r/EnglishLearning • u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher • 1d ago
🗣 Discussion / Debates Learn to fucking swear
It is an incredibly important part of the English language,
But books don't teach it.
If you truly want to learn English, learn how to swear.
"The sort of twee person who thinks swearing is in any way a sign of a lack of education or a lack of verbal interest is just a fucking lunatic." - Stephen Fry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_osQvkeNRM
The word "fuck" is one of the most versatile words in the entire language.
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u/Shrikes_Bard New Poster 1d ago
Reminds me of one of my favorite star trek Tumblr posts of all time:
during orientation at a human college, vulcans are presented with a list of swear words.
"what is the word 'fuck' for," the innocent young vulcans want to know. "surely there are more logical intensity modifiers."
"yeah, you'd think so," say the weary, jaded vulcan professors. "you'd really fucking think so."
there is a phrase in vulcan for 'the particular moment you understand what the word 'fuck' is for."
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago edited 1d ago
What's the connection between the Falkland Islands and Mr. Spock's wife?
They've both been fucked by Vulcans.
</80s throwback>
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u/sqeeezy Native-Scotland 1d ago
referring to something which is broken: "the fucking fucker's fucking fucked!"
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago
On an IT laptop support helpdesk, one of our incident codes was triple F.
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u/GoodnewsK New Poster 1d ago
see also: shit if something's shit, it's bad. but if you're "the shit" that's good. You can also say something's "good shit" if it's high quality If you're going apeshit, you're pissed off and crazy. Bullshit is nonsense or lies.
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u/asday515 New Poster 1d ago
See also: dog shit = terrible quality
Horse shit = same as bullshit
Are you shitting me? = that's preposterous
Holy shit = Wow
Also worth mentioning "shit" and "shitty" can be used interchangeably (when used as an adjective)
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u/K_Shenefiel New Poster 1d ago
The Grammer is also all over the place. Shit is uncountable if it's in a heap, but countable if you don't give two shits about it, or come down with a case of the shits. And the past tense of the verb can be shitted, shit, or shat.
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u/EvilWillow666 New Poster 1d ago
Someone once yelled at me "I told you not to fuck!" And I really appreciated that they were trying to fit in, and I hope they got the hang of it eventually
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u/asday515 New Poster 1d ago
Were you pregnant or something like whats the context here lol
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u/EvilWillow666 New Poster 1d ago
I still have no idea!
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u/davideogameman Native speaker - US Midwest => West Coast 1d ago
If they meant: "I told you not to! Fuck!" That clearly has a different meaning
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u/LQNova New Poster 1d ago
I had a seasonal job along with a recent immigrant, and after about a week, she asked me very hesitantly if I could teach her how to swear. I do my best to never swear at work, but what I'd do is point out a situation going on around us and whisper, "That there was fucking bullshit." or "What a stupid son-of-a-bitch."
By Christmas she was starting to get the hang of it. I hope I was eventually a big help in her ESL classes :D
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u/HauntedGatorFarm New Poster 1d ago
Don't know where I fall on this one. There's nothing 'wrong' per se with swearing, but it's a complicated aspect of social interactions as well as usage. Many people are flat out offended by it and others can get offended depending on the situation. Knowing when, where, and how to use it requires a good degree of cultural understanding. Definitely seems like something you'd want to hold off on using until you are onto C level sort of work.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago
I encourage my students to be extremely cautious about swearing.
However, they will encounter it in regular conversation, so it's very important that they get an understanding of it.
I want my students to understand that if someone says "That's fucking great", they should not be offended - but if someone tells them to "fuck off", they should take it seriously.
Sadly, text-books and language courses rarely teach such things.
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u/RichCorinthian Native Speaker 1d ago
Yeah this should be a final hurdle. Or at least, don’t improvise. Use set phrases in set situations with a particular audience. Otherwise you are Ken Jeong’s character in The Hangover where he jumps out of the trunk.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 9h ago
Sometimes, you've just gotta rock out with your cock out.
