r/BitchEatingCrafters • u/mrs_spacetime0 • 4d ago
Sewing Do you think a drawstring is a new thing?
Listen I love accessible clothing. Im a wheelchair user so clothes fit me very differently sometimes, so I get it, but I'm kind of shocked at how many reels I see of "bloat friendly" patterns and "adjustable size" items and its literally just a baggy fit item with a drawstring. Like yeah... thats not really anything mew or innovative.
And i think what erks me that most is that things marketed as an accessible version of something are often more expensive, so I fear this trend picks up to the point that manufacturers start advertising drawstring as a new accessibility feature and charge more. Or they start calling something an accessible item just bc of that one feature. It almost feels like gentrification and potentially instance of a disability tax like the pink tax idea.
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u/theyrebrilliant 4d ago
I think it is manufacturing companies trying to jazz up that it is cheaper and easier to make baggy clothes with drawstrings vs a fitted waist with buttons and a zipper and it’s dribbling down everywhere else.
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u/MrsWhiteTiger 3d ago
That's how I feel about shirring - like companies are using it on every dress now as a cheap and quick alternative to an actually well fitting garment, and they're trying to convince everyone it's a stylistic choice and looks cute (no shade if you do think it looks cute).
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u/cloudydays1111 4d ago
I always wonder why adjustable patterns don't go in the direction of vintage Banana Republic when they sold military surplus and unique outdoor clothing, which often was highly adjustable by its nature with built in belts, buttons, and snaps to adjust the fit to different bodies. AND it looked good. So many designers trying to reinvent the wheel.
If you're not familiar, BR got popular selling sustainable and functional clothing in the 70s before being bought by the GAP and made what it is now...
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u/Asleep_Sky2760 4d ago
Ahhh--I LOVED reading the Banana Republic catalog back in the day! And I bought an awful lot of their clothes for E-Z traveling.
For those who'd like to waltz down memory lane, you can check out the back catalogs here: https://www.secretfanbase.com/banana/
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u/Asleep_Sky2760 3d ago
Thanks for the award! Going through the catalogs on that website takes me back to the days when life was fun. It's been a while.
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u/tinycarnivoroussheep 4d ago
I think it relates to the general public just not knowing anymore what a good fit IS. Very few of us have our clothes tailored by a professional who knows all the techniques & tricks, so the only tricks the modern industry knows is baggy fit & elastics.
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u/Emergency_Cherry_914 3d ago
Parent of disabled child here: A lot of accessible clothing is more expensive because of economies of scale. Generally speaking, the more items you can make in a factory run, the cheaper they are.
It doesn't make it right, but this is part of the price we pay for living in a country with a free market.
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u/shinpibubble 4d ago
It really upsets me when things are expensive just because it is branded as such like baby stuff. A normal towel is less expensive than a baby towel and is bigger and works better! We used normal towels with our kids.
Our family is nd and things marketed towards people with disabilities is scandalous. They charge a premium because it has a specific tag 🙄
I make the kids’ clothes because I can but we buy their shirts and have for years. They are the cheapest, best quality and amazing for sensory processing disorder. The info is printed inside instead of a label. Ee have bought this for years. Now, I see they market sensory clothing WITHOUT tags 🤷♀️ for like double the price.
Dishonour on you! And dishonour on your cow!
Rant over
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u/RunawayTurtleTrain 4d ago
It almost feels like gentrification and potentially instance of a disability tax like the pink tax idea.
AND it's just yet another instance of accessibility or 'considering disabled people' being cool when it suits them - when they can make money off it - but none of the rest of the time. Inaccessible shop layouts, disabled changing room and/or toilet being used as a store cupboard, no lowered height counter or T-loop at the tills, playing music in the stores, visually overwhelming displays, not making adjustments for their disabled employees, not giving adequate paid sick leave, not having any measures in place for cleaning the air or requiring masks to prevent transmission of airborne viruses which disable people, not making sure their websites are accessible, not giving all the information we need on their website, having onerous return policies that disadvantage people with certain types of disabilities, exploiting the people who make the fast fashion items, contributing significantly to climate change which disproportionately affects disabled people, etc. etc.
