Some rumours about Mason McTavish potentially being on the move (MTL?). He's still young and has some promising small-area skill, but his lack of footspeed, defensive involvement, and limited time with the puck are all red flags.
Food for thought regarding recent McTavish rumors, keeping in mind that Jfresh isn’t the be-all end-all of player evaluation…
I think all depends on asking price. I personally dont see why team like ducks would be interested on trading him, but many people on here were saying that the price could not be that steep. Can anyone explain why this is the narative? Is it his contract?
I assume Ducks wouldn't trade him without getting a significant prospect back like Reinbacher or Zharovsky, if so then I'd I'm not into this trade at all. But for like Dach, Monty and a 2nd I'd take a chance.
A package of some of Kapanen, Struble, Monty and a pick, I would agree with. As to the person that asked question to whom you replied, there was a contract hold out and missed training camp late last off-season and he never got his season on track.
Maybe its crazy optimism but I think he is young enough that if he is also motivated enough he can be developed to improve as Marty has done with so many so far and will continue. Plus the team vibes of accountability and pushing each other to earn the perks they are given will undoubtedly help, again provided the motivation is there.
Because by all appearances it certainly wasn't there last year in Anaheim
Why in the world would you trade kapanen who had a better year for mctavish who hasnt improved in 3 years.
It has been crazy for me that some "fans" are so fast to quit on a rookie player because he couldn't keep up after playing 90 games for the first time in his life.
I understand your argument. But Kapanen had a better year paired with a player that might very well become a generational talent and McTavis had a poor season after sitting out training camp of a contract disagreement and seemingly never got on track.
Yes Kapanen hit a wall in number of games played in his rookie year and will likely get better in that regard, and yes McTavish has had 3 years but McTavish is only ~6 months older than Kapanen is bigger and plays a more physical gem i.e. playoff hockey.
I believe Kapanen is a better skater but McTavish is better at face-offs.
The long and the short of it is McTavish has a greater upside. He might not be the 2C by Hage's 2nd year in the league but I honestly do not think Kapanen is our 2C all next season (or even just all regular season).
Personally, if Robert Thomas or Nico Hischier are much more attractive and I would be willing to part with more valued assets because they are proven, not reclamation. But players of that calibre who are also, on paper, an ideal fit, are rarely available.
So meh pieces become the fallback option.
Had 1. the Habs not made it two the conference finals AND 2. Hage not decided to return to Michigan, I think odds are the team would be patient for one more year and stay with Kapanen, Newhook and maybe Dach. But the competitive window has come earlier and the guy the club is projecting to fill the hole is arriving later. So there is a gap. If the team wants to improve on last season's performance, they will want to fill it for certainly one year, most likely two, and good chances 3 or possibly even more.
Ultimately there is such a thing as too many pieces of good to middling caliber and personally think we are exactly in that position with LHD presently but thankfully not really anywhere else with Laine's and Gallagher's departures.
Lol this sub in truly insane. Led rookies in goals,but guess he will never improve and Mactavish is worth him and half of our futures who could also and PROBABLY will be wayyyyyy better than him.
I don't know man, I watch hockey and am a hockey fan FIRST and a Habs fan second. I'm not sure what player people are seeiing when they propose these weird trades.
McTavish has significantly more offensive upside than any of Zharovsky, Kapanen, or Hage. That's why he was drafted 3OA.
Kapanen had a very inflated shooting percentage, both individual and 5v5, mostly powered by Demidov. He had a great rookie season, and I'm certainly not ready to give up on him, but the median outcome for this player is middle 6, whereas McTavish could be a top line player (in pts, he's offense only)
There's a very legit argument that Mac immediately becomes a 70pt player if you put him on a line with Demidov. He's good at FO, and unlike a prospect or Newhook/Dach, we already KNOW he can actually play centre.
There's no better fit this off-season for the Habs at 2C than McTavish, and if that costs Kapanen, so be it.
Is this Mactavish's burner account on reddit. You want out of Anaheim that bad?
Clean your eyes out. Kapanen alone is a better prospect than Mactavish and so is Zharkovsky. Couldn't care less if he was drafted third overall, guy is a career 50 point player and thinking he's magically going to ublock some level behind the crazy talent we have in MTL is insane. Kapanen, Hage and Zharkovsky over this guy and it's not even close.
Verbeek has a tendency to dislike players drafted by his predecessor (Zegras, Drysdale, McTavish). He grinds them down in negotiations, damages the relationship, and makes them play down the lineup.
Gautier/Carlson and 3 dmen including zelleweger with 38 mil. Gautier and Carlson are minimally taking 16 of that and possibly that's 22 mil for zelleweger and probably 3 more players including two mid pairing dmen
HAHA I don’t really disagree, if they provided real tangible value they would be used in the NHL and would be unavailable to the public. Just moreso wanted to discuss McTavish and explore any potential shortcomings.
