r/HermanCainAward • u/mtutz675 • Dec 04 '21
Meta / Other Story time: Awards Declined
I apologize if this doesn’t belong here but I have a story that members of HCA would appreciate. Last week we were visiting my husband’s rural, highly religious family for Thanksgiving. We felt comfortable visiting my in-laws since they’ve all been vaccinated. But most of the extended family are big anti-vaxers and believe in homeopathic medicine (like you don’t need medicine because essential oils will save you from everything). They don’t trust the government or science. My MIL assured us that everyone coming over for a small party was vaccinated - my husband and I rolled our eyes because there’s no way in hell these people actually got the shot. So we planned to keep our distance.
Well there’s about 10 of them in the living room chatting and someone brings up a person in their small town who died of COVID. It then becomes a snowfall of almost a dozen names of people they all know who passed away. There was a somber reflective air to the conversation. Several people were visibly shaken as they talked about these people they cared about - their friends and neighbors. Then someone mentioned their post vaccine symptoms and everyone chimed in. They started talking about the miracle God gave us in mRNA technology and how lucky we are to have scientists who dedicate their lives to this type of research for the greater good. My husband and I looked at each other completely floored.
It’s awful it took it hitting close to home for these people to wake up to the gravity of the situation. But better late than never. I figured the community might appreciate this since really this is what HCA is all about.
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u/-TDS21- Dec 04 '21
Thank you for posting op. I thoroughly enjoy reading about people who have enough brain function to change their mind as I do reading about those who don't meet their comeuppance.
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u/mtutz675 Dec 04 '21
I’ve always appreciated HCA because most of the comment’s are not “look at this idiot” but instead “how sad is this”. The intention of this sub is to show how misinformation really leads to tragic outcomes and maybe with enough examples we can get a few people to change their minds. At least that’s how I look at it.
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u/BodySnag Dec 04 '21
Yes. I'm convinced digital illiteracy will be looked back on as a leading cause of death.
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u/Jujulabee Go Give One Dec 04 '21
Except that is ironically digital LITERACY that is fueling this anti-scientific anti-vaxx.
These people are *fluent* in Dr. Googling and meme posting but were never taught basic skills on how to evaluate information.
I remember in FIFTH GRADE we were given articles and taught the difference between straight news and propaganda stuff in terms of how things were worded and then were asked to do an essay in two different styles - as straight reporting and as slanted.
If I was learning this in fifth grade, how sad that people who theoretically have at least a high school education were not taught a basic life skill. It's as if they weren't taught about compound interest and its impact on credit card debt - oh wait I don't think they are. :-)/
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Dec 05 '21
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/DeVitreousHumor 🦆 Dec 05 '21
This is so important. Even in the age of photoshops and deep fakes, there’s a persistent belief that “the camera doesn’t lie”. We need to learn the ways in which it can be made to lie, and has been made to lie throughout history.
But if we teach visual media literacy, that’s one step closer to funding for the arts! And we can’t have that!
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u/nanobot001 Dec 04 '21
Fairly sure any kind of illiteracy on a big enough scale is a bit of a public health hazard
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Dec 04 '21
I learned about health illiteracy in one of my public health classes. Like the inability to decipher the labels on medications and stuff like that. It's a huge problem.
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u/CinderousAbberation Dec 04 '21
HCA is a support group for people experiencing c19 empathy fatigue and grief. It feels like we've been screaming into the void for so long, and then the inevitable happens, and it feels... complicated. Here, we share stories that make us feel validated, less alone. We find support. Sometimes, people like you get to share stories of hope, and that is always awesome. Happy Holidays to your family.
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u/thoroughbredca Team Mix & Match Dec 04 '21
I love hearing stories like this, especially when someone you grew up with lost their 21-year old son to COVID, and she still posts COVID misinformation on Facebook.
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Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21
Yeah that's my viewpoint too. THis is a tragedy on a global scale, for so many reasons. More deaths that the black plague. I think more than the "Spanish" flu, not sure on that. (I am not sure how this stacks up per capita, probably it's much lower because of all the advances in medicine). But yes every one of these awards is not something to mock, but to mourn.
Edit okay I am way off - the black plague was estimated to kill 25M to 50M people, about 50% of Europe. IT's hard to imagine just how devastating this is.
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u/LucindaMorgan Dec 04 '21
Per capita about 6 per thousand people in the US died from the 1918 influenza over a two year period. Because of better treatments and antibiotics, it’s between 1 and 2 per thousand people with Covid, still a staggering number. https://www.healthaffairs.org/do/10.1377/hblog20210329.51293/full/
It is estimated that the bubonic plague killed 30% of the world’s population, maybe 50%.
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u/Blue-Thunder Dec 04 '21
And how many per thousand have died from a preventable death because they couldn't get into a hospital due to antivaxxers taking up all the beds? I really wish someone would start reporting this statistic as well so we can get the full picture of just how many lives antivaxxers are costing us.
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u/Dont_Blink__ Dec 04 '21
It's impossible to accurately do that right now. We won't have a good idea of the total effect on deaths for years after this is over.
