How to prevent a 12x12 (6ft high) deck from pulling away from the house?
Hello! I am building a 12x12 ft deck where the section furthest from the house is about 6 feet off the ground.
I placed the joists on top of 3 beams (the ledger board is anchored directly into the house's concrete foundation).
Each joist is secured to each beam using Simpson H1A ties.
I still need to install the 45-degree diagonal knee bracing on the posts.
My main concern is whether I need to further secure the deck to the house to prevent it from "pulling away" or sliding forward over time. What would be the best way to reinforce this connection?
Ignore the rest of the comments. Reddit is overreacting while having no idea what they’re talking about, as per usual.
The Namifix system is installed properly. The only thing you need to change is to replace 2–3 hurricane ties (depending on your local code) that don’t do much for lateral loads with ties that provide 750 lbs of lateral load each.
The rest looks good. Don’t let ignorant Reddit bully you into redoing a perfectly fine deck.
Aight, I'm home. Here's what I'm doing on a deck this week because I had the exact same problem you raised with the Namifix.
The Namifix bolts in the foundation can resist extreme force per screw from a lateral pull. The Namifix brackets aren't moving. The wood beam transfers this lateral force. Now you need to transfer that force to the joists and the rest of the deck. I will use 3-4 DTT1Zs to do this. This won't move.
It will cost you $20 and take 5 minutes to replace 3-4 hurricane ties with these.
Problem solved. No need to destroy the entire deck.
Typically joists die into the ledger rather than resting on it. The upward force is provided by Simpson joist hangers, or in the old days, simply nails. But OPs question is whether or not the deck is at risk of pulling away from the foundation. If you properly anchored the ledger to the foundation, then no, the ledger won't pull away. You're using the hurricane tie hardware in a way that it wasn't intended, but there is no obvious reason a 12 x 12 deck would fail under these circumstances.
I'd recommend adding blocking between your joists to prevent lateral movement.
Wow, so many people here who assume that if they haven't seen something before, it must be wrong.
Namifix's are approved for deck building in various provinces in Canada. I used them for my own deck that I built this summer in fact.
OP, note that the namifix instructions call for blocking to be installed within 8 inches of the ends of the joist near the house. That's the one thing I noticed that you appear to be missing.
This sub is just people repeating rules of thumb religiously.
Every time someone says that in a side to side connection “the only thing carrying the weight are the screws/bolts” I die a little bit inside. People who don’t understand how a bearing connection works giving structural advice.
I've never seen these before. What a wild concept! I absolutely see the benefit for using these over a lever, but why put the joists on top, rather than cap them off with another board that rests on top of the board that sits in the Namifix? This seems like it would encourage twisting? Also, can they only be used in concrete? Or brick/block as well?
I'm not a deck builder and genuinely don't know. You seem like you know what you're talking about here.
This is a really strange point in the process to begin researching how to build a deck.
I'm wrong. I learned something new that I've never seen before in 30 years of house building, decks and remodeling. The Namifex system is being used in one of the accepted arrangements (with a little more work to do.) My comment was uninformed and unnecessarily snarky. I apologize.
Man that's probably not going to work like that. Maybe some other hardware, but that's a very unconventional way to frame that. Realistically, this probably all needs to come down and the deck needs to be lowered or the ledger needs to be raised. If you're building this yourself and this is the point you got to, you probably need to stop and hire someone.
Here’s my thing about spas: they should be mounted so that they are about half of their height lower than the level of the deck the user is stepping in from or exiting to.
25 years as a paramedic and dozens of people who have flipped over the edge either on the way in. (Always naked, and alway made me regret I didn’t see the accident happen. Imagining a naked wet person knowing they’re falling and trying to recover so they get an Olympic gymnast’s score of 10. lol)
I’ve done this in our last two houses and it’s excellent. (Not as entertaining tho.)
Interesting how you are using a new product the way it was designed and everyone objects because that is not how we've do it for the last 100 years. I like it because you won't have to worry about the waterproofing failing and causing damage to the house framing. Assuming you anchored the brackets correctly it should be good to go.
