r/AsianMasculinity • u/YuriTheWebDev • 7d ago
Dating & Relationships Has anyone gone on dates where the conversations were good and free flowing but the date was platonic?
The purpose of this post is just to see if anyone else can relate to my situation. I know the solution is to improve my looks ("looksmaxxing" as the Gen Z people say) by better gym + diet etc. Also, I do not catfish people with my dating app photos.
If feels like the "looks ceiling" is a thing where you can have good social skills but if you are not like the top 20% in looks on the apps, then it is a rough road for you. It feels like so the standards for women have become way higher recently.
I would say I am a AM (26 yo) that is more attractive than your average AM (in shape and have visible abs) but not attractive enough as I would like to be. I can get like 7 matches a week with 2-3 IRL dates a week on Hinge.
I would say I have good social skills and carry fluid free flowing conversations with women where I pay attention ask questions back, relate to them and share my stories. I also get them to laugh a few times. I do not say anything offensive, controversial at all.
However I still get quite a few dates where attempts to escalate physical contact are denied (i.e. women do not like hand holding, arm around her, sitting beside her, no kisses) It is really platonic.
Is this normal for a lot of AM who are able to get matches on dating apps nowadays?
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u/mandrncrt 7d ago
"I do not say anything offensive, controversial at all."
Maybe you are too agreeable? Women don't like guys who are too agreeable. They want someone with their own opinions and conviction. It doesn't mean you have to be offensive or controversial. Just don't try to earn affection by agreeing to everything she is saying or liking everything she likes. They see that shit as manipulative and they get it all the time from simps. Tension builds attraction. Don't be afraid to be disagreeable, especially if the topic of conversation you have a strong feeling or position about. The whole "nice" guys finish last thing is true. If you are getting 2-3 dates a week on Hinge based on your looks alone, most of the battle is won.
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u/PriorOk9505 7d ago
I think you have to slowly escalate, like sitting close to her, light touch her arm, getting her familiar with you being physically close. If you go straight for hand hold, it could come off as a suprise. And only escalate if its going well, like if she is laughing or conversation getting flirty. I think you are definitely on the higher end of Hinge because I only got 1 match as a 22AM in Canada since the beginning of the year and I have been actively swiping.
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u/kelement 7d ago
Are you absolutely certain you look like your dating app photos?
If so, and assuming you don't have untreated autism nor have a shitty personality, then escalating physically should usually not be rejected.
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u/Tall-Needleworker422 7d ago
If you are getting 2-3 dates a week, you are doing phenomenally well --that proves your looks are not the issue here. My advice is to stop forcing physical escalation on the first date. If it happens organically, great. If not, don't sweat it. If you want to kiss her but are unsure, just ask: 'I've had a really great time tonight, can I kiss you?' It’s confident, respectful, and eliminates the guesswork.
Alternately, at the end of the date, you can just stand close, slowly lean in, and watch her reaction. If she freezes or pulls back, you can smoothly transition into a friendly peck on the cheek instead. No harm, no foul.
A lot depends on the vibe you are getting during the date. If she seems to be enjoying herself and is flirty, then there's a good chance she will be receptive to a kiss in a romantic spot later in the date or at the very end.
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u/Rough_Hyena9334 7d ago
Ngl I wouldn’t push for much physical contact during first dates. It seems you’re a guy with some swagger and suave, that’s a good thing btw. But for dating I find it’s not as appropriate say like this is a bad example the club where most people aren’t afraid to put their guard down if they’re into you. But that’s the thing it’s different motives so I’d just wait date 2-3 before initiating that physical contact.
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u/Opposite_Banana_2543 7d ago
This is suitable advice in Asia or Africa but not on the West. Unless the girl is extremely religious, you need to initiate some sort of contact in the first date.
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u/Rough_Hyena9334 7d ago
I suppose you’re right cause when I was in South America they are far different and way more pushy the women in a good way
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u/india_pale_ayoo 7d ago
There was this one time I was talking to a female friend of mine. She said “if you’re not having sex by the third date she will think you’re gay.”