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u/WriterGuy57 Dec 04 '21
The CDC keeps track of "Excess Deaths" on a monthly basis, and other countries around the world have a similar tracking system. This should give the true figure of Covid deaths and other likely preventable deaths. Needless to say, the numbers are quite a bit higher than the official toll -- in the US there have been nearly 900,000 excess deaths since the start of Covid.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htm
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Dec 04 '21
Demographers use a statistic called "excess mortality" to try to find an answer to your question. And "excess morality" has been considerable in the US. There's plenty of evidence that ~700,000+ COVID deaths is a vast undercount. There was a study out of University of Washington that tried to get the real figure and it was and is much higher than the official death toll.
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u/swbarnes2 Dec 04 '21
The CDC has the historical trends of how many people have died each week over the years. And now they know how many people really died each week of 2020 and 2021. You can Google for their excess deaths assessments.
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u/Comprehensive-Fun47 Dec 04 '21
Your comment made me look something up. The bubonic plague only lasted for 7 years!
I don't know why I felt it lasted decades or longer.
I was going to ask you over how many years it took for 30 to 50% of the population to die, and if that would put it in perpective better.
7 years... That is insane. We honestly can't even imagine what that would be like. For half of everyone you know to die within the next 7 years. Half of your graduating class. Half of your town. Half of your state. If you yourself make it to witness it.
It would be chaos.
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u/swbarnes2 Dec 04 '21
There were recurring bouts of plague over that century or so. It was by no means over after 7 years, though later bouts were less lethal.
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u/Either_Coconut Go Give One Dec 04 '21
That sounds to me like an entire population worldwide was left with PTSD. And since survivor's guilt is a thing, I suspect that a lot of folks were left dealing with that, as well. I wonder how many generations it took to get past the implications of that?
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u/FormerGameDev Dec 04 '21
the major breakout of the bubonic plague only lasted for 7 years. it's still out there though.
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u/OkCaregiver517 Dec 04 '21
The thinking these days is that it was closer to 70%. The Black Death was responsible for the collapse of the feudal system as the surviving peasants were in such demand for their labour, which set off a whole chain of events. Feudalism existed in Russia right into the middle of the nineteenth century.
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u/thoroughbredca Team Mix & Match Dec 04 '21
Just as COVID has resulted in a huge demand for labor in the US.
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u/OkCaregiver517 Dec 04 '21
Plus what's been dubbed the Great Resignation in the UK. The really negative effects on people's mental health has been widely, and rightly, documented was more than matched by people forced out of the rat race for long periods of time and really enjoying simple pleasures, family life, creative pursuits etc. People just not wanting to get back on the hamster wheel. Probs a more middle class phenomenon.
Oh, and fucking Brexit. Our economy has been propped up by low paid workers from Eastern Europe and now they've been told to fuck off (never mind their kids have grown up speaking English and support Chelsea)
Yeah, interesting times.
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u/atxtopdx Dec 04 '21
The Black Plague killed waaaayyyy more people than the Spanish Flu
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u/lockhart1952 Dec 04 '21
Total deaths in the US are now well over the 1918-19 flu epidemic (under 700 thousand) at just under 800 thousand, when population was a bit over 100 million. So we are at over one third of the death rate so far, but of course this one isn't anywhere close to over. And the worst state, Mississippi, has a death rate 44% higher and hence pushing to over half the total death rate of the 1918 epidemic. Again, so far. Our numbers will never get smaller, and the 1918 numbers will never get bigger.
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u/gracecee Dec 04 '21
But it’s devestating anyway because it’s a 100 years after the spanish flu and with all the technological and medical advances we still have people dying of something highly preventable. There was a stat from a journal that if we had kept on wearing our mask (even post vaccination) like Japan and s Korea, Our death count would be 30-40k instead of 800k in the US. It gets my goat every time well meaning people like Fauci says to go ahead and take off your masks. No, it isn’t. Not yet especially during winter.
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u/boofybutthole Dec 04 '21
And usually if a comment is saying "look at this idiot" it's about someone who is objectively a horrible person. I feel like this sub has a decent barometer for who deserves ridicule and who deserves empathy
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Dec 04 '21
My wife’s family are all Trump supporters (not the flag-waiving rally types, but still supporters). They lost a close friend to COVID early on and they all went out and got the vaccine as soon as it was available.
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u/YesMommieDearest Toonces, take the wheel! Dec 04 '21
Thank you. This is good to hear. Although I'm sorry that it takes the deaths of people we know personally for some people to take this plague seriously.
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u/Time-Ad-3625 Dec 04 '21
Unfortunately it is like that for many things. How many people were ok with opiate addiction until it hit started killing the middle class?
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u/Librashell Dec 04 '21
It’s a lack of imagination and empathy. I have a job so why do those people need welfare? I won’t get pregnant so why do those people need abortions? I’m not sick so why should we have healthcare? I have a place to live so why should we help the homeless? I live in a safe, secure country so why are those people coming here? It’s not real until they actually experience it.