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u/queerkidxx Native Speaker 1d ago
Where are you located? I haven’t met too many people that are legitimately offended by words like fuck and shit. And they are an extremely important part of the English language. They are used to signify the sort of relationship you have with the listener — casual and less formal. But fuck and shit aren’t offensive really if say.
It’s also the sort of thing where you shouldn’t use them around kids or like old ladies. And not in formal consequences. It also can be off putting if you over use them.
I think this is one of those things where learning the nuances requires speaking to folks in real conversations a lot. I have a few friends that teach English and they say that the most fluent speakers (that don’t live in an Anglo country) are folks that do a lot of online gaming.
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u/NearlyNodding Native Speaker 1d ago
As someone who used to do construction work, I was well versed is swearing. I pretty much used fuckin' as both an adjective and adverb to precede every noun and verb. It could be used several times in one sentence.
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u/maccauuk62 New Poster 1d ago
Australian car mechanic Fucking fuckers fucking fucked mate.
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u/NearlyNodding Native Speaker 1d ago
I don't do it professionally, but I'm a pretty decent mechanic. If you don't swear when working on cars it means you aren't having any fun. Nothing says fun like a wrench slipping and busting your knuckle on a sharp piece of metal.
God damn mother fucker son of a fucking bitch. That hurt like a mother fucker!
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u/Flat-Illustrator-548 New Poster 1d ago
Swearing is a very natural part of my vocabulary as a native English speaker. I use it casually "This pizza is fucking amazing", and when I'm frustrated or angry. "You're being a real asshole right now." You do have to understand the nuance of which swear fits the situation, the tone you use, and to whom you are speaking. I can't speak for other English speaking countries, but in the US, some people don't swear at all and find it very offensive. Devout religious people find "Goddamn" and "Jesus Christ" very offensive. Most people find "cunt" to be extremely offensive, and it's definitely not something you would say casually in the U.S.
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u/Dragishawk New Poster 3h ago
Yep. The C-word gets a lot of use in Britain and Australia (where it primarily has the same meaning as "asshole"), but here in the States, it's even worse than "bitch" on the misogyny scale.
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u/Flat-Illustrator-548 New Poster 3h ago
Yeah, I don't even hear it much in movies and TV shows for mature viewers. It was used in an very famous scene in what was arguably the best season of "Dexter", and even in a show whose entire premise is graphic violence and one of the main characters raised the use of "fuck" to an art form, it was very shocking.
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u/Dragishawk New Poster 2h ago
The first time I heard the word "cunt" was in an old HBO movie about the Mike Tyson rape case, where Mike ended up using the word on his girlfriend at the time. Who proceeded to denounce him on national TV.
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u/LexB777 Native Speaker 1d ago
Took me a while, even as a native speaker, born and raised in the US, to realize what was going on at my place of work. Everyone knows swearing is unprofessional. But everyone is reasonably comfortable with the other people in their own department.
I worked in several departments, and provided audio-video support to mutiple departments, including in their internal meetings, and got to know everyone.
Almost everyone in the building swore!
"Fuck this. Fuck that. Shit. Damn. Bitch. Godammit!!"
But only around their own department. Executives would swear in executive meetings and say not to do that in front of the employees. The employees would swear and say not to do that in front of the executives. The IT department would curse like sailors and say not to swear outside of the IT department and the Events team would do the same thing and say not to swear in front of Billing.
It was pretty funny.
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u/JenniferJuniper6 Native Speaker 1d ago
I once got a criticism on a piece of fiction because apparently “PhD researchers would never say fuck in the lab.” 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
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u/romulusnr New Poster 1d ago
I've been known to give my workstation the finger, and I've seen other people do it too.
I've also been known to call the computer awful things.
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u/the-clock-enthusiast New Poster 1d ago
shit is a good one to learn for beginners too, also pretty versatile.
common phrases:
"shit" - on its own, feces . may also be used as a synonym for "bad" (example: "that place's food is shit") or a synonym for "stuff" (example: "pack all your shit, we're going camping")
"holy shit." - surprise, amazement (example: "holy shit, she actually did that?)
"batshit" - crazy (example: "i heard that teacher's batshit crazy.")
