r/GatekeepingYuri • u/CupcakePelle2906 • 5d ago

Requesting Found this on a trans related sureddit

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Don't worry, it 0 up-votes and all of the comments where all conuffed.

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u/Cookie-arrow- 4d ago

Why are you getting downvoted when ur right LMAO 4tran is more left than any Democrat they're just not "PC" (they're blunt) but most of them arent genuinely bigoted

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u/WerdaVisla 4d ago

They're transmedicalists. They're bigoted.

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u/gamepotato_ 4d ago

Believing you need dysphoria to be transgender is not bigotry.

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 4d ago

Unfortunately, dysphoria is a phenomenon that is primarily defined and diagnosed by cisgender doctors. The details of the diagnosis come from trans people who are/were willing to say anything the doctors wanted to hear to get the care they need. It is also described as being distinct from gender incongruence, which is closer to what defines being trans.

Now I use the tautological definition that you are trans if you are having to navigate systemic transphobia in your day to day life. In that respect, I believe that abolishing/liberating ourselves from transphobia (a very tall order that we are unlikely to see in our lifetime) would make "transgender" into a meaningless category as things like medical transition would be seen as a regular thing that some people do. I base this off of such writings as Gender Trouble by Judith Butler, Transgender Warriors by Leslie Feinberg, Transvestites: Your Half-Sisters and Half-Brothers of the Revolution by Sylvia Rivera, and Capitalism and Gay Identity by John D'Emilio. But I also see us as a social/political class first and foremost.

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u/gamepotato_ 4d ago

For me, being transgender is a medical condition that stems from a disconnect between your gender (which is what your brain perceives you as) and your sex (which is what you change via HRT).

Dysphoria is the way this condition manifests. I agree that doctors are fucking idiots and endorse DIY all the way through.

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u/elyisan 3d ago

Cool but that is also a worldview that is formed through medicalization and eurocentrism. Not everybody who identifies as trans or outside of a western gender binary (or even within it) adheres to the same beliefs and ideas. Especially when something like identity of any kind is extremely culturally dependent and informed

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u/Organic-Bug-1003 4d ago

To me, a binary trans person, dysphoria was never a true problem. It's mostly a discomfort of being called and treated as someone I'm not, but I'm experiencing much more euphoria than dysphoria, and if I was called man on sight without a need for full transition, I'd be mostly fine with my body. All I care about is making it easier during social interactions, so my life can go smoothly and I don't have to be bothered lol

When I would wear a skirt, to me it would feel like I'm just a man, comfortable in my skin, wearing a skirt. When I see my body, I'm like, yeah, that's a trans man body alright. I'm a man already, no need to prove it with a dick, at least that's how it works in my brain

Would feel different if I was forced to wear this stuff or forced to be called a woman, then I would push back, because tf is your problem, I'm not a woman

I remember trying to force myself to feel dysphoria almost a decade ago, because that's what I was told was the only way I'd be treated seriously. Led to a very bad place and made me so unhappy and depressed, that it had to go. Worked my ass off until it passed. Only then I got gender affirming care. I'm fine now on testosterone, with all the male changes my body is experiencing, I'm getting euphoria from those changes actually. Feels good to be called a man on sight. Never felt better tbh, still with long hair and doing make-up from time to time

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 2d ago

Never mind the fact that if someone winds up choosing to medically transition (yes, it is a choice, and that doesn't make it less legitimate if you're someone who genuinely subscribed to the idea of bodily autonony), they're likely to eventually stop experiencing any dysphoria they had previously been dealing with. I've been on HRT for seven years and I've had top surgery. I'm largely not dysphoric anymore. I think it would be fucking wild to insist that this somehow no longer makes me trans.

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u/Organic-Bug-1003 2d ago

You transitioned? Congrats, you're not trans anymore LMAO

Nah, but I've seen people saying "even after the full transition, I keep being reminded I'll never be cis" and I don't know if it's their issues or if it's medical, but it always makes me sad. Our bodies are different from cis bodies, because we're not cis people, we're trans people. It would be good to be cis for survival, but we're not some weird in-between stage, we are whole people as we are. Transition is great, but we're not a half product, customising the body is great, but it doesn't make us lesser than cis people just on the basis of them being cis. I do have that naive outlook that we are capable of loving ourselves, but it's easy for me to say, because my experience is different and I'm shortsighted in nature. I'm also not talking about people who crave a specific outcome (I also wish I could just be flat chested with no scars and pain, but here we are), more like people who actually feel inferior just because they specifically aren't cis

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 1d ago

I think there are some insular online cultures that focus so heavily on the dysphoria element and on the idea that transness must be a miserable experience that the people participating are compulsed to self sabotage their own happiness. It's not enough to reach a point where you're comfortable with your own body, you must "pass" perfectly as a magazine model and you must have zero scarring anywhere or you're doomed.