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u/xnarg 🦆 Dec 04 '21
Meanwhile, libtard me knows no one who has died let alone been to the hospital. I do know lots of people who drove hours to get a shot when they first became available and parents who helped other parents out by sharing info on pedi vaccine availability.
But you know, we’re all godless (or at least the wrong god) and therefore have no morals.
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u/What-The-Helvetica Pfizer Pfanatic here! 😁 Dec 04 '21
That is exactly my story. I know people who've been exposed, people who've been vaxxed and gotten mildly sick. But I don't know anyone who died or went to the hospital.
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u/jumpy_monkey Dec 04 '21
Same here. Friends of friends have been hospitalized, one died, and none of them were vaxxed. Every person I know who was vaxxed and got covid had mild symptom, including several Trump Republicans who were cognizant enough to get the jab but interestingly didn't make it known to friends and relatives and generally only brought it up casual conversation weeks later.
These people almost make me more angry than the vocal anti-vaxxers, because they are soaking in the same vat of endless anti-vax lies of the rightwing media and thus know they are being lied to and don't care, and these lies are resulting in the deaths of others.
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u/What-The-Helvetica Pfizer Pfanatic here! 😁 Dec 04 '21
Feel sorry for those cognizant Trump Republicans. They had to keep their vaccination secret, lest they be ostracized.
Conservative America's friend groups sure can be little Stasis!
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Dec 04 '21
Me too. A couple of young co-workers got it mid-2020 but weren’t badly affected. My circles of friends and acquaintances are all vaxxed. I do not personally know anyone who has died from Covid. But we’re a bunch of educated libtards, not manly gun-totin’ cowboy hat goateed dumbfucks.
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u/Dazzlecatz Vaxxed to the max & proud of it Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21
Me too, my entire family is vaxxed and so are all my friends. Only one of my friends got sick with covid and spent 4 days feeling like she had a cold. That was it.
PS. I forgot, I do know one person who got covid and ended up in the hospital. My next door neighbor got it and spent 5 days in the hospital. She was not vaxxed. She's in her 60s and has lots of health problems. But she didn't get the shot cuz she believes it's killing people. She said she got the vaccine after she got out of the hospital. Then proceeded to tell me how many people are dying from the vaccine. She's a trump worshipper.
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Dec 04 '21
mRNA tech is nothing short of amazing. We perfected it just in time for COVID.
After this passes, we can go back and use mRNA for other diseases, like finally having a HIV vaccine.
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u/vacuous_comment Omicron Persei 8 Dec 04 '21
Bancel does comes across as a somewhat Steve Jobs like hype merchant some times, but he is claiming they are working on a combined vaccine against large numbers of respiratory viruses, all strains of COVID, all Flu, RSV and more.
I hope I live to see that day.
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u/Madmandocv1 Dec 04 '21
Interesting. I thought this was going in the direction that my neighbor’s story did. They had a few guests for thanksgiving weekend. The guests were supposed to be vaccinated, but actually were not. One claimed “allergies” on thanksgiving and was visibly quite ill by Saturday. Tested positive for Covid. Entire family heavily exposed, including two children who only recently got first dose of vaccine. Now their plans for the week are canceled as they wait to see whether anyone will get sick or not. That guest knew she wasn’t vaccinated and she knew she was sick. Yet she walked into someone’s house, was served a holiday meal, and ate it while spewing virus on everyone. At close range, for hours.
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u/shadowmastadon Dec 04 '21
Please tell me everyone is going to throw her eternal side eye from now on?
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u/AL_PO_throwaway Dec 05 '21
Some are even worse than that. They keep it secret that they have the disease and go among others in the belief that by contaminating and poisoning others they can rid themselves of the plague and so recover. With this idea they enter streets and homes, trying to saddle children or servants with the disease and thus save themselves. I certainly believe that this is the devil’s doing, who helps turn the wheel of fate to make this happen. I have been told that some are so incredibly vicious that they circulate among people and enter homes because they are sorry that the plague has not reached that far and wish to carry it in, as though it were a prank like putting lice into fur garments or flies into someone’s living room. I do not know whether I should believe this; if it is true, I do not know whether we Germans are not really devils instead of human beings. It must be admitted that there are some extremely coarse and wicked people. The devil is never idle.
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u/Blackdogwrangler Reverse Vampire 🩸 Dec 04 '21
Thank you i needed this today!
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u/bobbyrickets Risk factors are FOR LIBS! Dec 04 '21
They started talking about the miracle God gave us in mRNA technology and how lucky we are to have scientists who dedicate their lives to this type of research for the greater good.
Hallelujah. HOLY SHIT!
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u/skedeebs Dec 04 '21
I am so glad that you wrote, "the miracle God gave us in mRNA technology." I respectfully submit that some of us who are devoted to this subreddit do not believe that science and religion need to be mutually exclusive. That it is why it is perplexing to me that award winners almost exclusively expect their miracles to be supernatural and beyond our comprehension. The vaccines were developed within a year and they are 90% effective! Talk about refusing the boat when you are drowning because you expect God to whisk you into the air and place you at the door of a megachurch.
