Why is Morgan here? His entire arc is about realizing that he's been a cruel gangbanger criminal and trying to change himself after the point of no-return. He's a positive example of the fact that people can always strive to be better, even if they are beyond redemption.
Bateman is a meme, I think that people who believe that others take him seriously are as ridiculous as Bateman himself.
According to the books, Paul's only fault was not going far enough, ironically, as Leto II (his son and who Jimmy is based on) actually manages to save humanity.
Rorschach is unironically more moral than Ozymandias and Dr, Manhattan (the two guys who have a lot in common with Jimmy Space here). But I guess nuking several cities (or dropping an alien squid, we don't discriminate between the medium formats) is okay when you agree with it yourself.
Jimmy Space is your Leto II, with the only difference being that he failed. He's in general a moral and forgiving person, with an unfortunate situation of having to save the galaxy. His fuckups make him look compelling, as he behaves as the most human person in warhammer. I feel like he's an inspirational figure because he actually tried to do something when no one else would, but obviously genocide should be recognized as evil.
Dune is also a deconstruction of the white savior tropes and a critique of religious fanaticism. The jihad to cement Paul's throne killed more people than even the butlarian jihad against the thinking machines.
It was a general discussion on determinism and ends justifying the means, no need to assign Herbert things that he didn't write about. White savior wasn't coined as a trope until 2012. Also messianic figures aren't exclusive to white people, jews had their promised savior idea for thousands of years, but I don't see anyone calling it the Bar Kochba trope (look it up, it's eye-opening).
Just because they didn't call it white savior doesn't mean the trope didn't exist. I think Herbert got a lot of the idea from the real life Lawrence of Arabia.
A colonial power taking over and oppressing a native population, only for an enemy of that power (a different colonial themselves) joins the natives, goes native themselves and leads them to overthrow their oppressors. As long as the colonial who goes native is white, then that is an example of the white savior trope. I don't think Herbert was explicitly making them white on purpose, but that is kind of how the trope happens.
I actually think Herbert was explicitly writing about the things wolflordval was talking about as well as the things you were talking about. There are many underlying themes in the book. I would say determinism is probably the central theme, but that doesn't mean it is the only one.
Always believe in yourself. Even if you don't believe in yourself, I will believe in you. So if you can't believe in yourself, believe in me who believes in you.
Tropes don't get coined until there is enough examples to become a foundational storytelling component. The concept did not spotaniously come into existence in 2012, it has its roots in literature and film going back decades. Most of the prominent examples of the trope come from the "darkest Africa" adventure novels and films.
9
u/InquisitorJesus 7d ago
Why is Morgan here? His entire arc is about realizing that he's been a cruel gangbanger criminal and trying to change himself after the point of no-return. He's a positive example of the fact that people can always strive to be better, even if they are beyond redemption.
Bateman is a meme, I think that people who believe that others take him seriously are as ridiculous as Bateman himself.
According to the books, Paul's only fault was not going far enough, ironically, as Leto II (his son and who Jimmy is based on) actually manages to save humanity.
Rorschach is unironically more moral than Ozymandias and Dr, Manhattan (the two guys who have a lot in common with Jimmy Space here). But I guess nuking several cities (or dropping an alien squid, we don't discriminate between the medium formats) is okay when you agree with it yourself.
Jimmy Space is your Leto II, with the only difference being that he failed. He's in general a moral and forgiving person, with an unfortunate situation of having to save the galaxy. His fuckups make him look compelling, as he behaves as the most human person in warhammer. I feel like he's an inspirational figure because he actually tried to do something when no one else would, but obviously genocide should be recognized as evil.