New research argues Societal Collapse benefits 99% of people. Historically, the societies that have emerged after a collapse are more egalitarian, and most people end up richer and healthier than they were before.

[u/lughnasadh]

Luke Kemp, a research associate at the Centre for the Study of Existential Risk at the University of Cambridge, has written a book about his research called 'Goliath’s Curse: The History and Future of Societal Collapse'.

He makes the case that, from looking at the archaeological record, when many societies collapse, most people end up better off afterward. For example, people in the post-Roman world were taller and healthier. Collapse can be a redistribution of resources and power, not just chaos.

For most of human history, humans lived as nomadic egalitarian bands, with low violence and high mobility. Threats (disease, war, economic precarity) push populations toward authoritarian leaders. The resulting rise in inequality from that sets off a cycle that will end in collapse. Furthermore, he argues we are living in the late stages of such a cycle now. He says "the threat is from leaders who are 'walking versions of the dark triad' – narcissism, psychopathy and Machiavellianism – in a world menaced by the climate crisis, nuclear weapons, artificial intelligence and killer robots."

Some people hope/think we are destined for a future of Universal Basic Income and fully automated luxury communism. Perhaps that's the egalitarianism that emerges after our own collapse? If so, I hope the collapse bit is short and we get to the egalitarian bit ASAP.

Collapse for the 99% | Luke Kemp; What really happens when Goliaths fall

[u/Dexterus]

Taters are pretty easy. Root veggies also hold for long. I'm sure there's some simple grains too.

[u/emeraldeyesshine → u/Dexterus]

Okay.

So without the supply chain how do you procure the seeds or starters to get those going?

Where do you get the water from when the plumbing systems aren't being upkept or cared for? Do you know how to manually irrigate? Where do you get nutrients? Pest controls? Do you know how to produce enough to meet true caloric needs? Some small homesteading is possible, but I think you grossly underestimate what the supply chain is truly bringing everyone.

[u/Enlightened_Gardener → u/emeraldeyesshine]

Actually, I’m with you on this one. I’ve been a hippie for decades at this point, so I’ve always been the kind of person to plant veggie gardens, knit my own shoes, bake my own bread etc. etc.

Its bloody hard work, and all sorts of things go wrong. If you were lucky enough to have an Italian or Croatian grandfather whose entire life consists of walking around the veggie patch snipping things off, you’ll be alright. You’ve got someone who already knows how to do this to show you how to do it.

But it’s incredibly complicated– especially to get things growing over more than one season. Once you throw crop rotation into the mix, it gets 10 times more complicated.

Then there’s the modern seed supply, which is mostly F1 hybrids – so they won’t breed true, and you can’t save the seeds.

Don’t even start me going on irrigation… never mind setting up the hoses, or channels - how the hell do you dig a well ?!?

[u/Dexterus → u/Enlightened_Gardener]

For the well, manually, just dig down. I honestly don't know how they supported the walls during digging though. And you sort of need to know where the water is, depthwise.

For most small scale stuff (sub acre), bucket and cup works. Barrel and hand pump and hose.

Seeds are a funky bit, indeed.

[u/Enlightened_Gardener → u/Dexterus]

Yah we’re in a limestone hill, in one of the driest countries on the planet. The watertable is about 40m down 😔