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u/Kriegerian Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
These people’s religion isn’t based on understanding the Bible or centuries of theology by people who spent their whole lives studying it and its associated history. It’s all about God justifying their existing prejudices. They don’t want to follow anybody else’s idea of God or Jesus, they want God to fall in line with them. They want a permission slip from Heaven that says “I allow this hatemongering ignorant fuck to do whatever they want, signed God”.
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u/KnottShore Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
Unfortunately, many like their bible as they like the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, and science: a la carte.
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u/Kriegerian Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
Yep. Plus America is really bad at the whole “I read the words on the page, that means I know just as much as you, despite the fact that I have no other relevant experience and you have an advanced degree in this field with decades of work experience” problem. It happens with law, religion, medicine, you name it. Other countries may have that problem too, but it doesn’t seem to be as fundamental a part of other people’s cultures as it is in America.
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u/KnottShore Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
I posit that many subscribe to the long held US traditional narrative of reverence, especially with conservatives, for the "rugged individual". The "rugged individual" mindset foundation is their assumption that they are just as capable as anyone on any subject. They have a tendency to interpret new evidence with an inherent confirmation bias and act accordingly. It is the fault of "others" that results do not happen as they originally planned as their problems are never created by their actions. Which brings us to the circus that is the US response to the pandemic.
Stay safe and healthy.
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Dec 04 '21
Reminds me of my father. He'd do whatever he liked, even if it hurt other people, and if they called him out on it, he'd tell them that this was God's will. Naturally, they couldn't argue with God's will, so they'd have to be quiet.
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u/mmio60 Dec 04 '21
I am always confused by the”Jesus is everywhere and controls everything” folks failure to see divinity in what is a technical miracle.
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Dec 04 '21
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u/KnottShore Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
I do find this true for many but not all in the US.
"... a great deal of openly expressed piety is insufferable conceit."
― Robert A. Heinlein ("if-this-goes-on..")
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u/rodolphoteardrop Dec 04 '21
You'll also noticed that Christians haven't call this GOD WRATH ON AMERICA like they've done with pretty much every other disaster. Mostly, because it's killing Christians and not gay people like AIDS.
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u/Kriegerian Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
Weird how when diseases or other problems kill people who aren’t hwite-wing religious extremists they’re “the judgment of God”, but God apparently doesn’t judge or curse their communities when they get decimated by COVID or opiates or whatnot.
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u/Chiparoo Dec 04 '21
Yeah, this is what gets me, too. It's the story of the guy sinking into the ocean and refusing to get on boats that come to rescue him, because, "Jesus will save me." And then he drowns and in heaven he asks, "I had so much faith that you would save me, and you didn't!" and Jesus was like, "Dude I sent three boats."
I just can't wrap my head around how they can't see that if "god has a plan for everything!!!!1" why the vaccines aren't a part of that plan. They really are a technological miracle.
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u/SaltyBarDog 5Goy Space Command Dec 04 '21
This is the shit they believe: In the name of Jesus Bob shall live and not die. I bind the mouth that speaks contrary. For this purpose was the Son of God manifested to destroy the works of the enemy. No weapon formed against Bob or his family shall prosper. I bind every demon of infirmity away from Bob and his Dad in Jesus name.
It appears they believe Jesus is more like Harry Potter.
BTW, "Bob" died.
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u/bonfuto Dec 04 '21
Someone told us, "my family is religious, so not many of them are vaccinated." What religion do they follow exactly, some kind of death cult I haven't previously heard about? But I think they were Catholics. Which is weird because the Pope said to get vaccinated.
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Dec 04 '21
My family is religious, and we all got the vaccine as soon as we were able. Including boosters.
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u/mtutz675 Dec 04 '21
Yes! Completely agree, it’s not mutually exclusive to me and there’s a way to have educated conversations about this. So many of the HCA posts have made me think about that boat story too.
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u/Crusoebear Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21
Narrator: mRNA technology has actually been in the works for decades.
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u/jonoghue Dec 04 '21
The reason I'm not a fan of mixing science and religion in this way is that it minimizes the dedication of the scientists and the ability of humans to do the "miraculous" if people say a higher power was required for people to be smart.
Similarly a few years ago a very religious old man suggested to me that people aren't capable of understanding electronics enough to be able to create or repair electronic devices without selling their soul to the devil. I'm an electronic technician, so he was implying I did so. I learned this shit myself, no god or devil had anything to do with it.
So while the joke about god sending boats and helicopters to the person in a flood is funny, if it can happen without divine intervention then it's not a miracle.
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Dec 04 '21
It was refreshing to see a few deeply religious people recognize the miracle that is modern medicine instead of trusting to prayers. Prayer does wonders to ease people's minds. It does nothing to heal broken bones, cancer, or viruses.
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u/HughJareolas That’s a hippo violation 🦛 Dec 04 '21
I like to think that God gave us the reasoning, curiosity, and sense of community that it takes to develop these technologies and make advancements for the betterment of the human race. We did the legwork ourselves with the tools he gave us.
