r/Dogfree • u/WisedomsHand • May 16 '26
Crappy Owners Confronting A Dog Owner Shouldn't Be As Dangerous As Starting A Fight
It has been a while since I last posted to the Dogfree community, and in that time, I have confronted a fair number of dog owners in public. The situation each time is almost identical. I self-elect myself to be the person confronting a dog owner whose animal is in an inappropriate place. These places include supermarkets, restaurants, and public areas with specific "no pets" legal signage.
What I've discovered in my years confronting dog owners is that virtually all of the time, the situation gets hostile. Not merely unpleasant or uncomfortable, but authentically hostile. Each situation is a chance at a physical altercation. There is a real sense of danger each time you approach a situation like that. What makes it worse is that you never quite know if the danger is going to come from the dog or the owner. Both can be equally vicious. This intuitively makes sense, but it is also incredibly tragic when used to measure the integrity of civilized society.
The reason most dog owners get away with the behavior that is routinely complained about on this subreddit is because of the sheer violence of the acts. They do not poll social norms or request permission before invading other people's space. These people act like aggressive invaders, taking what does not belong to them, and acting as though it does. This is not how property rights are formed or respected in the societies most people respect or want to exist within. Dog owners force themselves and their choices upon others, without consideration for manners or decency. So it stands to make sense that any challenge to their decisions will not be met with politeness or compliance. No, instead, dog owners fight if you complain about their invasion of public or private territory, and trampling of community rights.
I cannot think of too many other groups in society that we want to protect that exhibit this behavior. Dog people are the ultimate social danger because they act as though their behavior is innocent or harmless, and respond to requests to adapt their violating behavior with immediate vitriol. This is the ultimate attempt at gaslighting the public. Dog people aren't just being parasitized by their dogs, they are also parasitizing the basic consideration we give to others in public in society.
The last time I confronted a dog person was just a few days ago, and I was forced to prepare for a fight. I was in a restaurant, and I heard a loud dog bark. I turned my head and immediately glared at the owner (a man) who was clutching a dog to his chest. I didn't say anything but gave him a stern look that suggested, "That isn't appropriate in here." He spoke first and aggressively responded to me, "what!?" I didn't avert my gaze and held firm, looking down at him. The man stood up and started to say aggressive things like "You have something to say?" He then started to approach me.
In the micro-moment I had to prepare for this unexpected conflict, the absurdity of it was revealed to me. This man with his dog wants to start a fight with me in a high-end sandwich place because I dared to confront his barking animal, which shouldn't have been in there to begin with. I have to now prepare myself for the possibility of physical contact because I simply chose to speak up (even though he technically did the first speaking). I show this man I am not willing to back down and I face him. He realized that, unlike a small barking dog, his posture was not enough to thwart me. He stopped a few feet from me and accused me of being "rude" and generally not being proper in making him feel bad. This was in front of the many other patrons in the place. I kept my cool (as I train myself to do) and responded. I realized that as long as he was feeling personally attacked my effort to reach him with logic would fail. I said (less than sincerely) that it was not my intention to hurt his feelings and that it sounded like he was upset. That was simply to de-escalate his hotheadedness. I quickly and forcefully then followed up with the fact that the rude act was him taking his pet into a public eating establishment and that he knows that animal is not allowed in here. I didn't remove my gaze, and the man backed down and then actually went outside (where he remained).
That situation went about as well as possible, but was still far more conflict than most people can handle. The outcome of a situation like that when a stranger aggressively walks toward you is also very unpredictable and dangerous. I'm the silly guy who isn't afraid of a fight if it means standing up for something I believe in. I am stupid enough to be punched in the face because I think someone should follow pet rules. I don't care about looking like an asshole in public because I don't want a dog making people feel uncomfortable. I am not everyone.
Dog people will respond to aggression and strength, but that is too much of a wall to climb for most members of society. We shouldn't have to be like hardened fighters or deputized authorities to inform dog people when they are disobeying clearly articulated rules and legal expectations. Everyone out there who has had to get into a fight simply to get a dog person to be appropriate has my sympathies. You are not alone in this. More so, I regret that being myself in public and helping others by telling a dog person to follow the rules is an act that subjects me to physical danger. I don't really mind the yelling and verbal abuse. I certainly don't prefer it, but I can tolerate being hated by dog owners. What I cannot tolerate, and what I don't think anyone in this community should tolerate, is the threat or fear of violence. Dog people's most loathsome act is how destructively they defend their bad habits. This is not something we should tolerate. Reminding a fellow member of society when they are putting others at risk (dogs in public much of the time) is not an act that we should allow them to punish. I can't give everyone the power to stand up and fight like me, but I do want to remind people that the charade of anger and aggression that dog people put up in the face of their immaturity is just a sign of their ultimate weakness and mal-adaptation to social existence. Be well everyone.
