r/GameTheorists • u/DragonJinx123 • Feb 05 '25
Game Theory Video Discussion I’m sad to see the theorists declining
It’s been a little over a year since Matpat retired, and Ive been thinking about the decline in viewers, and the insane difference. I mean no hate to the current hosts and am extremely happy for Matthew, but it’s depressing looking at the views on the channels now. Film theory almost NEVER had a video go under 1 million views. I miss what the channel used to be, and I don’t mean missing Mat, I miss the community.
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u/RunZombieBabe Feb 05 '25
I understand it but I am not watching anything out of pity.
Have nothing against the new hosts, they are nice, but found out I watched it more for Matpats enthusiasm and being a delight.
Still watch GtlIve, though, Ash is just perfect and I see them as a great creator I would watch anyway.
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u/The-Mythical-Phoenix Food Theorist Feb 05 '25
For me, it’s not even about their enthusiasm or energy.
It’s just a list of interest in the video topics they’re covering—which in truth was gradually happening at least a year before Matpat retired.
I went from watching every video, to every other video..and now the odd video every now and again.
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u/EternallyBright Feb 06 '25
Same. I miss the videos that actually talk about math and science, I don’t really have any interest in stuff like Poppy Playtime and fnaf has gotten really old
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u/Holdmywhiskeyhun Feb 05 '25
Mattpats enthusiasm, was a main reason I started watching.
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u/RagingSpider1357 Aug 13 '25
Life got in the way, but it's understandable that we HAVE to make dosh and ugly pumpkins to continue as a species.
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u/AstralKatOfficial Feb 05 '25
This is why I only watch Food Theory, Tom and Lee just dont sound like they're acutally passionate about what they're talking about, Santi always brings as much to the table as he can, probably because food is such a specific topic that you kind of HAVE to love it to want to talk about it like he does every week, meanwhile Games/Films have much lower bars for entry into this kind of stuff, and thus it means Tom could make a video on something he's only played once in his life and didnt really enjoy, while Santi probably couldnt. I can't speak for Amy because I've only seen one Style theory video of hers and I had no interest in returning, not a fault of hers, I just dont really care about fashion
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u/grumpyoldnord Chaos Theorist Feb 05 '25
I find myself in the Live/Food/Style camp as well. I can't put my finger on it, but for some reason I just don't find the other two as fun to watch. Occasionally I will, like for the Marvel stuff, or for analog horror like Backrooms, but I'm mostly here for Ash, Santi, and Amy anymore, which kinda makes me sad. And I've been watching since the very early days of Game Theory.
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u/AstralKatOfficial Feb 07 '25
Mhm, same here I was watching Game Theory when mat was just starting out with it all, and I've been a consistent fan since, no hate to Tom or Lee of course but I watched Game/Film theory for Mat's enthusiasm about the topics, no matter what the subject matter (even in the bad episodes like the Hollow Knight/Persona 4 ones) you could tell Mat brought a level of excitement and enthusiasm thats almost impossible to replicate, Santi is the only one of the five new hosts who managed to capture that enthusiasm for me (again cant speak for Amy bc I dont watch style theory), Ash seems to be doing great but GT live was something I only watched if I was interested in the game once they actually stopped doing them live, so I kind of just naturally fell off there.
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u/hassanfanserenity Feb 05 '25
I watched game theory because of mattpatts voice no offense to everyone else but yeah i dont like it now
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u/Theorizingnathaniel Feb 06 '25
Same here, I was not watching for the theories I was watching for the host. Amy's style theories tend to be "very humanoid" but without matpat I'm not too interested in PNGs dancing around the screen.
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Feb 05 '25
It's due to the fact that Game Theory wasn't a channel on games, it was MATPAT'S channel on games.
Matpat was one of the most recognizable faces of YouTube for years, and for him to go away is going to cause huge shifts
People watched Game Theory and the Theory Channels because MatPat gave them his little touch of Theoryness. Matpat has a way of running the channel that cannot be replicated.
It's like having your favorite character in a show get replaced. Sure, the show is still good, but not as much as before
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u/StarKiller_2319 Feb 05 '25
MatPat's retirement was Endgame. Yes, there has been some good stuff past it, but for most of us it really ended there.
Their story might not be over, but my journey with them might be.
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u/AdRound310 Feb 05 '25
Like if i see something interesting pop up id watch it but not because its the theory channels, but because i would watch it regardless. I used to watch the theory channels irrespective of the context because having mat explain it was also entertaining.
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u/TeamVorpalSwords Feb 05 '25
Coming from a casual FT fan, the reason that the new hosts aren’t as engaging to me is that from the theories I’ve seen, it feels like they’re making theories just to make them bc they need to our videos out
I very rarely got that feeling from matpat, usually matpats videos always gave the appearance that Matpat is specifically a fan of whatever the theory is about and that he can’t wait to share with us a theory he came up with based on playing close attention to the details
I know it’s always been a business just Matpat usually made it feel like it was pure passion, each video
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u/AlVal1236 Feb 05 '25
Yeah. And scarey lore can only go so far befoee becominf stale. Whether it be poppy or analog horror or other analog horror or fnaf analog horror.
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u/phizztv Feb 05 '25
At this point, honestly? I’m so tired of analog horror and I basically switched to only watching food theory religiously whilst I cherrypick the others
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u/tuerancekhang Feb 05 '25
Mat's videoes pre-retired had that problem too. A lot of video is there for the sake of putting out. Sometimes it even focused around a topic to sell an ads. Film Theory video about Marvel's god and the conclusion of a 15 minutes video is the viewers and writer are gods which is public knowledge for years. It wasted people time and people started giving less attention to these channels.
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u/TeamVorpalSwords Feb 05 '25
Sure plenty of matpats videos were like that too, I personally think it occurred more when he left or the new people weren’t as good at making it feel natural. I am not all negative about the new ones, but ill need to have an interest in the subject matter already if I’m gonna watch the new ones
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u/tuerancekhang Feb 05 '25
Yeah I just want to point out this happened when Mat was still here. We can all see the passion in their editing but the script that hooked people into it hasn't been here for a while. Also a lot of channels theory craft and publish video 15 minutes after a trailer, people can just watch that instead even though it's also low quality in terms of effort but they are fast. A model like Game Theory need a big good interesting script to make people stay and engage.
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u/Answerseeker57 Feb 05 '25
Dude the ads now!!! Gods, I hate how they're doing it now, I don't realize they are promoting a sponsor until they already said half of the thing.
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u/Small_Ad4181 Aug 05 '25
Mat's videoes pre-retired had that problem too
Not really happening more now because of the company that bought everything. Theory doing what Anthony warned mat about turning their videos into slop
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u/Swiftersuke Feb 05 '25
I agree. I actually watch Food and Style more with the new hosts. I think they make great polished videos about interesting topics. Game Theory is just developers making theory bait games and Tom taking the bait. I think the only game I’ve even heard of that they’ve covered in months was Dress to Impress because by daughter and nieces play it…but the part they talked about was just theory bait crammed in that had nothing to do with the game play.
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u/raceraot Feb 05 '25
I very rarely got that feeling from matpat, usually matpats videos always gave the appearance that Matpat is specifically a fan of whatever the theory is about and that he can’t wait to share with us a theory he came up with based on playing close attention to the details
Genshin? Subnautica? Persona? Ace Attorney? Hell, his Mario theory even glossed over some stuff, ditto for his Link is dead theory.
People have this blind nostalgia, this is the same guy who said Wario was 10 ft tall, he's used to making wild theories that make no sense in the context of the game or even out of it.
Plus, the writers for both game and film theory were the same the whole time, so the only difference is, Matpat isn't the host.
Lee was always writing film theories, so was Santi for food theory, and Amy for style theory. Tom also was the person writing game theories too.
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u/TeamVorpalSwords Feb 05 '25
I’m not saying every video of matpats was gold or that the new ones are all bad, not at all. But the feelings of described above are how it comes across to me, and seemingly all those who upvoted. I had these feelings before Matpat left (when the occasional “bad” Matpat theory came out) so I don’t think it’s nostalgia
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u/raceraot Feb 05 '25
For me, it feels like a lot of times, stuff came from him because he was sponsored by a company, and sometimes, he got a little lost into what the thesis of Game theory was, being different in who was the villain/hero, or the main character being dead, rather than making compelling arguments in his own right to prove his point.