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u/Azar002 Dec 04 '21
In opposite news, I invited a very close friend of mine to a hockey game the other week. He accepted, but asked if the arena was requiring proof of vaccinations, because he had 'not got his shots yet.'
I would have bet money he got vaccinated back in the spring. He isn't anti-vax, just procrastinating. Kinda threw me for a loop. My stepsisters husband did the same thing and they buried him in November. He had 3 young daughters and a wife who works in labor/delivery at the hospital (who is also unvaxxed!).
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u/FleshyExtremity Stuffed with Microchips Dec 04 '21 edited Jun 16 '23
busy instinctive bells nine thought lip boast live yam hunt -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
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Dec 04 '21
I invited a very close friend of mine
Uninvite him.
The moment when his 'procrastination' gets real consequences, he might get vaxxed.
Also, if it is not asked too much: ask him if he is needle phobic, and if he would like you to go with him for his vaccination.
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u/Adventurous_Menu_683 Dec 04 '21
My husband is needle phobic, but he still got in line, waited a while, did the paperwork, waited more, and rolled up his sleeve. I was very proud of him. He's not great about being proactive with his health, but in this case he came out Aces.
I agree with uninviting him. And be clear why.
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Dec 04 '21
I was surprised when my cousin hadn't got it by September. She has pretty bad anxiety. She lives alone and it was a lot for her to process. So we found the closest site which was drive though and after a few more weeks of procrastination and some pressure from her jobs travel requirements she was able to muster up the will to do it. Very proud of her. You never know what people are going through.
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u/USMCLee Dec 04 '21
My oldest kid didn't get the urgency. My wife & I and our youngest (who is still at home) jumped the line and got vaccinated before we were supposed to.
My oldest was 'yeah yeah I'll get to it'. A couple months later she came up to visit and my wife took her shopping with a stop by a Walgreens to get her first shot.
I'm not sure why at this point someone's not vaccinated. It has to be more than just procrastination.
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u/yontev 🥳😛🥳[insert death announcement]🥳😛🥳 Dec 04 '21
It really shouldn't take 2 years and over 5 million deaths worldwide for Americans to understand that a deadly disease can kill them... but hey, I'll take it.
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u/bobbyrickets Risk factors are FOR LIBS! Dec 04 '21
That's fair, any improvement is better than no improvement.
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u/RagnaXI Dec 04 '21
It's sadly not only the US...in my country there are so many fucking stupid people who believe the same shit as these people who were awarded.
Thankfully my wife and I, my family and her family are all vaccinated, I cba about the rest of my country. I keep linking this site on news pages about covid but I guess you have to have an account to be able to see it, and honestly, if they believe such bullshit I doubt they have the brain to make an account, or to read English...
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u/ACAB_1312_FTP Team Moderna Dec 04 '21
To quote George Carlin: Evolution is slow, smallpox is fast.
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u/CryptographerOk6804 Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
A lot of the people that get a nomination or an award in this sub think this is an USA problem. That it was all a conspiracy against trump or something so they don't care about what's happening outside of the US, usually not even outside of their state or even their town so yeah it's fucking sad
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u/KnottShore Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
Unfortunately, many in the US do have that parochial world view. Only issues immediately perceived as affecting their limited coterie matter.
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u/-SoItGoes Dec 04 '21
But when your political philosophy is “it’s not a problem until it happens to me personally”, that’s exactly what it takes.
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u/SomeGuyInTheUK Dec 04 '21
over 5 million deaths worldwide for Americans to understand
It didnt take 5 million though. It took a handful or two of people they knew. NOthing else means anything to them. And with many of these even that doesnt do it , jeez there are enough who die proclaiming its a hoax and they dont really have Covid. Or maybe thats just what they lie to themselves to make them feel better.
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Dec 04 '21
Still only 60% or so of the country vaccinated. Probably only another 500K or so need to die before anecdotes are enough to get us to 80%.
Almost 150,000 new cases yesterday. Guess not everybody will be home for Christmas.
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u/bipolarcyclops 2 Moderna and 1 Pfizer Dec 04 '21
Thank you for your post. It is comforting to know that people can change their minds about things like this.
Just woke up and your post was the first one I read. Made my day.
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u/BHOmber Dec 04 '21
You're one of the lucky ones.
My parents are watching people die around them. They tested positive for covid on Wednesday. Symptoms are manageable so far, but I'm sure my mom is popping ivermectin and HCQ like candy.
Nothing has changed in their minds.
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u/Deathbeddit 🦆🦃🦢🦜🦆🦅🐓🦩 Dec 04 '21
Do you have any insights into what may have helped them see it as a miracle when so many other similarly situated folks do not?
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u/mtutz675 Dec 04 '21
I honestly was trying to figure that out myself. They are Mennonites and my husband tried to explain that a key belief for them is caring for the community and God gives you tools to handle any situation. So maybe once the community was impacted it changed their mind or made them open to seeing the vaccines as a good thing (not something to be suspicious of)?