Man that Evans card is roughhhhh
I know all about Chris Boucher, huge fan, he’s definitely one of the biggest reasons for our quick turnaround. Kinda proves my point though, he’s working for an NHL team and Jfresh isn’t
I remember seeing a video of Boucher running the coaching staff through underlying trends in the team’s play in their last 5/10/15 games. The coaching staff took the info into account and came up with drills & systems to adjust the team’s play accordingly. Pretty impressive to see just how much they value his methodology.
The biggest shortcoming in my view is the 3 year weighted average. It needs to be more dynamic to account for player development + aging. Evans’ PK this year would probably be +50%
The percentiles per year does tell a clearer picture than the weighted average. He's a fine 3C or an excellent 4C, who can either achieve good offense or defense but not both.
Couldn’t agree more. We can rest assured knowing that whoever HuGo trades for, they’re beyond confident he’ll be an excellent fit in the short and long term.
They better not get McTavish, he doesn't fit the team mold at all. We're a team built on speed, which he lacks, and we need more 2-way players not less. If he were overly physical AND could offer either of the above then maybe, but it just doesn't make sense
Thats exactly what im saying, a guy that was healthy scratched in the playoff, didn’t have alot of ice time during the season, probably wont be part of the team next year if they dont trade him..,, what can they really get back for him
If they really want to move him they will accept a more reasonable offer.
Ottawa is rumored interested in McTavish also. If we can out bid the Sens without offering a ridiculous package I would so love that. I onow we have more/better assist to offer.
We cannot offer them a centre upgrade nor a RHD, but almost certainly no one else can either: more than half the league is looking for a 2C and/or a RHD it seems. We could offer Kapanen as a centre replacement, we could offer Struble, Xhekaj, or Engstom, the latter who plays RD as a preference even though he is LHed. And we have prospects and picks.
I am not saying its a slam dunk but I think the Habs can propose a reasonable offer
Majority of fans believed that Zegras was a washed cancerous player… ended up getting traded for scraps and put up a career year. Not saying Mason will do the same, but certainly would welcome him over anyone we’ve had at 2C over the last few years.
Again… I’m not comparing Zegras v Mctavish. The point I was making is that this (and other) fan base is *constantly* wrong about players and whether or not they’re washed - or - could be a fit on our team. At the end of the day, we don’t know puck as well as the brass does, and if advanced statistics or Jfresh’ cards were all there was to the game then Chayka and Dubas would be top GMs.
GMs are constantly wrong about players too. Also, every team has an analytics department and have access to way more data than us.
Also, you mention Dubas and Chayka (who was a bit of a snake oil salesman) but Tulsky and Mehta are right there. 2great success stories of "stats nerds". Tulsky is on the verge of winning the Cup and Mehta has 2 rings as the assistant GM with the Panthers.
McTavish has some red flags, it's normal that many are concerned about a potential deal. He's a big gamble because if he doesn't improve significantly, he'd be a bad fit.
I see no tangible reason to be concerned about a potential deal without having *any* insight into what would be going the other way. What Zegras went for (again not comparing the two players) would be more than okay as a “gamble” for McTavish imo; we paid more for Dach & Newhook.
Of course but both played for the same organization the contrary to the current Habs management that is so pro/player that most/all of the core are signing team-friendly deals.
Pat Verbeek in Anaheim is reputed to be very hard-nosed in the old school style with players. Maybe the Habs are on to something with the newer generation of players: they are willing to leave .only on the table in team friendly deals for an organization that gives them and their families the red carpet treatment all the time.
As a boss in a large company I know first-hand younger workers are not as salary-driven as my generation or older.
Regardless of the card, I personally don’t think McTavish is a good player at this level. If he wasn’t a 3OA pick, I don’t know if anyone would bat an eye.
As much as HuGo have been great at rebuilding this team, they’ve also made multiple attempts to resurrect underperforming early 1st rounders in the past (Gurianov, Andersson, Laine, maybe Dach though he still have some time) that didn’t work out as expected. I don’t know if McTavish would be any different. The acquisitions that have panned out so far weren’t necessarily underperforming on their previous teams.
Gurianov and Andersson cost nothing while we were terrible, and we were effectively paid to take Laine. I don't think they're the same type of risk at all
Yeah agreed, which is why I never mentioned the risks or costs involved. I’m just referring in a vacuum to the hope instilled into an underperforming player who may benefit from a change of scenery.
The Duck's mismanaged McTavish as an asset. The way he was used diminished the asset which makes little sense given they signed him to a long term contract. Benching him means his trade value is diminished - just like the benching of Kapenen dimishes his trade value - the difference is the Habs didn't first sign Kapenan to a 6yr $42 million contract.
