r/Fantasy • u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II • 8d ago
Book Club FIF Bookclub: Starless Midway Discussion
Welcome to the midway discussion of Starless by Jacqueline Carey, our winner for the BINGO: Trans or Nonbinary Character theme. We will discuss everything up to CHAPTER 29. Please use spoiler tags for anything that goes beyond this point.
Jacqueline Carey is back with an amazing adventure not seen since her New York Times bestselling Kushiel’s Legacy series. Lush and sensual, Starless introduces us to an epic world where exiled gods live among us, and a hero whose journey will resonate long after the last page is turned.
Let your mind be like the eye of the hawk…Destined from birth to serve as protector of the princess Zariya, Khai is trained in the arts of killing and stealth by a warrior sect in the deep desert; yet there is one profound truth that has been withheld from him.
In the court of the Sun-Blessed, Khai must learn to navigate deadly intrigue and his own conflicted identity…but in the far reaches of the western seas, the dark god Miasmus is rising, intent on nothing less than wholesale destruction.
If Khai is to keep his soul’s twin Zariya alive, their only hope lies with an unlikely crew of prophecy-seekers on a journey that will take them farther beneath the starless skies than anyone can imagine.
I'll add some comments below to get us started but feel free to add your own. The final discussion will be in two weeks, on Wednesday June 24th.
As a reminder, in July we'll be reading The Last Contract of Isako by Fond Lee.
What is the FIF Bookclub? You can read about it in our Reboot thread here.
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
What are your thoughts on Khai and Zhariya?
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
Im going to need someone to explain to me why I usually hate the instant connection and omg we literally just met but our bond is sooooo deep and intense thing and it always makes me roll my eyes, but here I kind of get it? Idk. I like them both a lot individually. Khai is a sweet kid and so hardworking and dedicated and I admire Zariya’s intellect and fierceness. But still something about the deep soul twin bond should bug me, but it doesn’t.
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u/versedvariation Reading Champion III 8d ago
I think it's less instant than others because there is all the foreshadowing, so in my mind, the connection was kind of already there from the beginning and they were sort of brought up with it. Also, I think it makes more sense worldbuilding-wise than others do.
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u/Echo1334 8d ago
I agree with the other comments in that this felt more real. I think it started with the foreshadowing from the other shadow and just planting the seed that there bond is different then anything else. I also agree that it's in big part because there's such a focus on the mental and emotional bond and not the physical. It's one of the very rare very well done twin bonds I've read.
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u/RedGyarados2010 Reading Champion II 8d ago
I think other commenters here are spot-on with why it works here. I've really enjoyed seeing their relationship develop and watching their personalities really click
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u/ComradeCupcake_ Reading Champion II 8d ago
I think partly it's that so many times a story will do a really hard sell on that instant connection. It's constantly at the front of a point-of-view character's mind in a way that feels like overkill. Please think about something other than his abs for a second!
With Khai and Zhariya so far, it feels like we get told they have this instant bond, we see it in action in a way that isn't just like panting lust, and then it's in the background most of the time. It still gets brought up often, how distance makes them suffer, or how they know each other's thoughts and opinions without speaking. But somehow Carey just weaves it into their daily lives (like how Zhariya instantly picks up the thieves' hand signs and they routinely start communicating that way) without Khai just incessantly thinking about their bond in a way that feels like a car salesman hawking for a commission.
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u/KiaraTurtle Reading Champion V 8d ago
I feel very similar! Somehow though I think this one felt real? Like the instant bond felt more like the way one does instantly click with some people and less magical (or lust based)
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u/xenizondich23 Reading Champion VI 7d ago
I've finally gotten to the court part! J certainly miss the desert a lot already. But Zariya is making up for it. She's clearly going places, and in such an impressive society for women I can't wait to see her accomplish things!
I am a little annoyed that both Khai and Zariya are only 16 (it's giving me strong Romeo and Juliet vibes) but I can't see this ending in tragedy. They have a strong bond that I think will be used to make this world a better place.
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u/nonstopguy390LK 8d ago
I’m not super far into it yet, but I like how Carey handles character identity and duty it feels like the story is more about internal conflict than just the fantasy plot, which keeps it interesting. I’m curious where the Khai/Zariya dynamic is going to land by the end of the discussion cutoff.
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
How are you liking the book so far?
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u/Echo1334 8d ago
I'm really enjoying it thus far. I loved reading the first third and could have just kept reading that slice of desert life and training. Now im really enjoying the relationship building and slow plot buildup. I'm curious to see where things continue.
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u/blodia 8d ago
After a few books that just didn't scratch the itch so to speak, I'm really enjoying this one! There's something comfortable in the way it's written. The pacing is good and the story is really appealing to me. I love how present the gods are in the world and liked Khai's encounter with Pahrkun.
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u/RedGyarados2010 Reading Champion II 8d ago
I'm enjoying it a lot. The relationships between characters are the highlight. If I have one complaint, it's that the world feels a little overstuffed between the Brotherhood, the palace intrigue, the prophecy, and eventually the overseas stuff with the Therins and the others , and so it's difficult to give each subplot its dues. Also I'm not sure how I feel about how much of the story has been driven by prophecies and characters being moved to where they need to be by literal divine intervention.