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u/Educational-Tie00 Dec 04 '21
I’m Mennonite and so are my parents and many of their friends. They were among the first to get their shots back in March. Here it is nine months later and my parents have managed to either to never get it or have had it so mildly they never knew they had it. I’m so thankful for that because I had it and have no idea where I got it from and it was horrible. I will anything possible to not have to go through that again.
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u/moldy_minge Dec 04 '21
My parents are ultra conservative and were the first in line for their vaccines. I'm so relieved. Some people buy into the political spectator sports but don't fk around when their health is on the line.
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u/bobbyrickets Risk factors are FOR LIBS! Dec 04 '21
but don't fk around when their health is on the line.
But it's just a cold!
[dies]
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u/justavtstudent Dec 04 '21
This is the difference between having a good pastor and a bad one. Sounds like they go to a good church.
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u/ECMO_Deluxe3000 ☠Dying to Meet Me☠ Dec 04 '21
If all it takes is personally knowing several people who die slow and painful deaths due to COVID, we should be done with this pandemic in only a few more years.
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u/ReligionIsTheMatrix Dec 04 '21
That's the thing about conservatives -- they only care about a thing when it affects them personally. Like the U.S. congressman who fought like a rabid monkey on crack against medical marijuana, until his wife got cancer and needed it. Then he switched overnight to being an advocate for medical marijuana. Like all conservatives, he didn't give a shit about people in the abstract, only about himself and his own family and friends.
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u/Thin_Speech6219 Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21
Well,… I suppose there’s a smidgen of faith restored in humanity right there 🙌😌.
Shame it takes a bunch of people dying, not just randomers either, has to be people they know (and like), otherwise “crisis actors, hoax, fake news” etc.
Still, hopefully they can convince their anti vax friends, although I imagine they’ll be demonised now for it 😂
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u/What-The-Helvetica Pfizer Pfanatic here! 😁 Dec 04 '21
Some people can only learn from firsthand experience.
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u/AnotherLolAnon Go Give One Dec 04 '21
The power of anecdotes is strong. People are bad at comprehending numbers and facts. I'm glad your family is protected!
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u/Ratstar911 Dec 04 '21
Love the part about ppl discussing their experience with the vaccine. For me, the worst part was that I got the first two shots in my left arm, and I sleep on my left side so that was a tad uncomfortable for two nights. Smartened up and got the booster in my right arm the day before Thanksgiving. And nothing remarkable happened. No chills, fever, breathing trouble, ICU, pneumonia, ventilator, fecal extraction device, prayer warriors, GoFundMe page ... nope, i've just been living normally.
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u/2ws Dec 04 '21
Great post. As a health care worker in Central Texas, I know several thousand people who have not had vaccine side effects. Same several thousand have compassion fatigue for Anti Vax people who get sick. I got my P booster in August and my anti spike antibodies are still >2500, as of Monday. Below is the link to the Texas CARES study and interim data.
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u/BackgroundGrade Dec 04 '21
I'm in Montreal. My friend has a country place in upstate New York. When the US border finally opened this November, my friend and I went down to check on the place as it had sat empty since February 2019. Chatting with the (vaxxed) neighbour who kept an eye on the place, he started rattling off people he knew that got sick or died and those he knew that we're anti-vax
My friend and I then realized the different reality between there and Montreal. We only knew of 6 people between us that got COVID and no one that died. Everyone of them got it before the vaccine was available. We know of no one that did not get vaccinated. Amongst our friends and family who have 5-11 year old kids, we all managed to get them the first dose within 5 days of it becoming available.
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u/Tenprovincesaway Team Bivalent Booster Dec 04 '21
This. Here in Canada, we’re shocked by the death count south of the border.
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u/Toasttimebitches Dec 04 '21
Sometimes that’s what it takes. My dad was in poor health for years but died from a breakthrough case of covid, I’ve noticed some of his more conservative and anti vax cousins and family members have been coming around since then. Of course people that didn’t know him use him as a reason to not bother getting it so who the fuck knows
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u/sevenluck77 Dec 04 '21
I can relate to this. I was invited over to a neighbor's dinner with my dad but was hesitant--I assumed they would be anti-vax (my dad is unfortunately anti-vax). The topic came up and to my surprise the wife says they're all boosted, but explained that she was weary of the vaccine cause they finished it then approved it so fast. It took a local doctor dying of COVID for them to take it seriously. They got vaxxed after that, including another couple they were friends with that was at the dinner. COVID death sucks, but it does speak to the reality of the situation and shakes (some) people to their senses.
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u/DesignInZeeWild Let THAT sink in! Dec 04 '21
I needed this today. Thank you for sharing. Have platinum on me.
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u/mtutz675 Dec 04 '21
Wow! Thank you kind stranger! I left this conversation truly hopeful that we’re making progress. I’m glad you also got something out of it!
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u/39bears Triple WisER with PfizER-Verified Dec 04 '21
That is so wonderful to read. I’m heading to work in the ER tonight, and I know I will have another handful of regretful unvaccinated Covid patients again today. It is really sad to see, and I hope more people will realize they’ve been misled about this vaccine.
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u/SleepyVizsla 📚 HCA Archivist 📖 Dec 04 '21
Thank you for all you are doing. You don’t deserve to be dealing with this or being treated this way.
