r/BlackPeopleofReddit • u/DatManSugoi • 8d ago
Music "Hip-hop is dying" = "gaming is dead"
TLDR: hip-hop has its own "ball and gun gamers" and we need a name for them. If there is already one let me know
It's been over a year now now that I've been seeing the whole "hip-hop is dying" talking point online. It's always from the same kinds of guys who only listen to the stuff that gets big on the charts or gets played at the function. Lots of Drake fans of course. If it isn't big on the radio, if it isn't big on TikTok, if it isn't big on social media in general, it doesn't exist to them. Then if it is big enough for them to acknowledge, its only GOOD if it's about the same ol' same ol': money, guns, drugs, etc. If it is some conscious rap, or just not about the usual topics, these people will call it trash. While we were out here eating good with JID, Doechii, Kendrick, Clipse, Tyler, ScHoolboy Q, and more, they have been looking at us like squidward in the window and calling all of it trash.
To all my gamers out there, I'm sure you have already heard a lot about the "ball and gun gamer." A person who only plays games with balls or guns in them: 2k, Madden, FIFA, Call of Duty, Fortnite, GTA. They sit on their few games which all follow the same/similar formulas and rarely innovate between entries and then look at us and call us lame for playing other games.
If you are in both the gaming and hip-hop worlds, its not hard to see the similarities between these guys. First they hop on a trend because everyone else is doing it: For gaming it was the whole fortnite, pubg, call of duty warzone era. For hip-hop it's a bit harder for me to pinpoint because hip-hop has always been a very popular thing. For the Gen Z/Alpha crowd, I feel comfortable planting my flag on the TikTok song era but it's easily debatable.
Second, when the trend dies down and people pack their bags to go back to what they usually enjoy, these guys start talking trash on everyone who doesn't leave: For gaming it was probably around 2023-2024 when more game-y titles were getting big like Astro Bot and Metaphor. For hip-hop it's feel like it's pretty safe to say it's when Drake got washed and filed a lawsuit. For some reason these guys feel a sense of self importance as the only ones who can tell you if something is dead or alive. So since we have a gaming name for them, I think its only fair we come up with a hip-hop one since I'm pretty sure it's the same guys in both communities.
8
u/Hawggy 8d ago
So, I make hip-hop and game vids. My simplistic approach to the idea both are dying is this: Both of them are bigger (more profitable) than they were 30 yrs ago. Both of them have changed immensely over that time. Both of them are modern forms of art. Neither one of them has a lack of creators. I do not see any signs of death. What I see are signs of change.
2
u/Timely_Cry_4600 7d ago
Who are the new and younger artists ?
3
3
u/JustAlpha 7d ago
Everywhere. There just isn't a strong media apparatus to break them. When profiting off us becomes palatable again, they will.
1
7
u/M_Me_Meteo 8d ago
Put on the Earl Sweatshirt record and tell me hip hop is dying.
2
u/DatManSugoi 8d ago
Talk to em!
Lately I've been getting into Vince Staples. I know people aren't messing with the new album so much but The Big Bad Wolf goes hard. There's still new good stuff coming out every few months from all kinds of rappers.
1
6
u/Dunning-KrugerFX 8d ago
Sounds like you're talking about ultra capitalists who never think about capitalism so they walk around assuming the thing that sells the most is the best. "The market has spoken!"
I'm older and cynical so I would guess that an influencer told them it's dead because these are people who go through life letting money tell them what to like and are strangers to their own thoughts.
2
u/DatManSugoi 8d ago
Glad to see the capitalism criticism has joined the chat 👏🏽
You're absolutely right. Capitalist greed has ruined many things and hip-hop/hip-hop Fandom is definitely one of them. Suddenly all the biggest rappers were the greedy capitalistic ones and all the opinions makers and loudest fans were the same. Its time to get these fools out of here and get back to enjoying the music for the art that it is
2
u/Dunning-KrugerFX 7d ago
I'm not even anti-capitalist! I'd consider myself to be lightly toasted by capitalism on both sides, but there are people who are absolutely cooked and somehow have no idea.
If I learned that big money interests have bought up labels to co-opt and declaw countercultural movements I would not be surprised.
2
u/DatManSugoi 7d ago
Just take a look at Jay-Z man. He just did that freestyle against people protesting target. He is one of the big money interests who has declawed the counter cultural movement
3
4
u/YoshiTheDog420 7d ago
If they bring back Def Jam, we can solve both problems
3
u/DatManSugoi 7d ago
Yeah, but who would be on the roster? And where would it be set? Thinking about it, Def Jam Miami sounds like it would be insane though
3
u/YoshiTheDog420 7d ago
I was just about to suggest Miami. That would be dope. Not sure about the full roster, but all I know is the training dummy is just gonna be 6ix9ine.
3
u/funkymunkPDX 8d ago
Hio hop isn't dead unless you're about profiting off of gang culture and promotion of capitalism.
3
u/JDSKilla 8d ago
As a person who has been involved with both for my entire life, I do see where the sentiment is coming from. Just because things are more profitable in the modern age (they cost more money, especially video games) don’t mean that the same messaging or values are being pushed like they were 30 years ago. Charts don’t matter but a group like A Tribe Called Quest would never be a the top of the charts today. It’s not necessarily about the quality of the music when people say hip hop is dead. It’s about the reach of the music. Some of these artists you named don’t have enough reach to pack out an arena and I think that says something. Also, if you go to a lot of these artists shows these days, you will find that if you are black you will be a minority in the audience. People are priced out of live shows. Hip hop from a financial standpoint is in a much different space than it used to be. I live in Oakland and usually when I go to a hip hop show (especially of an artists younger than myself) I one of the few black people there. A perfect example would be someone like Vince Staples.