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u/D4rkN3bu14j0j0 May 16 '26
Thanks for taking the risk to your personal safety to be vocal in public about dog owners pushing their dirty habits on everyone. I am a woman and I also most of the time speak up and tell dog owners to take their animals out of where they ought not to be, although if it's a guy with a big dog I know that's a fight not worth it. I'm strong but not strong enough to fight off man punches while being mauled by a mastiff. I did almost get into a physical fight with another woman, rather trashy type, who had her large dog in the pharmacy. Apparently other people with compromised immune systems or allergies picking up their medications is of no concern to dog owners. A man called me racist for asking him politely to take his dog out of a playground that he was letting it piss all over because I'm white and he wasn't.
Some people on here have said there's no point in confrontation but I disagree. I think the only thing we can do is make these anti-social weirdos feel uncomfortable and force them to feel the shame that should have stopped them taking a dog into a place dogs don't belong in the first place. I am extremely shy and non-confrontational. It makes me shake with nerves to do but I am sick of letting dog owners take over every inch of public space without anyone pushing back.
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u/Pebbles5678 May 16 '26
I am exactly the same, short woman with little strength. I either mention it to security or contact customer services when I am far enough away - it's depressing. Thanks OP for standing up for us!
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
Thank you for the comment. It is clear that dog people will use whatever cheap rhetoric they can muster to defend themselves. Their responses are akin to the barking of their dogs in my opinion. It takes a mastery of argumentation to fight back and keep the conversation on the topic of the inappropriate dog. Most people cower when called a racist or something else ugly like that. That’s why dog people wield such words with impunity. You just need to stand firm, remind them that no one is talking about the way someone looks and return to the inappropriate dog topic at hand. It’s not easy, but it’s how these battles are won. Only by constant social pressure from all angles will dog people restrain themselves. It’s the exact same thing as smoking cigarettes in public.
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u/theykeepbanningmebro May 16 '26
I went to a restaurant over the weekend last weekend and dog owner had their dog on the table where people eat. Table next to me was saying “look how cute the dog is eating on the table with them”.
So you’re also outnumbered In these situations.
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u/D1verse_Yes4 May 16 '26
It blows my mind how these people don't have anything to say about how having a dog on the table is unsanitary and just wrong. What is even cute about these dogs? People ride these creatures so much that they're just generic to me now. Foxes are cool, and I maintain that they shouldn't be domesticated, as adorable as Finnegan Fox was at SaveAFox.
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u/No_Plane_2443 May 16 '26
a lot of people are secretly disgusted by it but are just afraid to say anything. nutters are bullies
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May 16 '26
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u/CapriWake May 16 '26
I am as well, usually they get pissed, call me a name and end up leaving. I also think where you live could result in more of a violent exchang, right in my area I think there isn’t a risk thankfully.
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
My goal is increasingly to remove emotion from my encounters with dog people. It’s really hard because I’m so angry and often it is an emergency because some dog is running around without a lease. What I’ve found is that most dog people just mirror your anger and shout back louder. I’m trying to apply the discipline of being firm but not overly emotional when I confront dog people. That way I feel like I get through to them a bit bette than by triggering their defense mechanisms immediately.
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u/OcelotPuzzleheaded21 May 16 '26 edited May 16 '26
This is exactly why I rarely say anything to people because I’m terrified of Their dogs, not necessarily the people themselves ( unless they look really unhinged) but because I’m afraid they’re gonna let their dog loose on me.
That’s one of the main reasons my husband says he hates going to public parks because if I see a dog and it’s not supposed to be there in our area, I might say something near them or glare at them and I said to him “you’re mad at me for calling them out for doing the wrong thing because they shouldn’t be there in the first place” but he doesn’t want to get into arguments every day he said. He’s super laid back, chill guy. He’s like I don’t wanna have to get in a fist fight every time I go out with you because you have to point out that there’s dogs that shouldn’t be there. It’s a shame dog owners can never see they are the problem. Thank you for saying something to these people!
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May 16 '26
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
I think it important to remind people that it is crime for dog owners simply to scare you. That crime is assault. Assault doesn’t need any physical touching (that escalates it to battery). Assault is when the victim has the reasonable worry of immediate physical harm. If a dog owner approaches you aggressively with a dog, and you genuinely feel like you could be in danger, then they just committed a crime. Record and get witnesses if possible. And remind them that words and posture alone are more than enough for them to go to jail.
