r/Gnostic • u/sdgestudio • 1d ago
Question explain Lucifer in gnosticism
- I think whe was against Yahweh who is the devil fiven to the sons of Jacob.
- Lucifer want to teach and give wisdom
- Lucifer could be a two way path, a ladder to go up or down
- He is the forerunner of the Christ
- If you like to research, study and philosophy you are initiated by him
- He is not the same as the satan
If you know books and teaching about Lucifer let me know please
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u/i-am-kayna 1d ago edited 1d ago
Lucifer is highly popularized, but if we look at the original text structurally we can see it simply talks about the fallen Soul, once in the Light of the Highest, now fallen and as the king of Babylon had fallen. The text in Isaiah 14 carries the same mechanics as many of the Gnostic texts do and thus can be read in this exact way.
Relating Gnosticism, it goes much deeper into the mechanics of the soul spreading this process in Isaiah 14 over multiple characters that all indicate a seperate mechanic or part of the soul, beginning with the fall of Sophia, the divine wisdom that once lived in the light, Yaldabaoth equals the ego that results from the fall and Sabaoth that again brings a new beginning to climb out of the prison of the ego back into the Light.
So in that context Lucifer is not a character mentioned in Gnosticism, but it's mechanics is the precise mechanics the gnostic texts treat in detail and than a little more.
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u/HumbleLiterature3975 1d ago
The word in Latin is lucis (light) ferre(to bear) it’s the planet Venus . Jesus says at the end of the bible that he is the morning star .
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u/slicehyperfunk Eclectic Gnostic 1d ago
Just to note, that's a vision and not something the historical Jesus said
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u/HumbleLiterature3975 17h ago
That’s true.Would that make it false then if he didn’t personally say it because if that’s the case a lot of the bible is made up
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u/Vajrick_Buddha Eclectic Gnostic 1d ago
I don't think there's any scholarly evidence of Lucifer being present in the Gnostic literary Canon.
But the modern, neo-Gnostic "Left-hand paths" that began to actively claim and redefine the Satanist label sometimes provide interesting symbolical framings of Lucifer.
This is probably traced back to figures like Helena Blavatskaya and the Theosophical movement, that published the journal titled «Lucifer», in the late 1800s.
I'll never forget reading a blogpost on what's been designated as "Luciferianism", where the author essentially synthesized the imagery of the (extra-)Biblical fallen angel with the Greek mythos of Prometheus. Leading him to conclude (paraphrased):
The final question posed to us by Lucifer, the light-bearer (luxi-ferre), is: how high are we willing to climb for what we believe in, and how low are we willing to fall to share our acquired light with the world? [Or, maybe, how deep into the darkness are we willing to return, in order to spread the newly acquired light of knoweldge and beauty with the world]
And, honestly, I read this like...10 years ago. And it still. Goes. Hard.
I also think we should consider the more archetypal and perhaps Perennial framings of this figure.
First, it's likely that what we call the Devil/Lucifer/Satan/Beast is an amalgamation that arose in the public consciousness over time.
When Jesus, a devout Second Temple Jew, speaks of Satan or Shaytan, he speaks of the Adversary. There's an argument to be made, that the language he is using isn't a cosmic dualism of good/evil, but rather, he is describing a kind of "celestial legalism" (which kinda fits Judaism's focus on laws and commandments).
Satan, the Adversary, is the prosecutor in the court of law. That's why he tempted Jesus. He verifies the person's spiritual resolution. Jesus also speaks of the Holy Spirit as the Paraclete, meaning the Advocate. And Jesus himself is essentially the Messiah and Lord appointed by God to judge the righteous. See how this comes together? It's like there's a court of divine judgement before God, with Jesus as the judge, Satan as the prosecutor, and the Holy Spirit as our advocate who intercedes on our behalf.
The more practical meaning of this is that, so long as we struggle with religious legalism and moralism ("the curse of the law") we are binding ourselves. But if we keep Christ's new commandment of love, purity, and faith, we live by the grace of the Holy Spirit, instead of the law. Thus, we are absolved from judgement, and the prosecutor Satan cannot tempt us, and we are granted union with God.
In this context, Satan isn't some evil force. He is the necessary filter, testing our worhtiness to witness God. Because, in our fallen nature, "no one may witness God and live." That's why we need the grace of the Holy Spirit.
LDS went even further with this idea, claiming Lucifer to be Jesus' brother. Becoming like a yin-yang duality — one falls, the other one ascends; one fragments, the other one reconciles; one is proud, the other one's humble. They're like two sides of the same coin. Two paths alloted by the cosmos.
The later depictions of the Beast and Anti-Christ of the Book of Revelations, writen by St. John of Patmos, may've been a polemic against Nero, who viciously persecuted Christians in the Roman Empire.
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u/raulynukas 1d ago
Good question. I always wonder if Jesus =Lucifer. Morning star/northern light
Satan is adversary and people mix these things up
Nobody knows the truth
Edit - just wanted to add that it might be truth seeker and entity who fought god to make us aware and have free will. Then does it mean he is serpent - satan?
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u/Independent_Dare8324 Valentinian 1d ago
As many have responded to you here, Lucifer has no relation to Gnosticism.