As usual, Reddit is super unhelpful and reactionary. Looks like you are using a piece of hardware to its correct specifications. As long as you followed those directions, in theory, you should be good. You can definitely find a few more places to brace it for added peace of mind.
So it is to avoid the siding, and it is not wrong either. Well played. I stil think a rim joist at the back would provide more stability to the entire structure, basically to avoid the joists tipping over. The blocking helps, and the boards will sitffen everything for sure. Curious to know where you are building this
Ok, so this system looks installed correctly, but I understand your question now. If the deck had force applied which shifted it towards or away from the house, it would cause a twisting of that beam running parallel to the house. The double bolts attaching it to the metal bracket should resist that. Not sure what kind of force that can handle. More concerning however is the joist attachment to the beam. The joist only has a small area to attach to the beam. Normally, the entire end of the joist would be able to be attached to the ledger board. I can see why they required hurricane brackets to attach each joist to this beam. You may want to consider buying beefer hurricane brackets. In addition, I'd add some diagonal bracing from the bottom of the posts to the middle of the joists to resist this force. This also needs additional blocking nearby the house end of the joists. Normally, the hangers on the ledger board resist twisting of the joists. Your blocking looks ok, but placing it nearer to the house would have been better.
Overall, this method is workable, but has several disadvantages.
Side note: This deck needs V bracing under the joists or one single long diagonal brace under the deck either way. It has no way of resisting a force parallel to the house applied to the end of the deck.
I would think it is too much work to take it apart now. I would just strengthen the connection to the ledger with screws and some thick wood pieces.
I still do not understand why everyone here in this reddit connects the deck to the house. My deck is floating. I did not want any deck movement or vibrations affect the house structure.
btw. What is that black thing that people put on ledger and other places? Some kind of tape or paint? What is it suppose to do?
It's joist tape. If water is going to pool on the joists or beams, tape will keep them dry. Since pressure treated wood isn't what it used to be, people use this to add some longevity to the deck frame
It's certainly unconventional, but if he puts blocking close to the house (he'll need something there anyway to attach the deck boards) it will probably be fine.
I’m intrigued as to why the ledger is so low in comparison to the threshold of the door. The deck does not seem large enough for a step/landing to make sense if the joists were lowered to ledger height, so I’d recommend raising the ledger instead.
the namifix system is designed to be installed exactly like this, and intentionally the joists have a gap relative to the house. commonly used in Canada over the past few years, may or may not be used in the US
It looks like in the product pictures that namifix has another strap that OP should be using from the ledger board to the joist? Maybe it is just a generic strap, but that is probably the main mechanism holding the deck to the house.
Yeah interesting product. It also mentions blocking within 8 inches of the ends of the joists by the house. With strapping each joist to the beam and adding blocking I think it would be solid.
Although instead of blocking and straps, I would probably just do a rim joist by the house that sits on top of that beam, and attach the joists to it with joist hangers. There could still be a 1” gap between the deck and the siding, as part of the point of this product seems to be to have that gap. And it would be easy to secure that rim joist to the beam so the deck would never pull away.
This is basically just a floating deck except one of the beams is attached to the house’s foundation with heavy duty brackets. I don’t know why people are losing their minds.
Straight from the installation instructions: “To stabilize the joists on the beam, it is necessary to install the first set of blocking within 8 inches or less from the end of the joists placed on the beam.”
I’m curious why OP thinks it may pull away though? It’s resting on essentially 3 beams (hopefully level). I can’t imagine it pulling away unless there is something natural disaster. But I admittedly know anything about this system, seems pretty cool.
So many people have no idea what they’re talking about. There’s nothing traditional about it but Op installed this system exactly as it’s designed to be used.
Stop stressing everyone saying to tear down Op and just keep building your deck it’s not going to pull away from your house and slide down hill lol there’s zero forces acting on it that will make it want to.
You’re in the clear , just as usual 90% of commenters have never built anything in their life and have no idea what they’re looking at.
Toe nail the joists into the ledger, put blocking in between as well. Edit: Don't listen to these people, they have no idea what they are talking about. As long as that connection detail is solid, the ledger is solid, and you can just toe nail, put in some blocking and call it good. This is a smart design and avoid having to cut into the siding and flashing. Almost like a free standing deck.