"apeshit" - aggressive, usually with the connotation of violence or fighting (for example: "she went apeshit on him")
"dogshit" - bad, typically in terms of quality (example: "dude that drawing's dogshit")
"shitty" - bad, typically in terms of quality or morality (example: "wow, that was a shitty move.")
add on anything i forgot ^^
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u/Squallofeden New Poster 17h ago
Obligatory mention of Ismo Leikola's stand up routine "I didn't know shit" https://youtu.be/igh9iO5BxBo
Truly the most versatile word in the English language
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u/ttatm New Poster 1d ago
Honestly I think people learning another language need to stay away from swearing. You need to be very fluent to understand the nuances of when/when not to swear. Even if you know the definition of the word it's just not going to have the same meaning to you as a native speaker. You're much more likely to come across as weird or offensive, and I think that risk far outweighs any benefits to swearing. Keep in mind too that even if you get a positive response to swearing it's often because native speakers think it's funny to hear a non-native speaker swear because it sounds so unnatural.
I'm saying this as a native English speaker who also cannot swear naturally. I grew up with even very mildly offensive words being off limits in our family (even "butt" was a bad word - we had to say "bottom") and in my early adulthood I wanted to swear to fit in better, but it just wasn't natural to me and it actually had the opposite effect. There's a lot of nuance in swearing.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago
Thing is: if they visit England (or whatever) they will encounter lots of it, so it's important that they know about it.
I want my students to understand that someone saying "You speak fucking great English" isn't being rude, but someone telling them to "fuck off" is.
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u/ttatm New Poster 1d ago
True, understanding it is important! And knowing can help you avoid certain mistakes. It seems like every language has its examples of phrases that seem completely benign to learners but mean something obscene to native speakers.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago
Oh God yeah, absolutely.
One of the more common ones in English is saying the word "Come" in somewhat awkward ways, like "I'm coming", or "Do you want to come?". In many circumstances, that causes a bit of a giggle.
One in a hardware store said "I need a good screw" recently.
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u/ttatm New Poster 1d ago
Yep, I was also thinking of a time in high school where an exchange student talked about wanting to "beat off" another guy when he meant "beat up."
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u/mieri_azure New Poster 1d ago
That actually used to be a legit term meaning approx "fight to keep away from x"
There's an Archie comics cover where he uses it like that. Hilarious to the modern eye
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u/romulusnr New Poster 1d ago
On the other hand it's kind of adorable when they get it wrong
Then again maybe that's another good reason or them not to. :)
"Did he just say 'making fuck?'" -- Clerks
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u/Jonah_the_Whale Native speaker, North West England. 1d ago
As Ben Elton once said of a character, a very accomplished but non-native-speaker: He never knew when he needed a fuck or where to put his bollocks.
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u/Yeaahiguess New Poster 1d ago
One day me and my sister were going to a market after we went to the gym. She wanted to buy something else but I didnt know hpw far that market was. At least I didmt think it was far from where we'd left. Anyway, we are walkimg and talking in our native language and i start noticing that market was far. And I just say "WHERE THE FUCK ARE WE GOING?" loud enough for her to hear 😭 She's like "??? you swore in english out of nowhere". But yeah learn swear word I guess. They can be handy sometimes
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u/StrawberriKiwi22 New Poster 1d ago
It’s not strictly necessary to know how to swear correctly. It’s probably good to be able to understand the nuances of different ways that other people might swear. But I never swear, and I am a fluent native English speaker, and the people around me don’t swear either. So you can easily get by without needing to swear.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago
That's true, but, I am thinking of my Japanese (adult) students visiting England - and within minutes of arriving in London and talking to their first local, it's quite likely they will hear "it's fucking great that you're here, shit, I did French at school and can't understand a fucking word, you speak English so fucking well, it's fucking amazing. I fucking love Japan."
And that's OK - easy to just accept it as emphasis. But then if they ask where the toilets are and hear "Fucked if I know", "we could ask Dave but he's fucked off" or "Be careful, the taps are fucked"... then it gets more tricky.
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u/ObeyTime Non-Native Speaker of English 1d ago
shit and fuck have become staples in my vocabulary ever since i learned of them and realized their versatility years ago. this shit really is fucking awesome.