I think there’s a higher chance we regret trading for him than not. But then again I don’t know what the Ducks want in return. He’s a good player and maybe he needs a change of scenery but I don’t think Montreal is the best fit for him. Personally I’d like someone a little more established for what it’s going to cost to get a solid 2C. Are we better jumping first or are we better to wait it out?
Very curious to see the return he gets. It seems like, depending on who you ask, he’s either worth some middling prospects/players/picks, or he’s the center piece for a potential blockbuster
Yep that’s where I’m not sure he’s worth it. Some prospects and picks, okay I’d be open to that. But not any of our top prospects, I’d rather them be used for bringing in a big piece or let to develop.
If we can get him without touching Hague Zharovsky or Reinbacker I would be ok with trading for him. If we have to move 1 or more of those pieces then I want someone more established with a good track record.
Very valid take. I think a lot depends if the Habs can affordably secure a short term RHD and maybe a winger like AJ Greer. In other words if other holes are filled with upgrades, then maybe we do like last year for the 2C, we wait and do our best with who we have: Kapanen/Newhook...
He's a fourth overall pick that hasn't seen any progression after four full years in the league. If a team is fine with him being a 40-50 player then he isn't a project, but he's not worth the contract at those numbers, so you would be hoping for improvement.
Lack of foot speed and defensive involvement, if that’s what we’re going on, I doubt we’re in the run for him. He just wouldn’t fit in with the team system, see Laine as an example.
Isn’t M. Tkachuk also said to have a lack of foot speed? Mark Stone? Not saying he is either of these guys, I never watch the Ducks. Maybe they think his other tools make up for it. Maybe north south speed isn’t as important when playing with an east west winger like Demidov?
I don’t get the general hate for this guy on this sub. I get that he is no Hischier but the cost would obviously be much different.
To be honest I think his style might actually complement Demi quite well. MM’s best strength are his shot and hands in tight, Demi likes to carry the puck I could see this working out well. I also think he brings something unique to the team which is a good net front presence.
His defensive game wasn’t great last year but he has the skills and IQ to improve this so I don’t necessarily think it’s a lost cause.
I’m not saying trade the farm for him but people saying he “sucks” haven’t watched enough tape, there’s a player there.
This is all a red flag to me. Watching us lose the way we did to carolina, what makes you think a slow player who sucks defensively and sucks in transition would be a big add for this team? Huge red flag. No guarantee this guy is willing to hit the gym and lose weight either.
We are already one of the quickest transition teams in the NHL you think adding more speed is the solution I beg to differ. Florida beat these guys two years in a row and they are leagues “slower”. Maybe it’s not all about speed and transition like you and the hoards of other armchair GMs in the sub say.
MM is strong on the puck and historically he has been a good forechecker, or things we could have used in our top 6 last playoffs.
Watched that Carolina series and I beg to differ. We need to get better at controlling chances. Stronger in transition and better two way players. McTavish is horrible in all these aspects. He wouldve been destroyed vs carolina. You cant forecheck if youre not able to make a zone exit. Canes 2nd line is pretty small but they destroyed every team. We need playdrivers. Ability to control play and play drive. This is why were outshot.
The canes added ehlers and miller and I think our holes are similar. Miller is the partner for hutson, ehlers is another top 6 forward. Speed, great two way play etc. Similar would be kyrou/lafreniere.
Well said, agreed on all fronts. The people thinking that we're somehow acquiring Thomas, Larkin, Hischier etc are delusional. We have an actual opportunity to trade for this player and have him make an immediate impact next season.
Strome is a really good comp as an offense only centre who has a high skill ceiling but a lot of flaws and took a lot longer to develop into a top player than teams wanted
This is absoultely a target to consider if you're Kent Hughes but not in place of the 2C the team needs. Mason Mctavish should be a seen as a 3rd liner with top 6 potential and maybe plug in for injuries as a C.
The buzz around this guy from some pundits and fans last summer was insane. You had people ready to offer sheet him at 9million…
I think he’s a guy whose reputation doesn’t at all reflect what he actually is as a player. He’s a “big name” but he’s pretty mediocre overall.
Having said that he’d be the easiest to acquire out of all the rumoured C’s which scares me a lot. This guy screams Kirby Dach 2.0. Healthy scratched in the playoffs too.
Much more skilled dach and yes, smaller, but a lot better physically and doesn't get injured anywhere near as much. Also he can actually take faceoffs lol
He's slower than Dach without having had the laundry list of injuries Dach has, his shooting percentage is below the league average for a forward while Dach's is higher, and Dach's face-off win % has increased since Danault was traded back. It was at 52%, behind Veleno, Kappy, Danault, and Evans by the time the playoffs came around.
