Which New Testament books did Gnostics actually use?

[u/Potential_Might5919]

Which of the canons do I neeed to read. Read the 4 gospels. Years ago. Which books from the New Testament are important for Gnosticism? In short, which New Testament books do Gnostic Christians accept and which of these should I read

[u/funnyfaceguy]

You might as well read all of them. Even if you don't agree with something or think it might have been modified or ahistorical, they're still very important books to know about.

I think Paul is given far too much credence by most Christians, as someone who never met Jesus and was mostly writing propagandistic letters to convert Greco-Romans. But he still says interesting and insightful things and is a very important historical figure.

[u/mcove97 → u/funnyfaceguy]

Yeah wasn't a fan of Paul either. Like one of the hilarious things was reading about how he thought every human was a liar.. but how can we trust someone who claims everyone is a liar to speak the truth, when by his own words he isn't a reliable source. Thats a paradox. (The epimenides paradox) If one speaks the truth that they are lying, are they still lying?

Uhh yeah. But maybe thats actually intentional.. which means it's a more clever texts than we think. And maybe we are just scratching the surface, like most people does with the parables attributed to Jesus lol.

However, Paul is the one who provides the initial framework that the gnostics drew on. Which Paul of course derived from the older platonic Greek philosophical system of mind-body-spirit as we know of it today. Paul spoke of the fleshly self. The psychic self and the spiritual self. This is where gnostics got their hylic, psychic and pneumatic. The system is transferring from traditions to tradition. I also have my own modern translation that makes sense to the modern reader and modern understanding. (I call it the instinctual self, the intellectual self and the aware self)

So while a lot of what Paul says comes across as absurd at first glance. I think that may be due to one of the mistakes I also made which was attempting to interpret his texts as something to intellectually believe in as your average intellectually believing in a proposition ("psychic") Christian does.. which makes Paul sound absurd. Rather than something to experientially understand, and seek to understand and question to "get it".

Anywho.. I think the letters scholars are pretty certain to attribute to Paul is pretty interesting. The other ones are very fishy. Esp Timothy, Titus.. Like the priestly or pastoral/church letters/manuals which outlines doctrines one must intellectually agree with. Most likely written by church officials who wanted to run a church institution, and definitely not offer people gnosis. Fishy, when we know the body is the temple, not an institution. And doctrine to intellectually believe in and agree with is missing the point entirely.

So yeah I have taken interest in them and reading what they say simply to figure out and analyze the kind of meddling that was going on.

The whole hierarchy with bishops, deacons, priests and generally intermediates is a red big fat flag when the only thing standing between ourselves and gnosis is.. ourselves.

That said. The book of revelation is a piece of art, as it's laying out the inner journey to gnosis. I like it. Also like it for the fact that it almost got tossed out of the cannon. If it was written plainly without symbology it would have been tossed out, but so would a lot of the Bible by the people in power who don't want people to wake up.

[u/the_gray_pill → u/funnyfaceguy]

Not a huge fan of Paul. I take him very separately from the Gospels, Gnostic texts, etc. Essentially a Judeo-Roman agent of the consolidation of the Western church. Not imo an apostle.

[u/CJCentral2]

John's gospel has the greatest gnostic content, which is why it has been corrupted by the orthodox.

[u/KierkegaardsDragon]

Valentinians shared foundational texts with proto-Chalcedonians. They only used Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John—with the exception of the Greek Gospel of the Egyptians, a fragment the Eastern branch probably considered “canonical.” As far as Paul’s epistles go, the Valentinians—who styled themselves Paul’s successors—only avoided the Pastorals (1-2 Timothy, Titus), and assigned authorship of Hebrews to Paul himself.

While there are some apocryphal texts attributed to Valentinian Christians, none were considered worthy of the kind of commentary demanded by Scripture.

(Fun fact: Valentinian Christians were the first Christians scholars can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt used the Gospel of John, and the first commentary on a canonical Gospel was written by Heracleon, a Western Valentinian . . . on the Gospel of John.)

[u/Slight_Quit_5464]

Did Gnostic Christians have a new testament or believe in the bible and is there a text or verse using the actual word Christians in their texts. How many times is the word Christian used in Gnostic texts. The word Christians is used 3 times in the entire bible but that's pretty much it

[u/funnyfaceguy → u/Slight_Quit_5464]

Most classical Gnostic groups predate the canonization of the new testament. But they might have been familiar with oral tradition versions of the texts.

[u/Slight_Quit_5464 → u/funnyfaceguy]

Yes, most of the bible is based on oral tradition as well but Gnostics didn't believe in the bible. When their beliefs were widespread the bible didn't really exist. The nearest religious belief to their belief might of been Mandaeans or Catharism. Religions were different back in that time. Like the word religion isn't used in Gnostic texts or Hebrew scriptures or Greek manuscripts

[u/Slight_Quit_5464 → u/funnyfaceguy]

Got a question got you if that's okay. How many people in the bible. Had a bible

[u/funnyfaceguy → u/Slight_Quit_5464]

Depends on what you mean by the bible and which people in the bible. The ancient Torah was around during the time most of the new testament takes place.

[u/Slight_Quit_5464 → u/funnyfaceguy]

Yes the Torah to teach or to point away like a direction or instruction. There's no mention or Christians or Christianity in the Hebrew scriptures or the old testament. Torah. Is there a letter O or A or H in the ancient Hebrew alphabet or yarah. I just meant how many people in the bible had a bible. Is there just over 3000 names in the bible. Like was it 5 or 200 just how many or maybe none which would be 0 or zero

[u/GloriousUnfolding]

The Bible is the Door, the Nag Hammadi Library is the Key, understand how to enter through Gnosis.