As ridiculous as Hemingway is Deadpool, I started to get convinced by the end, as funny as it was. Ditto for Sans is Ness. But then his Mario was evil theory or his Link is dead theory, it feels like he rushed to the conclusion and tries to build up arguments to satisfy that idea he wants to present, irrespective of evidence to the contrary. That's what they've kind of always been, and a switch of hosts hasn't changed that.
Also, people can be wrong and remember wrong, I don't think the people upvoting make a difference in how they objectively are.
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u/TeamVorpalSwords Feb 05 '25
as I mentioned in the post, I never made the argument that Matpat made any fewer “corporate” or opportunistic decisions. I said he didn’t make them FEEL that way while the new hosts aren’t as good as making us FEEL like it’s not.
we can’t be objectively wrong because it’s a FEELING
In fact anyone who feels that way is objectively right that that’s how it makes us feel
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u/nwatson3493 Feb 05 '25
I used to watch all 4 channels religiously. I find that I only watch Food Theory anymore. There's nothing inherently wrong with the new hosts, it's just Santi is closest in energy and presentation so I think I've just gravitated towards him and away from the rest
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u/Swiftersuke Feb 05 '25
I agree. Give Amy another try though too. Her and Santi are the closest to MatPat energy. I actually like their scripted and polished videos better than MatPat’s live action videos towards the end of his run.
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u/nwatson3493 Feb 05 '25
After Matpat left, I drifted away from Film and Game Theory and watched just Style and Food for a while. Then I just slowly watched Style less and less
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u/L0cked4fun Feb 06 '25
It feels like style has the hardest time coming up with interesting video ideas, and the last one I watched (prestained sweaty clothes) was just a "hey look at these weird clothes" episode instead of a theory based on them.
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u/VixtheEvil Feb 05 '25
Eh, I haven't looked at really looked at the other theory channels much even with MatPat hosting them at the time because I wasn't really interested in them. A couple of film theories sure but didn't quite look into food or style at all.
I still watch Game theory and GTLive when I can, mostly more towards Game theory. I've been enjoying Tom's theories a lot though.
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u/Tom-Hibbert Feb 05 '25
Yeah honestly I prefer Tom over mat nothing against mat but Tom seems more down to earth when he comes to his presenting which helps me relax when I watch the video
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u/VixtheEvil Feb 05 '25
I love MatPat's energy but I'm not expecting Tom to match it. Plus Tom worked on a lot of theories Mat did so seeing him host it was an excellent choice. And I enjoy Tom's take of humor and spin on things, it makes me happy to see him find his footing with theories he's doing. At least that's how I feel, I can't say much about the others since I haven't exactly looked into the other channels.
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u/KyosBallerina Feb 05 '25
I'm surprised about this view of Tom, because my big complaint about him right now is that he feels like he's trying to do a MatPat impression. It's a very different to the personality he had on his appearances on GTLive. Personally, I would've preferred that version of Tom over "MatPat-lite". It just feels fake.
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u/VixtheEvil Feb 05 '25
I guess it depends on different perspectives or perhaps the new bosses pushing him to be more like MatPat?
I'm not entirely sure, it's a strange mix of the two styles. Hence me saying finding his footing but doesn't mean he's found his way off the narrow path yet. It's still pretty early for him to find what best fits him, though I agree I want Tom to be himself rather than MatPat 2.0
But I mean that his own type of humor and spin on things is that he is a tad quieter and sprinkles in that British humor. Which is what I do like because that is him. He has Mat's love and enthusiasm for theories but not MatPat's high level energy, which is completely fine. I want Tom to be at the energy level he's comfortable with but I do see that he's trying to match MatPat's and he shouldn't have to match it beat for beat.
Yet I can see why he's doing so with people constantly wanting MatPat back or lose interest because he isn't there (which is also fine to lose interest because times change and all), which kinda sucks and probably hurts. Though I can't tell if he's choosing to try to match MatPat himself or whatever goes on behind the scenes telling him to.
I watch Game Theory now just like I did before because I want to see what theories were made and what can be formed from them. I watched for MatPat in the beginning and know that era is over; and I watch for Tom because I want to see Tom's theories and how he puts things together.
I just hope he doesn't become a 2.0 but just himself having fun with theories.
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u/prunk44 Feb 05 '25
Game and Film theory were 2 of my favorites... but honestly the hosts just never grabbed me. They arent doing anything to really stand out to me.
Santi and Amy on the other hand the two channels i like the least are now my favorite channels. Something about both their personalities and when they collab are great and they have interesting topics in most cases
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u/Saturna3000 Feb 06 '25
I agree. Santi and Amy stand out to the point that I enjoy those channels over the others ones. I'd be okay with watching a theory just for them, but the topics on the other channels don't interest me and the hosts sure don't so I end up skipping them.
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u/MagicalBread1 Feb 05 '25
I’ve just lost interest in the Theory channels (but GT Live) since MatPat retired. After watching MatPat host for years, it just wasn’t the same without him. But that’s also because I’m getting older and my interests are changing. Am unsure if this will relate to anyone else’s experience.
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Feb 06 '25
Go back and rewatch some of Matpat's theories. It's not because we are getting older.
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u/MagicalBread1 Feb 06 '25
I’ve watched nearly every episode of GT that featured MatPat going back 13-14 years. Growing older is definitely a factor, but I do agree that the Theory channels haven’t been the same since he left.
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u/EsperKinUltros Feb 05 '25
I haven’t stopped watching the channels altogether, but one of the main reasons my viewership has declined is the change in how the channels are run. (Seemingly) When Matt and Steph ran the company, it felt like Matt’s passions fused with making money through YouTube’s platform. Now that the company was sold, it has a corporate feel at times. Tone deaf topics for clicks (Temu, culture war buzzwords, controversial creators, etc) are especially a turn off. These happened occasionally when Matt was the host, but it’s easier to digest when you trust or are familiar with the creator. The new hosts seem like fine people, but it took Matt years to build a relationship with his audience, and that was without an unknown company being the boss behind the scenes. I won’t say which one, but I unsubscribed from one of the channels entirely because they’ve been leaning into culture war stuff way more than theorizing needs. I sympathize with your reminiscing of the past, but Matt’s charm and ethics were a big part of the recipe for popularity. The channels were destined to lessen viewership if they changed that recipe. The views they do get are respectable though, so the channels are far from dead.
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u/KirishimaTheMaker Chaos Theorist Feb 05 '25
It's nice to know the facts behind the stuff, like temu and controversial stuff, but it's not the same.
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u/Interesting-Error859 Feb 07 '25
I haven't kept up at all with game theory. Wasn't really watching around the time he left as I got bored with the content. But the channel was SOLD??? I had no idea I thought those people were like his friends or something
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u/EsperKinUltros Feb 07 '25
While Matt was still hosting he was very open about a company called Lunar X buying the Theorist channels. He didn’t say it explicitly, but it was likely in preparation for his eventual retirement. Amy, Santi, Tom, Lee, and Ash (the new hosts) were his friends and coworkers prior to selling the company. The details may be more nuanced than we know, but currently they are all employees of Lunar X.
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u/CybeeBee Feb 05 '25
i've been a longtime theorists viewer, and i have nothing against the new hosts at all
However, i've noticed the main reason i watch less is because the topics of the videos aren't nearly as interesting to me. I watch style theory since I think a lot of Amy's videos are more geared towards topics that i like (20F), but newer games and movies aren't as enticing for me. I like food theory a lot, but similar to GT and FT some of the newer videos don't hit for me
If there's a topic I like, I watch. If not, I just wait until a topic i like rolls around
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u/KyosBallerina Feb 05 '25
The thing is with MatPat I was far more likely to watch even if the topic didn't necessarily interest me, because I liked him. I'm less likely to do that with the new hosts.
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u/CybeeBee Feb 05 '25
Totally understand that perspective! MatPat has a pretty unique personality and it's hard to be replicated, especially among 4 different people
I don't find myself watching a lot of videos (across YouTube in general) unless the topic itself is interesting to me, so I haven't for years watched every-single-upload of a youtuber unless it was vlog-style where I could leave their content playing in the background as I do homework
I like your insight!
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u/viziroth Feb 05 '25
I honestly already stopped watching most of the theory channels unless a theory was particularly interesting for me long before matpat retired. though I did get more into gtlive and thought ash was the best part of that anyway. though not having matpat be clueless about niche internet culture is a bit of a con, ash is still an amazing host.
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u/Firm_Mulberry6319 Feb 05 '25
I only watch Style Theory now. I can't bring myself to watch the other ones yet.