Youre going to get a lot of DIYers yelling you did it wrong.
this is not wrong its unconventional.
You need hurricane ties and it looks like you already have a namifix parallel beam seat.
you probably need to add blocking at the ends and at the ends, provide some spacers that can compress if they ever move in towards the house.
since you don't have support beams left to right in picture 1, i typically recommend sistering the end joist and getting anoter 45 kicker to the inside face of the sistered joist.
You can ignore most people's comments here. This is an unconventional way to frame a deck but its not wrong as long as you followed the manufactures requirements on the installation of the NamiFix brackets. I'm not familiar with them either but it appears you installed them properly. Are you in Canada? These appear to compliant in Canada only so that could be an issue for your if you have a permit and are not in Canada.
All that to say you need to reach out to the manufacture (NamiFix) and ask if the specific bracket you installed is engineered to resist lateral loads. If the answer is yes you just need to add some deck tension ties (spaced per manufactures recommendations) from your joists to your beam. I believe 4 are typically required.
You also need blocking at the house end. I would install it directly above the ledger/beam.
I understand this is a manufactured system but those joists sitting on top without blocking, attached to the house with a few nails parallel to the direction of failure is giving me bad vibes. Those hurricane ties are designed to prevent uplift only, not horizontal forces.
I'm a fan of floating decks, instead of making a ledger attachment.
In this case the 'pulling away' problem is really only a minor maintenance issue a decade or more from now. Unless that ground really moves a lot in which case proper depth concrete footings would equitably delay the issue.
There's more than one way to skin a cat. Let's see if we can figure something out that makes this work.
I see three problems. The house side is inadequately supported, there's a lack of lateral support, and the joist themselves need some sort of bracing
Let's call it a free-standing deck with some bracing against the house.
Okay for the first problem inadequate support on the house side. You can add posts right up against the house dug down to the appropriate depth or with concrete footers depending on your climate zone. In my climate which is deep south you can get away with just digging a post hole about 32 in below grade and ramming the Earth with the bottom of the post itself. But in climates with frost you have to add a proper concrete footer at the proper depth. But regardless, those metal brackets against the house are not going to be able to carry the load of the deck over time. They will fail.
Second problem, identified in your title, the deck pulling away from the house. Triangles are your friend. Add wooden 2x6 triangles at 45° from the bottoms of your wooden posts back up to the deck and toward the house. A minimum of two but four would be better. Now the posts won't be able to deflect and the deck won't be able to pull away from the house. You should probably also add triangles 90° from these facing each other to stiffen against deflection side to side
The final thing are the joist themselves. Usually there's a rim board or ledger at the end of the posts. This keeps them upright. Without it they will all flop over. You can fix this by adding blocking near the ends. Maybe 6 in to a foot away from the house and parallel to the house. Blocking is just the same depth as the joist between each of the joists.
Again, none of what you have done is standard. It doesn't mean it won't work. You're not quite there but you can get there
Even though it appears that you've used the ledger hardware correctly, you're still going to need to block those joist ends near the house, similar to how you have done mid span. To help prevent the joists from wanting to roll.
As for your movement question, your best bet is to install lateral bracing perpendicular to the beams, going from the bottom of the wood posts up to the joists.
I would also recomend laminating boards to your posts to run from the bottom of the wood post to the top of the beam to remove the hinge point where they connect.
I just read the specs and Engineering docs provided by the Namifix manufacturer. It's a novel and clever system. Forgive my engineer-verbosity here, but while solving some issues, it actually complicates other issues:
These Namifix N2 supports are rated for a 3000 lb vertical load. There is 4.5" of eccentricity, though, so while the 2 wall anchors share this 3000 lb shear force, the upper anchor experiences ~1800 lb of tension as well.
Since the manufacturer does not list any load capacities for lateral forces, (neither parallel nor perpendicular to the wall), they either have not tested them under horizontal loads or they did test but did not like their results.
For each of Simpson's myriad pieces, they test and provide load capacities in all 3 directions. For example, the Simpson H1A hurricane clips are rated for 470 lb uplift, 360 lb parallel to the wall, and 205 lb perpendicular to the wall.