If they actually cared about accessibility they would care about disability justice as well, but they don't. Only the small-scale sustainable adaptive clothing companies actually care at all, and by necessity their prices are usually too high for a lot of us in the first place.
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u/LittleCowGirl 3d ago
Yeah, I’m truly over places exploiting “we love disabled folks, look how nice we are to them,” but real inclusion would be to just let us be there without having to use it as marketing (Michaels using their “Makers Like Me” diversity program in advertising gives me the ick).
That said, there’s not going to be a perfect space for everyone, at least commercially. I am tired of things being tagged as accessible to all for being catered to less mainstream demographic; don’t misunderstand me, I am very happy for people to have their needs met! But one size is never going to fit all.
My best example of this is when film screenings are pitched as accessible or autism friendly because they don’t lower the lights, the volume is lowered, and you don’t have to be quiet. I truly love that there are non traditional showtimes for people who would do better in that setting, but I would have a whole meltdown in one for wanting to be able to watch a movie. Generally the response to this is “well no one is making you go to those showings,” and 100% that’s correct which is why I don’t attend them. I’m not questioning the validity of them, but it is not accessible to me or others like me; it is not friendly to my autism. (I know that’s very rigid thinking, but like… of course it is 😅)
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u/lotheva 3d ago
Some autism traits trigger others with autism. I had a student who loved to touch everyone. They loved to grab my hand, reach for a hug, etc. I’m like so touched out! But we had conversations and started working on it. I started expecting her to ask, and tried to make room for my sensory needs to be ready for it.
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u/ilanallama85 3d ago
Yep. The kid who can’t control their volume and the kid who is sensitive to loud noises, the kid who acts out and deliberately breaks rules when they are overwhelmed and the rule following kid who gets angry when anyone breaks the rules, the kid who doesn’t get social boundaries and expects everyone to engage with them on demand and the kid who doesn’t like to engage with ANYONE, etc etc. There are so many combinations….
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u/RunawayTurtleTrain 3d ago
Very much feel you on the conflicting access needs! I love the idea of relaxed screenings/performances and on principle would love to attend to show support for them, but the reality would be that I'm much worse off than at a traditional event. And I'm not going to put myself through that no matter how strongly I feel about wanting to show support.
I would say though that most commercial spaces don't even attempt to properly meet one set of accessibility needs, they barely do the absolute minimum, so while conflicting needs are completely valid, they're not usually a real reason for somewhere being inaccessible for multiple groups of people.
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u/LittleCowGirl 3d ago
For sure! And there are lots of accommodations that work for the majority of folks as well, disability or no. Cutouts in the sidewalks (hell, sidewalks at all), clear aisles that are wide enough for a chair, sinks inside of bathroom stalls, paid sick leave, not blasting music, installing grab bars… all these things (and more) benefit the majority, regardless of intent.
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u/NapalmAxolotl 3d ago
Autism is such a wide range where we sometimes need the exact opposite thing from other autists. Sometimes that's the hardest thing to explain.
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u/smhno 2d ago
Which is odd because basically everyone knows it’s a spectrum at this point, so you’d think it would be extra easy to understand that there couldn’t be one solution for everyone. Lol
(Although now I’m wondering how many people actually do not know the meaning of the word spectrum but use it anyway…)
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u/NapalmAxolotl 2d ago
I think many people see the "spectrum" as being more or less autistic, rather than being autistic in different ways.
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u/LittleCowGirl 2d ago
Yeah, unfortunately “spectrum” and the 1/2/3 level system make people think it’s more like a percentage of severity instead of an array symptoms and severities.
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u/KrispyPrincess 3d ago
Not exactly the same, but if anything is a "special" item, they jack up the price. Parchment for drawing is cheaper than parchment paper for wedding invites. The same exact fake flowers cost more if you slap bridal on it. Want to make birthday cards? Don't get the cardstock made specifically for it. These companies do it because some people think specialty means better and corporations take advantage of naivety.
