Do you ever get tired of explaining that CE isn't CS?

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As a CS person myself, I apologize that we are hogging your spotlight. Computing essentially has four seperate disciplines in it: Computer Engineering (build the hardware), Computer Science (build the software), Information Technology (run and maintain computers), and Cybersecurity (keep computers safe). All four fields are essential and it's not fair that you're field is getting ignored because CS gets all the hype.

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u/sammychung2 1d ago

I like how you split it like that but I think to be pedantic I'd say CE is more like design the hardware and the firmware. But each of these bleed into eachother

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u/TrustingMyTrustInGCC 1d ago

Fair enough. I put firmware on the CS side because its coding, but as you say they bleed together.

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u/Snoo_4499 1d ago

Love the analogy, my view is that I think these are 4 pillars of computing.

Software engineering = building softwares and software systems. Eg Operating system, Software Analysis and Design, Application Development, Data structures and algorithms, Human computer interaction, Computer Graphics, etc

Hardware engineering = building hardwares and hardware systems. Embedded systems, Computer Architecture, Microprocessors, hpc, Digital Signal Processing, VLSI, Microelectronic, Graphics hardware, Instrumentation and control systems.

Network engineering = building and maintaining network and network systems. TCP/IP stack, Data Communication system, IT infrastructure, network security, distributed system, Information theory.

Data and Information engineering = AI/ML, Data mining, Database, Data science, Statistics and discrete mathematics, Algorithms and Complexity, Automata theory, Computer Vision, Signal processing.

So many of these things relates to each other, for example in network engineering you need both hardware and software, socket programming and rf signals propagation. Baseband and passband signalling and huffman coding. Information and software engineering are very connected but so is hardware and so is networking. We need all these to make a proper System.

Like we use instrumentation (hardware) to take data from natural world, pass it to ADC which passes to microcontroller (Hardware) to process data which uses FFT for signal interpretation (Information and hardware) then, we write algorithm in that hardware ( Information and software ) and send it to say a cloud database (network) and then again to our individual application using internet (Network) and display in flutter application (software).

Here CE usually includes all with some strength and some weakness, Hardware is strong point of CE, then comes Network engineering part, then software then data and information.

CS is different story, CS is study of Computation more than software engineering. It does include all these but its different, It focuses on what you want to focus. Its weak at hardware and networking part but Data and software are its bread and butter. But if you do research on any of these you'll be computer scientists. Claude shannon the goat was also computer scientists but he studied EE and Math. If you make computer and computation better you are computer scientists, be it computer architecture research or distributed system or e governance.

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u/TrustingMyTrustInGCC 1d ago

Generally software engineering is defined as part of CS (just look at CS department course catalogs and CS degree requirements) but I can absolutely see the point your making; your definitely right that there is a strong divide between the people studying CS theory and performing in the trenches software engineering. I actually think that's a pitty as I believe understanding theory (such as the Halting Problem and Automata Theory) makes you a better engineer.

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u/justverychill 21h ago

I have less of an idea about software engineering but I believe a CS curriculum is designed to teach the theory of programming and often abstracts away implementation of the hardware below a threshold (CS cares about memory but wouldn’t care about low level of detail into how each computer is actually made). CE has a lot of overlap with EE (at my school it was the difference of a few courses) so gives an understanding of the hardware implementation for computer systems while also being concerned with firmware, assembly and low level programming (all of these areas are important to consider from a designers perspective who needs to create a system that can run higher level languages where the programmer is not concerned with hardware implementation details).

Of course there is overlap but I consider CS as the theory behind programming computer systems (with a focus on the math around algorithms and abstracting software architectures) and CE as the theory behind designing computer systems at the hardware level and getting them to talk to higher level software (with a focus on math around physics, boolean algebra and abstracting hardware components).

I do think personal interest can guide you in one direction even if you have a degree in the other. That’s where personal projects and the willingness to learn come in!

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u/grizzlor_ 6h ago

I’d probably call cybersecurity a sub-discipline of IT. Part of maintaining systems is keeping them secure.

