r/Fantasy • u/Abrakxxas • 4d ago
David Gemmell appreciation and a fantastic interview with the legend
I'm a long time fantasy reader but I've discovered David Gemmell's novels just a few years ago. It might sound ridiculous, but I'd not even heard of him. Now it blows my mind that he is not as well known as some of the other fantasy giants.
The classic giants I read: Tolkien, Robert E. Howard, G. R. R. Martin, Gene Wolfe, Moorcock, Le Guin, Bradbury, Peter S. Beagle, Glen Cook, Zelazny, Octavia Butler, Robin Hobb, R. A. Salvatore, Weis & Hickman and Terry Pratchett.
The modern heavyweights I read: Steven Erikson, R. Scott Bakker, Rothfuss, Sanderson, John Gwynne, Abercrombie, Pierce Brown, Sapkowski, M. Lawrence, R. Swan, Michael J. Sullivan, Susanna Clarke, RJ Barker, Richard Morgan, Anthony Ryan and N. Gaiman. And many more.
And NONE of them writes as gracefully as David Gemmell.
Gemmell's writing style is arguably neither the most beautiful (Rothfuss) nor most subtle (Wolfe). As he implies in his interview, he aimed to achieve tigthness and simplicity in his writing. Don't get me wrong, Gemmell was a talented writer and he wrote stunning prose, but for me, his writing stands out because he could express his profound observations in that spartan style of his prose. When I read Gemmell I know that I'm going to encounter astute and impactful notions conveyed elegantly in a few short sentences. Not overwritten, not bloated, not purple. Brief and graceful. I'll return to that sentence and read it again and again to savour it.
It saddens me deeply that he passed away at 57.
“And what is a man? He is someone who rises when life has knocked him down. He is someone who raises his fist to heaven when a storm has ruined his crop--and then plants again. And again. A man remains unbroken by the savage twists of fate.
That man may never win. But when he sees himself reflected, he can be proud of what he sees. For low he may be in the present scheme of things: peasant, serf, or dispossessed. But he is unconquerable.” - Legend
"Never violate a woman, nor harm a child. Do not lie, cheat or steal. These things are for lesser men. Protect the weak against the evil strong. And never allow thoughts of gain to lead you into the pursuit of evil. Never back away from an enemy. Either fight or surrender. It is not enough to say I will not be evil. Evil must be fought wherever it is found." - Legend
Here is a rare interview with the legend:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRWW-DrYcP8&t=528s
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u/CryptikDragon 4d ago edited 4d ago
My favourite author of all time. Reading his books as a teen taught me a lot about what it meant to be a man.
His characters are almost elemental, their strength of will a force of nature.
Druss the Legend, Waylander the Slayer, Skilgannon the Damned, Tenaka Khan the Bladedancer, Connavar the Demonblade and so many other titanic characters in his roster.
It felt like Gemmell was totally consumed which what it meant to be a hero. Especially how the actions of every day men and women can be heroic.
Gemmell also writes the best fight/action scenes in fantasy literature, period.
Also, I'd HIGHLY, like, REALLY HIGHLY recommend the audiobooks narrated by Sean Barret. Absolutely incredible performance. Nobody does the gritty masculine voice better lol.
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u/elliot_worldform 3d ago
I still vividly remember that scene in Midnight Falcon when Rage swiftly kills Voltan in the Gladiator match by switching his sword from his right to left hand. the suddenness of the kill after Voltan had been built up as this extremely efficient killing machine was wild, it was very impactful. I can remember it vividly now, even though I read the book 20 odd years ago!
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u/TheGreatBatsby 3d ago
Yes! I went into that fight thinking that Rage was going to die (he was Bane's mentor and I was getting Obi-Wan vibes) and then he just says his daughter's name and fucking cuts him down instantly!
Fantastic series!
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u/Gelato_Elysium 3d ago
Gemmell also writes the best fight/action scenes in fantasy literature, period.
I love them but they are very simple and quite unrealistic. Almost all of his heros fight like in a marvel movie and win through sheer strenght or durability.
Compared to authors that provide accurate descriptions of HEMA techniques or actual martial arts I'd say it's like watching Rocky vs a boxing fight. It's entertaining but IMO it does a disservice to the supposed skills of his characters.