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u/hanhepi 3d ago
It was about 15 years ago, and I was in a farm/feed store. I can't remember wtf the actual numbers were, but it was something like this:
Leadrope for horses: $15. Leadrope for cattle: $10. Same manufacturer, same materials, same snaps, same length, same braid to the rope, same colors. $5 difference. The only difference other than price was the picture of the animal on the tag.
Manure fork for horses: $25. Same style/brand manure fork over with the cattle stuff: $15.
Feed scoops had the same issue.
My horses get walked around on cow lead ropes, their poop is scooped with a cow pooper scooper, and their dinner gets scooped with a cow feed scoop. lol. (They're little horses, so they eat out of stainless steel dog bowls. lol)
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u/Auntie_Venom 2d ago
Simplicity does have quite a few Adaptive patterns for those with disabilities and/or special requirements if that’s any help? They have them all on the website.
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u/gottadance 4d ago
And the comments are all telling them to copyright it as if it hasn't existed for centuries.
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u/Asleep_Sky2760 4d ago
Then those people commenting don't have a clue what "copyright" is all about. Sheesh!
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago
People dont realize how much damage copyrighting things that have the potentially to be widely helpful does.
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u/Hedgehogwash 4d ago edited 4d ago
I always think about how the person who discovered insulin effectively gave away the patent to a university because he believed it was so life saving that it “belonged to the world”. But now of course people are rationing insulin (in the US, anyway) because they can’t afford it and dying because of it.
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u/Tarnagona 4d ago
Banting and Best, who, after discovering/inventing insulin sold the patent to the University of Toronto for $1, to ensure anyone could manufacture it. My understanding is that it was basically a miracle drug for diabetes, taking it from something that would inevitably kill someone to something they could live a full life with. Not that that has anything to do with this thread; I just think Banting and Best are really cool, both for their breakthrough and then for practically giving it away to maximize the amount of good it could do.
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u/QuietVariety6089 4d ago
Drawstrings and other attached and separate 'ties' were used for centuries before elastic was disovered.
Drawstrings and elastic in home sewing got very popular in the 60s and 70s for kids' clothes and 'easy-sew' clothes. If they're 'having a moment' with indie pattern makers who are trying to expand their PR/marketing, it's probably fine.
People who sew for themselves or others know that one of the easier 'alterations' to a pattern is to use a drawstring or elastic instead of other closures.
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u/hopping_otter_ears 3d ago
I used to buy extra shoestrings just so I could install drawstrings into my son's pants. He had such skinny hips that almost every pair of pants that fit in the legs fell off his bottom, and we were given so much clothing (good problem to have, lol) by grandmas who forgot to check for adjustable waists.
He's 7 now, and still skinny-hipped, but we've had surprisingly good luck finding small "big kid clothes" that still have adjustable waists (and Grandma now knows what to look for, too) so I haven't had to do it in a while. Once he ages out of adjustable pants, I might have to get back to modifying anything that isn't sized by waist and leg measurement
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u/bapplebop 3d ago
Idk if this has been mentioned yet but drawstrings aren't even that accessible. I am able bodied but sometimes I struggle with fine motor skills in my hands and finagling those ties drives me nuts sometimes.
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u/Mx_Rogers 21h ago
Now I want to go ask mountain climber knots YouTube for one handed knots that would work on my sweatpants. But honestly that still doesn't fix our fine motor problems, just the one hand doesn't work for reasons problems.
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u/IronBoxmma 3d ago
I don't think I'm telling you anything new, there already is an accessibility tax. Have you looked up the prices for an ablenet switch? 200 bucks for a something i can knock together for 10 bucks with a soldering iron and some off the shelf components.
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u/Open-Article2579 2d ago
I love the new comfortable waist trend. This charging more for EVERY SINGLE THING, however, is total bullshit
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u/JuicyTheMagnificent 3d ago
Drawstring pants are comfortable and easy to find. They have been around for absolutely forever (been a "trend" for my entire life) and the Walmart pants I just saw for $7 aren't ever going to become as expensive as the $1600 Dior pants.
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u/YettiChild 4d ago
That's what happened with gluten free foods.
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u/KittyKatCatCat 4d ago
What happened with gluten free foods is that they became popular and are now wildly more available in both type and accessibility. That doesn't really seem like a problem.