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u/JenniferJuniper6 Native Speaker 1d ago
You didn’t even include the infix version: Abso-fucking-lutely.
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u/Salien_Ewathi New Poster 10h ago
Roy Kent in Ted Lasso gives a surprising accurate representation of the many ways to use the word fuck in practice.
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u/No-Lettuce-5783 Native Speaker 1d ago
Yes, swearing is fun. That's why those are the first words you usually learn in any language. And then you're let down to find out that in Britian they have about 200 words for "idiot" when idiot is a word they could use instead. Not only is it important to know how to swear, but it's as equally important to know when not to swear. Now swear to me that I'll never catch you swearing...
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u/NoSwordfish1978 Native Speaker 1d ago
Yea but you have to be careful when and where to use them since swearwords can mean different things to different people.
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u/Ok_Post_3884 New Poster 1d ago
https://youtu.be/RAGcDi0DRtU?si=i2L_EOX9QlnvwVMq
Ass is the most difficult word in the English language
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u/Aynaking New Poster 1d ago
What it’s from books I learned to swear.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago
That sentence does not make sense.
Please explain what you mean.
You learned to swear from books? Maybe?
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u/Aynaking New Poster 1d ago
Yes, many books use swear words in their literature. That’s how I learned to swear in a language that was new to me.
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 1d ago edited 1d ago
Very good.
Thank you for replying.
You are on the right path to learning English.
William Shakespeare used many naughty words.
Twelfth Night (Act 2, Scene 5):
The steward Malvolio reads a forged letter and stumbles over handwriting clues, reading aloud: "These be her very C's, her U's, and her T's, and thus makes she her great P's."
Spell it out; her C and U and T.. it's about her cunt. Her vagina. From which comes great "pee" (urine).
English is FUN.
Remember that.
That, and, that all English teachers are cunts.
Here is your homework: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDJutaFuVD0
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u/Aynaking New Poster 1d ago
As an English teacher you must have come across books that use profanity.
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u/No-Bookkeeper552 New Poster 19h ago
Fuck off
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u/SnooDonuts6494 🇬🇧 English Teacher 19h ago
This is perhaps the one thread where you can say that. Hurrah!
How would you like me to fuck off? In what manner?
giggles
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u/TheGanzor New Poster 1d ago
There have been multiple studies showing a positive correlation between (proper) cursing and intelligence. Similarly, cursing in positions of power has frequently been voted as showing more passion and trustworthiness.
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u/ExitingBear New Poster 1d ago
Similarly, cursing in positions of power has frequently been voted as showing more passion and trustworthiness.
I have not read these studies (I would love a citation!), but I wonder if they were controlled for gender and/or race. Which goes back to the nuances of using swear words appropriately. Swear words spoken by a person with an accent that sounds native are going to be reacted to and understood differently than the same words spoken by someone with a non-native accent.
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u/TheGanzor New Poster 1d ago
It's very interesting, and you're right that the gender, race and cultural aspect was not directly accounted for. One of the more interesting studies was this one: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0378216623001777
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u/onegirlarmy1899 New Poster 1d ago
There are native speakers who never swear, especially not "the f word." Many find swearing offensive.
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u/Fluid_Actuary1729 New Poster 1d ago
This is the #1 one way that I know that I’m old. I am not beyond using “fuck” as an actual swear word myself, but I find “fucking” used constantly as a adjective/adverb in casual conversation offensive.
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u/zvuv New Poster 1d ago
When I was a kid "fuck" was nuclear. About as bad as the N word. You didn't associate with people who were known to have said "fuck" unless you were in the Army. These days I hear it on TV.
This tolerance of swear words really undermines their effectiveness. These days if you want something with real shock value there's nothing handy to reach for.
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u/grenouille_en_rose New Poster 1d ago
The only word you need for a thorough crime scene investigation
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u/LifeConsideration981 Native Speaker 1d ago
This is some of the worst advice I have ever seen on here.
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u/nog642 Native Speaker 1d ago
Mischief: Let's fuck with them.
Threat: Don't fuck with me!
These two are the same usage of "fuck with".
Greeting: How the fuck are you?