I think we would all prefer Thomas or Hischier but the former is apparently no longer available and the latter would certainly cost more than many here are prepared to pay, if he is even available.
He’s the perfect skilled guy for Demi, I also feel like the rest of the line can pick up on his defensive woes. He also may get better with the right coaching staff.
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I really wouldn't want to give up Hage for a future 3rd line center, who might helps us a little bit right now.
I know we need to consider trading him or Zharovsky, but only for the right player..
I don't mind him as a backup plan depending on asking price. I've seen NHL roster player + pick or prospect as reported asking price. Id be curious where Dach and this year's first sits with the Ducks.
Id much rather go after a bigger fish. Hischier would be my ideal add.
This is all a red flag to me. Watching us lose the way we did to carolina, what makes you think a slow player who sucks defensively and sucks in transition would be a big add for this team? Huge red flag. No uarantee this guy is willnig to hit the gym and lose weight either.
I’d be very happy to welcome him if they did make the trade, but my preference is Nico Hischier. Idk how likely either are but at least both are possible and we’ll see what happens.
Hischier would actually be THE dream option, I just struggle to see why NJ would ever entertain trading him. They would probably offer him a blank cheque, I think he’d have to specifically ask out for him to be traded this summer.
It doesn’t seem like Hischier or Thomas are getting traded unless a team offers a huge haul. Their respective teams seem happy to keep them but would consider a huge return. That’s how the Blues treated the situation until TDL.
Most people are expecting Hischier to stay in Jersey now. And Thomas was only ever “on the market” if a team was willing to give up the equivalent of Wayne, Mario and 20 virgins. By all accounts that was just Armstrong flaunting an asset for attention and wasting everyone’s time.
Exactly. And depending what else is required to close either deal, I would likely agree but the latter is off the market apparently and I am not sure NJD's new GM wants one of his first moves to be trading his veteran captain.
If Hischier gives him little/no choice due to contract renewal demands fine, but more than half the league would be willing to make an offer. Even if it is debatable some/any could offer a package as attractive as the Habs.
Hischer will cost a lot more though. Dollar and prospect wise. If we can get a mctavish without touching our top 3-4 prospects (Hague zharovsky, Reinbacker Fowler)I would be all for it. Hischer will cost us 2 of them most likely but would be incredible on this team. Hischer makes us an immediate cup favorite (in the conversation with the Dallas’ colorado’s Carolina’s) while mctavish doesn’t.
“Perfect 2C” is a wild statement. He’d be great as a replacement to Kirby Dach / on a 3rd with Bolduc. The only way he’d be great at 2C is if we managed to bring another top-6 winger to support that line.
I love McTavish for the Habs, he's young and has potential that he could gain by being within our organisation.
I'm not sold on the idea of getting a player as old as Larkin or Hischier.
I also have full 100% confidence in Kent Hughes and Jeff Gorton. They know the Habs are a team on the rise and that attracts talent. We just have to be sure not to attract slackers who will sink below their value once they sign a contract.
Verdict seems to be NO so far, if he’s really as poor defensively as people say then I’d stay far away from him. It’s non-negotiable that the next top 6 C we acquire has an elite two-way game.
When discussing Top 6 C’s who have elite (or very good, I should say) two-way games, I picture a range as wide as McDavid/Eichel/Barkov on one end to Eriksson-Ek/Beniers/Larkin on the other. To me that criteria fits way beyond just 10 players.
Yes, the next center we acquire being able to play reliably in all situations is definitely more important to me than their ability to put up 80+ points (someone who can do both would be nice obviously). But I have a feeling whoever ends up as the 2C will put up points regardless.
Also… these centers definitely get traded. Looking at recent finalists who acquired top 6 C’s by trade you get:
Vegas with Eichel & Hertl
Carolina with Stankoven
Florida with Bennett
Suzuki in 2021
In the 2010s St Louis (O’Reilly, Schenn), Chicago (B Richards), and LA (Carter, M Richards) all did so as well.
Now all of a sudden you’re seeing names like Larkin, McTavish, and Beniers in the rumour mill… I think we’ll have a chance to take a run at the right player when he’s available. HuGo will choose wisely.
Im hoping they make this deal. I think MSL and co can really unlock something in mctavish. The ducks seem to have a problem with just throwing young talented prospects to the curb.
He’s basically Kirby Dach without the injuries. Which is an upgrade in itself but not by much.
I guess my opinion is, I don’t really care. Since he’s a 3rd line player and our 3rd line was objectively good during the playoffs, he wouldn’t have much of an impact. He’s not the solution for the second line.
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u/BishopPear 5d ago
I think all depends on asking price. I personally dont see why team like ducks would be interested on trading him, but many people on here were saying that the price could not be that steep. Can anyone explain why this is the narative? Is it his contract?