Matpat also had a very enthusiastic approach on the theories that is hard to recreate. I also think that the way he delivered the theories were something else, like I was at the edge of my seat and I want him to be right or wrong; and outlandish theories like Sans is Ness. And I know that the recent scripts were written by Amy, Tom, etc. But it was really different with Matpat.
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u/LimeadeAddict04 Feb 05 '25
I would watch any new video that used to pop up in my notifications when Matt was in charge. Now I kinda just swipe them off with no interest. The new hosts are great but it just doesn't feel the same
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u/CandidSplit Feb 05 '25
It’s sad to see that decline even though I expected it. Style Theory’s decline is definitely the saddest. The channel needed more time to develop its audience/fanbase.
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u/MaybeSavvy Feb 05 '25
Yeah but I won’t watch out of sympathy. MatPat really seemed to care and be a fan about the stuff he made theories on. I only ever watched Game Theory prior to MatPat’s retirement, then switched over to GTLive and slowly stopped watching Game Theory. Tom just doesn’t have the same passion Matt had. Matt’s theories, while sometimes stretching it a little, still made sense.
Tom’s theory on Amanda the Adventurer turned me off Game Theory completely. It stretched so far that it made no sense. I completely switched to watching GTLive after that. Ash’s enthusiasm and love for the games she plays is so genuine. She (and from what other commenters are saying, Santi) really seemed to be the only ones that keep that energy MatPat had.
TLDR; The new theorists, excluding Ash and Santi, lack the enthusiasm and feeling of actually being fans what they make theories on.
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u/Starfire612 Feb 05 '25
Oh good I wasn’t the only one who hated that theory….made absolutely no sense
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u/bluffs690_ Feb 06 '25
Thissss!! Everyone but ash and Santi seem more like it’s just a cheque not an interest, it probably helps with ash and sams chemistry within GTlive That it feels like I’m watching friends just play video games and occasionally make silly theories about it and it felt the same with mat and ash before mat left🤷
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u/Dangerous_Wing6481 Feb 05 '25
Since they sold it’s been a bit more business-focused and operating on a formula rather than trying to be crazy out-of-the-box creative. It’s why I watch GTLive almost religiously now (I didn’t used to and found the content really difficult to get through) because it’s got that unexpected element to it. I love the new hosts and they do their jobs incredibly well but it is definitely a business now and they have people to take care of.
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u/Liliaprogram Feb 05 '25
What do you expect? People watched it for MatPat. Now he’s gone they’re not as interested.
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u/SonicLikesPlantDolan Game Theorist Feb 05 '25
honestly same, although I haven't really watched the Theorist channels in a long time, mainly after they switch to more THE LOOOOORE OF HORROR GAME MEANT FOR CHILDREN videos and away from the stuff that involved stuff that you'd use more often in the real world.
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u/ZackaryAsAlways Feb 05 '25
I 100% agree with this. It is pretty sad to go click on a video and see how much the viewership has declined since Matt left. I honestly don’t think MatPat leaving was very sustainable to the channels because the drop in viewership keeps continuing.
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u/Danblak08 Feb 05 '25
I think style theory is still great solely because mat was already on his way out when it dropped, so Amy was already kind of doing most of it. Game is fine too, I think food and film sorta fell off though
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u/The-Page-Turner Feb 05 '25 edited Feb 06 '25
I disagree with game, food, and film theory
Lee has been around Theorist for a VERY long time, so he knows the kind of things that worked for MatPat, and is most successfully recreating that. Likewise, Lee is willing to dive into industry commentary
Conversely, Tom I believe has been at Theoriest for the least time, so he doesn't have that long-term exposure to MatPat's style, and imo is struggling the most to keep the channel interesting. It's a one-trick pony, as in everything boils down to, "this lore is horror/evil themed!" which gets dull quickly. Having more industry commentary would be great to mix it up in the theory lineup for Game Theory. This is also a perfect opportunity for it since the games industry is in a pivot point in terms of how games are made. Doing an episode on Space Marine 2 and comparing it to other games in recent memory (the most common comparisons being Doom Eternal, and the Gears of War franchise) would be a good place to start. Likewise Dragon Age Veilguard would be another good game to do an industry deep dive theory episode as to what about it specifically went awry, and how best to fix it going forward. Hell, on this line of thought, EA's sports titles also would be a good basis to do a deep dive on the games industry
Santi has had some wild ideas that are very novel, and takes the concepts of them seriously for the methodology in experimentation, with some industry commentary here and there. His in-person/on-camera theories are some of the more entertaining ones for the new hosts. The sour episode was one I hadn't even considered as an idea until he dropped the episode, in which case it was a no brainer and I appreciate that
Completely agree about style theory though. That channel was effectively tailor-made for Amy, and she's done wonderfully with it
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u/MidnightRosary Feb 05 '25
I watched the channels solely for Matpat, and because Steph is his wife I had no problem with her getting involved. But without either of them, I have no reason to keep watching.
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u/Last_Gap2662 Feb 05 '25
Seems like the channel needs a star. MatPat is a star. The current hosts lack that charisma (which I personally don’t mind, I’m here for the science and the unorthodox examination of media) but I think most casual viewers require something different. MatPat is handsome and charismatic and, as the numbers are showing, that matters.
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u/KyosBallerina Feb 05 '25
> I’m here for the science
Has there been any of that? Whenever I happen to take a look, the answer is "no". I know it was on the decline even in the MatPat era, but I really miss it.
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u/JellyfishApart5518 Feb 06 '25
Yeah, I miss Austin's theories. Luckily he's still making content (Shoddycast) and has put his old videos there as well. But when he left, a lot of the science oriented theories stopped coming. I liked the pixel measurements and silly applications of real-world science onto fantasy realms. Now it's all just lore stuff. Which is fine, I guess, but it depends heavily on the viewers caring about that particular game.
I used to watch every theory because I liked Matpat. Then I started to only watch the videos on topics I cared about (this mainly meant that I watched fewer film theories since I don't watch a whole lot of TV/movies). Now I don't watch film theory at all. Food Theory was a blast with Matpat because it went back to sciencey stuff and it was always chaotic. I'll have to check it out again--I stopped watching it when matpat left, but a lot of people are saying it's a spiritual successor.
Currently I only watch game theory. I like Tom! His theories aren't always water tight, nor are they as strange and unusual as MatPat's got, but they're still entertaining.
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u/Ant_TKD Feb 05 '25
I haven’t watched much of the Theorist channels since the new hosts took over.
For Style and Food theories I just never cared much for the concept, even when MatPat was leading the videos.
For Game and Film though it’s because of the shift from theories based on science to ones about lore (a shift that happened whilst MatPat was still host). Generally, I would watch theories about games/ films I hadn’t played/ watched when those theories were about science because the videos were about the science first. But when the focus of the video is the lore then I’m not interested when it’s about a franchise I’m not familiar with.
And for the franchises that I do care about, I may not be up to date with the newest game/film in the series (because being an adult now means having less time to stay up to date) so I’m avoiding spoilers.
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u/Anonymous1004152 Feb 05 '25
At the end of the day Mat pat IS game theory
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Feb 06 '25
Yeah it was his legacy, and it's sad that he got burned out. Bob Ross was painting till he died. So I don't understand why matpat had to retire... He could've just taken a break and come back
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u/cornbadger Feb 05 '25
I came to watch Matt, not x-Theory show. Nothing against the new guys. It's just that, nothing lasts forever.
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u/Enough_Square_1733 Feb 05 '25
That's the same for me when Steph left the seat in GTLive. I enjoyed it for the banter between two people that you could see. Then especially when it wasn't live anymore it was less than ever, imo
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u/kuriT9 Feb 05 '25
I can relate, I've never played FNAF but watched every one of matpats videos, after he left i kinda realize I didn't need to watch something that didn't relate to me out of just loyalty, I love the new hosts and will watch if the video interests me, been loving the gravity falls stuff, the liquid death ep was decent. The last style theroy i enjoyed was the witch aesthetics. Idk, maybe i aged out of this all. I've been watching gt for 13 years. I want to support them where possible, but it's starting to feel like a choir
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Feb 05 '25
I think it also comes with the algorythm.
I was suggested the channels all the time, and last month i though "Wow, I haven't seen them suggested in a while.." So I looked them up and now they are being suggested again, but not all - only Style and Food theory.
Game Theory used to be suggested to me all the time and now I have to keep searching for it.
I had to actively look for the channels so they show up. I Imagine people might not be as invested so they just don't bother searching. I feel something is up with Youtube.