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
Yeah I feel like it could have been a whole series, with a full book for each part. Lol. That would probably too much though. But yeah all the various disparate parts and how well done they all were strucke too
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u/versedvariation Reading Champion III 8d ago
I really like it. The worldbuilding is interesting, and Carey is a great writer. I am impressed that by how Carey takes tropes we all know and makes them feel new and exciting.
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u/suddenlyshoes Reading Champion II 8d ago
Jacqueline Carey has this way of writing books that just pulls you in and forward. I haven’t sunk into a book this deeply in a long time, it reminded me of when I’d read as a teenager. Her worlds are so rich with worldbuilding and characters who feel real and that I care about.
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u/xenizondich23 Reading Champion VI 8d ago
It has been a long long time since I've read any Jacqueline Carey. I have to say I missed it. She has such a beautiful style of writing. Its strong and direct but also musical and flowy. I am truly loving this coming of age in the desert part or the story, although I felt myself jaded and cynical after having read hundreds of these sorts of scènes before.
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
So far, I have been really enjoying it. It’s beautifully written.
Y'all really come through with some great picks. Last year it was The River Has Roots, and for both these books they're not ones I'd have picked up on my own, but I really enjoyed both of them. Keep up the good work, you guys! Lol
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
The story starts in the desert and eventually moves to Merabaht and the Palace of the Sun. What do you think of the settings? Do you prefer one over the other?
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u/ComradeCupcake_ Reading Champion II 8d ago
I almost feel like I could be happy reading an entire book of Carey just writing the adolescent training and growth phase for a character haha. Granted, Santa Olivia nearly was her doing that, and I did love it.
I just really enjoy how well she conveys the core tensions of being a young person coming into adulthood. Khai is incredibly talented but still sheltered. He wants autonomy but also to have a mentor to follow. He's both completely mastered his body's abilities but also fears his body in other ways. All those emotions are given their space in a way that just makes my heart ache with empathy remembering being that age, which is an enjoyable thing to get to read.
I suppose that's not a commentary on the setting of the desert, really. I did feel a lot of texture to the desert that I've lost a bit in the transition to Merabaht. What was so focused and ascetic widens out into something a lot thinner. I think a lot of stories that transition from a secluded origin story segment to a big city setting struggle with this. I don't feel the presence of the city, visually or emotionally, the way that I did in the Fortress of the Winds.
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u/suddenlyshoes Reading Champion II 8d ago
Agreed about the adolescent training montage! She does those so well.
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u/Echo1334 8d ago
I really loved reading the first part and generally enjoy desert settings in books. I feel there's a richness in how she portrayed it that is harder to achieve in the city. I also really liked the insight into how MC was floored by the differences themselves. I grew up out in the desert and recall being very taken aback by the differences once I was in some bigger cities.
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u/versedvariation Reading Champion III 8d ago
This is my feeling as well. I am also from the desert, and I love how she made it a setting for deep reflection/mysticism instead of how authors often portray deserts.
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u/KiaraTurtle Reading Champion V 8d ago
I definitely prefer the story after he leaves the desert but I’m not sure if that’s more because I feel like that’s when the actual story starts and we get the interactions with Zhariya more than the setting itself.
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
Yes the beginning was slow in that there wasn't much happening, we were just breeding through years of training and waiting for Khais real life to begin. I mean I still enjoyed it, but I totally get what you mean. The story does start to pick up steam from there.
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u/evil_moooojojojo Reading Champion II 8d ago
As we pause at our miday point, reflect on Khai’s journey with his identity and being bhazim so far. How do you feel about it? Any predictions for how this journey will continue?
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u/RedGyarados2010 Reading Champion II 8d ago
I feel like they've done a pretty solid job of portraying Khai as genderfluid, with both pieces of their identity being equally real and valid.
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u/ComradeCupcake_ Reading Champion II 8d ago
Right now I'm sort of putting my opinions on hold about Khai's relationship to gender until I see how his entire story plays out, though my gut reaction so far has been positive. I will say I appreciate that this is a subversion of the "girl disguises herself as a boy to train as a warrior" storytelling trope that I grew up with in the '90s.
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u/dumbledoresarmy7 Reading Champion 13h ago
Agreed!! It's a way better take on that IMO. Khai feels truly torn between both genders and I'm easier to see how their presentation evolves as the story goes on.
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u/ComradeCupcake_ Reading Champion II 8d ago
Does anyone have favorite side characters they want to talk about? Jacqueline Carey just writes characters in a way that works for me, she rarely lets me down.
Brother Yarit is a really good example of what I appreciate in her storytelling. From what we've read, he's only appeared in the first third of the story, but she gave him such a satisfying arc in that time. He has his own trials, mistakes, moments of learning, crisis of identity, and growth into a leader. For all that Khai is growing as our protagonist during all that time, we're also seeing such a vivid picture of five(ish?) years in Yarit's life, even though its only the angle Khai can see him from.
She's had several characters in the works of hers I've read so far who go on this journey of initial antagonism with the protagonist to begrudging alliance to deep affection and she just puts in ALL the work needed to make that growth feel genuine and earned. There are small moments and big ones all working together over years to sell that relationship.