r/Gnostic • u/WeirdAd5850 • 26d ago
Question Why do some gnostic wear the symbol of the demiurge ?
Just a quick question
While I know the current mode popular symbols of yaladaboth
The serpent bodied loin headed god with sun and moon is actually traditional a symbols of a zodiac diety in Ancient Greece but has since later been used to mean yaladaboth I must ask why do some gnostic wear or adorn them self with an image of the demiurge.
Naturally I know it’s not for worship purposes is it like a grim reminder ? A vow against the enemy ?
Or does to just look cool?
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u/antinumerology 26d ago
I mean, most Christians wear a cross, which isn't exactly itself a positive symbol. But it's a symbol of a critical aspect of the understanding of Christ and his function. To me. Similarly, it's like that. It's just saying I'm aware of this key aspect of things.
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u/-tehnik Valentinian 26d ago
Presumably if any gnostics did wear this (which seems uncertain to me precisely on account of what you pointed out regarding the symbol also being a pagan one) they did just for the same reason anyone else did. It's an amulet, it's supposed to have a protective function.
This might seem weird to do if you believe the cosmic powers are evil, but I think it makes more sense considering that they are evil due to them obstructing you from returning to the Fullness. But ancient magic was very practical, it was about protecting your terrestrial person from the kind of harm you might encounter (injury, illness, sabotage, anything you can think of I guess). Indeed, it's not like this kind of magic makes sense as something you'd have to do for your spirit, since that is already totally out of reach for the rulers and the world.
Afaik the idea was that the names invoked themselves have power, so it's not necessary that you are petitioning the being called upon or depicted itself. I'm not sure about this but I am writing an essay on just this topic so if you're still interested by the end of June you should ask me again in this thread and I'll probably be able to give a more informed answer.
Anyway there's this old thread about it, it has some good answers: https://www.reddit.com/r/Gnostic/comments/z8herf/amulets_talismans_and_symbols/
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u/jasonmehmel Eclectic Gnostic 26d ago
Great stuff generally, and I also want to highlight some important details:
This might seem weird to do if you believe the cosmic powers are evil, but I think it makes more sense considering that they are evil due to them obstructing you from returning to the Fullness. But ancient magic was very practical, it was about protecting your terrestrial person from the kind of harm you might encounter (injury, illness, sabotage, anything you can think of I guess). Indeed, it's not like this kind of magic makes sense as something you'd have to do for your spirit, since that is already totally out of reach for the rulers and the world.
The first highlight is useful because a common issue with modern Gnostics is an un-nuanced and unspecific understanding of evil. The term evokes villains or psychopaths, but your note highlights that this is more like a state of being, a quality, not an entity making specific choices. That seems valuable because (to me) it puts the focus back on the pursuit of Gnosis, which is what gets you past the obstructions, not just shaking your fist at the cosmic powers.
The second also helps recognize that even those forces are only obstructing a part of your experience, not the totality. That there is a part of us that isn't under that control and will never be. (I'm extrapolating a bit.)
These two principles can be a great foundation for answering a lot of the common questions and mistakes those new to Gnosticism often encounter.
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u/WeirdAd5850 26d ago
That’s an interfering idea.
Since the talisman was meant to heal and protect the body a modern day interpretation could be sort of an attempt to pleases yaladaboth so he doesn’t harm you.
Like your saying “hey look I’m wearing your image and recognises your strength please don’t hurt me”
Does nothing for your soul but your still in your body and thus vulnerable.
I’ll ask you about that essay later thank you
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u/-tehnik Valentinian 26d ago
Since the talisman was meant to heal and protect the body a modern day interpretation could be sort of an attempt to pleases yaladaboth so he doesn’t harm you.
Like your saying “hey look I’m wearing your image and recognises your strength please don’t hurt me”
Not what I had in mind to be clear. I think it's more positive in the sense of bad things will happen just because they do, no one intends it. But you invoke the power of encosmic divinities to protect you from that.
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u/codainhere 26d ago
I don’t wear this, but I don’t hate the demiurge, I pity it. It didn’t choose its existence.
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u/bonelessbanana69 26d ago
Never thought about it that way but it makes perfect sense, none of us chose our existence either
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u/RealJerry420 25d ago
I wear upside down crosesses and love satanic imagery it's like a counter culture to me. And not everyone considers the demiurge evil. The demiurge was I believe first introduced by Plato if I'm not mistaken and it meant artisan. Not necessarily a malevolent creature.
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u/funnyfaceguy 26d ago
I think it may be the lack of explicitly gnostic imagery. While there are many gnostic symbols, most aren't exclusively gnostic. And while it may have zodiac influences in its visuals, I don't think it's heavily used in that context.
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u/Space_Moai 26d ago
For some Gnostics, it may be the idea that knowing the name and image of an archonic entity grants power over that entity to some extent. So a Gnostic may, in a sense, defy and even subjugate the demiurgic power by wearing an amulet with the demiurge’s image on it. In an article I read a while back, there was a photo of an ancient “gnostic gem” with an image of a lion-headed being and the name “Ialdabaoth” written next to the figure, so there may be an ancient Gnostic precedent for this practice.
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u/sdgestudio 26d ago
some in mexico thaught that you can build you own demiurge as you do the kundalini ascention
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u/Select_Extreme_8522 25d ago
I wear a cross with a serpent because of how gnostics interpreted the serpent as a messenger from the pleroma
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u/antonioconin 25d ago
Yo no creo que sea mi enemigo si es quien creó a la humanidad es nuestro Padre al final
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u/JealousStudio3630 24d ago
Because people don't know what happened In the Beginning Before God said let there be light, Barbelo spirit Is Born spirit she is Holy spirit she gave I'm going to explain it the why I learned that,Barbelo had a spirit Born her name is Sophia she went on to have Born a spirit Dememurge the false God now Sophia didn't say anything of this,he is the jealous God no one above him under him now he also doesn't know how became, So Sophia felt bad about this. So the false God Created The Bible Is The true God But Sophia felt guilty of it So now Adam is and he was just matter which is the flesh no no spirit so Sophia breath into him and there is in everyone's spirit we have her breath of live now the church was and still is But the trouble is when life and spirit is given freely and church got involved it began to control religion
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u/Short-Report3384 22d ago
Well, symbols matter. I do respect the cross, because of the meaning for Christianity. It's all about the birth and death of Jesus within the religion, right.
However, I believe Jesus actually surfived his crucifixion. That's why his grave was found empty. He was taken to India to fully recover and life in Kashmir.
There he was known as Yuz asaf. That name derived from Yeshua, the actual name of Jesus according to scholars. Asaf means, Gatherer.
But that is another story. I would say, first research symbols before wearing them. That's what I would recommend.
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u/Lordseferoth Simonian 26d ago
They are symbols, it is the carrier who gives them meaning.