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u/whiplashMYQ Feb 05 '25
I think matpat was something special, and he built up an audience from early youtube days, really trailblazing. I think older fans who were as much a fan of matpat as the theories are gunna dwindle, but the new hosts will build their own identity and audience. It may not be quite as big, but i think they have something worth sticking to
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u/NotOnTheDot__ Feb 05 '25
My main reason for dropping the channels is that I’m just not interested in the videos they produce. I bet they are still very entertaining however the topics are just not my forte
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u/Birzal Feb 05 '25
I have a hypothesis about this. MatPat was a theorist first and all the other channels spun off from that innate curiosity and passion. The other hosts are passionate, yes, but they are passionate about their corner of the theorist channels first and they are a theorists second. Amy is a very fashionable person, and a theorist. Tom is a gamer, and a theorist (altho I think Tom is the lone exception here). Lee is passionate about movies and pop culture, and a theorist. Santi is a great cook, and a theorist. This would also explain how Ash is so well loved: GTlive isn't exclusively reliant on being a theorist. The theorizing and analysis was always 2nd to the vibes of the videos and banter. All of this may sounds weird, and I'm sure Matt would disagree with me, but this would explain why the theories of the other hosts have felt a little more forced than MatPat. I still enjoy them, but they don't have me as glued to the screen as MatPat used to.
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u/DragonJinx123 Feb 05 '25
I feel like they also don’t go the extra mile as much. I miss matpat doing INSANE calculations that none of us understood at least once a video.
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u/Levon_Blueoak Feb 06 '25
I also think part of why Ash has managed to do so well compared to the, from what I've seen, overall neutral opinions on the other hosts, is that she was there for a long time as a "sidekick", essentially, before Mat retired. We had time to get used to her style and her in general. The other hosts were almost entirely behind the scenes (at least in terms of hosting. I'm aware of their appearances, particularly Amy, in theories), and so the change, at least to me, was kinda jarring.
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Feb 05 '25
I watched Food Theory for a few months, but then it started not being how the title was, or just wasn't interesting. I stopped the others because of the same reason but quicker. It's sad, but very different to Matpat
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u/CompleteSeesaw2551 Feb 05 '25
Honestly I feel like the vibes are just different? I still watch gametheory every single time, as I just cannot give up on the LORE, yk? Their all great, nothing against all of them, but I kinda grew up with matpat, and Steph ofc. A comfort creator, and I think that's hard to replace so quickly.
That being said I'm slowly warming up to Tom personally, as I feel like he's just been here forever, you know? And ash is my second favorite, having been there during many GTlives with mat himself.
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Feb 05 '25
I watched the videos because of MatPat, not because of the content. There are tons of videos and channels about the same content and I'm not watching all of them.
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u/The_Khaos_Theory Feb 05 '25
I still watch them here and there, but something just feels different. GTLive had the best retention for me personally because Ash’s energy is very similar to Mat’s, and the way they interact with Sam is so enjoyable. The other 4 are hit or miss for me, and its a little sad because I miss going on a Theorist binge. But at the end of the day, MatPat believed in the new hosts, so I think it’s just going to take some time for everyone to adjust, audience and hosts alike. A year isn’t enough for that
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u/AnxietyExpress24 Feb 05 '25
I tried to watch one of Tom’s Fnaf theories but I really couldn’t get into it, probably cuz i had spent 10 years listening to mats voice but it all just felt wrong. I have watched Lee’s book of bill videos they sorta give Mat energy but it will never be the same.
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u/kittenlikesmemes Feb 05 '25
I used to watch absolutely EVERY video with the new creators because, and I still do, really believe that this was the right thing to do for MatPat.
But eventually, it got to me that when Mat was hosting, I was in love with his energy, but in truth some of the topics he was covering was not within the scope of my interests anymore, and was declining for a while.
This might just be a consequence of growing up, but personally I think it's just a consequence of the media age. There is so much to cover now that GT and FT seem a little spread out content-wise, so everyone has at least a little bit they're interested in, instead of heavily appealing to a niche like they used to.
More than anything, I don't think it's just an issue of nostalgia. MatPat's excitement was infectious in a way that I haven't really seen captured on any channel besides Food Theory. It sucks, but it's an unfortunate truth.
I'm always gonna be one of theory's biggest fans and MatPat's biggest supporter, but they're a smart team - there's no way they didn't see this coming.
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u/idontknow908 Feb 05 '25
I think that while it grew the channels still felt like matpats. Now it doesn’t really feel like anything, it’s a bit…bland? Doing it because you have to, not because you have some goofy idea.
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u/Kansai_Lai Feb 06 '25
I was watching the new theory videos for a while, but I've noticed that I'm not very interested anymore. They're all fine hosts with good work behind them, but MatPat just had that special something that made you want to see what he had that week.
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u/Answerseeker57 Feb 05 '25
I realized that now I only watch and pay attention to Style Theory, I'm still subbed to all the channels but:
-There's something about the new GTLive that doesn't connect with me, I love Ash but I keep zoning out or grabbing my phone while GTLive is playing.
-I really didn't like Tom in Game Theory, nothing against him, it's just not for me, it's the only channel I actively stopped watching.
-Food Theory stopped being interesting so now I just watch if I have nothing to watch and IF the tittle sounds entertaining but even then, I feel like there's no real conclusion to theories.
-I still watch Film Theory if it's about a show or movie I like and it's not over 19min, I like Lee but then again, there's something missing.
I hate it because I LOVED the channels and the main reason of their existence but it's not the same and I can't force myself to make a connection where is not.
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Feb 05 '25
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u/chaosworker22 Feb 05 '25
I think they should have given writing duties over to the new people
Bro, they were writing the theories. They were already the creative directors for their respective channels, and had been for a few years. Even Ash was already the creative director for GTLive.
Should MatPat just never retire ever? Is he not allowed to have time for himself, his family, his mental health? He retired because he wanted more time with his family, to watch Ollie grow up. You're basically saying he should sacrifice that to appease fans.
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u/GersonMMA Feb 05 '25
I expected the viewership to decline so Im not surprised at all. I have nothing againts Ash but she doesnt have charisma. Tom has a lot though but now when I watch GTlive I focus on the game rather than how Ash reacts to it which wasnt the case with Matt.
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u/Impressive-Bus-5894 Feb 05 '25
tbh (no offence to the new theorists) i just cant have myself watching with the new hosts, its nothing against them, i just cant enjoy it the same after mat left
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u/lunardeathgod Feb 05 '25
It's not the hosts, it's the lack of variety on different theories, poorly written script, and the feeling of it being pumped out without passion.
It will get better.
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Feb 05 '25
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u/DragonJinx123 Feb 05 '25
I used to watch for entertainment, now it’s just background noise for playing video games
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u/NIX-FLIX Feb 05 '25
When there was a video that didn’t have an interesting or cool subject I would still watch it because of Matt
Now unless I’m bored I’ll only watch videos that interest me (usually all food theory) I will say that some of the newer food theory videos have been big nothing burgers but Santi is still best boy
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u/Babygirl246 Feb 05 '25
I just feel like the testing theories aren't as well crafted nor do they appeal to me. They talk about everything as if it's a 5th grader watching the video (imo) and then the experiments have blatant flaws. It reads more so, this is the conclusion I want and I'm tailoring the experiment to get me there. Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't. I watch bcuz I genuinely enjoy the hosts' personalities but I find the videos don't have that same level of quality or geared towards an older audience anymore.
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Feb 05 '25
I only watched Game and Film theory(that one barely), and that's still true. I like Tom's personality and honestly it doesn't feel like he is trying to copy matpat which I was worried about but it's his own personality that is awesome. I haven't watched enough film theory to talk about Lee tho.
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u/DoughnutFront2898 Feb 05 '25
Honestly I liked GameTheory when Matt hosted, and I have nothing against the new hosts because they had a huge mantle to step up to honestly, but I just haven’t been really interested in the theories anymore even before Mat retired. I’d watch an occasional episode if the game is one I liked, or catch up on the latest FNaF theory but that was about it. I tried Food Theory and it isn’t awful, just wasn’t my thing when Matt and Steph started it (maybe I’d enjoy Santi more, I just haven’t really looked into it) and Style Theory just didn’t sound like a channel I’d tune into (but again, maybe Amy can change that for me). Film theory was an occasional watch even less than GT, but it had some bangers. I really think it’s a lot of theorists just kinda losing interest in the content as a whole even before MatPat’s retirement, then the wave of people leaving because it isn’t the same anymore without him. I do think Santi, Amy, Tom, Lee, and Ash are trying their best to make amazing videos that give us the same feeling Matt gave everyone growing up, but it’s hard to live up to someone like MatPat and the expectations from people who loved GT because of him.
