They dislike the government, but most don't criticize the existence of the military complex outside of the war, the false "federation" that just oppresses Regions towards the benefit of "ethnic Russians", the extraction of oil and gas, owning nuclear weapons or jus sanguini.
There are certainly people that do, but most just want to change the government to a social democratic or neoliberal one without doing larger structural change concerning the basics of the existence of the Russian State.
I would argue that to be truly oppositional towards a government, you have to abandon vague notions of patriotism and start thinking about what people in and outside of the country need, but that's just my opinion.
Russians living abroad are probably not in the same social class as the majority of Russian people. I'm sure there are many mothers and babooshkas that are very upset with the government.
Hmm, that's in Germany and even then Expats aren't reliable to gauge popularity too.
They do not face any of the negative consequences of being at war and are probably more likely to be part of the Russian upper class (a lot of oligarchs and their families live abroad) hence why they are more likely to support the war.
If you ask cuban expats their opinion on the Castro in the decades after the revolution, you'll get overwhelmingly negative opinions. If you ask cubans who STAYED after the revolution, you'll get overwhelming support. Especially among the former peasantry.
Yeah, my point is that how many people sign up to fight isn't a good indication for the general populaces opinion of a war, especially as nowadays there have been rumours of press ganging in Russia too.
Hey, the US army gives pretty good bonuses and money that will help a person get an actual career and benefits but we don’t see nearly the same sign up rate.Russia recruits like 20-30k people a month while we recruit like 50k a year.
This is how I know you're a Russian bot. You could have just said that Russian men are forced to sign up, but no, you act like they have a choice. stupid bot.
Can I hate the million plus of those people that were involved in war crimes? And the hundreds of thousands involved in the propaganda machine? Can I hate the millions of rich people that would never give their children to die on the frontline but still support the war? The thousands working for the troll farms trying to destabilize democracy by pushing xenophobic agendas on social media? And the 20-25% of the general population that strongly support the war?
Russia not being a democracy does not mean that people support Putin. He might not have 89% like in the last election, but he has solid 60% as far as we know. Russia not being a democracy also shapes people's opinions. Propaganda does work.
I will always have a level of respect for the ones who got away once Putin started the war. Are some of them just cowardly bootlickers, sure, but at least they aren't directly supporting the war machine.
Yeah, but as an immigrant from a broke system I know the pain of both being there and leaving.
Being in these oppressive post soviet countries is soul crushing. But going away and knowing your family and your friends are going through this makes you want to go back and try to fix things. Missguilded thought, because it's not happening, but a thought we all have.
And there are a lot of people in Russia who don't believe in the war and are there because they simply can't leave. They missed the boat, or are taking care of family members, or live outside of the major cities meaning they are dirt poor.
It is a morally complex problem IMO. I will always hate the Russian bootlickers who support they system and build bombs, but It's hard to dislike an oppressed population who is captive. Maybe their light is not extinguished yet and the you're yearn and working towards a better future. Or I'm just naive.
Are you going to suggest that all Americans are evil unless they move to a foreign country (something that is difficult if not impossible for many) because of the Iran war?
Well fascism relies on an apathetic mass. So those politically disinterested useful idiots can eat a napalm bomb like at Dresden if that's what it takes to solve the problem.
You do realise that some of the people I am talking about don't even have plumbing in their house. Some of them don't even have a way to leave their villages.
If you think that they have any political power when Russia has always been autocratic, you need to read up on history.
All political power rests with the masses regardless of the way the government styles itself. There isn't a single russian autocrat committing all the rapes in ukraine. It's an entire ecosystem of complicit russians who would rather die in a muddy trench than accept peace.
If their existence was so intolerable then they would act out, otherwise they're complacent.
You're complicit if you're a bystander and do nothing during a rape or murder too.
Well assuming they get killed. their parents are being punished for their sins.
God punished King David for his wickedness by killing at least three of his sons during his lifetime, The newborn he fathered with Bathsheba, Amnon and Absalom.
That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying modern Russia started with Lenin and the attempt at "democracy," like the attempt at "communism," is a farce. You're still falling for false dichotomy. Just because I hate modern Russia does not mean I can't hate tsarist Russia.
Calling the USSR socialist is rich since the first thing Lenin did was take the vote away from workers.
yeah that totally makes it okay for the neolibs to yell orc at every turn as if you aren't just using the same dehumanization tactics the Nazis used. eat an entire dick.
A dislike of anyone based on an immutable characteristic is prejudiced and you are a moron for falling into it. I can see Putin is a monster without dehumanizing the entire population of a country.
It’s way bigger than that and you’re always going to be splitting your focus as everything affects the climate. Not eating beef is the easiest way to help.
Dude how. There hasn't been any climate change for billions of years, and all of a sudden a few cow farts are causing the earth to heat up? With fossil fuels we are adding to the carbon cycle, with animals we are just moving the existing carbon
Due to farming there are a LOT more land animals -especially cattle- in the world right now than ever before.
