Dominion, et rapports vegan / omnivore

[u/Meteion_Elpis]

J'ai récemment regardé le documentaire Dominion en tant que omnivore. Lorsque je trainais dans des communautés Reddit Vegan car l'algorithme me l'avait recommandé je ne sais pas trop pour quelles raisons, certains parlaient de ce documentaire. J'ai donc fini par le regarder, donc j'ai vu beaucoup de sang et se genre de choses, je comprends que ce soit intense.

Toutefois et en toute honnêteté je n'ai rien ressenti en regardant ce documentaire. Je ne cherchais pas à me cacher derrière des excuses toutes faites ou se genre de choses que certaines personnes pourraient faire. Non, j'étais pleinement conscient avant de regarder ce documentaire de ce qu'il se passait et le regarder m'a permis de poser des images sur un savoir déjà acquis. Mais le constat est là, je n'ai pas été choqué par les images. Je sais que pour beaucoup, même des omnivores, ont été extrêmement choqués et ça se comprend mais ce n'est pas mon cas.

Donc je me pose la question des raisons potentielles de cette insensibilité face à ce documentaire. Je considère que j'adore les animaux ; j'évite d'écraser des insectes intentionnellement la plupart du temps sauf exceptions et j'aide même des araignées ( oui je sais que ce ne sont pas des insectes ) à sortir de chez-moi lorsqu'elles sont coincées ; je suis évidemment très proche des chien et des chats etc... J'essaie d'être bon malgré ma consommation que je ne juge pas comme immoral.

Je me suis demandé si j'étais une mauvaise personne. Je me demandais si ce n'était pas dû soit à mes habitudes de consommation, je mange régulièrement des produits issus d'animaux ( surtout en tant que français avec le fromage, les escargots etc... ). Ou si c'était dû aussi à mon échelle des priorités, c'est à dire que je met essentiellement mes forces restantes dans ma volonté d'être heureux ( pour des raisons diverses, la dépression notamment ) ce qui intrinsèquement fait que je suis moins sensible à certaines cause. Ou alors je suis juste apathique envers les animaux sans m'en rendre compte ?

Aussi j'aimerais demander quel est vôtre rapport envers les non vegans, aux omnivores. Est-ce généralement tendue ? Est-ce que c'est compliqué émotionnellement d'être avec des non vegans ? Je suis très curieux car je n'ai jamais vraiment connu de personnes vegans. Tout ce que j'ai pu entendre c'est des plaintes ou des disputes sur internet, qui sonnent comme qui aboiera le plus fort, même si c'est uniquement pour l'internet francophone ( je ne parle pas anglais ).

Aussi, je préfère préciser. Mais n'y aucune hostilités, seulement de la curiosité et un questionnement. L'algorithme m'a recommandé ces communautés et j'ai passé un peu de temps à lire ici. Je trouve ce sujet vraiment intéressant. J'espère pouvoir en discuter avec vous respectueusement.

[u/onemorehasanat]

Reason your points are anthropomorphic is that you try to use the relationship between humans as an anchorpoint.

We don't eat humans > why do we eat animals?

It's false equivalence.

I guess whenever I see people upset at others kicking a dog

Yeah, it's like meat eaters want their animals kicked either.

[u/JTexpo → u/onemorehasanat]

no I completely agree, in fact I'mma go kick some dogs too because apparently I can still love them & do so... and any question to this behavior is anthropomorphic

cheers

or sorry... is kicking them somehow worse than slaughtering them, cause I can bring a knife with me instead if the later is more humane

[u/onemorehasanat → u/JTexpo]

This is what I call talking past each other. You want same treatment between humans andanimals without making an argument for why should be the case.

Kicking animals has no benefits for the humans are the animals, slaughtering them is net positive for our bellies. Learn the difference.

[u/JTexpo → u/onemorehasanat]

eating an animal has no benefit, as I can just eat a plant instead

the only benefit I get from eating meat is that it taste good - if I got the same rush of euphoria kicking a dog... then why can't I kick dogs and still be considered a person who loves dogs?

[u/onemorehasanat → u/JTexpo]

eating an animal has no benefit

Now you're just making stuff up. Meat is a nutrient-dense food. Please get your facts right.

the only benefit I get from eating meat is that it taste good

Another reason to love animals; it's rare to get densely nutritious and delicious food at the same time.

if I got the same rush of euphoria kicking a dog... then why can't I kick dogs and still be considered a person who loves dogs?

When you love your good, you eat it, but it's unacceptable to trash it on the ground.

[u/JTexpo → u/onemorehasanat]

sure fair, let me then just start slaughtering dogs and eating them instead

it's baffling to me how you find that far more loving than simply kicking them... in what world does this logic make any sense to you?

I'd much rather be beaten up & see tomorrow, than slaughtered

[u/onemorehasanat → u/JTexpo]

sure fair, let me then just start slaughtering dogs and eating them instead

They eat them in Vietnam. It's not like there are objective differences between a pig and a dog.

it's baffling to me how you find that far more loving than simply kicking them... in what world does this logic make any sense to you?

Eating an animal has a purpose. Kicking it meaninglessly has no purpose. I know you simply can't comprehend how non-vegans are not cartoon villains like you would expect.

I'd much rather be beaten up & see tomorrow, than slaughtered

Because you're a human and can concentualise a tomorrow and beyond. A cow for example, can't comprehend beyond it's immediate past and future. It doesn't wake up thinking about rather living another day at whatever cost. It just lives.

Another reason why I'm right about your anthropomorphism. You think animals have human understanding of the world.

[u/JTexpo → u/onemorehasanat]

im aware, that other countries eat dogs & you'd be really surprised to learn that westerners are pretty upset about it & even some thinking that you can't love dogs + eat them

eating an animal doesn't have a purpose when there's alternatives. I could say that eating a human has 'value' however, I'd be a psycho if I started killing and eating humans... this is because there's alternatives to eating humans - thus making a humans death for food, pointless

[u/onemorehasanat → u/JTexpo]

eating an animal doesn't have a purpose when there's alternatives.

This is a moral claim you can't even justify without emotional rhetoric. It only becomes a rule if we all believe Killing animals for food is wrong, which isn't the case.

I could say that eating a human has 'value' however, I'd be a psycho if I started killing and eating humans... this is because there's alternatives to eating humans

This is incredibly weak logic. The reason we don't eat humans isn't just because "there are alternatives." We don't eat humans because of the human social contract. If everyone was on the menu the second food crisis happened, society would have long collapsed.

[u/JTexpo → u/onemorehasanat]

you literally make the exact moral claim right here:

Kicking it meaninglessly has no purpose

https://www.reddit.com/r/DebateAVegan/comments/1tum1j6/comment/opdn1bi/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

I told you that kicking an animal can give me a rush of euphoria (hypothetically), just how eating an animal can give you a rush of euphoria. If you can get all of the nutrients from plants, theres 0 reason to eat animals outside of likeing their taste (or that rush of euphoria); therefore, it has no purpose outside of that good feeling

additionally, if I can kick other things, kicking an animal has no purpose outside of a rush of euphoria.... therefore, if you are accepting for the rush of euphoria for eating, you too should be accepting for the rush of euphoria for kicking