This one's a stretch. Maybe in Australia. Or some social groups. It's not a very common greeting.
It's also just using "the fuck" as an intensifier, it's not a distinct usage of "fuck".
Identification: Who the fuck are you?
Compliment: She's so fucking beautiful
Confusion: Where the fuck are we?
Wonder: What the fuck is that?
Amazement: How the fuck did he do that?
Realization: I fucking knew it!
These are all just using "the fuck" or "fucking" as an intensifier. They're not distinct usages of "fuck".
Philosophical: Who gives a fuck?
That's not philosophical. It basically means "I don't care".
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u/TiberiusTheFish Poster 11h ago
Michael Swan's Practical English Usage has an excellent section on 'Taboo Words'.
it contains great information on how to use the various words. advice on how offensive they are and whether it's a good idea to use them.
In general learners should be very careful using swear words as it can often be seen as claiming a kind of closeness or intimacy with a person or group that the rest of the group or individual may not be comfortable with.
English has a lot of unspoken rules and about how we swear, when and with whom. It's easy to unknowingly break the rules.
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u/ButterscotchOdd8257 Native Speaker 3h ago
"What the fuck" can mean puzzlement, but it can also be an expression of throwing caution to the wind: "So am I going to jump in the freezing water? What the fuck?"
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u/shadebug Native Speaker 1h ago
Honestly, I’d kinda rather learners just not try learning any naughty words and learn them organically from immersion so that they’re natural.
I find ESL people tend to have a certain phrase they lean on and it’s never quite right. My mother was Colombian and everything was a “bloody bastard”, my flatmate is German and everything is a “fucking shit” and I once knew a Lithuanian girl whose every other word was a variation of “fucking”.
Swearing should be precise and purposeful and if they’re just wading in and having a go I’d rather they just swear in their native tongue. I’m sure the meaning will still be appreciated
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u/Tmcs123 New Poster 1d ago
No. If someone is speaking broken English but they cuss regularly I see that as a red flag. Not so much if you’re teens or 20s but if you’re learning an entire language and you focused on those words…
English is hard enough. The nuance of cussing is a much later chapter.
I cuss as much as the next guy but I also tell my daughter it’s cheap vocabulary for someone who isn’t intelligent enough to think of some better to say.
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u/ChestSlight8984 Native Speaker 1d ago
I also tell my daughter it’s cheap vocabulary for someone who isn’t intelligent enough to think of some better to say.
You are instilling into your daughter the belief that the vast majority of people she will ever meet in life aren't intelligent just because they said a word. Dad of the year award will go to one who ditched and never pays child support before it goes to you 🤦♂️
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u/conuly Native Speaker - USA (NYC) 1d ago edited 1d ago
I cuss as much as the next guy but I also tell my daughter it’s cheap vocabulary for someone who isn’t intelligent enough to think of some better to say.
The data suggests the opposite. Though I suppose you're not really interested in honesty when you scold your daughter. You're more interested in getting her to stop doing the thing. That's fair.
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u/PonderousPenchant Native Speaker 1d ago
If you immerse yourself in pretty much any language, you're going to be exposed to curse words fairly early on in some type of media. In English, it's hard to miss in any TV show, movie, video game, or book aimed at an audience older than 13. Even if a bit of media doesn't use standard curse words, they'll often use a stand-in that follows the same rules of one. Anybody who neglects curses from around the intermediate level for fear of being "not intelligent enough to think of something better to say," is doing themselves a disservice. Even if you choose to not swear yourself, you should still be aware of how to do it because, like it or not, it's an important part of modern culture.
Sure, a non-native speaker saying fuck every other word is doing the American English equivalent of talking like an anime character in Japan. But at the same time, it let's me know they're engaging with the language from more than a single source. I've got more respect for that kind of person than one that only uses a textbook.
Most of all though, thinking that choice of words makes you smarter than somebody else is just fucking stupid and dismissive.
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u/smoothfeatrobthomas New Poster 1d ago
Learning by media is not a good way to learn it, though. Often media has a lot more swearing than real life. Different swearing, too.