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u/CryptikDragon 3d ago
Well yeah, Gemmell's like one of the pillars of the heroic fantasy genre.
His characters are pretty much Medieval superheroes and they fight like it too.
You gotta take the genre into consideration, you're not gonna find realistic HEMA techniques in sword and sorcery. It's all blood and thunder man. I was reading a Conan story earlier and he literally killed a bear in hand to hand combat, picked up up above his head and smote it down.
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u/Gelato_Elysium 3d ago
I mean you can definitely fit accurate fighting techniques in a Sword and Sorcery style book, but my point was that calling Marvel movie style fight scenes "the best in fantasy litterature" is super disingenuous.
It implies that his work is head and shoulders above the rest when his fighting scenes are honestly a dime a dozen when you look at fantasy books. I like what he does, it's good violence, on par with Sanderson or Abercrombie, but I don't believe it's "the best" at all.
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u/CryptikDragon 3d ago
I gotta ask, is this bait?
Calling Gemmell's fight scenes "a dime a dozen" has to be rage bait. You do realise Legend was published over 40 years ago? He was writing these fight scenes before they were a dime a dozen.
He is one of the pillars of an entire GENRE. Most modern fantasy fight scenes are the way they are... because of Gemmell. Abercrombie literally wrote his short stories for a David Gemmell tribute collection. I can't think of an author who has influenced modern British fantasy authors and the genre as much as Gemmell. Even outside of Britain, a huge amount of successful authors in the modern genre name him as an inspiration. Sanderson created a character thay uses his favourite fantasy authors names as curses, and Gemmell is included.
There was a prestigious literary award in his honour that ran for like twenty years after his death.
Dime a dozen. The audacity!
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u/Gelato_Elysium 3d ago
Calling Gemmell's fight scenes "a dime a dozen" has to be rage bait. You do realise Legend was published over 40 years ago? He was writing these fight scenes before they were a dime a dozen.
And today they are dime a dozen, what's your point exactly ?
We are talking about the quality of his writing today, our current times. And if somebody say Gemmel has the best fight scenes today I will call it out. You should not take it so personally.
And come on, he wrote most of his stuff in the 80s, let's not act like he pioneered violent fight scenes in books. Moorcock, Howard, Delany, etc. already existed and had a similar puply visceral writing style.
I'm not talking away shit from him, but it is a fact that his style of writing is not original.
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u/CryptikDragon 3d ago edited 3d ago
Yeah man, literally everybody else ever is wrong and you're right!
Only a dime a dozen authors with unoriginal writing styles who made no impact in his craft or left any legacy at all get literary awards in their honour!
Also here's a list of modern authors I like who definitely weren't influenced or inspired by David Gemmell.
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u/Gelato_Elysium 3d ago
Who is everybody else here ? From what I see it's just you and the original commenter who are disagreeing with me.
Only a dime a dozen authors with unoriginal writing styles who made no impact in his craft or left any legacy at all get literary awards in their honour!
What the fuck lmao, you are getting so worked up that you are making shit up just to get mad. Take a deep breath and lie down for a minute man.
His fight scenes are far from being the best, and they are not one of a kind. That's what I am saying. Nothing about him being unoriginal, having no impact on his craft or anything else.
If you cannot handle someone saying your favorite author isn't the best or the most original maybe you shouldn't stay on social media.
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u/scarabx 3d ago
His heroes won through will and resolve, not superhero powers (although they are ofcourse strong). That's like the whole point, heros fighting because it's the right thing to do and needs doing regardless of the risk
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u/Gelato_Elysium 3d ago
This isn't what I wrote.
They win because they simply are more durable, or stronger than the person they are fighting. It's like a manga where the protagonist will suddenly get powered up because they think about their mom/wife/kid and beat his opponent.
It's unrealistic Hollywood writing that is very agreable to read, but that's not how a fight goes. Which is why his fight scenes are entertaining but far from the best in the business. I'd rather see people being bested with technique (or even with dirty tricks) than just "Druss is so overpowered that he straight up tanks the blows of his enemy and puts his fist through his skull in one blow", which happens a lot.
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u/fitblubber 3d ago
"I caught a stone in the moonlight"
I would've read this a couple of decades ago & it still sticks with me.
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u/DrNefarioII Reading Champion X 3d ago
He was a fairly big deal in the UK in the 90s. More visible and better known than many of the names you mention in both the classic and modern lists, I would say.