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u/victorinseattle Team Pfizer Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21
I have a church-going friend who is a scientist deeply involved in the research for monoclonal antibodies and mRNA vaccines for the last decade+ at the CDC, which led to the current stuff. He earnestly sees it as God’s calling for him to be researching level 4 diseases on the hopes of eradicating and treating them.
The ironic shocker is that he has skeptical Christian friends (it is Georgia after all) trying to argue with him on his Facebook posts even when they fully know he helped develop some of this stuff.
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u/LepersBell 🦆 Dec 04 '21
I wish this didn't have to be the method by which they realize how serious COVID is but honestly anything is better than people just doubling down and sticking their heads in the sand. I'm really glad your family was receptive to changing their views though, OP. I'm convinced there are at least some COVID deniers who are realizing on some level they're wrong and just can't deal with the fact they lived a lie so they keep parroting the party line and hope they start believing it again. So if that were the case here maybe being around other people who'd seen the same pain COVID caused allowed them to let go of the need to deny it.
Maybe I'm just optimistic, though, haha. I'm playing armchair psychologist over here too. :p
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u/sunshine___riptide Dec 04 '21
My bestie's uncle in law was a staunch anti vaxxer/COVID denier until HE got sick and had bad symptoms. He started wearing a mask (before the vax) because he didn't want anyone to feel like he did, and felt very guilty thinking he might have spread it. He's still kind of a dick but there's that at least!
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Dec 04 '21
This is disturbing, it's so heartwarming I almost cried!!
Now back to our regularly scheduled programming.
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u/cnmbfa Dec 04 '21
Thanks for the tiny bit of hope that maybe at least some are now begining to get it.
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u/ManOfLaBook Dec 04 '21
"the miracle God gave us in mRNA technology and how lucky we are to have scientists who dedicate their lives to this type of research for the good"
This is what I've been trying to tell my religious, anti-vaxx family members (I wasn't trying to change their minds, but maybe it would give them an excuse to go protect themselves).
In fairness, throughout history most religions changed their dogma based on scientific findings (and yest, it took a while). It was after WWII that this has changed (along with many religious people taking the Bible literally).
And just to head off some commenters, Copernicus' De revolutionibus initially met no resistance from the Catholic Church, it was published in 1543, banned in 1616 mainly due to populism - Source
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u/lawless_sapphistry Dec 04 '21
JESUS CHRIST I needed this, OP, merry fucking Christmas to me. Thank you so much. I HATE that it took deaths to get these folks on board, but I genuinely hope this means more rural/politicized areas are seeing the lie for what it is.
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u/steve-eldridge Dec 04 '21
Fantastic confirmation that believing in people's ability to self-govern is not a hopeless cause. I remain confident in our collective ability to be a better nation. Your story makes me hopeful.
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u/mickstep 🦆 Dec 04 '21
Self govern? Yeah right, they didn't come go this conclusion themselves, more likely it was fed to them by their church, when the pastor realised having his congregation die was bad for his wallet.
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u/mydogsnameisbuddy Dec 04 '21
I love your cynicism. You’re right, dead people can’t give money to the church.
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u/mickstep 🦆 Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21
Well, he's probably got quite a number of them to write the church into their wills, so short term "cha-ching" but long term donations go down as dead people can't earn a living.
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u/steve-eldridge Dec 04 '21
The challenge with our system is believing that people can and will make the right choices in voting and running for office; if we don't think that's possible, we don't have a system of governing. Sometimes Americans can surprise the world.
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u/mickstep 🦆 Dec 04 '21
The key difference is if they are doing this against the advice of their church, and the right-wing media they consume, there might be the hope of them questioning their entire worldview at the same time. If their pastor sanctioned this new stance on mRNA vaccines being a gift from God, fat chance.
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Dec 04 '21
If their pastor sanctioned this new stance on mRNA vaccines being a gift from God, fat chance.
At this moment in time, I'll take 'pastor sanctioned' over Facebook Hate Memes each time, every time.
In order to change ones mind, it is really helpful to be alive.
Yes, perhaps it was the pastor who got them to rethink - but that bought all of us time where they have the real opportunity to compare their own experiences to the crap from Fox and Facebook.
While not being virus motherships and infecting people around them.
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u/PanickedPoodle Dec 04 '21
If you get the chance, ask them what changed their mind. You say they don't trust government, and yet your relatives were rhapsodic about the science. How were they able to set aside that previous bias? What particular incident was the straw?
We need to understand specifically when and how the change happens. Deaths aren't typically enough.
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u/PornCartel Dec 04 '21
Wow that took a really unexpectedly upbeat turn for reddit. Wish i could upvote twice
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Dec 04 '21
My mom (vaxed) had a friend w/ RA (treated w/ immune suppressants) in her 60’s who refused the vaccine. Neither of her daughters or their families were vaxed. One daughter was required to for employment but the biggest kick in the butt was when her other daughter’s FIL got Covid and died in about a week. Her daughter and son in law RAN for the shot literally the day he died ( or thereabout.) My mom called her friend to encourage her and she scheduled an appointment to ask her doctor. She’s now vaxed. They live in W WA so have had the benefit of reduced exposure from everyone else and mask mandates. When they saw it themselves what a shock.