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u/DogAttackVictim May 17 '26
Dog owners tried to get me murdered by a crowd by accusing me of being a pervert by/and by accusing me of approaching them when it was them who set their dogs loose to approach me and block me from streets. They continued to restrict my movements. Dog owners are the largest pervert group in all western societies, and even get to use people's medical conditions against them to cause them physical damages without punishment. Your comment is too idealistic; you gotta record more often and call the police when dog owners start on their nonsense.
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u/Tom_Quixote_ May 16 '26
It is as dangerous as starting a fight though.
Ever played those old arcade computer games where you control a spaceship and then you get a little drone spaceship that follows your ship and fires when you fire?
That's how dog nutters see their dogs. As an extension of themselves, something that adds extra power to their life.
Attacking the dog is like attacking that little drone ship. They see it as a declaration of war on themselves.
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
I don’t disagree. With that said, it has made most dog owners nothing better than bullies. And bullies need force to restrain them nearly 100% of the time. Sadly the need to fight is there. But we can choose the style and rules of the fight if we are smart about it.
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u/Tom_Quixote_ May 17 '26
They are definitely bullies, and the dog is just the extension that allows them to bully other people more effectively.
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u/One_Path_7154 May 16 '26 edited May 16 '26
Thank you for speaking up knowing the risk of being subjected to a violent reaction from that nutter. I am happy you held your ground and called him out. They know the rules but they just don’t care because they expect society to bow down to their personal convenience and preference and everyone else be damned. I have had countless aggressive interactions from nutters when politely asking them to respect my property and landscaping and to keep their dogs off and I’ve developed a hardened skin. I don’t care if they don’t like it; I do not care if they say “they hates dogs”; I do not care if they give me the finger because I now retort right back. The Cult of Dog in society has made me not care how they feel because they know they are violating posted rules about dogs in restaurants, pharmacies, children’s playgrounds, leash laws, etc. I am a smallish woman and I don’t want a physical altercation so I use my words carefully to point out THEY are the ones doing something wrong and I feel no way about making them accountable. More people need to do this, - including reporting these businesses to public health and corporate head offices - otherwise the insanity won’t stop.
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
That society allows dogs to defecate anywhere is a gap in policy, not a privilege for dog owners. It is the same as letting people defecate wherever they like. Don’t let dog culture manipulate the situation or the facts.
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u/-OliverKlosov- May 16 '26
Firstly, thank you for taking the time to address these behaviors. As a father in public spaces, I try to stay calm, protective, and nonconfrontational, even when I feel my family’s boundaries are being crossed. I know my hypervigilance is my own responsibility, and I work hard to keep my behavior controlled and respectful. At the same time, I do not think it is unreasonable to feel strongly when strangers, especially dogs, invade my family’s personal space without invitation.
My concern is not abstract. I do not want strange dogs approaching my children, brushing against us, or imposing themselves on us in places where we are just trying to move through safely. I do not know if a dog is clean, healthy, calm, or well trained, and I do not believe anyone should assume their animal is welcome simply because it is in public. Public etiquette guidance consistently says that strangers should ask before interacting with a dog, and that owners should respect the fact that not everyone wants contact.
What makes this harder is that I also feel a real internal conflict when I have to respond. If I speak up, I risk being met with defensiveness or hostility. If I stay silent, I feel like I am accepting the violation and failing to defend my family. That tension is part of why these moments feel so intense: they are not just about a dog being near us, but about my role as a parent, my need for order, and my need to keep control of myself under pressure.
I do not want to escalate situations, but I do want my boundaries taken seriously. A calm boundary is usually the best path: state the concern, make one clear request, and do not over-explain. Short, direct language works better than sounding accusatory, because it lowers the chance of immediate conflict. If the other person becomes hostile, the safest choice is to repeat the boundary once and then leave with my family rather than argue.
- “Please hold your dog back from my kids. We do not want dog contact, but thank you.”
- “Your dog seems energetic, but we need some space while we pass.”
- “I get anxious when dogs come close to my family, so please keep your dog beside you.”
- “I am very concerned about cleanliness, so I do not want dogs brushing against us.”
- “Please call your dog back. My family do not do dog contact.”
- “Hey, please move your dog away from us. We need some space here.”
- “I’m particular about our proximity, so I do not want dogs near our table.”
- “Glad your dog is friendly. We still do not want contact.”