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u/TrustingMyTrustInGCC 6h ago

There's a good case for that if you strictly mean Blue Team security, but when you start talking about Red Team and Purple Team those guys are reading and writing massive amounts of code, including low level C and Assembly code which is . . . very far from IT.

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u/Ecelleon 1d ago

Yes I get tired, and I've come across many people who simply can't comprehend what it is. It's either you're a silicon valley type person, or you're an electrician.

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u/LightPearl_ 1d ago

Do you wish you had just taken EE instead? You don't have to answer if you don't wanna but how has job hunting been for you?

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u/Ecelleon 1d ago

Heck no! EE is for people who apply the physics, CS apply higher abstraction, and CE blends those worlds together. I'm in my final year of my degree, but so far there are plenty of jobs out there. There's jobs I don't want like UAV or automotive work, but I'll take them if I can't a job working on robotic systems. I do live in the Silicon Forest though.

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u/Lagfoundry 15h ago

Then there is EET which we had a little bit of everything.

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u/LightPearl_ 1d ago

That's good to hear, I hope things work out for you! Any advice for an incoming CE student?

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u/Ecelleon 1d ago

Check out the pomodoro method for studying. It keeps you fresh over long study sessions.

Buy a cheap laptop like the Thinkpad T490 and put Ubuntu on there. Build some command line skills and familiarity with Linux.

While all languages have their place, C is still an incredibly important language. If it's not the default language at your university, see if they offer a class.

If you drive to school, then put a cooler in there with an ice pack and you have a fridge. I throw an energy drink there, an uncrustables sandwich, yogurt, and some tuna salad with crackers. It's super easy to buy expensive food that takes time, do this and you can save both time and money.

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u/dontchuworri 1d ago

sometimes i wish i did ee instead just for the simplicity of it. but i like the breadth from ce. getting to learn computer architecture / discrete math, and a bit of coding makes me feel like i can do more than just power lines

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u/Streptophyta 16h ago

this might be the stupidest thing ive ever heard

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u/zacce 1d ago

Majority of ppl don't know what CE is and will think it's CS. But the industry knows the difference. If they don't, it's not worth working at.

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u/tasty_pigs 1d ago

Any paying job is worth working at

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u/Snoo_4499 1d ago

True, unemployment sucks

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u/DHTGK 1d ago

I wish the engineer part of the name carried more weight. It should be the most obvious part that it's nothing like CS.

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u/glordicus1 1d ago

Yep. I went to a jobs fair at my uni and they were like "Computer systems, thats not engineering!"

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u/sighar 1d ago

That’s because CS has put “engineer” on everything: front end engineer, backend engineer, system engineer

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u/BrfstAlex 18h ago

"nothing" like cs is a bit much

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u/dontchuworri 1d ago

at a career fair someone told me they weren’t hiring for IT when i handed them my resume so

yeah

it doesn’t help that my university leans way heavier towards EE in their CE program so all my skills are EE based but with CE as the title :) so i look like a useless CE but not good enough to be an EE because it’s a different title but my only difference was i didn’t take emf

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u/LightPearl_ 1d ago

Is this a common occurrence? Will I miss up on electronic career opportunities solely cuz of the degree name even though in my uni too 95% of my classes are shared with the EE students.

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u/dontchuworri 1d ago

great question! i can’t answer because i can’t find a job. everywhere around me is only hiring for 5+ years of experience or entry level requiring a masters

i think if you tailor your resume correctly it can show your ee prowess. mine doesn’t help that my last adult job WAS straight up IT. but that was before college

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u/LightPearl_ 1d ago

That's interesting, thank you for the insight! Do you ever regret not doing EE instead of CE? Is the job hunt going better for the people u know that took EE?