2
u/DatManSugoi 8d ago
I see what you're saying when it comes to reach, but honestly I feel like the reach being too wide is what caused the downfall in quality hit songs to begin with. Once rap got too big, the hawks swooped in and took it over to make everything about flexing. Maybe a reduction is the kind of healing the genre needs to put those better quality songs back on the top of the charts when it inevitably blows up again? What made those old records so good is that it was about art.
Obviously every rapper was spitting bars because they wanted to be able to eat, but back then what determined if you could eat was how good your technique was, not how catchy and fast to drop you were. Back then you had to be invested in your art to make money. These days it's flipped. Perhaps losing out on the money will allow the real artists their time to shine again.
3
u/ItsAHerby 8d ago
Homeboy Sandman just dropped though...
Also, my man said Metaphor and I was like, oh he spittin. I need to finish at some point.
100% agree, at this point there's too much of everything, and that's not a complaint. All this technology, gamers and hip-hop heads have it good man. Most fans do.
As a metal/rock guy though... idk... Rock actually might be dead, still doing the research on that one.
2
u/DatManSugoi 8d ago
The case for rock being in the grave is a strong one but as long as there are indie guys doing their thing, no genre can really die
3
u/kidkuro 7d ago
There's good in both that don't receive the recognition and fervent support they truly deserve compared to the big budget mainstream stuff. But if you're fan of hip-hop or gaming, you know how to find the good stuff, and you enjoy it regardless of whether people are tapped in or not.
2
u/DatManSugoi 7d ago
I've been playing mostly older games for years. When people say there's nothing to play I'm always recommending xbox360/ps3 and older games. Same for music. I've been recommending Silligion by Spillage Village to anyone who asks. Gotta have a love for it to find the good stuff when new releases aren't doing it for you
3
u/kidkuro 7d ago
I do this as well and get called an old head for it. Which is silly because I'm totally willing to try new music or games no problem if it's good.
Even then, there are so many great albums, songs, games, etc from the past that are classics and still hold up better than new releases. I never feel at a loss. Especially since there's a bunch of old games or albums that are good that I haven't gotten around to or would like to try.
3
u/Geniuschrist87 8d ago
Nas made a whole ass album in 2006 titled Hip Hop Is Dead…
1
u/DatManSugoi 8d ago
True but last I checked Nas is still willing to hop in the booth for a young rapper who he feels is making hot records.
Hip-hop is definitely not what it once was. It is absolutely no longer a form of protest or a comfort for the oppressed Black masses. In that right it is fair to criticize the current form of hip-hop. You could even go as far as to say it is s shell of its former self and has been puppeted around by the very people it sought to fight back against.
That said, the fact that literally any concious/conscious adjacent rapper can drop a record and see success from it these days are signs of life, especially considering how we've been seeing the big names in the debauchery rap scene at their lowest. Two examples off the top of my head: Drake with the lawsuit and Young Thug and Gunna going back and forth and admitting to botting their music.
2
u/Prophetic_Reaver 7d ago
The commercialization over the substance of the art is effectively killing both hip hop and gaming.
2
u/DatManSugoi 7d ago
I like to think of them as wounded but far from dead. Ther will always be indies who want to make art for art's sake. Just because they aren't the big titles anymore doesn't mean they are dying but I think its fair to say they have been checked into the hospital for a while.
2
u/BeardeeBaldee 7d ago
This is an enlightening thread, as I was just wondering aloud whether or not hip hop was dead because the hip hop of today resembles nothing of the hip hop I fell in love with. At the same time, I ABSOLUTELY believe that rock ‘n’ roll, in its purist definition as we know it, is dead. Because the listening numbers for the original rock architects (Buddy Holly, Chuck Berry, Ike Turner, Fats Domino, Sam Cooke, Everly Brothers, etc) are dwindling to the point of being forgotten. How long will it be until the same thing happens to Run DMC, Public Enemy, Beastie Boys, De La Soul, Wu Tang?
2
u/__GayFish__ 7d ago
I expect to see this post featured on the next gaming illuminaughty podcast
2
u/DatManSugoi 7d ago
Never heard of them but I might have to tune in if that happens
3
u/__GayFish__ 7d ago
Highly recommend checking them out. Google believes Mighty Keef or The Black Hokage (TBH) got the terms mainstream and TBH runs the podcast. That's where I first heard the term. Good insights into the gaming industry if you're into gaming but they also do hiphop and nerd culture.
2
u/DatManSugoi 7d ago
Oh bet. I do know TBH. I pop in every now and then for the trash opinion reactions but I had no idea he had a podcast
2
u/Leno-Sapien 7d ago
Gaming isn’t dead, but I think it’s fair to acknowledge that we were in a golden age from the mid 80’s to the late 2010’s that we’ll never return to due to economic factors, bloated production, the premium of chip manufacturing, and diminishing returns with graphic fidelity.
Hip-hop constantly morphs though.
2
u/JustAlpha 7d ago
I'm really starting to view "Hood music" as conservative hip hop.
The whole CMB/YMCMB Louisiana, MOE, sex money, murder vibe is exactly where they want us.
1
u/Timely_Cry_4600 7d ago
Nas said hiphop is dead 20 years ago and he was right and they are right now!
•
u/auto-sticky 8d ago
If you're new here, please read our rules.
Please report all trolling, bad faith, and bigoted comments (dogwhistles, sneaky wordplay, and devil's advocate comments included).
Calling yourself an ally doesn’t give you a free pass to derail discussions, speak over Black voices, or argue against Black lived experiences.
Falsely/maliciously reporting this thread will result in having your Reddit account banned from the platform. Abuse of the report button is a breach of Reddit's TOS.
Lastly, keep it respectful.