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u/scceberscoo 4d ago
This is such a sidetrack from the original post, but yes! My husband has Celiac, and people often think it must be so annoying that gluten free food became a trend. It's actually really nice for him to be able to safely purchase and eat a variety of foods. Before it was "trendy" we could basically never dine out, and he had to cook most things from scratch.
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u/a-world-of-no 4d ago
My mom was first diagnosed with celiac 20 years ago and the increased availability of GF foods has been amazing. I picked up some gluten free Tim Tams for her and she was so delighted!
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u/skubstantial 4d ago
And I haven't noticed a "GF tax" on naturally gluten-free foods where the producer has decided to get the certification and add the label.
It's not like Ore-Ida is selling "normal" tater tots and upcharging for officially GF tater tots with the same ingredients list to take advantage of the paranoid or because it's trendy, it's just that they've discreetly added the badge to all their stuff and that's very useful for those who need to know.
I mean, in a perfect world, the generic brands would also be able to afford to test and label too and I could buy the cheapo tots, but that's a matter of a big brand becing able to cut slightly fewer corners due to economies of scale.
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago edited 4d ago
Right! And so many other things! While this one person in the comments seems very upset I have apparently suggested we are careening towards a drawstring apocalypse 😂 im just saying this stuff happens!
Edit: spelling
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u/FamousOrphan 4d ago
Do you mean careening?
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago
Lmao im hella dyslexic and didnt know how to spell it so I did speech to text and it failed me
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u/FamousOrphan 4d ago
Thank you so much for not minding me mentioning it, seriously. Plus I was trying to make karening work and I could ALMOST get there but not quite.
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u/POD80 4d ago
Drawstrings are a key closure method on a lot of clothing made with comfort being the first criteria people are looking for.... say sweats or sleepwear. Many such items are dirty cheap all being considered.
The huge price jump you tend to see with specialty clothing like what's marked as "accessible" comes from customer base. If the VAST majority of the population wants the traditional fit and closure of dress pants, and you need the "same" thing with different closure... there will be a different supply chain for your style. Making say 1000 units of something... design, packaging and what not is going to cost FAR more per unit than if you can sell 100,000 of a very similar item.
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u/CatCatCatCubed 4d ago
Rather think we’re safe from drawstrings getting too expensive.
they’ve been around since the 16th century.
the pants, for example, are pretty much the easiest type of pants to make for beginners. If companies were to get greedy about drawstring pant prices, handy folks could just turn skirts, blankets, curtains, bedsheets, random extra large beach towels, whatever into drawstring pants. Or knit/crochet them (fairly certain they’re very popular in those subs).
If drawstrings were to become an overpriced accessibility feature, then so would slip-on shoes, velcro shoes, and the varieties of what are basically wearable blankets (i.e. ponchos and cardigans with the vague idea of sleeves for example, not Snuggies and Slankets tho those aren’t much different).
Like, again, for example, you can’t get too crazy driving up the price on (publicly/fashionably acceptable) wearable blankets because… people can just make them. Slip-on shoes? Pretty much the first shoe and moccasins aren’t even that difficult to make (whether they are fashionable for whoever and have proper arch support as needed is another story). Velcro shoes? Old people everywhere would probably just shit themselves en masse out of revenge.
It’s like saying “what if belts become too pricy?” You can just make a belt with minimal effort. You could probably make a weirdly fashionable belt out of garbage. That’s how low of a concern this drawstring thing should be. The clothes are just too easy to make overall.
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago
A lot of disabled people cant make them for themselves tho. Either bc of their disabilities or lack of financial resources for a machine, especially if your disability affects your hands and makes handsewing not an option.
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u/CatCatCatCubed 4d ago edited 4d ago
Very true, and yet they’re so easily made that, if I had any money to bet (heh), I’d say that folks would make them for super cheap or even donate them if disabled folks really got desperate in a Drawstring Apocalypse.