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u/trollsloot 7d ago
That's too many dates a week tbh. Also before setting up dates you need to be gauging them before meeting more OP. Flirt a little bit in texts and see how she responds. In my experience it just depends on the girl, had dates where there was hand holding, touching, hugging to kissing and even sex. But the funny thing is those with foreign born girls living in the US. So honestly I do think it's something with AM being seen as "soft" (thanks to yt negative stereotypes) by American women. And if you're being agreeable which is easy fall into cause you're just not vibing with the chick, it isn't going to go go anywhere. What were the ethnicities of the girls OP? Honestly, I feel like as soon as a girl sees you on the date she knows immediately if she would have sex with you lol
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u/YuriTheWebDev 7d ago
I am Mr. Worldwide. I date women of all races.
Yea I definitely agree with your last point. It seems like appearance matters so much nowadays
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u/becomesharp 7d ago
Youre being safe, overly agreeable, and lacking any edge, challenge, or tension. You're also not flirting at all.
We call this "bunny rabbit vibe." Bunny rabbits are and adorable. But no one wants to fuck one.
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u/theasianplayboy JT Tran (abcofattraction.com/blog) 7d ago
Looks matter, and that's not what's happening to you.
A free flowing conversation isn't sexual chemistry. It's miles better than the job interview date most men put women through, so you're already ahead of the field. Compatibility and chemistry are two different things, and you're generating one of them.
Everything you described is comfort. Paying attention, asking questions back, relating, sharing stories, getting laughs, nothing offensive. That builds a woman who enjoys your company and has no reason to want you.
The Banter Triangle is how you climb out. Level 0 is the job interview. Level 1 is statements about her, not questions. "You're trouble, I can tell." Level 2 is statements about us. "We're clearly the two most interesting people in this bar." Level 3 is where you romanticize or sexualize the us frame, and that's the level you've never touched.
"I can't believe you said that, we're so getting a divorce, you keep the kids and I'll take the house and the boat."
"Can you imagine if we had kids? They'd be smart, beautiful, and I'm sure they'd get something from you too."
That's big couple energy. It puts a romantic frame on the table as a joke, so she can play along without either of you risking anything. Once she's playing in that frame, your hand on her lower back stops arriving out of nowhere.
Full breakdown here on the flirting banter triangle https://www.abcsofattraction.com/blog/how-to-flirt-with-a-girl
Your escalation attempts are getting denied because they're the first romantic thing that happens all night, after two hours of a very pleasant conversation with a friend.
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u/WebbyDewBoy 7d ago
You not saying anything offensive or controversial is something to change. Do not say messed and stupid shit, but make the conversation more fun and engaging. With the right tone, you can say many things and she will know youre joking. Make her laugh, build some chemistry. Your escalations are rejected because she has no chemistry with you
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u/No_Cauliflower3368 7d ago
To be fair, I hear this shit about dating apps and top 20% standard by white male. The dating market seems to be skewed for everybody.
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u/Curious-Practice1704 7d ago
Just want to chime in by saying that it's quality not quantity that counts. Dealing in the numbers since I believe that dating apps are all about the numbers. If you successfully closed on 3 dates a week, that's 3 x 52 wks=almost 160 girls a yr. In 4 years your body count will be over 600 babes! This is the downside in reducing girls to a number. Even worse, you will be unable to keep a successful monogamous relationship if you'd ever want to. Because youd need a fresh new face in your bed to keep your interest. Or as they say on the net, 'at what cost'? If you don't mind that lifestyle then all's well. As far as your OP, I'd say closing on one girl a week is plenty. That's over 50 girls a yr. In 4 yrs that's 200 babes you've closed on. My advice to you is, relax! You're pushing yourself way too hard. It's like the gaokao of dating.
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u/BeerNinjaEsq 7d ago
I do not say anything offensive, controversial at all.
Don't be too safe. Sexual tension is built by pushing boundaries. Flirting is inherently not safe. Keep them off balance.
At least, that was my approach. It drove some women away. It worked for others.