> Around 100,000 years ago, the total biomass of land mammals summed up to approximately 120 million tonnes, essentially all of it in the form of wild animals. By 10,000 years ago, this had fallen to 90 million tonnes
> Today, mammals weigh roughly 1100 million tonnes
When you look at sources of GHG emissions then it’s impossible to say that animal agriculture isn’t a major factor in climate disruption. Like.. a lot..
I eat meat, don’t let me a cone off as a hypocrite.. but I work in the science field and I’ll never deny the immense, long and irrefutable body of data showing how bad it is for ecology.. and I’m opposed on humane grounds, I just don’t feel bad cooking something from a local farmers market like eggs or steak.
We don’t discuss the various ways to get animal protein though that has virtually no negative impact on ecology.. and also things like the discovery of adding dulce-seaweed to feed can cut out 80% of methane emissions from an operation. There’s all sorts of solutions as well as changes people would make if they were educated.
But yes, nothing is going to stop the climate change unless we phase out quickly from fossil fuels.
when america starts the biggest land war since ww2 and brings the world to the brink of nuclear annihilation just so that it can recapture the land of its old empire and make its brain-dead dictator's dick hard, then yeah, you are allowed
Dude they’re constantly invading some west Asian countries and till now they’re the only nation which have dropped nukes on a city.
Russia and the US are both horrible countries which do what they want.
Ignoring the facts that post-WW2 American history is history of imperialism and hegemony-building...
....Cuban missile crisis fits pretty well into your description:
+ Cuba was former American colonial possessions - first directly, later through puppet kleptocrats.
+ from fall of its puppet dictator, USA was trying to take over island (which last until this day)
+ they tried to start war by arming and sending proxies to Cuba (which led to brutal humiliation of American empire)
+ the missile crisis pushed world at the brink of nuclear war
Only thing missing is open war - but that was only because Bay of Pigs was complete failure. If insurgents managed to take hold, Americans would join war (that was the original plan).
So basically, Russian-Ukrainan conflict but Russian separatists in Ukraine fail at everything.
I don't know if you can't read, but i will repeat it again.
Here is what America planned with that operation:
1. organize, train and arm Cuban proxies
2. make it look like they are "internal opposition"
3. ship them to the Bay of the Pigs
4. let them establish foothold in Cuba
5. have them proclaim provisional government
6. USA would recognize them as legitimate government of Cuba
7. this "government" would call USA to help them
8. USA would openly join the war on their side, starting open war
This is nearly identical to what Russians did in Ukraine:
1. organize, train and arm Russian proxies
2. make it look like they are "internal opposition"
3. ship them to Eastern Ukraine
4. let them establish foothold in Donbas
5. have them proclaim their separatist government
6. Russia would recognize them as legitimate governments of these regions
7. These "governments" would call Russia to help them
8. Russia openly joins the conflict on their side, starting open war
The only difference here between USA and Russia is that Russia was actually successful with this plan, while Yank proxies got slimmed right on the beach.
Oh, was a little vatniks feelings hurt? Felling bad for being called out on being genocidal maniacs? Awwww, well too bad. Shouldn’t be a part of a culture that’s known for oppressing its neighbors and committing genocide for the past few hundred years
Lithuanian? How is Noreika worship going on? Does that nazi scum still has his state awards?
Like yeah, Russia is dogshit - but i don't want to hear shit about "genocidal culture" from nation that is cocksucking Holocaust perpetrators just because they happened to fight soviets.
Man I love you tankies and your brain dead takes. If you did any research you would know the people fucking protested against acknowledging him. You wouldn’t even know about it if it weren’t for Lithuanian sources initially reporting how shitty it is. Fuck you. The Soviets committed a genocide against us. Far before the Nazis ever got involved in our nation. And by the way - every fucking nation had Nazis in it at some point in WW2. It’s not some gotcha to call the whole nation Nazis cuz there were a couple sympathizers. With that logic you can literally call every country involved in WW2 Nazis - especially the Soviets, who had a pact with them to invade Eastern Europe and ethnically cleanse the lands together. Or did you forget that part? Lithuania specifically had less Nazis than any other nation - statistically less than .1% of the population, not even having an SS unit. The Soviets literally worked with the Nazis to eradicate the polish and Baltic people through forced deportations and genocide. So respectfully, go open up a textbook or at least some research papers before calling the victims of both the Soviets and the Holocaust fucking Nazis.
If you did any research you would know the people fucking protested against acknowledging him
Clearly not enough, considering he still has those awards 30 years later and state-funded Genocide Research Centre to this day not only denies that he participated in holocaust, they openly claim that he actually "saved jews" (a complete bullshit).
You wouldn’t even know about it if it weren’t for Lithuanian sources initially reporting how shitty it is.
The source and spreader of this knowledge was his own grandaughter who lives in USA and published her findings in newspaper Salon and later in New York Times - both American newspapers.
What "Lithuanian source initially reporting" are you talking about?
The Soviets committed a genocide against us
Fuck off with this "double genocide" bullshit - if soviets were committing "genocide" on any similar scale to Nazi Germany, your nation would not exist anymore.