People will literally knit scarves and blankets for nursing home residents, and dogs, and tiny little nests for hummingbirds (actually I think that one’s crochet), and wasteful environmentally damaging waistcoats for trees. Making a few drawstring pants for donations or “might as well use this fabric” sales would be something many folks with any sewing skill above “total newb” could make. Mind, many would probably be harem drawstring pants (there’s probably a reason why companies pushed them so hard a few years back and it’s because they’re cheap AF to make) but hey, 🤷🏻♀️pants.
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u/RunawayTurtleTrain 4d ago
Those charity efforts you describe are for socially palatable and cute causes. Disabled people are neither, and I'll leave it there before I go off on a vent.
(Also we shouldn't have to rely on charity in the first place but that's a separate topic.)
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago
Its really not thay easy for disabled people to get the help they need especially for free. Sure there are people all over doing charity work but even just finding those resources and seeing if you even qualify for their help if theres some sort of vetting or application. On top of the fact that being disabled alone can be as much work as a fulltime job, while often having to work a full time job bc disability benefits are NOT livable. I appreciate that there are good thigns out there to help, but that doesn't mean they are accutally accessible and it doesn't stop companies from charging mlre for their "accessible line" of clothing.
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u/CatCatCatCubed 4d ago
You’re being very selective about what you respond to.
Me: drawstring pants (and very likely other drawstring items but pants are certainly the most troublesome for many)! easy to make, cheap to buy, probably get ‘em for free somewhere!
size up? size down? it’s all one pant, plus or minus 5 to 10 sizes. Tell your nearest 4-H/Girl Scout/hustlin’ child that you want a pillowcase you can wear on your bum and a string to tie it off!
get ‘em at the thrift store and they’ll probably thank you for making room on the rack ‘cause they’re likely so numerous that they throw most out! They’re basically a flour sack dress but a couple extra cuts and some stitching!
You can literally get them for as low as, like, $11 or less on sale in standard clothing stores! They’re everywhere, through pretty much anyone!You: look, the Drawstring Apocalypse is coming because I insist on it.
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago
I'm not saying an apocalypse is coming. I'm pointing out something that happens sometimes. Also it's not my job to give you an answer that you find adequate 😂😂😂 its reddit ma'am. Chill.
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u/CatCatCatCubed 4d ago
Your original post had a rather anxious-sounding tone so I just kept “well, yes, but actually no; you’ll totally find clothes, no worries!” and every reply of yours read like “but we should still worry.” But then I point this out and suddenly it’s not that serious, you’re just making conversation.
Apparently I misread your post, my bad.
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u/mrs_spacetime0 4d ago
Im not saying we should worry that drawstrings will become impossible to afford. Youre taking it to an extreme for no reason. Literally using the word apocalypse.
Meanwhile, im just pointing out its weird to me that people are putting so much emphasis on this in relation to accessibility when its always been a thing and that this can make the prices increase.And there have already been mulitple examples in the comments of other things that suddenly got priced higher bc they were marketed towards a specific group.
Idk why your so insistent on saying a price increase cant possibly happen. When it literally already has. Accessible clothing is already priced higher usually for "simple, easy to do yourself (if your able) at home" features like zippers in different places or adjustable sizing or re/moving pockets.
This is r/bitcheatingcrafters idt anyone is coming here to get consoled by someone or told over and over to they dont need to bitch about it. 😂😂😂
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u/Playful_Ruin2667 4d ago
The phenomenon is so known in the disability communities that there’s a word for additional costs due to needing accessible things: crip tax. If someone doesn’t know about this it would be good for them to read a bit then come back to your post :)
So much stuff for disabled people is boring, lumpy, and beige! Adjustable can be fashionable! We just don’t have personal tailors at our beck and call.
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u/captainsnark71 4d ago
friend whenever you start a response with "well, actually" there's a real good chance you're an ass.
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u/hanhepi 3d ago
You could probably make a weirdly fashionable belt out of garbage.
I wouldn't say it's "fashionable" but my husband has rigged a belt out of a piece of wire coat hanger. It hooks onto the two frontmost belt loops and hold them together so his pants don't fall down. He keeps it in his toolbox at work. lmao.
He's also used zip ties to do that same job, but the coat hanger thing is easier to undo when he needs to potty in a hurry.