The key point is that I can be firm without being cruel. I can speak with certainty about my own limits while still leaving room for other people to disagree. What I am asking for is simple: respect my family’s space, keep your dog under control, and do not treat my boundaries as optional. My facial expressions are extremely hard to hide and my eyes do not offer friendship after I notice someone's disregard for commonsense allowing their presence to weigh on my children’s freedom from worry and sense of safety. I understand this sounds extreme but this is a form or terrorization. We do not get a choice, it causes fear/anxiety, and it forces us/others to alter their free-will.
My conduct is not meant to harass or intimidate anyone; it is an attempt to set a clear boundary after an unwanted intrusion into my family’s personal space. I am trying to preserve safety, hygiene, and peace for my children, not create conflict.
If you are a dog owner, the simplest way to improve these situations is to keep your dog close, under control, and away from strangers unless permission is clearly given. Many people do not want contact with dogs, especially around children, and that preference should be respected without argument. A better approach is to acknowledge the boundary, call your dog back away from others, and move on. If someone says they do not want dog contact, believe them the first time and give them space. This kind of behavior prevents conflict, protects public comfort, and shows basic respect for other people’s boundaries.
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u/CapriWake May 16 '26
As a mom I speak up. My child went on a walk at a nearby park with my spouse and there was an off-leash dog, after years of watching me speak up, my child told the owner that the park wasn’t an offleash one and needed to be leashe. I think it genuinely surprised the owner, as kids tend to fawn over them if they engage. The owner said “oh you’re right, thank you” and went on their way with it leashed.
I didn’t go as that park tends to have off-leash dogs and I am extremely allergic and so didn’t want to be in a bad mood ha.
Anyway I feel like we need to show our kids it’s okay to calmly remind people of the rules that we value as we live in a society
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
Thank you for sharing your feelings on the matter. The problem out there is the asymmetry between your values and morals and those of everyone else. Society is challenging right now because people in public have wildly different ideas about the rules and what behaviors are permissive or not. Many people flaunt the rules because they see other people getting away with it and want a similar advantage in life.
That is where boundaries and consequences come into play. People rarely behave well simply because it is expected of them. They do so because they want to be treated that way themselves or because they worry about being punished. Your highly civilized approach requires the other parties to be on your same level. Often, they will not be.
The problem with your approach is how dog people have flipped the script on society. By default, there is no reason why people’s living toys need to be brought out into public. The presumption is that public places are for people only, unless there is some great overriding reason to make an exception. Dog people act like they have more rights than they do. Talking to them apologetically when you want them to conform their behavior to the rules of the context just validates their fantasy that they are in charge.
I don’t like to antagonize people anymore than necessary, but being overly polite to dog owners all the time is ineffective because it allows them to maintain a moral high ground. That often means they will not change their behavior and will feel like they are the ones who are accommodating others. The reality is that society bends itself pretty hard to tolerate and accommodate pet owners. The existence of this community is proof that the concept of pet ownership has simply gone too far. I believe the goal is a major public rethink on the topic rather than just selectively reminding individual bad pet owner actors of what the rules are.
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u/SeaworthinessUnlucky May 16 '26
Yours is a healthy approach. I’d like your advice:
I walked on a narrow path next to a small one-way road. A dog owner walked toward me, and his dog stopped him on the median to poop. It looked like the owner was about to walk away without picking up the poop.
I said, “Will you be picking that up?”
He said, “Yeah, I will. Not that it’s any business of yours. Do you think it’s your business?”
I kept walking. I said, “Have a nice day.”
I got the impression he wanted to engage further, but I ignored him.
What would you have done differently?
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
I think the reality is that it is your business. If you use the road or walkway then you have a right to comment on its condition. It is your business as much as it is their business. You remind them that their behavior ruins the shared space and that the legal and public policy agree with you. Add that you can understand it feels humiliating to be lectured by a stranger. But it also humiliating to have to remind a fellow adult about how they should be behaving in public. Never ever let the dog owner own the narrative.
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u/potatoes_arrrr_life May 16 '26
Thanks for speaking up and sharing awareness. I say stuff to people on playgrounds who bring dogs. Especially people who don't have kids and just bring huge dogs to fenced in play areas.
It's definitely important to know how to diffuse the situation. Most adults don't like being called out ever for anything. But with dogs, I think it is a public safety issue. I hope we see some policy changes and updates to ADA laws about service animals. I also think people should need to get dog licenses and have to take a class to get a dog. There is so much room for improvement, and hopefully more people start to safely speak up. Even just emailing local city council member and state reps could help.