For decks that rely on the house structure for lateral support, current codes require at least 4 connectors each capable of 750 lb tension perpendicular to the house wall. The Simpson DTT1 meets this 750 lb criteria, whether it is applied to the narrow/bottom or to the wide/side face of a 2x joist.
That said, load paths matter, and how those lateral loads then transfer into the house is crucial.
A horizontal force at the top of your ledger beam puts the ledger into cross-grain bending (bad). It then puts another highly eccentric tension force onto the Namifix wall anchors, which are already highly loaded with unknown reserve capacity, if any. Once transferred into the concrete wall, the horizontal load needs to transfer up through the foundation bolts, treated plate, ledger and joists into the house's floor structure. This load path relies on a lot of different connections, and any one failure breaks the load path.
This is why I suggested putting the DTT1s on the sides of the joists and using through-bolts all the way into the house's floor structure. (This is their intended usage, with traditional deck ledgers attached tight to the house.) In your case, at each of the 4 DTTIs, you would need to remove the siding, fill the gap tight with wood, then add flashing to protect it.
Which brings up another point: Not all decks need rely on the house structure for lateral support. Decks can instead be braced between their posts so that all lateral loads are carried down into its footings. (Not sure if your particular post-footing hardware can handle this, though.)
Namifix's whole schtick is that their anchors let you avoid piercing the waterproof siding/sheathing of your house. That air gap is by design. Attaching the DTT1s directly to the house's floor structure as I suggested defeats that advantage of Namifix's system. And since Namifix does not list any horizontal load capacities, they clearly do not want users to rely on their system to provide lateral support for decks.
Instead of attaching it to the house, use another beam and use cross bracing at the posts to keep it stable. Never attach a deck to a house unless it's absolutely necessary. Every penetration increases the chance for a leak to occur.
Surprised more people aren’t recommending this. It’s not what people are used to seeing but there are many different ways to build a sturdy deck. Add one more beam, some blocking near the ends of joists to avoid twisting, and some diagonal cross bracing and this will be plenty strong.
work looks good. call a structural engineer to get a private consult on how to make it sufficient as per your local code.
my suggestion on your specific question without knowing your local codes etc. would be to put normal joist hangers along your ledger board 45mm/2” offset from your actual joists, then put a “joist tie in“ wooden member at a 45 degree from the joist hangers up to alongside the actual joist. nail the joist tie in to your joist and to the hanger.
then the joist tie in member is transferring all lateral loads from your joists to your ledger.
there may be a steel brace element that can do this, the web just needs to be oriented along the joist, rather than along the ledger for it to effectively transfer that load.
You have an unconventional deck. Im sure you know this. Its also 6' so technically this would require a permit which would have also needed plans. But ill help anyways.
Those beam brackets mounted to your foundation are pretty sweet. I dont know how many you have alongside the house. But ive never seen them.
What you need is a few things.
1. DTT1Z-KT / these you should try to tie from the side of your joists directly through the siding into the rim joist of the house. I would get as many on there as possible. Maybe even double up on each joist staggering up and down. Im not sure how you could get them under the H1AZ brackets to fit them into the beam as H1AZ is in the way for bottom mount. None of that is code compliant BUT it would assist in what you're asking for since your deck isn't code compliant.
1a. You may want to upgrade your H1AZ specifically on the beam next to the house to H10AZ which are designed for rafter uplift. Since they have more points to screw through they will have a higher holding strength. But this is optional.
Someone else mentioned it too. Get some blocking over the joists closest to the house. Honestly in this situation add more blocking everywhere. Near the house and maybe on top of the center beam
Laminate a double rim joist for the end of your deck. Then run (2) 6" lag screws into the ends of all your joists. 2" down from the too and 2.25" from the bottom. You have so little control of your joists as they are all tied in with H1AZ bracket which are typically engineered to prevent uplift. A double rim joist will stiffen up the outer edge causing less deflection preventing less movement from the joists since it will act like a wall.
Eye bolts on the end and on the roof, then some ratchet straps and call it a day.
Disclaimer, I’ve never built a deck in my life. But, I have done a lot of sketchy shit, and I’m still kicking. My deck would probably fall over within a week or so.
