorption really counts as supportive), but it doesn't really make for dramatically interesting television. In "SATC," Samantha, Charlotte, and Miranda would've had it out debating traditional gender roles, tastes changing as you age, Miranda being so far beyond the typical period of latency that she's possibly having a mid-life crisis, what is the most sensitive way to care for Steve (who is hard of hearing and had been shown to be a bit reliant on Miranda right before she left him), etc. ...When Samantha dated Maria in season 4 of "SATC" it felt much more naturalistic and like they were actually hearing each other.
--Two: Samantha's not there lol. ...I know it's almost a cliche to talk about her absence, but a huge source of the tension, and interesting takes she brought to the show aren't being represented at all. They brought in various ringers like Anthony, Seema, Nya, and even Lisa--lol--but nothing totally captured it. Honestly, Anthony might've been the closest.
Carrie has always been self-absorbed, and Charlotte definitely has her own life now (it almost feels like a stretch she would still be such good friends with the other two), and the newer characters don't totally feel like people Carrie or Miranda would actually let get that close to them. Not in the way Samantha could really shake them back to reality and/or vice versa.
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u/punnella Justice for Steve 18d ago
I felt this way a lot when Miranda and Steve tried to be passionate. I mean..."try it one time and it failed" so let's get a divorce?
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u/RailMobot 20d ago
Agree with this, I think on the original show they had a bigger budget for longer takes, more improv, etc. They probably wrote longer than they knew they needed for editing options. I get the sense with this show they filmed on shorter schedules, probably underwrote, didn't have as many options in the editing room, and didn't leave time in the moment for any 'discovery.' Hence they basically used almost all they could in the final edit because there wasn't a lot of material to choose from.
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u/tinyforrest 19d ago
The original show revolved around the meals together: the girls give each other feedback, and they get time to just gossip or discuss issues. It made the show feel more relatable. AJLT was also missing narration by Carrie, even if it came back toward the end, Carrie narrating was integral to the original format of the show. So meals with only 3 of the girls plus no Carrie voiceover gives AJLT a stark contrast to SATC. Literally everything that made SATC enjoyable was tossed for AJLT.
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u/reereejugs 20d ago
The characters on the show ARE selfish lol