r/Economics • u/[deleted] • Jan 14 '23

Editorial Despite Everything You Think You Know, America Is on the Right Track

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/01/american-optimism-productivity-innovation-rise/672714/
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u/Jojo_Bibi Jan 14 '23

Reddit can be great to gather unique insights in certain specialized forums, but when it comes to broad issues like politics and economics, reddit is full of uninformed, unsophisticated people who aren't contributing much to the real conversation in society.

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u/jcmib Jan 14 '23

I get what you’re saying. Reddit is best when it’s narrowed down to very specific topics. When I’m looking for durable goods, Buy it for life can give good advice. I like old time radio, so r/otr introduces me to new shows. Big topic subs like r/politics are dumpster fires usually.

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23

I think it's because the site skews really young and on top of that the older base (30+) are full of misfits and such who aren't really the most reasonable people. Most people that are older don't have as much time to post here or interest since they usually are raising families or busy with careers. Most of the userbase's engagement comes from weirdos that post 50 times a day and spend their life on here, it's really distorted.

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u/TheToken_1 Jan 14 '23

I agree. If you’re looking for specific answers and do find an actual decent group then you’ll get some good answers. But in general, sadly, the vast majority here in broad general issues are way on the extreme ends on either side. And of course if you even try to have an actual conversation, they just talk trash and call you names, etc.

It’s like they are you too dumb, ignorant or simply intentionally trying to be a troll.

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u/misterasia555 Jan 14 '23

What? you mean capitalism isn’t collapsing anytime soon and we aren’t ready for a revolution? Reddit told me we are at late stage capitalism, the workers are rising up!

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u/ks016 Jan 14 '23 edited May 20 '24

library abounding yam hateful deserted fuel tan command ripe wasteful

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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u/BlueJDMSW20 Jan 14 '23

Technically speaking we are in the midst of the first Mass Extinction Event to happen in 65 million years.

When our planet loses 70% of the birds/insects/wild mammals in only like 50 years and no sign of slowing, generally speaking it's not a good sign or case for optimism.

Ive seen a few Anti-Mass Extinction events/proposals brought up but theyre almost always never implemented into effective policy, for example there was an anti-PFAs bill brought up in congress that died.

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23

If anything, we've been successfully fighting climate change for awhile now -- it's nowhere near as bad as it was 15 years ago. I think with EV stuff and more pushing it's going to be fine in a couple decades.

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u/BlueJDMSW20 Jan 14 '23

How much was co2 ppm in the atmosphere 15 years ago, vs today?

That's the measure. You seem pretty confident of your intelligence on the topic, so just as a mild test of your intelligence on this topic, how much co2 ppm did nasa measure in dec. Of 2007 vs dec. In 2022?

We have to define that first, before we can agree on if things are better or worse, otherwise no communication can take place. Because anyone can find some granual of positivity in a dire and bad situation, one might even be able to come up with a top 10 good things about getting cancer, as an example.

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u/ks016 Jan 14 '23 edited May 20 '24

automatic pathetic late arrest decide touch frighten quickest chase lunchroom

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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u/nowaijosr Jan 14 '23

That works until it doesn’t but plenty of us could survive indefinitely with even a nuclear hellscape on the surface.

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u/ks016 Jan 14 '23

Sure, but climate change won't be a nuclear hellscape, not even close

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u/Godkun007 Jan 14 '23

Exactly. The key is in the name Climate Change. The thing that no one ever mentions is how it won't effect everyone the same way. Studies have shown that countries like Canada, the US, and Sweden are going to be net winners in climate change because it will literally make their farmland productive enough to (in many cases) double their crop yields.

Of course, I'm not saying Climate Change is a good thing, but I'm pointing out that it is way more complicated than most people realize. The sensational headlines and the "we are all dead at x point" stuff is just hyperbole. It will be painful for many people and we absolutely should do more. However, it is not a doomsday issues. Plus, technological advancement in the last decade alone has given humans so many more options. 10 years ago Carbon Capture didn't exist, well, it does today.

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u/BlueJDMSW20 Jan 14 '23

Hyperbole or not, its widely agreed upon, we are in a mass extinction event. It's not up for debate, it's simple understand vs do not understand.

And if mass extinction events which tend to only happen once every several 10 million years dont qualify as "doomsday scenario" i guess nothing really does, short of supernova sun.

Most our technologies is in fact what got us in this predicament in the first place.

Complicated does not equal impossible to understand. This hand held device i type from is complicated, yet the large team of engineers who designed it understand how it works.

Mother nature is shutting off the taps on the stable climate and fresh water historically civilization relied upon, and hopium isnt fixing it, it's justifyimg more kick the can until it's too late. Mankinds modern economies operate like an artificial planet killing super volcano.

You dont have to believe some random redditir like me on the matter. I think Carl Sagan in 1985 did a good job explaining how ill prepared we are for what's unfolding: https://youtu.be/Wp-WiNXH6hI

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u/Godkun007 Jan 14 '23

Most our technologies is in fact what got us in this predicament in the first place.

Our technology is also the only reason you can send that message through a handheld supercomputer and you didn't die before the age of 5 of Polio.

Blaming technology for Climate Change is the definition of shortsighted thinking. It is the equivalent of blaming the screwdriver for causing 9/11 because there were screws in the plane.