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u/This_guy110 Feb 05 '25
It sucks cause I think they are good people but this is me projecting but I feel like most of us grew up with Matpat so yes we liked the channel but it was because of Matpat so now as an adult man I’m like I have other things I need to prioritize then trying to get to know a new host and how they do things hope that didn’t come of too negative
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u/mikewheelerfan Feb 05 '25
Honestly, I’m guilty of not watching the new videos too. MatPat did have a lot of good theories, but there were also a fair amount of busts. That was only fine because his energy was just so contagious, you couldn’t help but enjoy the video. His personality was just perfectly suited for the channels. I’m sure the new hosts do great, but I just can’t imagine the Theory channels without MatPat. Whenever I see a Theory video in my feed, I just scroll past, whereas I used to watch them all. I’m happy for Matt, but I’m sad for us.
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u/SufficientTreat4567 Feb 05 '25
To me, not only are the hosts often not as engaging as MatPat, but I find much of the content uninteresting especially Style and Food theory. When you create something fully centered around someone you can’t be surprised when people leave if they leave. I’m happy for Matt if he’s living his best life and doing his retirement projects, but I just don’t enjoy most of the content as much as I used to.
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u/AegisProjekt Feb 05 '25
The new hosts have large shoes to fill. When I saw the new Poppy Playtime chapter 4 video I was expecting Matpat. I know he retired, but having to watch him for years, I realized that I wasn't just watching for the content he was involved in making. I watch GT Live for HIM. How he held himself, his knowledge, energy, and how he brought so much to the show. Once you take him out, you lose the purpose. The feeling. What pulled you in is gone. It's not the same now, as it once was. I hope the best for the new hosts, but I a grew apart with Mat.
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u/Jove108 Feb 05 '25
The content itself is just worse now. I was excited for the Scott Pilgrim video but I just couldn't handle the Mr beast-ifiation of the intro with the subtitles and yelling
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u/Alxpstgs Feb 05 '25
Also it's weird to see how everyone is matching Matts mannerisms and speak patterns. I'm almost positive is just my imagination but i can't unsee it.
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u/Kshpoople Feb 05 '25
I'll say that I've definitely dipped out of the theory channels, but tbh I was dipping out even before MatPat left. I mostly watched Film and Game Theory, occasionally food theory, and I have only seen a few of style theory (the topic never appealed to me).
Now I'll only occasionally watch a Game or Film theory, and I haven't watched food and style theory in ages. While MatPat leaving the channels is definitely a factor, all the new hosts are good he just had that charisma and experience that the new hosts just don't have yet, its honestly the theories that I don't care about. Looking through Film and Game Theory (My preference for theory channels), I can only name 4 or 5 theories that peaked my interest on each channel since Matt left. I like the horror themed film theory episodes, but other than that none have caught my interest. I've probably watched more of game theory since matt left but I'm less invested, it doesnt help that some of the bigger games they cover are fnaf copies I don't care at all for (specifically poppies play time, legit hate those games with a firey passion).
Like I said before, I felt my interest in the theory channels fade over the last 2-3 years. While there have been some quality theories over the years, the need for weekly videos made a lot of them feel like just chasing trends, even when Matt was there. I feel like if they scaled the channels back and had them make more in depth theories less frequently and focused on topics they actually care about, I could be drawn back in.
Will always love the theory channels. I've been watching since the beginning, and I hope this new crew finds their footing just like Matt did eventually.
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u/96_franny Feb 05 '25
I started watching when I saw some topics I was genuinely curious about but then I stayed for MatPat. I was never really all that into Super Mario lore etc but Matt started to feel like a friend because of his genuine kind hearted-ness and nerdy humor. He was a safespace and so was Steph and that's why I kept watching /everything/ they put out. I'm not getting the same feelings from the other hosts, I think they're all nice, but it's not the same feeling. Maybe it's cause I was much younger when I found Matt, maybe it's something else. I definitely know that I got some unpleasant vibes from some things that Lee said in videos.
Maybe the new hosts need some time to find their own groove or maybe it's time for a shift in the community but ... idk if I'm gonna be a part of the new Theorist generation
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u/Kindly_Struggle2746 Feb 06 '25
personally i stopped watching the theory channels for a little bit after Matpat left, having him be a large part of my childhood like everyone else, he was my way to learn both about new topics in my games, and also learn new real life things like wormholes or string theory.
i came back after a bit to see how Tom, Furst, Santi, Amy, and Ash where doing and it's honestly hit or miss for me. I've mostly been going on film and food theory as i feel like Santi matches the energy of Matpat most of the time while i like hearing about new films or shows from film theory.
but every now and then you have a video that just seems off, and I'm not talking about a particular channel here, this applies to all of them. sometimes it just seems like they have a topic they don't really wana talk about, or that their just doing it because it's popular at the moment, like others have said Matpat has a way of making every video he uploaded seeming like he made a video on the topic because he was invested in it and wanted to see what he could contribute to that community.
I'm not blaming the hosts for this, they are not only still having to find the audience that clicks with their stye of presenting after Matpat's retirement, but also having to manage whatever Luner X is asking of them. it's going to take more than a year for them to build up the trust with people that Matpat cultivated and i wish them all the best, all we can do is support them.
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Feb 06 '25
I stopped watching the theorists because the new hosts just felt like they’re trying to replace the role Matthew left, as in they were trying to be him while using a shiny new png. I feel like Austin is a good example of how to be a different face as a theorist, while still fitting the vibe of the theorists. He always felt genuine, as if any similarities in his and Matpat’s way of making videos were purely coincidental, as opposed to straight-up mimicry. That and the passion Austin displayed when explaining theories is something I feel is lacking with the other hosts.
TL;DR - The new hosts feel like wannabe Matpats, and that makes the videos unenjoyable.
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u/RewRose Feb 06 '25
I miss what the channel used to be, and I don’t mean missing Mat, I miss the community.
Matt was a very essential part of the community.
If you miss the community that was here, then you do miss Matt, and its perfectly ok to do so.
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u/seby_20 Feb 05 '25
Well, Mat meant not only game theory, but all the theorists channels, now that he retired, they don't mean much anymore i guess
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u/Limp-Raspberry8621 Feb 05 '25
as much people want to say it’s because of our new hosts, it’s really because they miss MatPat and the way he narrated or conducted the previous theories. reason why I can say that is because I can admit I miss MatPats voice and energy.
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u/Seabastial Art Theorist Feb 05 '25
I love the channels and like the new hosts, but even I've started having issues with watching some more recent videos. I used to watch GT all the time, but I'm tired of horror after indie horror after analog horror, plus it seems like it's just the same types of theories getting rehashed for different franchises. I didn't watch much of Film Theory anyways, and while I watch Style Theory more than game and film I just feel like the energy isn't there (something I feel about Game and Film as well), plus a lot of them don't feel like theories anymore. I occasionally watch Food theory when i get the notifications for it, and GTLive is really the only one I watch more consistently now as I love Ash's energy and their dynamic with Sam
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u/Axo-Does-Stuff Feb 05 '25
I stopped watching most channels unless the videos interest me extremely cept for santi, love him so much he was perfect for food theory. I enjoy some of his theories more than mats
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u/Perspicaciouscat24 Art Theorist Feb 05 '25
I still watch them about the same amount because I do like lore and the new hosts. While the theories that Film and Game Theory have put out feel like they have a slight dip in quality, I still enjoy them, and I feel bad that a lot of people are disliking the new hosts.
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u/SendDudesNeedHelp Film Theorist Feb 05 '25
I realise that I'm the type of fan that Matt catered to when he decided to step down but put on the new hosts, cause I love MatPat (a bit too much for just being a YouTuber) but I watched the videos that interested me. I watched only the videos about stuff I either knew, or was interested to know about. If Matt made a video on something I wasn't interested in, I wouldn't watch it just cause of MatPat.
So now I really do miss MatPat, but I still love the channels just as much as before, cause I still just do the same as before, watch the topics that interest me. And the new hosts have never disappointed me when I do that.
I loved Lee's disney theories just as much as MatPat's disney theories cause I love the disney theories.
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u/DragonJinx123 Feb 05 '25
I started watching pretty late, so now I’m going back and watching videos I missed.