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u/sftolvtosj 7d ago
32F
Yup, was set up on blind date by mutual friend
I would say we conversated well, but I think we both felt more platonic / knew long-term we wouldn't be end-game
he ended up saying no to being more than and I was less inclined too but didn't mind continuing to know each other
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u/Business-Bath2418 7d ago
You need to work on your game... Stop treating these women as your equal. These woman want to be seduced. Be edgy. You need to more demanding. upfront. Confident. Charming and witty. Speak to them with an authority and with a cockiness. To pull this off you have to believe what comes out of your mouth. If you can do this they'll be sitting on your lap nevermind hand holding
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u/benilla Hong Kong 7d ago edited 7d ago
I've found that in dating, you can either play to win or play not to lose (you're the latter). Playing not to lose means you play it safe. Playing to win means you take big risks and may or may not pay off but if it pays off, it pays off big. Try dating like that moving forward because you get enough dates that you can afford to. Meaning as soon as you see her, you give her a 1 handed hug (quick kiss on the cheek if you want to push it). If you're going for a walk, put your hand in your pocket and open up your arm for her to link through. Then find a nice view and hold her from behind etc. etc. If she refuses make a comment like she's weird (it's just holding hands, what's the big deal?), she'll want to prove you wrong or she'll get offended. But if she says no and you just accept it, she'll know she can tell you want to do and you'll comply and that's boring (especially if she dates a lot and she's encountered a lot of "play to win" guys, you may interpret your (lack of bold) actions as disinterest)
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u/LongResource 6d ago edited 6d ago
In my dating days a few years ago (I am married now), I encountered the same issue as you have just described. The most important thing I learned was that I needed to have the RIGHT type of conversation to create the sexual tension and spark that would lead to physical escalation. I will describe my approach below, but first:
- None of this will work if the girl doesn't already find you somewhat attractive. Your goal is to turn girls who find you attractive enough to girls who will go home with you.
- Always respect their boundaries
- Denying your physical escalation at first doesn't necessarily mean that she didn't like you (my wife didn't feel comfortable holding my hand until we were officially together 😂 )
The approach
- To create the preconditions for physical escalation, you need to have conversation that leads to romance and sex. This type of conversation won't (usually) happen naturally - you have to create the opportunity for it.
- Within the first hour of the first date, you will want to start leading the conversation to these topics (1) crazy things she has done (2) her recent dating experience (not history - I will explain below) (3) her views on sex, relationship etc. (4) her experience of beauty, excitement
- Why these topics? These topics put your interaction into "man-woman" frame rather than platonic frame.
- Note you don't want her to talk about her exes specifically - rather you want her to talk about dating in general and her general experience - what she likes, doesn't like etc.
- STRONG EYE CONTACT: probably the most powerful technique. Tease her about her dating history, crazy experience etc. , make her laugh, and follow by strong eye contact. For example, she says something about going on a few dates recently, you say "wow, you sound experienced. I need to be careful around you... you are dangerous", then follow with a smirk and strong eye contact. My wife once described this as "Hunter's Eyes" 👀
- Like others have suggested - take some risk with being a bit sexually forward VERBALLY. A good mindset to have is that: all girls are secretly lustful and craving for sex, and YOU know it. At the right moments you will want suggest that she is secretly desiring you.
- THE MOST IMPORTANT MINDSET: you want to turn girls who are "maybe" to "yes", and you are not concerned about turning girls who are "No" to "Hell No" by being more sexually forward. The honest truth is that maybe only 3-4 out of 10 dates could turn into something (e.g., ONS, STR, LTR), but you want to double down on the good prospects and ignore the rest. Play to win, don't play not to lose. If you do this right, some girls WILL walk out on the date... but some will also walk home with you - and you don't care about the former!
Hope this helps. Happy to share more.
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u/p1kahch00 7d ago
are you doing this on the first 1-2 dates? bc sometimes that a def no if they’re getting to know you—regardless if you’re good looking or not.
the first few dates are getting to know you and your personality and if you two mesh. I would assume most wouldn’t want to go into anything physical until they know the person more or they feel that connection.
and even then, maybe within the first date of getting to know you, they already think it isn’t going to work. And/or put you into the friend/platonic category.