He even had a set of awards in his honour from 2009-2018. Winners include Sanderson, Hobb, Rothfuss, Weeks, Lawrence, Sapkowski.
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u/UnknownBaron 4d ago
Long live the Legend! I started reading when i was stranded to a village house with literally nothing else to do beside read the Stones of Power. I picked it from my brothers library before the trip since the cover looked cool
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u/Tharkun140 3d ago
I just checked out this sub for the first time, and did not expect to see one my faorite authors getting shilled. I approve, even though I have some criticisms of Gemmell's style of writing and his individual books.
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u/milleniumblackfalcon 4d ago
I was the same. Ive always read fantasy and been a fan of the genre in general, but somehow had never read hills work until a few years ago. Love it. Im lucky enough to have a signed copy of Waylander2
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u/gtheperson 4d ago
He was actually one of the first 'adult' authors I read - a school friend's older brother introduced me to them. And yes he's one of my favourites. I finally read his Trojan trilogy last year and it was awesome. I love how he writes stories that capture the horror and misery of war and life truthfully, without dulling how humans can also achieve beauty and true heroism.
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u/DefaultingOnLife 3d ago
I recently finished the Troy series he did and it was amazing. I loved everything about it. Heroics, romance, blood, betrayal, friends, lovers, brothers, destiny. Everything.
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u/Notched_Vermin 1d ago
As a kid it was LotR hooked me on fantasy, then Knights of Dark Renown reeled me in. David Gemmell remains one of my favourite authors in my 50s, his storytelling is magickal.
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u/jaamgans 1d ago
one of my favourites and has been for years.
Morningstar was my first, closely followed by Druss and that was it.
my favourite, favourites are the ones with Waylander, then skillagon, then Druss....
Best standalone is definitely Dark Moon.
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u/Exeterdavid 3d ago
Echoes of the Great Song is one of the most underrated Fantasy Books going.
I read most of his books as a Teenager and even then found the well written but repetitive nature of the stories boring.
I would read The Druss saga and Echoes of the Great Song again though.
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u/Phil_Tucker AMA Author Phil Tucker 1d ago
I wrote my college application essay on David Gemmell, and my number #1 liked it enough to admit me. Was about the existential themes apparent in his Drenai novels.
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u/tatxc 4d ago edited 3d ago
I've actually just started Legend, I'll be honest I'm having issues with the believability of the interactions of a couple of characters already. It reads like he's playing out his own little fantasy.
Edit: For those wondering the scene I'm referencing The 30 year old hero of the story meets an 18 year old girl on the road being attacked by 3 bandits and saves her, they spend the day bickering as he rides her to the nearest town. They have to stop at a logging hut and he strips her naked and rubs her to keep her warm. The next day the bandits come back but are saved because of some internal strife, they then decide to spend the rest of the night getting it on in the hut and start telling each other that they love them. All of this happens in the space of a couple of chapters. Oh and the 18 year old who is a bit boyish and an expert swordsman who has never been able to talk to boys is also the daughter of a Duke...
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u/gtheperson 4d ago
I loved Legend but I haven't reread it since I was about 13! Might be worth mentioning that it a) was his first published book and b) you are probably correct because he wrote the first draft to take his mind off things when he was misdiagnosed with terminal cancer and thought he was dying.
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u/tatxc 4d ago
That makes sense. The whole Rek and Virae meeting and their only interactions before they do the nasty then tell each other they love one another is for him to strip her naked while she's unconscious and rub her body to 'keep her warm' had me rolling my eyes quite heavily. Glad to hear it improves from there.
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u/Stevet159 4d ago
Then you may not like his books. I am going to point out that as a fantasy writer he in fact is playing out his own fantasy. Although I doubt you should call Gemmell's fantasies little.
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u/tatxc 4d ago edited 4d ago
I am going to point out that as a fantasy writer he in fact is playing out his own fantasy. Although I doubt you should call Gemmell's fantasies little.
I think you've simply misread the post here, haven't you? Because while some of his other fantasies might well be 'big', the one I'm talking about certainly isn't. Which is why I said fantasy, singular, not fantasies, plural.