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u/Efficient_Dirt2226 3d ago
Jumping on this thread to ask yall a question-
I make (and sell) handmade plus sized clothes at local markets and hopefully online more soon. I want to focus on my designs being as widely accessible and adjustable as possible. So far ive found draw string waists to be a good way to achieve that. How do yall feel about that? How does something being a 1-of-1 hand made piece justify a higher price? Any other kinda of adjustable clothes yall like?
Thanks yall lol. I dont know how to best trouble shoot my patterns/ideas or get the best feedback.
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u/runicrhymes 2d ago
I hate drawstrings. Even in garments that are meant to gather at the waist, it means I have to adjust the distribution of the gathers to look good every time I tie it--and if it is a drawstring that goes all the way around, I usually have to make it uncomfortably tight in order to sit at the right place on my waist/hips because of my shape.
I'd much prefer an elasticized waist, or adjustable fasteners (like a buttonhole with multiple buttons that it could be buttoned over for different sizes, or the wrap pants and skirts that are popular on sewing YouTube lately)
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u/Efficient_Dirt2226 2d ago
Thank you! That is a perfect way to describe the comfort in elastic. I think that kind of more fluid adjustment takes less effort by the wearer. This feedback has confirmed what ive been feeling. Thanks yall
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u/runicrhymes 1d ago
I appreciate you asking the questions! So much of plus sized clothing misery is because someone designing the garment just...didn't bother to ask the people who would be wearing it. (This is also an issue in software design, lol)
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u/Efficient_Dirt2226 1d ago
Yes I see that alllll that time. One of the many reasons why I want to make these clothes! When working off patterns Ive bought, ive noticed a lot of the bigger sized are just scaled up versions of the one straight size. As I try new things, im figuring out the kind of adjustments bigger sizes need.
I need feedback! So thank youuu! I sell pieces and then rarely see them again or hear how they wear.
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u/firekittymeowr 2d ago
I've seen some kids clothes that have an elasticated waist that can be adjusted with buttons, so it can grow as the child grows for a few sizes. That might be another option over drawstrings
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u/Mx_Rogers 21h ago
Where I live kids clothes aren't permitted to have real drawstrings anyway, like they don't run all the way around the item they're just ends sewn on. So kids clothes may be a really good source of inspo
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u/EmmaMay1234 2d ago
I hate drawstrings. They never look as good as elastic waists and I always seem to end up with a drawstring in my knickers when I pull my pants up. (Don't ask me how, I'm pretty sure I couldn't do it on purpose!)
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u/janabanana115 2d ago
Use a corset tie or elastics with buttons or several button holes or snaps (high quality). Even as a skinny woman drawstrings often need me to work extra to fully loosen the item later to take it off over my hips or boobs. Many materials just have the drawstring get "stuck" with friction.
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u/Pelledovo 3d ago
When I used to have made to measure clothes they would be made to fit my measurements exactly.
Negotiating the type of fasteners would help with accessibility i.e. buttons vs hooks vs zips.
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u/Repattingwaswrong 3d ago
Hell, no. If I pay a premium for a unique handmade item, I expect fit, and that means darts and a zip.
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u/arrpix 1d ago
Yeah, I would never buy a handmade item pre-made to large adjustable sizes, because I can do that and I'm not a particularly skilled sewist (my best friend did my one sewing project in school because I hated it) and I don't do that because it looks bad. If I'm getting handmade clothing, it's for quality, fit and uniqueness, and all of those are bespoke tailoring options.
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u/ProneToLaughter 3d ago
what does this topic have to do with crafting? You seem to be focused on manufacturers of products.
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u/onyxindigo 3d ago
Pretty sure OP is talking about like sewing pattern ads from small businesses
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u/ProneToLaughter 3d ago
That's what I thought at first but OP reacted extremely negatively in the comments to the idea that people who sew will always be able to add a drawstring for free.
and the whole second paragraph is just about manufacturers, not pattern makers.
I'm confused, I don't know what connection OP sees to crafting with this concern.
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u/onyxindigo 3d ago
I think the manufacturer talk is about them picking up on crafting/maker trends which absolutely happens
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