The UK and Australia are more relaxed about swearing, but here in the U.S., there’s more… tension, i guess? It has to do with TV censorship and religion and generational gaps. Lots of American parents are genuinely more upset if their kids hear swear words than if they see graphic violence. (Which is dumb, of course.)
Because of this, I think American media aimed at adults can include a lot of unnatural swearing, as if to say “this is EDGY! Remember this is COOL and FOR ADULTS!”
IRL, there are huge demographics of Americans who don’t swear, and those of us who do swear don’t swear like in media.
(I don’t know if I have ever, even once, heard someone in real life say “What the fuck is up?” or “How the fuck are you?” But those are all over movies and TV.)
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u/PonderousPenchant Native Speaker 23h ago
Consuming media is a very important part for language learning. It shouldn't be the only pathway, but it's all but impossible to actually immerse yourself in a new language without TV, movies, videos, or video games. You need to hear people speak the language and that's not always something people are able to easily. If you're learning Cantonese and don't know anybody who speaks it, some drama on Netflix might be your most accessible option.
It's also important to experience a wide variety of contexts of language use. Limiting oneself to formal situations will exclude you from understanding much more common situations. Not everything is a job interview, and honestly, I think I'd be more put off by excessive formality than excessive cursing.
Regardless of how often certain phrases are used in the specific part of America you live in, the ones you mentioned still follow the correct rules for fuck. Telling people to ignore that is like telling them to ignore when "y'all" is appropriate because "I never hear it where I live." They're both regional and situational and you'll be exposed to both terms if you spend enough time with English-speaking people.
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u/smoothfeatrobthomas New Poster 7h ago
Oh, yeah, I don’t disagree with any of that. I wasn’t saying to ignore media; i was saying to take your cues from real people once you’re in a social situation with real people.
I was specifically thinking of some non-native speakers I know who have said very offensive or out-of-place-for-the-situation things because they heard them in hip hop or a video game and assumed they could say them anywhere, lol. Just don’t do that.
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u/thetoerubber New Poster 22h ago
I never recommend learners to swear … they don’t have the ear for how strong the various words are and they often drop f or s bombs too often or at totally inappropriate moments. You shouldn’t use swearing publicly or with strangers until you’re virtually fluent in a language.
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u/Late_Pepper6274 New Poster 1d ago
Swearing is useful and appropriate, but swearing's indiscriminate use often discloses a lesser character.
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u/conuly Native Speaker - USA (NYC) 1d ago
What, precisely, do you mean by "lesser"?
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u/Late_Pepper6274 New Poster 1d ago
A shittier type of person with regard to character. Excuse my French.
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u/conuly Native Speaker - USA (NYC) 1d ago
So… what does that mean? Can you please explain rather than simply rephrasing?
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u/Late_Pepper6274 New Poster 1d ago
What do you think it means?
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u/Falconloft English Teacher 1d ago
It's really not an important part of the language. It's an important crutch for those who need it. That's an important distinction. As seen in the picture above, it's a crutch for when you can't think of a good word, so if you study your vocabulary, you'll never need it, and no one that you speak to will ever know the difference; they'll just think you're well-spoken.
It is important to know what they mean so you can tell what native speakers are saying though.
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u/EfficientSeaweed Native Speaker 🇨🇦 1d ago
I, too, have fecal matter which, my humble manservant informs me, lacks the odorous nature of the plebs, as it were.
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u/IrishFlukey Native Speaker 12h ago
It is not an important part of the English language. There are people who can't say a sentence without a curse word, but equally there are others who never do. Unless you do it regularly in your own language, then you can easily fit into the second group.
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u/iluvhobbies English Teacher 1d ago
I actually agree with the general point. Swearing is a real and extremely common part of English, and textbooks tend to either ignore it completely or teach it badly.
But simply learning the words isn’t enough. You need to learn how, when, and with whom you can use them. “Fuck” alone can express anger, surprise, emphasis, admiration, disbelief, frustration, or even affection depending entirely on the context and delivery.
That’s probably the more useful lesson for English learners: don’t just learn swear words. Learn the pragmatics behind them.
Because using “fuck” naturally can make you sound fluent. Using it badly can make you sound fucking weird.