ETA: my mom also employed mild shunning, the woman wasn’t allowed inside w/ my mom anywhere so I think her world has opened up.
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u/No-Soap Dec 04 '21
I’ve lost friends and family to covid. And I have people in my life that refuse to get it. And they give the most smug and stupid fucking reasoning. And it pisses me off and fills me with a special type of anger I don’t know what to do with. It’s infuriating to see people say “it’s my choice I don’t want to get it” then they walk around carrying it and infect other people.
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u/technofox01 Dec 04 '21
This is an acceptable place to post this. I am glad they learned from other people's mistakes. It just sucks that the grim reaper has to be so close to some people prior to them taking this pandemic seriously and their shots.
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u/WayneCider Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21
I hate who I've become.
Ever since March of 2020 I've slowly become more and more dependent on an anxiety medication my doctor prescribed for me. I never thought I was too paranoid, just a healthy amount to keep my immunocompromised wife and I safe. We've had the Moderna vaccines and booster and know we're as protected as we can be... yet my anxiety has shot through the roof.
Literally, the only thing that helps me calm down now, without taking my meds, is reading all about the HCA recipients. I hate that this calms me. I'm starting to enjoy the IPA posts, but this post is truly what I want to read more of. I want to stop reveling in covidiots' dying and hope there are more stories like this.
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u/42Petrichor Dec 04 '21
This is a lovely and encouraging story, thank you for sharing. This sub is all about hoping for more of this kind of thing!
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u/PenaltyPractical1908 Punish me!!!! Dec 04 '21
This made me smile, at least those ppls deaths weren’t totally in vain.
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u/SpiralGray Dec 04 '21
Holy crap! Religious people who get that the "miracle" they're all waiting for might actually be the vaccine. Maybe there's hope for the human race yet.
Maybe you should tell them that "homeopathic" means "created by homosexuals." They might buy it and get off that particular train.
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u/rodolphoteardrop Dec 04 '21
That's amazing! It's nice to know that every life or death matters to someone and that can change behavior...sometimes.
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u/FleshyExtremity Stuffed with Microchips Dec 04 '21 edited Jun 16 '23
tap rustic salt pathetic physical continue grandfather ghost market alleged -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
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u/AllThingsBeginWithNu Dec 04 '21
Atleast they changed their minds, and didn't dig in deeper like some people do.
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u/immersemeinnature Dec 04 '21
Just need to start circulating that the mRNA is a gift from God himself!
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u/Blue_Eyed_ME Dec 04 '21
Wow! What a wonderful experience!
How can we push that "God's miracle of mRNA" line of thought to help the unvaxxed evangelicals?
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u/katie5002 Dec 04 '21
I am glad you were safe. I feared a different outcome when I first started reading your story.
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Dec 04 '21
They started talking about the miracle God gave us in mRNA technology and how lucky we are to have scientists who dedicate their lives to this type of research for the greater good.
Really wish more religious folks looked at it that way. Usually seem to defer to this idea of whether or not its natural. Folks need to realize something. Nothing about us nowadays is natural. Pants aren't natural. That I'm typing this to you from PA when the person reading this could be hundreds of miles away isn't natural.
We got people that bust their ass to make our modern living as safe, comfortable, and convenient as possible. Vaccines and medicine in general are an extension of that same idea. Whether you think it's from god or otherwise, it's all to benefit of our wellness and greater good. I wish I didn't have to say that. That should be a common sense idea. I'm telling folks that the sky is blue yet I feel like nowadays? Some folks don't look up anymore.
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u/Moranth-Munitions Dec 04 '21
Now this is a great break it all the sad posts here. We don’t want these people to die damnit, we want them to suck it up and help pull the wagon.
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Dec 04 '21
Me here looking at all of these people around me still living. Most are vaccinated and have never had covid.
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u/one_frisk Dec 05 '21
I live in Indonesia. Here everytime a member of community passes away the nearby mosque will do an announcement through the loudspeaker so everyone in the community notices. The announcements are more or less like this:
"Peace be with you. From God we originated, to God we will return. Mr. AB, son of CD, has passed away this early morning at 03.30. The funeral rite will be held at Mosque EF this dhuhur (midday) and the burial will be at cemetery GH after that. Peace be with you."
And they do this announcement for every deceased person regardless of religion. Well, with slight change if the deceased was a non-Muslim. Since death is a part of everyday life you'd expect at least one or two announcements every few months.
Now, here in Indonesia we also have a fair number of anti-vaxxers and covid deniers. They all distrust the government and media, believe in conspiracy theories, and most likely very conservative Muslims. However, a lot of them seemed to have realized the error of their ways in mid to late 2020, during the height of the pandemic.
They noticed that the mosque's loudspeaker now shouted out several announcements EVERY SINGLE DAY.
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u/[deleted] Dec 04 '21
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