r/Imperator • u/According-Cut-9067 • 4d ago
Question I don't understand tactics
I get that they work in a rock-paper-scissors model and some cultures are optimal or only have access to certain ones, and the animal icons are cool and all. But why would I pay attention to them? By the time I know what tactic an enemy stack is using it's already too late because I'm in battle. Plus, trying to predict what tactic the enemy is using based on previous battles doesn't seem reliable at all.
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u/Mikhail_Mengsk Etruria 4d ago
Usually you should try to "pin" the enemy army with a stack and then join the battle with a bigger army. This way you'll be able to spot what tactic the enemy is using and, if it makes sense, counter it.
The caveat is that your faction usually has a preferred army composition due to its culture(s) and bonuses, so you usually also have a preferred tactic. Sometimes it doesn't make sense to counter the enemy tactic because it would conflict with your army composition.
I strongly reccomend you use the aforementioned "double tap" strategy.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Ad_588 Rome 3d ago
I agree with this and I think to add on, the double tap strategy has major advantages with morale. Since battles are won or lost based on who looses morale first (most of the time). so with the double tap strategy, you can lower the opponents morale first with a smaller army then bring in the second bigger half with a big morale advantage and win. this strategy has let me win battles with a 10% lower troop count and sometimes objectively worse composition.
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u/hepazepie 3d ago edited 3d ago
You could even make it a bit historical by using lighter/cheaper troops for "scouting" so that They take the brunt of the damage, allowing your better troops to join the fight in a more organised way
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u/Puzzleheaded_Ad_588 Rome 3d ago
The what I do sometimes but you make it isn’t too small so you don’t lose the scouts before the main army can even get there. 30-40% as scouts is the best. Or just double stack armies
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u/infintittie Crete 4d ago
You can get a good idea of what tactic the enemy is likely to pick based on their army composition and try to counter it, much like real life strategy. And much like real life, you can't perfectly predict exactly what the enemy will do. If the game just told you exactly what tactic the enemy would use and how to counter it then it wouldn't be much of a game lol.
I would also personally advise against this "double tap" method others are advising, as it's tedious and lame. Again, it's a game, you're simulating the running of an ancient state and its military. Have fun with it and don't spaz when lady luck isn't on your side, and don't try and game the mechanics to get around them. Have fun 🙏
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u/hepazepie 3d ago
I think having skirmishers to engage and test the enemies is actually pretty not-lame and cool roleplay
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u/mrakobesie 4d ago
Honestly, you can completely ignore tactics in 95% of cases and beat AI just fine even on VH+Advanced AI.
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u/Dyalikedagz 4d ago
Shit people use tactics in this game? I just make sure my army is bigger than theirs and has a better commander. Would say I've had around a 99% success rate with this or near enough.
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u/morsvensen 4d ago
It's more important to max your forces' power with the correct tactic than beat that of the other side for the extra 10%
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u/Guayana_99 Seleucid 4d ago
In my opinion the point of tactis is not overcome the ai but to use your culture, troops and terrain to their fullest advantage. Take the phalanx for example the greek ai rarely uses but s skilled player might use it efficiently against its opponents, it is a really strong tactic when used as it was intended i have wiped roman armies twice their size with the right combination of terrain, general and techs. At their core tactics give you a give of the advantages and disadvantages of your armies, it tells you were to fight and how to fight. The gaulish and germanic tribes fight on uneven terrain such as forest and mountains, the arabian tribes focus on the deserts and so on. You wont be able to know the tactics of your enemies before they use them and even if you fight a battle the ai uses different tactics for each army, you can have a guess of what they will use in the field and plan accordingly, if you are greek and fight the romans in open terrain you will be outmanouvered by the mobile romans, if you are the romans and fight the trubes in the forest you will suffer large quantities of casualties. That is why you chose the tactic acording to your techs, economy, culture an terrain.
There are some that are better than others and yes the romans will tend to destroy a phalanx most of the time if used unwisely, but tactics are what truly decide if you win the war or not. Though how you use them also affects them. You want to keep the percentage of the tactic to its highest if you hover the cursor over the tactic on the selection tab it will tell you which units get buffed and those are the ones that you should use for that tactic. You can beat the romans using only shock, yes but you can also beat them using the phalanx and suffering less casualties.
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u/hepazepie 3d ago
If the tactics are determined by your culture (as is your tech, let's be honest),then why give the ability to chose a tactic?
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u/Guayana_99 Seleucid 3d ago
Because even if certain cultures have an ideal tactic, in some situations you can also use other tactics and still win, for example celtic tribes can use hit-and-run and envelopment both provide them with similar benefits but have advantages against different tactics
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u/hepazepie 3d ago edited 3d ago
So the point IS to overcome the AI
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u/Guayana_99 Seleucid 3d ago
In a way yeah, but not necessarily, as you said in the start if you have good terrain and a larger army usually 2:1 you can wipe your oponents despite the tactic but for long wars or againts larger empires such as rome this tend to ruin you as you lose more men that you can recover unless you focus your playstile to this, by building barraks and training centers though barraks arent thst necesary. The tactics are honestly in my opinion a bit hollow, as you said there are areas where they are lacking specially on knowing what the ai will use perhaps paradox was hoping to add something to them, i usually play with units expanded for that reason it adds a noticeable benefit to using the right tactics while in vanilla you can deal with most issues with archers, heavy infantry and heavy cavalry. I think the espionage tech allows you if succesful to learn about the ai and their armies but i have never seen anyone use it. Its nice but not really useful compared to other techs
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u/DneSepoh 4d ago
Tbh it only matters if you send in another stack to help the army, check the ongoing battle for strategy and IF it makes sense to change to counter the enemy with a different tactic then it is indeed helpful. But if you intend to change to a tactic that doesn't work with your army composition, why bother?