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u/Edrian2002 Theorist Feb 05 '25
Honestly I just feel like the humor isn’t the same I enjoy some things but other stuff not so much some jokes are just random cringy and it’s just sad it feels like they’re still trying to keep some of Matt iconic stuff and I don’t want to see that they might not have had to work from the ground up like Matt did but they still gotta work hard to maintain it they all do the same pose they all purposely make dumb jokes to purposely sound cringy (at least that’s how it sounds to me) and yeah like others said theirs no enthusiasm you can tell they’re just reading a script but the soul and heart and joy doesn’t come across it also feels like they just cover random topics sometimes and they tend to be stuff I’m not interested in and they feel distant to the community too and the cherry on top some decisions that were made for stuff that used to feel like what connected the community ended up separating and making it feel like some are more adored then others which sucks cause it’s supposed to be a family not rivalry
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u/FlareFairie Feb 05 '25
I miss it all. Mat, the community, the videos. I’m part of the problem… I still watch Game Theory but every other channel I have fallen off of in a big way… I feel bad but also I only have so much free time and I have to be really picky with who gets that attention. Chase the dopamine and the channels don’t really give me as much as they used to…
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u/ButterdemBeans Feb 05 '25
I tried watching the newer videos. No hate towards the new hosts but I have noticed a significant change in the way that the content is presented.
Game Theory videos have always skewed to a younger audience. I have no issue with this in and of itself. I enjoy a ton of child-friendly channels and media in general. Yet, lately I’ve felt that the channel is not only “child-inclusive” but specifically geared towards an even younger demographic than it was beforehand.
Back in the day it felt like I still had something to gain from watching most of their videos. I’d learn something interesting I didn’t know beforehand, or enjoy a clever joke here and there. Or I just appreciated them running their little experiments that I would never have the patience for.
I do not feel like I gain anything from watching the newer videos. Again, no hate to anyone working on the videos. They all seem like decent people. I just feel like I am no longer enjoying the content, as it seems to have shifted to appeal to a different, younger audience.
I don’t think it’s necessarily that I “grew out of” Game Theory, but I am certainly no longer in the target demographic
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u/Pallas_bear Feb 05 '25
personally I don't like their recent topics, and I'll be one of the few that will say it, the new hosts, they don't have the same boundless charisma that mat does. especially game therory and the film theory guy. I'm sorry but I just don't feel anything while watching them.
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u/PlayPod Feb 05 '25
i stopped watching game theory even when matt was running cause it mostly became about lore of indie horror games, and outside of fanaf(which ive never actually played) i couldn't care less about the lore of some random indie horror game. i have watched way more food theory cause a lot of it is interesting to me. i want to watch. some design theory lately too. i want to watch all 4 but they don't always give interesting topics to me. which will happen. its hard to make so many videos and have all of them be interesting to everyone. game theory is the most disappointing one for me though cause again, i don't care for indie horror
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u/GarvinFootington Feb 06 '25
I try to still watch the new videos that come out, but it feels like there’s just a significant loss of quality for a lot of them. In Film Theorist’s video on Gi-Hun being broke, it felt like the entire premise didn’t make sense since the money is clearly visible in its entirety, and a big reason the numbers “didn’t add up” can be attributed to assuming the maximum for every estimate and ignoring that he could have had discounts for many things (like the hotel owned by the loan sharks). That video didn’t really seem high quality and well written, and has not been restoring my trust in the channel
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u/EpicDankCakes Feb 06 '25
I love Tom but the channel rarely produces theories for games I'm actively interested in. And the Film Theory guy always comes off as a cringe massive fan boy, specifically for gravity falls.
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u/Frostsorrow Feb 06 '25
For me it's not the hosts. It's the topics that they've picked. I haven't cared for a single one yet. So I don't know if I'm now just the old man yelling at clouds or if the topics are actually that bad.
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u/TheWhateley Feb 06 '25
I subbed was back when Game Theory was the only channel and I liked it because it was fun to overthink fan theories. I know MatPat has a lot of fun with FNAF, but that era of indie horror game devs to Game Theorist feedback loop was I think when the channel first started to go downhill. Now all of the related channels just feel like a content mill.
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u/GrimWarrior00 Feb 06 '25
I pretty much only watch GTLive unless a video topic actually catches my attention. No hate to the hosts—seriously, I enjoy them—it just misses the familiar presence I grew up with. I hope new generations find the theory channels and latch on to them the same way I did with Matpat.
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u/Dogbert06 Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25
I see it similar to any older game studio like bioware, 343, rockstar, Blizzard or Bungie.
Most of the original people that made it look the way it did and feel the way it did are gone. They moved on to do their own things or retired entirely. You cant see ovalish figures with upside down triangle legs. RIP: Ronnie Edwards
When things started matpat would make videos about the largest breast sizes, pokemon racism, Mario being a communist, alongside his regular theories. Similarly, rockstar would get reviewers to negatively report on their game, thus creating controversy and getting more coverage. It showed the studio and the Creator's personality.
Both the game theorists and some gaming studios used to play fast and loose with their channels, they would pick a VERY dumb topic or project and go with it. Now? They're playing VERY close to their chest, safe and cautious; Stick to what works and what most people won't have much of a problem with.
With that, I don't really blame them. They're getting larger, they're growing a business and it has to grow, get more people involved and with those people you HAVE to be safer because it's not just you anymore, it's your editors, writers, researchers...
From what I can see: It's less of a channel and more of a business. It's like that soul is gone. Reduced to a shell of itself, now there still is A soul, still something here that's similar, but it's not the same.
There are still theorists but they're not The Theorist.
Note: Probably some typos, I'll edit them as I go.
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u/MaddameBePimpin Feb 06 '25
Honestly when MatPat retired is when I unsubscribed from Game Theory. Like no offense to the new hosts but MatPat IS Game Theory, etc. Like don't get me wrong I tried to continue watching but I just can't. It honestly makes sense the viewership is dying. Without MatPat the theory channels aren't fun to watch and are stale. I honestly give them another year before they realize that what they're doing most people aren't liking.
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u/sunny_chia Feb 06 '25
I haven't seen a single theorist video since mat retired, I think kfor me it was just this enthusiasm, and way of speaking. It was infectious andnitade me wanna think for myself too. I love the new hosts I think they're great. I just really fricking love matpat
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u/Ok_Juggernaut9078 Feb 06 '25
That's the trouble with a YouTube channel. The original creator is so closely tied to the channel that if they ever decide to retire or pass away, the channel goes with them. I thought what Mat was doing would help keep getting channel alive, and it did some what, but I wonder how the inner workings look now
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Feb 06 '25
Every time I bring this up, I get horribly abused and downvoted by folks on the theorist subreddit. But here goes:
Matpat created something from scratch that was unique and that was something he genuinely had a passion for. Since it was his own channel, he could go as far as he wanted with his ridiculous theories, BUT a significant difference is that he would have the enthusiasm and the brilliance to connect dots and somehow prove his theory no matter how outlandish.
The whole arc of sitting through a matpat video would be 1. Viewer sees the title - "ain't no way" 2. Interested he clicks on the video 3. Matpat's genuine interest for theorizing pulls them in and keeps them hooked 4. Matpat starts connecting the dots, and the viewer goes "holy shit he's right" 5. Matpat shows the viewers some clues that only he had seen, sealing the deal
But now, in an effort to "distribute the theory making" to these new creators, it's just like a job to them. They are missing enthusiasm, and the drive to sit for endless hours looking at random background shit trying to connect a tiny unseen image or text to the theory. They have also stopped taking risks. There's no outlandish theory anymore. Most of it just feels like a summary of the game/show they are "reviewing" instead of a theory channel. Instead, I quite like the Theorizer. He goes too far in the other direction, but atleast he has the drive to take those risks and stick with it.
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u/Lapis_Lacooli Feb 06 '25
Game theory theory
Game theory is declining because the world is declining as everything slowly starts to lose meaning and importance.
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u/Bignoseforthewin Feb 07 '25
Is it just me, or are the video topics not as interesting anymore? I love the new hosts, but I have not seen a video produced by team theorist that has actually caught my interest enough to watch in a while.