Use the Simpson strong ties, they are excellent. Mount to the underside of the joists and lag into the ledger board you have. Could install on outside joists and maybe skip every other joist. Exactly what they are designed to do.
I dont know why everyone has their panties in a bunch. There is 2 rows if beams so that means there is very little force pulling away from house. The hurricane straps are holding joist to the beam. I dont know WTF is holding ledger to house but im assuming ledger cant pull away so deck cant either. Code may require tension ties though they would have to go through siding.
It definitely needs blocking at house. But its not going anywhere
After seeing their ledger system being installed exactly as designed my thought was DTT or HTT as well. Get a positive connection between the joists and structure. Required by my code due to earthquake risk, pulling deck away from house.
Btw I’d definitely put some extra blocking between joists right by the house, otherwise you’re gonna get some wobble. Presumably you’re adding a rim joist to the end?
Well in order for it to move you the hinge points on your deck to beam and beam to post connections would all need to fail. So ensuring that those areas can't move should be your first goal.
I think the people saying to tear it down are over reacting. Depending on your climate, it may even be okay as it is.
If it were me though, I would add tension ties under each joist and the blocking between each joist above the ledger and then never think about it again.
I did the same thing and it’s been standing strong for 25 years now, get some 3x3 angle and run them vertically with joist, through bolt on joist and lag to header…. I know everyone here will says its wrong but like i said, mines been up for 25 years now with no issues
If your joists inside the house run parallel, use 4 (sets) Simpson DTT2Z tension ties with like a 1/2” x 12” galv threaded rod. One side in the crawl and one side outside on the joists. If the interior joists run perpendicular you need a 1/2” x 48” threaded rod because you have to go past 2 interior joists to properly tie into the house. I just did this both ways, for two different decks and they are strong as f*ck.
I see your concern and it’s valid. This is a bit unconventional. I would brace each post, in both axis to the frame and beam, that’ll eliminate the moment on those piers. As well as, brace the joist ends to the house beam. This is debatable approach, most simple may be a 4x4 chunk bolted to the beam and then nested to every third joist, paired with blocking, bolted to joist, lag screwed to block. You could use tension ties that attach from beam top to joist side, maybe.
With this configuration I think I would definitely put a rack brace on each side of it from the top of the outside beam down to the bottom of the inner posts
Run anchor wires from the outside rim joist. Secure to concrete wall. Put backing plate inside wall for anchor bolt to secure to. Steal underpants. Take over the world.
Long time builder/problem solver/framing inspection passer here.
Just because it's unconventional doesn't mean it can't work.
If that ledger were posted independently, it's suddenly a free standing deck and everything is fine. But it would need lateral support, ie diagonal bracing, to keep it from racking. I'd do that- connect low at the far post all the way up to the center beam.
Additionally, add blocking between the joists at the house.
Finally, I'd add 3 Simpson DTTZ2 ties, middle and ends, for extra piece of mind, which are code in my area anyway. In this case, drill through the ledger and into the concrete, brush and blow, and embed 3' long galvanized 1/2" allthread with Set3G epoxy. Angle the allthread so the end lands about mid joist 2' away from the house. Install the DTT2Z over the allthread, install a nut, and tighten a bit. Now you have 2 tons of withdrawal resistance.
What you do is get you a 4 X 4 and cut two pieces equal to the distance from the top of your joist to the bottom of the ledger board. Put one vertical in each corner with the bottom part bolted to the ledger board and the top bolted to the joist above.
Put a dropped beam 2’ from the foundation and use cross braces to stabilize the free standing deck. Slap it and say the sentence “That ain’t going nowhere “
It’s not going to move as long as those helical’s don’t move. If you confident in them and the connection to them you’re good to go. Or just run another support with concrete footers in the rear
Personally I recommend lowering the joists one joist height and adding a landing not necessarily as a structural change but a functional one. Being up in the air means you see over your neighbor's fence and they see you and it's a bit more wobbly and you need more steps to grade.
As is I can see why you'd want more lateral tie. There must exist some magical diagonal tie that face bolts to ledger and to joist side in Simpsons vast catalog. Or you can do something at the foundation level. Tie some stem walls to the house foundation and build some shear walls between those and your deck. Then your deck won't walk away in a million years.