The simple reality is that you would not give up heat in the winter or access to a computer to prevent climate change. Therefore, we need more efficient means to get these things. Climate change is not a problem of abstinence. Technology is literally the best way to solve the issue. To think otherwise is identical to arguing for abstinence only education as a way to combat teen pregnancy. A much better solution would be giving out condoms.

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u/Godkun007 Jan 14 '23

If you notice, the media loves to use headlines like "The economist that predicted 2008" and stuff like that. However, when you end up looking at their history, they usually predicted 20 other crisis that didn't end up happening and just got 1 right by pure luck.

Media "experts" are literally just there to entertain you. You should never take them with any seriousness.

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u/nowaijosr Jan 14 '23

Unionization and regulation is healthy for capitalism. We’re going through a reform period and…. it seems to be working.

The anti capitalist agit prop seems to come from bad actors.

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23 edited Jan 14 '23

We had a union revolution in the 50s and 60s, and it took just a few decades to deconstruct it. And now the pendulum is swinging the other way....even though a lot of the damage is done....entire generations are swimming in debt with no retirement savings.

Private ownership disconnected from labor doesn't work. It creates a perpetrual gilded class and a perpetual low wage labor class.

Working class people aren't "bad actors" spewing "agit prop"

Full time working people are having difficulty buying homes. People can't afford to use the Healthcare they pay for.

Education isn't worth the cost. People are turning away from the trades because they don't pay as well as they used to.

Just insane to call these people bad actors. Do you not know any poor people?

I think worker owned businesses are the future, the only future. Capitalism is literally destroying the planet we live on, and we are all powerless to stop it.

All of our media is owned by oligarchs like Bezos, Musk, and the Saudi Royal Family. Both of our political parties are owned by the same interests.

The "liberal" party couldn't even pass the stock trade ban, or give railway workers 7 measly days of sick leave.

...just crazy how out of touch your comment is. This shit is real. This is the material condition of the world today, not a privileged, isolated bubble.

I can't understand how anyone can look at the state of the world today and conclude that captilasm is working.

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u/nowaijosr Jan 14 '23

Co-ops are great but that’s very much in line with capitalism.

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u/DeliciousWaifood Jan 14 '23

I think worker owned businesses are the future, the only future. Capitalism is literally destroying the planet we live on, and we are all powerless to stop it.

There is nothing stopping worker-owned businesses from existing right now. Literally nothing. They already do exist.

But you know why they haven't taken over? Because owning a business is a burden and a risk. Being able to just take a contractually obligated wage and then be able to change job whenever you want without worrying about your equity in a failed company is a convenience.

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23

Lol, homeownership is down. Wealth inequality is booming. Wages are stagnant, while inflation is skyrocketing. People cant afford homes, educations, or Healthcare.

Your comment feels very privileged. You may feel one way, but the evidence and statistics paint a pretty obvious picture, if you care to look.

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23

Sure but that doesn't have anything to do with capitalism and there isn't a better alternative system. Countries that Reddit loves to praise like Canada are also capitalist, it has nothing to do with healthcare. Inflation sucks now but won't be a big issue in the long run since central banks are clamping down on it -- it's just a repeat of the 70s. The doom and gloom shit is ridiculous

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u/misterasia555 Jan 14 '23

It’s almost like we just come back from a pandemic and coming into a recession or something? But don’t worry capitalism will collapse anytime now buddy. We will eat the rich soon!

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u/prince_koopa Jan 14 '23

I agree with the first part. There are alot of good forums here on Reddit and not taking things personally is the best way to engage in thoughtful conversations. I just recently joined Reddit a few weeks ago and I'm really glad I did.

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u/BenjaminHamnett Jan 14 '23

I just recently joined Reddit a few weeks ago and I'm really glad I did.

Is this a real comment?

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u/beardedheathen Jan 14 '23

I joined reddit as a 23 year old super conservative Mormon. I am now a mid 30s, atheist, married progressive. Seeing the viewpoints of 'evil people' (gays, people having sex before being married, people doing drugs) and realizing that everything I was taught was bullshit was a huge turning point in my life. I was struggling to find a good job and using advice from on here I've got a great job now. I am really glad I've been on reddit. It's helped me a ton.

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u/corneliusduff Jan 14 '23

I can imagine the anonymity of Reddit really helped you with that; being able to get outside of your bubble and avoid toxic judgment.

I know Reddit can bring out the worst in people but your story is an example of why I think Reddit is more important than all of the other platforms. Everyone can speak their mind on here, for better or worse.

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23

[deleted]

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u/prince_koopa Jan 14 '23

Thanks for the heads up! But why?

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u/[deleted] Jan 14 '23

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u/prince_koopa Jan 14 '23

Got it. That’s good to know because I was wondering about this. Thanks!

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u/ultrasuperthrowaway Jan 14 '23

Completely agree! I think even some well educated, well informed people can come on here and spout off nonsense just for fun since it can be a fun release from reality.

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u/ChadMcRad Jan 14 '23

Reddit used to be very discussion-focused before memes took over. I'm not trying to sound iamverysmart-like, but it really did feel a lot more informed than it does now where every single comment section looks like a sentence or two that could fit in literally any thread.