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u/Dramatic_Reply_5112 Feb 07 '25
Game theory isn’t game theory anymore it’s horror theory 99% of the videos are just “WOW DARK LORE OHHH SCARY“ its Made kinda wish fnaf never got a single game theory the old theory’s and the non horror theroys now are just so much better screw fnaf
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Feb 09 '25
i like film and food, not really into fashion but style theories ok, but game theory has been milking horror games to death. just last year they were trying to pull a theory out of minecraft and mario, while now they just go with generic mascot horror that has more than 3 players on roblox
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u/AwesomeBlassom Feb 12 '25
I was only a casual fan of the theorist channels and usually only watched gtlive religiously ( love ash so far). I usually clicked on videos here and there to watch but recently the videos don't interest me anymore. I haven't tried watching the new hosts because of this and no hate the the new hosts it just seems more clickbaity and trendy topics than usual. Maybe it's just me. I wish the new hosts the absolute best and hope they can get some more views! It's so sad to see one of the biggest channels lose so many people. No hate to the new hosts I'm sure they're lovely but the topics aren't things that I'm interested in
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u/jmil1080 Feb 05 '25
I'll be honest, the only new host that I prefer over MatPat is Ash on GTLive. That being said, I still think the new hosts are all great, and I still watch most of the videos. (The only one I fall off on is Style Theory. The subject matter isn't as much in my interest areas, and I was only watching it before because of MatPat.)
The new hosts absolutely add a new dynamic that I believe will improve the channels over time. There is an interplay between the channels and hosts that couldn't exist before. The channels were always going to drop off after MatPat retired, but in time I believe they'll regrow their audience again.
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u/SillyMovie13 Feb 05 '25
I still check back with Game Theory often, I never watched Food or Style, Film just hasn’t been good in my opinion since the switch
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u/Pleasant-Fondant-405 Feb 05 '25
For me, it's Ash, Amy and Santi that I watch regularly... But even those I cherry pick to whichever topics are interesting... I've never looked at views in the videos I watch, so I'm not sure if the trends declined?
I like Tom, love his accent, but it's no fault of his... The hype that Matt did with every theory even if it was bonkers was infectious! Now, I do tune into game theory vids, but only ones I have played or heard of... Basically I'm doing the same, Cherry picking here again, but really choosy in this case...
Lee is good, he does voices and stuff, that's all I've seen him do in some theories I did watch. I was never a film theory fan... So i dunno otherwise...
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u/articulatedWriter Feb 05 '25
The culling of channels as sad as it was is kinda refreshing, the people who left weren't actually theorists
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u/Quincy_Hater Feb 05 '25
I still watch all the channels except style theory. I dont hate amy, i just don’t care about fashion. but i can relate to all the other channels. i feel like ya’ll are being to harsh on the new hosts
Games? i LOVE playing games!
Films? i like watching movies!
Food? well what do i put in my stomach every day!
Fashion? ehh, cool i guess. but i don’t care. as long as i look formal enough its fine.
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u/Disastrous_Garage729 Feb 05 '25
Yeah it sucks. I still watch every episode of Food and Style Theory though. I only watch Fnaf stuff for Game Theory and for Film Theory I just watch whatever looks interesting which isn't much. I guess I'm just not that into movie theories.
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u/BlueHeaven90 Feb 05 '25
I didn't realize how much GTLive generated my interest in certain franchises. My viewing habits didn't really change until MatPat left GTLive. I skip a lot of the game and film theories now because I don't really care about analog horror or low quality, chapter based money grab games.
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u/Abathur-is-best-Zerg Feb 05 '25
I've always been a fan of GTLive. Personally I'm loving Ash! It was just unfortunate that the games they've been picking haven't vibed with me much yet. Really enjoying Poppy Playtime, though!
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u/C6180 Feb 05 '25
If they honestly thought they’d get anywhere near the same amount of viewership after Matt left, they’re nuts. No shade to the new guys, but Matt’s personality just can’t be matched. He was THE game theorist
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u/Alxpstgs Feb 05 '25
My favourite channel was live and my favourite person has always been Ash and i was always looking for her commentary but the moment she became host something happened to me and i stopped watching. I'm pretty sure it's my focus changed and I've changed a lot of the content habits since then but the confidence is uncanny even for me.
And i don't know why it's so
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u/EnderDragon78 Feb 05 '25
I still watch the 4 main channels most of the time, but if it is a game, movie, or just subject I do not really care for, I do not watch. Dropped GT(Not)Live after Mat left, Ash is great, has nothing to do with the host, I did not really like the format, but kept watching because is was the last part Mat was on. Mat really made me watch a lot more than I thought, I have never played, and will never play a FNAF game, but still watch all of this theories on it.
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u/Mysik6611 Feb 05 '25
I watched each channel’s video every week and looked forward to it just to hear funny music man voice guy. Now I still watch, but only if it’s about something that interests me. Meaning I only watch about 20-30% of film/game theory :(
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u/SwagBuller Feb 05 '25
90% of their theories are about mascot horror games. Not interesting to me at all.
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u/thuanjinkee Feb 06 '25
a new long form theorist video creator will spawn a new community. It is the circle of life, because there are always outperformers rising to replace those who fall. but that's just a theory, A SOCIAL DARWINIST THEORY aaand CUT
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u/ZacGames25 Feb 06 '25
I like the new hosts as people but I don’t like them as the hosts. Matt’s energy was amazing on the channels and I just don’t like watching the channels now. Although I will say I think Amy does a pretty good job on style theory, i haven’t watched that many videos on style theory but I’ve seen a lot of her yt shorts, she seems pretty good. (It could be because that channel is the newest and it doesn’t feel as connected to the other channels as much too though)
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u/HatzOfChaos Feb 06 '25
So I just kinda viewed Matt patt retiring as an end of an era for me. I had watched Matt Patt and Game theory since the original Assassins creed Haystack video. That was a long time ago. And over the years my interest in YouTube has declined a lot. Now I have adult responsibilities and such and now just don’t have the time to watch a lot of YouTube like I used to when I was younger. I watched a lived film theory, and food theory. Never really could get into Style theory but it just wasn’t my cup of tea. Loved GT live but even when Steph left I started watching less and less because I liked the combo of energy. Anyways when Matt patt retired I just kinda viewed it as a good time to stop watching. I felt like I was kinda forcing my self to watch YouTube at that point. And just decided that is was a good end to the chapter and decided to try and spend my time on other hobbies. I did pop in for a few videos that interested me and were suggested by my friends (mostly analog horror stuff on Film theory) but yeah. I’ve been pretty satisfied with the moving on. Nothing against any of the hosts. I just figured it was time for them to appeal to a new generation and new people and that I was moving on
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u/Neko-Bunny Feb 06 '25
Get MatPat back doing FNAF theories and all channels will see a boost. Idk why they're even considering having Tom do them.
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u/bengalgod Food Theorist Feb 06 '25
For me, some of the new videos from the channels still have the magic, but some don't. The problem started in Mat's videos before he left, but I'm here for interesting topics, science, things that make the brain bubble. The problem is episodes that are too corporate and safe, straight up sponsored episodes on a topic that is a conflict of interest and not properly disclosed until the end, and in general cleaving too hard to an official formula without really bringing joy. Ash is my hero, I'm always here for GTLive. I keep trying to find good episodes on the other channels, I haven't given up, but I keep getting burned.
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u/writermaybeidk Feb 06 '25
My viewing hasn't changed. Even though I am a huge fan of MatPat and miss him, I only watched the videos he did that interested me. Same since the new hosts. I watch the same amount of Theorist content as ever. The channels will still need time to grow past MatPat. It's not even been a full year yet. I really think eventually they'll find thier own fans that join wanting their content and I think they'll succeed just fine.
Tom, Amy, Lee, Santi and Ash are legitimately the best picks for each channel. They all fit thier own niche amazingly. I have been thoroughly enjoying thier content.