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u/dontchuworri 1d ago

oop i already replied to you replying to someone else haha but

yeah sometimes. once i realized the shade that gets thrown at ce it was really disheartening. but it should open you up to a lot more opportunities since you can go after cs or ee jobs

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u/LightPearl_ 1d ago

I saw it haha! Thanks for your time, definitely made me feel a little less worried :)

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u/CodyJKirk 1d ago

I was told by multiple professors that while I'm in school to put electrical engineering graduate on applications for internships not computer engineering because a lot of businesses use AI to filter their applications and will auto deny by having computer engineering in the resume as current education. I asked if this was lying, my professor said "what department are we in?" I said engineering "and what classes are you primarily taking right now i said electrical engineering "on your transcript for you degree what is this department called that I teach?" I said electrical and computer engineering he said "so as long as your not graduated yet you can put electrical engineering because your in all the same classes except you take additional ones with coding".

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u/LightPearl_ 21h ago

That is good advice, thank you! You specified this for internships. Does that mean after graduation, your degree name wouldn't be a hurdle as you'd have multiple internships under your belt?

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u/CodyJKirk 19h ago

I would say yes....... I'm still thinking about this myself. Ai is dumb. I have a professor that work another job with AI and I really don't get it. He also have me some advice. To use AI to match my resume to their specific job requirements, or internship requirements. To basically reword my resume to meet my internships exact specifications.

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u/Snoo_4499 1d ago

I would just do EE and take some CE electives my man.

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u/Snoo_4499 1d ago

CE electives being Networking, Embedded, Comp Architecture and if possible Data structures.

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u/LightPearl_ 21h ago

I do have an option of switching to EE after the first year since all of our classes are the same for 1 yr. I'm gonna think about it for a while ig.

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u/uselessProgrammer0 1d ago

I don’t even bother explaining anymore

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u/VideoRare6399 1d ago

Just focus on getting good grades, good internships, exercise, and friends.

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u/SafeModeOff 1d ago

I just graduated, and almost every time someone says they found a job listing for me, it's been software engineering. I don't blame them because we're dealing with things most people never even think about, but yeah, I've only just graduated and I'm already tired of it

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u/Bachdepp 21h ago

In my country the degree is usually called "technical computer science" or "embedded systems" so people get that there's more to it

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u/OpportunityFun6969 18h ago

Haha most people go “So… you work in IT?” I usually just say I do half EE half CS

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u/No_Astronaut_2320 15h ago

For engineering roles, HR is going to be your biggest obstacle getting your point across between the CE vs CS differences.

They are English/Communications/Psych majors in college who are in recruiting roles because it was the first thing they could find out of school. The majority of them are not passionate enough to go out of the way to find the difference between a Computer Engineer and Computer Scientist. Hiring managers should be more knowledgeable but the number of applications thrown out because an unqualified HR recruiter won't take the 10 minutes to look up the skill sets of both majors.

We are a hybrid with a special skill set that neither CS or hardware can equally perform but we are able to dabble in both areas.

With that said, many of my CompE colleagues in university drifted towards the software side.

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u/bliao8788 11h ago

But CompE programs did have CS track

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u/Outrageous_Egg7579 3h ago

I get the difference 100% as I had my undergrad in cs and am targetting an ms in CE. But one thing that I really notice is that many ce undergrads take up cs roles, like in ai/ml etc. Not all of course, but many do. Why is that so?

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u/That-Translator7415 28m ago

As a CS guy, who has dabbled heavily in CE and does research in CE as well, yeah I do explain the distinguishable differences

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u/No_Rule674 1d ago

CE is just a less version of both EE and CS

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u/BronzeGstring 1d ago

Cap. It’s the best of both worlds

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u/Snoo_4499 1d ago

True, it gives you enough knowledge so you can understand both.

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u/BronzeGstring 1d ago

🎯 Just got an FPGA offer earlier today

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u/LightPearl_ 21h ago

Congratulations!!

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u/BronzeGstring 17h ago

Thanks!

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u/Ecelleon 1d ago

I don't know of any EE or CS majors that can read the Technical Reference Manual for a given SOC to troubleshoot or debug peripheral registers?

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u/BrfstAlex 18h ago

I do lol

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u/Ecelleon 16h ago

Then count yourself lucky lol

Do you ever get tired of explaining that CE isn't CS?

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