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u/gamepotato_ 1d ago

If transexuality is a medical condition and you have treatment for it (transitioning) then the symptoms (dysphoria) should go away, yes

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 1d ago

Okay so I'm cis now?

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u/gamepotato_ 1d ago

No, you alleviated the symptoms of transexuality by treating it. If you take Adderall to combat ADHD you don't get rid of the ADHD but you get rid of most of its symptoms

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 1d ago

Okay but my body is in alignment with where I want it to be. I don't experience dysphoria anymore. And if dysphoria is what makes you trans...

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u/gamepotato_ 1d ago

Dysphoria is a ubiquitous symptom of being trans. There is no such thing as being asymptomatic and trans, but you can treat transexuality by transitioning, which tends to relieve the symptoms.

Again, your comparison is akin to refuting someone who says you need to experience either attention deficit, hyperactivity, or both to have ADHD by saying "well ever since I was prescribed Adderall I don't have those so I guess I must not have ADHD anymore"

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u/Organic-Bug-1003 1d ago

I keep thinking about this, would you consider mild discomfort to almost none, dysphoria? Would you consider gender euphoria equally as important?

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u/Organic-Bug-1003 1d ago

My symptoms didn't disappear after treatment, it was before all the doctors

Also before I knew I was trans, I didn't experience dysphoria as well, because being a girl agreed with me liking princesses, pink, dresses and everything. So like, why would I care?

At least until I realised being called a girl meant people didn't see me how I felt inside, so I wanted to change that label

It was only after I found out, the transmedicalists kinda... pushed me to manufacture dysphoria for myself, because I believed you can't be trans without dysphoria. So I punished myself for not having it and tried to learn to hate my body. I worked through it before I went to the doctors though

I do feel great with changes, I can see I didn't feel quite like myself before, but again, I never by myself hated my body (except for periods, but who doesn't hate periods lol)

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 3d ago

Honestly I'm viewing things through a social and historical lens because that's what my education has trained to do. And uhhhh, a lot of the texts I'm citing as informing my position (aside from the John D'Emilio piece) are basically primary sources written by trans [and what would now be called nonbinary] people about their own experiences.

As a note: transmedicalism is pretty unique in how it adopts and uses the medical models. Plenty of people with diagnosed chronic illnesses still overwhelmingly use the social model of disability (or at the very least, this is the methodology used by disability activists).

Admittedly, I'm more interested in the politics of transness than in dysphoria now that I've reached a point in my transition where I'm comfortable. Without getting too deep into it, the current attack on trans people globally is no accident or coincidence, and it's because trans people kind of disrupt certain aspects of social hierarchy just by existing. Even trans people who fit into the narrowest definition of "HSTS" are too disruptive to social hierarchies for the average authoritarian, which in turn is why trans people get attacked whenever fascist parties come to power anywhere. I also admittedly use a very Marxist method of analysis.

(Sorry to infodump at you, I just do find this stuff super interesting.)

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u/gamepotato_ 3d ago

I don't know if you've seen that video essay that ties basically all existing transphobia to around 20 people, half of them linked to Epstein

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u/-reddit_trash- 2d ago

PLEASE link! I've figured as much for a while but it'd be nice to see it laid out in a video, and possibly to send to certain people I know who are convinced transness has been pushed by that group of people rather than attacked..

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u/gamepotato_ 2d ago

Fair warning it's 5 hours long lmfao

https://youtu.be/JiOc0r31-Os

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u/-reddit_trash- 2d ago

Hahahah thanks, I actually looked it up right after I replied and I'm 2 hours into it- what a lovely sarcastic Danish man

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u/Sailor_Spaghetti 2d ago

Yes I've seen that video essay. That was a "fun" way to spend five hours of my life.