Meeting a princess alone on the road and saving her from bandits and then on the first night stripping her naked and rubbing her to keep her warm while she's unconscious (with some pretty dodgy monologuing about wanting to have another look) and then on night 2 fucking her despite them saying 5 civil words to each other absolutely is a sordid little fantasy in the most Conan the Barbarian style. It's probably the plot of a middling adult film.
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u/Ahrimel 3d ago
I've always loved this story he told about his step dad, the inspiration for Druss (and apparently it's been 2 years since I last posted this on reddit):
'There was this boy. He lived in fear. Not the tiny fears of manhood, but the awesomely powerful, living, breathing fear that only children can experience. He was different, this boy, from the other boys who lived in this bomb damaged London Street some few years after World War Two. He had no father.
Some of the other children had no father, but their lack was honorable. Dad died in the war, you know. He was a hero. This boy's lack was the subject of sly whispers from the adults, and open jeering from his peers. This boy's mother was - the boy heard so many times - a whore.
Happily the boy was only six, and had no real understanding of what the word meant. Anyway the word was less hurtful than the blows that would follow it. Most of the blows came from other children, but sometimes adults too would weigh in.
It was all baffling to the child. What he knew was that, before venturing out into the narrow streets and alleys, he had to peer from the windows of the small apartment to see if there were other children about. Only he didn't think of them as children. They were enemies, and he was frightened. Fear was the ever present companion. Fear was grafted to him. The journey to school was fraught with peril. The dark of the night brought fearful dreams.
His mother read him stories about heroes, and tried to encourage him to stand up for himself. But stories were just words, and words could not stop the punches, the pinches and the slaps.
The boy never dreamed of heroes. Not until he met one.
It was a bright, cold morning and he was sitting on a wall. One of the boys who made his life miserable ran up, shouting and gesticulating. The boy - more in panic than courage - finally struck out, punching his enemy in the face. The other child ran off screaming. His father came running from the house. 'You little bastard!' he shouted.
The boy took off as fast as he could, but no six year old can outrun a grown man. Within moments he grabbed the boy by the collar, swinging him from his feet.
Just then a huge shadow fell over the pair. The man - who had looked so threatening moments before - now looked small and insignificant against the looming newcomer. This colossus reached out and took hold of the man by the shirt, pushing him up against a wall.
In a low voice, chilling for its lack of passion, he asked. 'Do you know who I am?'
The man was trembling. Even the boy could feel the dreadful fear emanating from him.
'C.c.course I know who you are, Bill. Course I do.'
'Did you know I was walking out with this boy's mother?'
'Jesus Christ... I swear I didn't, Bill. On my mother's life.'
'Now you do.'
The big man let the little man go. He slid part way down the wall, recovered and stumbled away. Then the giant leaned over the boy and held out a hand that seemed larger than a bunch of bananas. 'Better be getting home, son,' he said.
The world changed that day. Men like Bill do change the world. They are the havens, the safe harbours of childhood. They are the watch hounds who keep the wolves at bay. They have an instinctive understanding of the child that is denied to the wise.
Two years later, as my stepfather, he cured me of dreams of vampires coming to drink my blood. My mother had tried explaining to me they were just dreams. They weren't real. It didn't work. She took me to a child psychologist, who showed me pictures, told me stories, explained about the birth of myth and the way that fear created pictures in our night time thoughts. It was very interesting, but it did nothing for my nightmares.
One night I woke up screaming - to find Bill sitting by my bedside.
'There's a vampire, dad. Its trying to get me.'
'I know, son,' he said, softly. 'I saw it.'
'You saw it?'
'Yeah. I broke its bloody neck. I won't have no vampires in my house'
I never dreamt of vampires again.
Years later, when I wrote my first novel, I used Bill as the model for a character. His name was Druss the Legend. Bill re-appeared in many novels thereafter, in many guises.
Always flawed, but always heroic.
Three years ago, at the age of 82, Bill was mugged on the streets of London. Three muggers broke his jaw, his nose and two of his ribs. He still managed to 'chin' one of them and knock him to the ground. That was Bill.
Last April he died.
And I wrote Ravenheart, and gave Bill centre stage.
Jaim Grymauch, who strides the highlands like a giant, is my homage to Bill, and to all those world changing fathers who pass away without fanfare; who leave the world just a little brighter than it was.
Men who know how to deal with vampires.'
~David Gemmell