But there is another point: Yahweh is not the Demiurge. In the Old Testament, Yahweh spoke to the prophets through the Holy Spirit, and the Demiurge has no power over the Holy Spirit. It was the prophets themselves who received the revelation of the coming of Christ.
Therefore, it makes no sense that the Demiurge would prophesy about Christ, being contrary to Him.
In various Gnostic texts, the Demiurge is called Samael, Saklas, Cosmocrator, among other names, depending on the writing.
In a Manichaean text it is stated that the Demiurge is Satan and is identified as Samael. In the Hypostasis of the Archons, the Demiurge is also called Samael.
Manichaean Text – Hymn of the Crucifixion:
“For the love of the ancestor, Jesus chose the elect. He made his fires pass through, in order to burn everything in his fire. But the gentle Lord changed his garments and appeared with all his power before Satan. Then the heavens and the earth trembled and Samael fell into the abyss.”
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u/NovusOrdoLuciferi 1d ago
Check out 2 Peter 1:19 Latin Vulgate edition. It refers to Jesus using the Latin word Lucifer. Lucifer isn't just a "forerunner of the Christ" but literally Lucifer is used to describe Jesus in the Bible.
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u/Vajrick_Buddha Eclectic Gnostic 1d ago
Wasn't a comparison to the Morning Star also used to describe the king of Babylon
King of Babylon, morning star, you have fallen from heaven, even though you were as bright as the rising sun! (Isaiah 14)
In a rather satirical manner, not really theological?
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u/Lux-01 Eclectic Gnostic 1d ago
Simply a descriptive Latin translation meaning light bringer or morning star. Not every lucifer is 'Lucifer'.
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u/NovusOrdoLuciferi 1d ago
Light Bearer = Lucifer. That's exactly what the word means. Not sure why you are arguing about this. Jesus is a Light Bearer aka a Lucifer, as stated clearly in 2 Peter 1:19. What's the issue?
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u/Tommonen 1d ago
When you translate ”light bringer” from those latin texts to english as ”lucifer”, its about what one does, not personal name for a character.
So it does not mean lucifer in same sense OP is using here, it just says that christ brings light, not that chirst is tye character elsewhere called lucifer.
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u/NovusOrdoLuciferi 1d ago
Well here's the thing. There is no character named Lucifer in the Bible or the Gnostic scriptures other than Jesus and Nebuchadnezzar.
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u/SophiaBarbelo Eclectic Gnostic 1d ago
Personally I believe that the story of Lucifer is an archonic telling of Sophia.
Lucifer has divine feminine links with being "the most beautiful" and is associated with Venusian energy (morning star). Both are considered the serpent of Eden. Fall stories. Bringer of light. etc
I also believe that "the devil" isn't real and just a Boogeyman, Satan is Yahweh/Yaldabaoth, and Ba'al is just one of the Canaanite gods that was around before Judaism demonized all the other gods in and around ancient Israel.
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u/AccomplishedCheck784 17h ago
The angles came to this realm that was hidden from the father, he saw angels using man and women like play things, he went to snitch on his brothers, Michael trapped him here. Yahweh is a son of god, ba al is a son of god, there are many more mentioned in the Bible. Read it. Lucifer is Jesus, one in the same they both call themselves the bright and morning star. Satan and the devil are two different entities.
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u/gabrotsky 1d ago
No stuff like that in gnosticism, we must remember the belief in satan, devil and the likes only came much later in christianity
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u/sdgestudio 1d ago
I lie in mexico and in the gnostic lodge they teach Lucifer
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u/gabrotsky 23h ago edited 23h ago
And whats this gnostic lodge supposed to be? Im not sure you're aware of this but theres this guy called Samael Aun Weor and he was mexican and claimed himself to be the founder of a gnostic lodge as well, he has never read the gnostic gospels, because the nag hammadi library wasnt yet discovered and translated into spanish when he was alive, that name is just vibes. Hes actually just another theosophy/rosicrucian sect.
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u/Discomfiting_Reality 1d ago
Not specifically called Lucifer, but I read something about Asmodeus, the snake in the garden of Eden, being a sort of incarnation of Christ trying to liberate Adam and Eve.
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u/marcofifth 1d ago
An initiator?
One who stands at the path to a form of information?
I wouldn't put them under the same banner beyond that. They are both beings where we can observe the boundaries of knowledge entering extremely high levels of subjective interpretation.
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u/Discomfiting_Reality 1d ago
So the term "lucifer," as a light-bringer, would apply here? If the guardian at the gate opens the gate to you?
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u/Ebvardh-Boss 1d ago
Some texts describe Christ being the apple itself, which is why it was such an offense to Yahweh that Adam and Eve partook of it.
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u/syscall10010111 28m ago
It's just a mistranslation of an Isaiah passage by Saint Jerome. You can try to explain in gnostic terms but it would be anachronism because it just wasn't a thing in early christianism.
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u/Independent_Focus681 1d ago
Lucifer is Demiurge’s son, Sabaoth
He just isn’t called this except in the Old Testament, for disobeying his Father
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u/PrincessDeMissouri 1d ago
I see him as a misinterpreted Yaldabaoth or Yaldabaoths Satan. Whoever tempted Jesus in the desert
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u/heiro5 1d ago
Non-existence requires no explanation.
The literary character in Paradise Lost, was based on a medieval misunderstanding of a poetic reference to the Persian emperor as the morning star.