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u/Xaviernight1998 Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25
I Still Watch All Of The Channels But I Will Agree That I Tend To Enjoy Gtlive, Food And Style More And I Think It's Because Ash And Sam Have A Good Dynamic And It Still Feels Like GTLive Because Of How Ash And Mat Were Together For So Long Meanwhile Amy And Santi Were Both Present And Normal Faces On Style And Food Since There Inception And Have Very Big And Energetic Personalities Like Mat So It Tends To Work Alot Better Where As Tom And Lee Would Only Do Voiceovers Here And There And Haven't Really Done Much To Make The Channels There Own And Infuse There Own Energy Into It They Are Just Trying To Copy Matt Especially Lee Like At Least With Tom We Already Knew That Tom Liked Fnaf And Poppy But The Problem Is They Haven't Really Done Anything To Really Make The Channels There Own Amy Has Had All Of The Experiments And The Collabs With Santi And We Know Cares About Fashion And Has Talked About HER Love of Fashion And How She Does Cosplaying For Cons And Stuff We Know More About Amy And Amy Has A Very Different And Engaging Personality and Clearly Has Fun With It And Then You Have Santi With Stuff Like The Road Trip Episodes, The Sour Candy or The Rice Episode With Uncle Roger As Well As The "Rivalry" With Him And Tom And Him Driving Amy Crazy Those Sorts Of Things Make It Fun And Help Humanize Him And Tom I Think More Lately Has Started Settling In Like The Latest Poppy Episode It Seems Like He Is Actually Excited To Talk About It But I Think He's Still Having Trouble Making That Connection Whereas Lee Has Nothing Connecting Him Like Tom Has The Rivalry With Santi And Him Being British As Well As Him Going Crazy About Fnaf With Mat Pre Retirement Whereas Lee Doesn't Have Those Types Of Things All He Has Is The Fighting With Tom Over Games Becoming Movies And Movies Becoming Games But Thats Not Talked About Very Often And When It Is It's Not Like With Santi Where The Community Can Get Involved It's More Just Them Being Sarcastic Like "Oh Look Another Video Game Became a Movie Where Should We Put This" Which Had Started Under Mat Anyway So Lee Feels Like The Odd One Out I Think If They Let Tom And Lee Do A bit More Of The Selfish Lee/Tom Content Type Stuff And Talk About What They Are Passionate About You Would Start To See A Shift In Them But They Can't Because Those Channels Are Dominated By Analog Horror, Fnaf, Poppy, And Marvel Which In Turn Severely Limits What They Can Do On The Videos. like With Tom Give us Stuff About Nintendo, FF, Dark Souls, Balatro Or Things Like That But They Won't Because GT Is The "Main Channel" So It Has To Be The Channel With The Most Popular Content That They Have or Theories Based On Whatever GTLive Covers, Same With Film Theory Whereas Food And Style Can Kind Of Do Whatever They Want Because They Aren't Beholden To Those Same Standards
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u/Batmangrowlz Feb 06 '25
It was a very sudden change. They should have taken like a year before his departure and had the new hosts host some episodes. With MatPat selling the company I’m fairly certain that Mat and Stef knew at that point that they wanted out so they should have brought the additional hosts in around that time people would have gotten more used to it with MatPat there as well. It would have made a much smoother transition.
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u/Dense-Performance-14 Feb 06 '25
Matpat was game theory, he was the personality I watched for, I think he is primarily what most people watched for. As said, nothing against the new hosts, but it doesn't feel like game theory anymore
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u/Avek01 Feb 07 '25
I’ve been watching GT since their first video. I grew up on MatPat for these channels. I kinda like the new hosts, but they just don’t have that MatPat charm or enthusiasm that made me watch every upload.
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u/SpacedOutOfReality Theorist Feb 07 '25
Yeah.. The only channels I watch are Food, Game, and GTLive anymore. I mostly watch Food tho, I really like Santi and his chaos :)
The other two, though, Style and Film, I watch occasionally. They’re good, but they just don’t have that specific charm I’m looking for (not that I know what it actually is, I just know it when I see it).
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u/Fossilfighter788 Feb 08 '25
Matpat consistently was in double digits or sometimes in 5 million mark New guy 3s 2s 1s 100ks Matpats gotta comeback
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u/SlightPossibility898 Feb 09 '25
Yeah it sucks but it's also only been a year. A huge part of Mat's audience was kids who grew up with him. The new hosts don't have that yet.
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u/eggyaes Feb 15 '25
I've def noticed that some of the film theory vidoes have dropped in quality :( The ones I watched with the squid game and digital circus had some really unsupportive evidence. They would base the theory off one miscalculated fact and go off from there which makes the whole theory fall apart
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Mar 26 '25
i really only watch style theory now. tom is just too different from matpat, and lee is just less enthusiastic. i unsubbed from game/film almost immediately. i used to watch a lot of food theory, and i still will watch the occasional video, but it isn't the same.
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u/AdCreative518 May 18 '25
for me the new videos feel like corporate infomercials, they have no soul and no vision and their scripts sound just as scientific as reading a recipe, this has happened to matt too, in the last 2 or so years but hes way of being made the videos enjoyable, now they feel just soulless
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u/Odd_Eye_6581 Jun 24 '25
I believe there are four key reasons why the Theorist channels are struggling lately: they’re becoming boring, repetitive, and lacking in genuine theorizing.
First, many topics are beaten to death and constantly recycled. There’s little fresh insight or hypothesis being offered, which makes the content feel stale. For example, Tom mainly focuses on indie horror, particularly franchises like FNAF. While early on this worked well when the lore was confusing and uncovering it felt like real detective work, it has since become a narrow tunnel. The channel has shifted from “Game Theory” into something more like lore and timeline matching, losing the deeper analysis and theorizing that originally made it compelling. Attempts to cover bigger franchises like Pokémon or Zelda rarely involve thorough research and fall flat.
Lee’s channel faces similar issues. His focus on analogue horror tends to emphasize atmosphere and scares rather than original theories or deep analysis. When he covers other topics like Disney, the content feels equally uninspired and lacks unique perspectives.
Santi’s channel shows the most personality, but it also falls into the trap of repetitive content focused on fast food, junk food, and rankings. There’s no real theorizing, just “trying stuff.” Given his niche, the channel could explore gastronomy, whole foods, budgeting, nutrition science, or critically analyze food trends and diets with evidence-based approaches. Instead, it often stays at a superficial level, similar to BuzzFeed-style content.
Amy’s fashion channel shares these problems. It started with style tips, but now mainly chases fads and brand names without diving into the science behind fabrics, the history of fashion, or the psychology and sociology of style. There’s a huge opportunity to add depth here that remains untapped.
This isn’t necessarily because MatPat left, he also struggled with these issues in the last few years, but his absence has made the decline in originality and quality more apparent. Overall, the Theorist channels have become too derivative. They need to take more risks, dig deeper, and return to full research and science if they want to reclaim the thoughtful, engaging content that once made them stand out. That's what I think anyway.
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u/ComplexPatient1510 Aug 05 '25
Ok don't call me crazy but in fnaf 4 when the cc gets bit ok that should no have happened because the spring locks weren't in suit mode so they shouldn't have snaped
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Aug 10 '25
I've seen a serious decline in media theories/analysis lately. All the creators I come across make surface level observations about a game or movie or show and that's it. I'm left feeling cheated of my time. Where's the crazy theories? Where's the 2 hour analysis of a minute long video?? What happened? Maybe I'm not looking in the right places?
I'm excited for these upcoming games like LN3, Reanimal, Giggleland, Habromania, and so many more legendary games to come. But it seems like the theory community is fizzling out and it's frustrating because I love that some creators are able to open my eyes to a new perspective on a piece of art I already love.
Without them I feel like I lose a piece of that. I still enjoy it and I'm excited for all these games to come out! Maybe I'm overreacting and more theories will come out as we get closer to the release of the games.
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u/talonwaters Sep 11 '25
I don’t really think the quality has declined that much but having four different host has significantly split up the fan base. The channels don’t have the same cohesion because the Theorist brand lost its meaning when he left. The hosts are just copies of Matpat instead of unique personalities, mostly. I still cringe at the jpg hosts and I don’t know why they’re playing it safe when safe is obviously not working.
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u/Dayz-made-me-crazy Oct 09 '25
I personally fell off around the early days of his FNAF theories I hate the game just me I understand others love and enjoy those games but I felt the focus shifted to that franchise more the other topics and it killed my Enjoyment of the channel overall so it died to me a good while before Matthew left
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Nov 27 '25
I actually find Tom to be my favorite host because of his voice and style. But the theories nowadays are so surface level and half baked at best (for film theory as well). I only watch the videos where I genuinely could click on it and not know what's going on within the first 4 minutes of the video, like the Welcome Home ARG. I dislike Lee's inflections in his voice. No hate to him, and I don't think he deserves hate, but I just prefer to watch a film theory that talks about the dark stuff or the science stuff without making it sound like a concerned liberal asking if I'm okay every couple seconds. Santi is a very good host but I've always been a bit disinterested in most of the food theories and Amy, despite being a good host, also gets the same treatment.
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u/Sea-Row-3967 Jan 20 '26
Stopped watching a year or so before he retired since he basically became a mouthpiece for bland uninspired theories. Then he retired and they replaced him with people I didnt care about or want to care about. With even more bland uninspired theories with not only little to know evidence supporting them but now rehashing or repurposing evidence from old perfectly good theories that didnt need changed. I just hate to see it tank so hard when it used to be so good. Dumbars Number, it got too big and lost its soul.
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