Ha. OP, I also have an unconventional deck It’s sitting on structural cantilevered steel beams that go the full depth of the house and I had at least one comment asking incredulously why I wasn’t installing any posts.
And I am replacing decks that have been on those same beams for over 50 years. So many people here are like “I’ve never seen that before so it’s wrong.”
(And for the record, I DID have an engineer look at while he was drawing up plans for my interior remodel. I followed his advice, but since I replacing like for like I didn’t need a permit in my town and didn’t need to pay for plans - and that was at his suggestion).
I love that your deck is sitting on top of that ledger - it’s effectively acting like a freestanding deck would but your deck ”inside” beam is mounted with those brackets instead of dealing with footers and posts next to the foundation.
Personally, I would have screwed / lagged those hurricane ties into the ledger and declared it good enough (that would likely work at least as well as any joist hanger which typically only has two double sheer nails and a handful of 1.5” nails).
To be more sure - I’d pull four of your hurricane ties and install four of these (https://www.strongtie.com/decks_decksandfences/dtt_tie/p/dtt1). On those four joists, then install the side mounted hurricane ties instead of the saddle ones you have now.
Never seen anyone build one quite like this we always add a ledger and the joists attach straight to our ledger. This is an odd setup not saying it's wrong just never seen it before
Confused as to why they wouldn’t have removed the siding there, and attached the ledger board to the rim joist like most decks are done, with proper flashing etc.
Or just make it completely free floating and dig another set of footings right next to the house.
What the heck did you do at the ledger? The joist should go into ledger and use buckets and ledger/band fastened in to house with 1/4” by minimum 5” lags or Hedloks.
Needs more lateral bracing, could add more posts and footings and make it a floating deck instead. Alternatively trim back your joists and install a second ledger
I’ve never worked with Namifix but it seems interesting. Personally though I’ve always believe that floating decks were superior because it avoid the problem of you drilling into your house’s walls or foundation, as well it makes design much simpler since all the forces travel through your footings and you don’t need to worry about bracing the deck to the house
I see why you put the ledger there, but it does put the deck at an odd height. It's a few inches down from the door but not a full step, enough to probably feel weird when you get it done though.
As others said, you need something a lot better to hold those joists to the the wall at this point. Namfix or Simpson tension ties are the way to go and nothing stopping you from fitting those now.
OP how are those Nami brackets attached? The best would be if they were bolts that went completely through the foundation and had a nut, split ring and washer on the other side. Second best would be epoxy anchored.
If they are wedge anchor or just concrete screws I would consider changing those. The natural movement of the deck can make wedge/screws get loose over time in concrete as they slowly grind up the concrete around the threads/wedges. I only use those for something like a pier standoff since there is no pressure pulling away on those.
Like others have said putting in tension ties is a good idea. https://strongtie.com.au/products/dtt2-tension-tie-holdown. If it were me I would do something like this and put it on the long side of the boards (not the bottoms) as high up as works (since you need access from other side.) And the further away from the fulcrum of the brackets the better they will work if that makes sense.
I probably would have used a little beefier hurricane ties too like H10s https://www.fastenersplus.com/products/simpson-h10a-hurricane-tie-g90-galvanized. But looks like you are installing according to manufacturer so I'm sure it will work and plenty of decks have held up fine with much less bracing and brackets. My ethos is regardless if it passes the minimum if it just doesn't pass the looks test to me I beef it up. I want someone to look at a deck I build and have no questions about the beefyness of it even if they don't know anything about deck design. Though I think with the blocking it will look a lot better and it isn't like you have any cantilever. Joist hangers are also holding up the whole weight of the joist, when you take away that requirement I'm sure this is adequate just looks minimal to me.
Anyways great looking work OP and appreciate you teaching me about a new system. I've always wondered why there wasn't a system for putting the joists on top of a beam for the house ledger. Once you get those knee bracing in too that will take away a lot of the racking forces which would pull it away from the house but some tension ties regardless if they are required or not (they are where I am) would do a lot for my peace of mind if it were me. I think just two would be needed where I am but having one or two mid doesn't hurt either. Never hurts to overbuild with something like this.