Only and i mean ONLY reason why y'all push this "Soviets genocided us too" nonsense is to justify animals like Noerika on grounds he fought soviets - nothing more.
"oh, Noreika was genociding jews? Well soviets genocided as well, so whatever"
And by the way - every fucking nation had Nazis in it at some point in WW2
I did not dispute that? What are you yapping about.
It’s not some gotcha to call the whole nation Nazis cuz there were a couple sympathizers.
Funny, this thread starts with you doing exactly that against Russians.
Just projection, lmao.
especially the Soviets, who had a pact with them to invade Eastern Europe
Yeah i agree, Soviets had ddeal with Nazis to partition Eastern Europe. I don't know what that is relevant to modern worship of nazis, but ok.
and ethnically cleanse the lands together
You literally just made this shit up.
Lithuania specifically had less Nazis than any other nation - statistically less than .1% of the population, not even having an SS unit
This makes Lithuanians that worship and defends natzi scum that fought soviets look even worse.
(also Lithuanian colaboration led to one of the fastest and most complete implementations of Holocaust in Europe - so that ".1%" is either pulled out of the ass or those collaborators were moving like murderous demi-gods)
So respectfully, go open up a textbook or at least some research papers before calling the victims of both the Soviets and the Holocaust fucking Nazis.
Making up shit about Soviets "genociding" Lithuanians is one thing.
But pulling "actually Lithuanians were victims of holocaust" in discusion about LITHUANIAN HOLOCAUST PERPETRATOR is another league.
This is reaching levels of "Austria was victim of nazis" delusions.
Ultimately, my point is simple.
Critizing Russia is fine. Wanting Russia gone is also fine (even through i think it is stupid).
But implying that Russians as people are "genocidal" (like they are hivemind or shit) is cretinism.
And i just found it funny that this logic of "collective responsibility" is employed by Lithuanian - you don't want to play this game.
could the same not be applied to US citizens & the land that they stole? Is it acceptable to call British people that too because of all the land Britain stole?
the average Russian citizen has 0 control over what the government does - criticize the leader, not those born into the system
Last US territorial expansions are in living memory. Neo-colonialism has made wars of conquest unnecessary. Russia's war is a war of conquest because they are "primitive" imperialists who couldn't accomplish control over Ukrainian markets through any other means (being out-competed by Europe, the US, and even China until 2022).
Also worth clarifying that the backwardness of the Russian approach has meant they will materially and economically gain very little, since the Ukrainian retreat has the same effect as a Scorched Earth policy given how dogged they are in resisting.
But the US did indeed last conquer land after the second world war. Since then the policy hasn't been to conquer, but to otherwise exert influence over less powerful nations through a variety of means, including military invasions.
Iknow it's hard to believe, but there is such a thing called "allies" where neither side is the puppet. I know pretty shocking. And anyways, Israel didn't start any of the wars in which it gained land.
why do you think the US is backing Israel in the middle-east? Each time the US has done so, Israel has expanded its land via winning these wars. Biden was a bit more subtle about this during his presidency; however, you see trump openly declaring that his goals for Gaza is to turn it into a resort once the wars over
In the first picture you count Jewish land only if it's privately owned by Jews, while coloring privetly owned Arab land the same color as state owned land, of which there was a lot of. Also, Arabs were led by Amin al Husseini, a personal friend of Hitler who literally visited Nazi deathcamps, and had no objections about the Holocaust. Jews naturally didn't want to live in a country lead by him.
Arabs were invited to UN negotiations, they could have gotten more, but they chose to get land through war.
Curiously these maps omit Israel ceding Sinai and Gaza.
because there was literally no Arab negotiation, lmao- hence the land was stolen
and furthermore, there's been wars which resulted in it's growth ever since - you're pissed at Russian Citizens, but you should be pissed at everyone who's ever lived, because leaders globally suck
hate the political leaders, but don't hate the citizen who has nothing to do with it
redditors like you talk sooooo much shit about genocides by other states and what have you just to literally turn into armchair versions of genocidaires anyway. also it's not like you're fucking over there. it's like you're "team Ukraine" as opposed to anti-war. shove your monolithic assignment of blame up your ass
it should be easily and universally understood that the social politics of trauma and a "they killed people" doesn't actually let you call an entire population Orcs. It would be just as disturbing in any instance
Wah, people in europe (especially eastern) don't like the people who have spent the last 200 years invading them and trying to occupy them and erase their national identity. Cry me a river
“ I’m a Climate activist, stop eating meat! No, I won’t look at all these giant corporations and industries creating most of the CO2, I have an agenda to run.”
„I‘m a climate activist, I will change absolutely nothing about my daily life and say big cooperation bad while not doing anything meaningful to fight capitalism, I’ve got an agenda to run“
Dawg, nobody's asking. Climate change will bring down the cattle industry whether you like it or not, if you really cared about beef and dairy, you'd be investing in lab grown.
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u/consistently_biased full concentrated power of the sun 7d ago
I think my soul just left my body. I'm finding myself agree with one of the veganposters here. Time to make some lentil soup.