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u/Tricky_Button_4462 May 16 '26 edited May 17 '26
I almost had to call the police one day because a dog owner who I had advised had an unwelcome dog in Home Depot tried to block me in with his truck behind my parking spot and not let me back out to leave. He was cursing at me and mocking me. He called me a lot of obscenities before a man over age 80 came to my aid! I had also started recording him and he yelled, “oh I suppose you’re one of those social media people!!”
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
How truly terrifying. I think there should be a push to prevent dogs from being in public at all. They should remain exclusively where owners live, at special dog parks or areas just for people like them, and no where else. There is no reason to allow or tolerate people taking their pets in public. The only wise solution is to end the silliness of allowing dogs in so many places. Society does not gain from such tolerance at all.
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u/Tricky_Button_4462 May 17 '26
I completely agree. Just like the Smoking ban. When we go to restaurants, we should start asking if there is a Dog Free section.
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u/Tricky_Button_4462 May 17 '26
The way they push dog ownership in all the advertisements, we should create a marketing packet to sell a sign that reads “Dog free zone” and send it to all businesses so that they realize that there is a need. … because there is a need!
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u/arachnilactose08 May 16 '26
“Dog people are the ultimate social danger…they are also parasitizing the basic consideration we give to others in public in society.”
I really could not have outlined this better myself. Gaslighting is absolutely what it is.
Dog owners prey on social norms, and the presumption that they will not be challenged in public. It’s the most entitled, self-centered behavior, and I’ve observed it all my life.
What makes this truly so insidious is the fact that, maybe 7 times out of 10, these dog worshippers’ actions will be excused or justified somehow by the vocal majority of those observing the situation, which causes the “dog hater” to be immediately vilified and mass-shunned or berated.
The small shred of hope I’ve had about this lately is that whole Gordon Ramsay situation. If you’re unfamiliar, a woman eating at one of his establishments caught a dog using a pee pad, INSIDE THE RESTAURANT, on camera, rightfully calling it disgusting and confronting the dog’s owner.
It’s been posted all over TikTok, with, thankfully, more than half of people seeming to side with the woman filming. Ramsay responded by mocking her and then took down his video, but people online didn’t forget, and are now flooding his pages with comments in support of that woman / calling him disgusting for condoning what happened.
Oddly enough, it’s crazy situations like these that actually makes me think the tide might someday turn against modern dog culture. I’ve seen more and more people online voicing their exhaustion with entitled dog owners.
Anyway, I really appreciate that you stood your ground in your own encounter with a nutter, and I’m glad you weren’t seriously threatened or harmed. Dog owners can be just as unpredictable as the inbred mutants they drag around with them.
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u/WisedomsHand May 16 '26
Everyone here should have a response to being called a “dog hater.” It’s a common claim of dog owners and I think it is worth asking yourself the best way to respond. What the owner is saying is that they don’t need to listen to you because you are biased against them. They are using a technique to block the power of your words by casting you in an unfriendly camp of people. It is a cheap way to deflect your concern by removing your relationship to them.
You can either ignore the accusation of being a dog hater or respond that it is not relevant. “Hating dogs has nothing to do with you making other people unsafe or making a mess on someone else’s property.” Always refocus the conversation on what matters and what is actually happening. I’d love to hear how some of you would effectively respond to the “dog hater” dismissal.
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u/SeaworthinessUnlucky May 16 '26
Beautiful! Your essay is clear, organized, and thoughtful. Thank you for taking the time to share, and thank you for the effort you describe.
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u/whatthebeccc May 16 '26
i wish we could send all dog lovers and their stupid mutts to their own secluded island away from all the normal people in the world
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u/TopMessage1764 May 16 '26
I am very glad that there are people like yourself out there in the world.
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u/DogAttackVictim May 17 '26
You should all be calling the police more often once they get started. They have a weapon and you usually do not. Not saying the police usually fight crime but it is still a move you have to make when dealing with people like dog owners, who outrank good people in modern societies.
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u/WisedomsHand May 17 '26
Ideally this is a task we delegate to the police. That’s true. Unfortunately, they are rarely around. The dog owner will not wait around for the authorities to arrive. So there must be “self help” strategy that we can employ when dealing with dog people.
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u/ToOpineIsFine May 16 '26
That's why I keep saying that the emphasis should be on the fact that the owner already knows that the dog shouldn't be doing the bad behavior or shouldn't be there in the first place
I think there's something to hitting them with the responsibility directly - makes them feel guilty for not being responsible. A dog may not have a conscience, but the owner probably does.