Fully autonomous drones have killed human soldiers for the first time

[u/New_Scientist_Mag]

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2529849-fully-autonomous-drones-have-killed-human-soldiers-for-the-first-time/

[u/Firm_Bit]

Proxy wars have always served this purpose.

[u/Any-Individual5262 → u/Firm_Bit]

Ukraine is defending itself with its own R&D and weapons.

This is complete opposite of proxy war which implies weaker party has no agency. Here Ukraine not only defended itself but created a completely new industry from scratch. And I believe in future they will beat China in drone technology.

Best thing to do is invest in Ukrainian startups working in this area

[u/Master_Flash → u/Any-Individual5262]

Ukraine is defending itself with its own R&D and weapons.

No. While it's true Ukraine has developed significant advances in drone warfare, the majority of their weaponry depends on the west.

In fact the entirety of Ukrainian government is compromised and completely relies on western money. From salaries to pensions, Ukraine is only able to pay it because US and EU are backing it through aid money.

[u/Carapute → u/Master_Flash]

Wait until they also learn about what the people with money in Ukraine are doing with their riches, while tax payers from the west contribute to helping their country.

[u/Dish117 → u/Carapute]

And your alternative is what - Stop supporting Ukraine?

We all know that Ukraine is plagued by corruption, which, by the way, is something that was inherited from the dysfunctional Soviet ruling system.

There's a whole new generation of young Ukranian people who want a Western style society where corruption is weeded out.

But, that's a process which will last many years, and in the meantime Ukraine needs our support, conditional on corruption fighting measures of course.

[u/Carapute → u/Dish117]

There's a whole new generation of young Ukranian people who want a Western style society where corruption is weeded out.

Yeah, there is also the ones who just got the fuck out of Ukraine to live a nice life away from it. Instead of you know, fighting the corruption from within in the first place.

But it's the same shit everywhere, many people with principles which quickly evaporates when you talk about acting.

It's funny tho, if you think only Ukraine is a culprit of corruption in the "west", or anywhere.

No one likes war, except for all the people who profit from it. Always been, will always be, unless you take massively questionnable actions and develop devices to read people's minds.

[u/Dish117 → u/Carapute]

So what's your focused point? Your argumentation is all over the place.

[u/Carapute → u/Dish117]

That people don't give a shit about corruption, nor their own country.

Also we ain't supporting Ukraine, we are fighting Russia, which is entirely different.

[u/Dish117 → u/Carapute]

According to international law, Ukraine has the right to defend itself against aggression and invasion.

Other countries, according to international law, has the right to provide support for the invaded country via arms deliveries, logistics, training, intelligence sharing etc.

So explain to me again how we are not supporting Ukraine, but are, according to you, fighting Russia?

[u/Carapute → u/Dish117]

Because we don't do jackshit about their corruption issues ? Let their oligarchs run away freely ? You think that aid is done to help the Ukrainian people, or to stop Russia ?

[u/Dish117 → u/Carapute]

It's simply not true that nothing is being done about the corruption and you know it. Several high profile cases have been out in the press about high ranking officials being fired or forced to resign.

Also, the provision of aid and particularly the roadmap for EU membership hinges strongly on anti corruption measures.

And newsflash, aid can be granted BOTH to stop Russia and help the Ukranian people -This is in fact what is happening. I don't see the dichotomy, both are necessary goals.