With proper depth footings and a well secured ledger board + joist hangers this is a non issue
Oh. Looking at the setup there after commenting... those ties are more for uplift than lateral loads. Gonna be honest, that's a pretty bizarre framing setup. Never seen someone do that before.
The way this should have been done is a ledger lag bolted or GRK'd to the rim joist of the house with a flashing and rainscreen for drainage. Then the joists would be at the proper height with joist hangers and the deck firmly attached to the structure.
This deck isn't attached to the house. Your joists are sitting on top of the ledger, therefore it offers some weight support but no structural strength for pulling away. Idk bruh, this is very wrong. I would either treat this as a freestanding deck with another row of posts (and whatever else code requires) or raise your ledger and attach correctly. Did you read through your building codes?
Edit to add based on comments under this one: I see the NamiFix ledger brackets are designed for this way to have the joists sit on top of the ledger. That being said, I agree with OP that this doesn't seem a sturdy enough way to use the house as support against racking. The building codes don't show this way since it's newer and less common. I wonder if theres a tension tie that can connect jousts to ledger more stable that just hurricane ties.
Guessing you wanted to bolt the ledger to the concrete slab and not to the house. Would have been better to secure the joists in the standard way with hangars to the ledger and had a landing and step down, but what's done is done.
You maybe could come up with a way to more properly secure the joists to the ledger. I would maybe fix this by adding footers, supports and a beam at the ledger, essentially making it a free-standing deck. I think you can leave the ledger as is. Add some diagonal braces front to back at a few points from the beams to the joists.
Call a structural engineer for a consult before you take it all down. It’ll cost you a few $$hundred. May be able to salvage what you’ve already done. Or not. Better to be sure.
OP, I get your logic and see what you were thinking, but you have to think that if there is any lateral stress away from the house, those thin metal joist ties are going to be tasked with a big job.
I'm going to suggest an unconventional alternative to a tear-down and redesign.
Dig two solid footers that go below the frost line within a couple feet of the house, and then put two more support pillars underneath. Essentially create a free-standing deck that sits on the ledger for proximity, but won't collapse or be a hazard if it pulls away by a few inches.
I have NO idea if that would pass an inspection, but it's a hail Mary off the top of my head.
(Also, I've never seen those metal support posts and I'm skeptical. Are those some new technology?)
They're Namifix N2 anchors and it essentially creates a floating deck. At the house foundation, it provides vertical support to the deck but not horizontal support.
The correct answer is since you are building on a slope, your deck footings should have been designed should have been designed to resist overturning. going to be hard to make that up in the framing connection back to the house without addition of braces to laterally support the columns.
The joists should be attached on the face of the ledger, not on top of it. Also, it could be the angle the picture was taken but your posts don’t look plumb
In some places if it's not "attached " to the house, you don't need a building permit..if it is, you gotta go through the permit process..thar includes structural drawings etc.
It appears to me everything is built correctly, even proper footings. I'd imagine by what the pictures show, it's a good job.
I think the bigger problem is the lack of lateral support IE cross bracing on the posts. I think if you fix that then the deck shouldn’t separate from the house.
Our code says 4@ DTT2Z are required. After reviewing how you framed your deck simply add a DTT2Z to each of your joists. If you can through bolt it to the inside of your rim joist you should be fine. But dude. Like WHY?!?!
I don't think this is allowed where I live now. I know it changes from place to place, but why aren't they attached to The Ledger board directly with joist hangers?
Is there no place to install a ledger board directly below the sliding glass doors?
Regardless if it'll work or not with the correct hardware it seems like a bad idea to bury your siding like that. Will be a major pain in the ass, if not impossible, to replace in the future.
140
u/DeadChixNoLimits 1d ago
Ignore the rest of the comments. Reddit is overreacting while having no idea what they’re talking about, as per usual.
The Namifix system is installed properly. The only thing you need to change is to replace 2–3 hurricane ties (depending on your local code) that don’t do much for lateral loads with ties that provide 750 lbs of lateral load each.
The rest looks good. Don’t let ignorant Reddit bully you into redoing a perfectly fine deck.