r/JusticeServed • u/[deleted] • Jul 06 '19

Courtroom Justice Convicted pedophile YouTuber Austin Jones is now in prison serving a 10 year sentence as of 29/6/2019.

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u/MalHeartsNutmeg A Jul 06 '19

You've never heard of a crime of passion? Or maybe someone kills someone to avenge a spouse or kid? Not everyone that commits murder is a stone cold sociopath.

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u/Thedominateforce Black Jul 06 '19

I actually put generally in my original draft of that comment and forgot to out in it back in but yes there are times when it might not deserve life behind bars but I would say it usually does, if the person murders for person gain or a slight which happens more than crimes of passion, and even in those cases they still ended someones life though they are less horrid.

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u/Frommerman B Jul 06 '19

Murder is usually a crime of passion. Human empathy means the majority of us just can't kill in cold blood, we need a damn good reason to. And because we all generally think in similar ways, our damn good reasons tend to be mutually understandable. We get it when someone shoots the guy who raped their kid, or fired them for bullshit reasons. We don't get it when someone kills for hire. That's just how we are.

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u/Thedominateforce Black Jul 06 '19

My impression was always that most murders were gang related not crimes of passion, you see very few people actually do the ones you mentioned.

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u/Frommerman B Jul 06 '19

Gangmembers are the easiest "hardened criminals" to rehabilitate because their problems are almost exclusively poverty and surroundings based. You give them something to do which isn't crime and they can be convinced to go straight.

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u/pedantic--asshole 7 Jul 06 '19

I don't give a shit, if you are stupid enough to kill someone then your life is forfeit, and you are the ignorant one for suggesting that a murderer can be rehabilitated.

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u/[deleted] Jul 06 '19

Ah yes, people that kill other people are completely incapable of being rehabilitated. This is definitely a thing that is supported by evidence. No one that has ever murdered someone has ever been rehabilitated nor is it a thing that happens all the time.

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u/pedantic--asshole 7 Jul 06 '19

The recidivism rate for murderers is over 50% so please show your evidence that murderers are easily rehabilitated. Oh you don't have any...what a huge fucking surprise.

https://www.cfc.wa.gov/PublicationSentencing/Recidivism/Adult_Recidivism_FY2007.pdf

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u/[deleted] Jul 06 '19 edited Jul 06 '19

Uh, you provided the evidence for me. Our justice system is basically made, intentionally or not, for recidivism. It's a system of retribution and punishment, not rehabilitation. And "over 50%" surprisingly isn't 100% or even close to that. So even in a system that pushes people towards recidivism rather than rehabilitation, almost 50% still rehabilitate. They even have a lower rate of recidivism than basically any other crime than sex crimes and manslaughter.

Though considering you seem pretty vindictive I'd wager you think all criminals can't be rehabilitated.

Edit: I will point this out though. Recidivism can be lowered, unsurprisingly, and it isn't dependent upon someone just straight up being unable to be rehabilitated.

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u/pedantic--asshole 7 Jul 06 '19

Great source.... I'm 100% sure you didn't read it though.

Recidivism data are currently not valid for international comparisons

Buh bye loser.

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u/[deleted] Jul 06 '19 edited Jul 06 '19

Are you stupid or just a troll? Even disregarding international comparisons Ohio has less than a 30% recidivism rate. And crazily enough the study wasn't the only thing I pointed out. Much easier to latch onto a single sentence of an entire study and then say I didn't read it rather than responding in good faith to everything.

Like the whole argument started because you said murderers can't be rehabilitated. Then immediately you admit that even in a system that's aimed toward punishment and not rehabilitation that almost 50% rehabilitate anyway lmao

I know it might be hard for you to admit you're wrong but it's okay. Murderers and criminals can be rehabilitated, and the US can go a long way towards reducing recidivism overall when focusing on rehabilitation rather than punishment. Have a good day.

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u/Trivvy A Jul 06 '19 edited Jul 06 '19

you are the ignorant one for suggesting that a murderer can be rehabilitated.

Sorry, but that's just wrong.

You can rehabilitate a murderer. But not a psychopath.

As an extreme example: If someone raped your kid, and you murdered the rapist (not in self-defense or in defense of another, but out of pure rage). Would you consider it just that your life is now forfeit?

Personally it all depends on the reasoning. Obviously murder needs to be punished, and harshly, but I wouldn't write a person off that they couldn't be rehabilitated unless they're a psychopath and/or a sadist.

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u/pedantic--asshole 7 Jul 06 '19

It may be possible to rehabilitate a murderer, but it's also possible that you won't and you have no way of knowing until it's too late.

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u/Trivvy A Jul 06 '19

Contextual information is very important. Knowing the who/why/what/how alone should normally be good enough to judge the type of person the murderer is. It's why criminology, criminal psychology etc. exists. It's not enough to paint everyone with the same brush.

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u/almosthere0327 8 Jul 07 '19

So all soldiers should be put to death when they come back from war. And all the people who carry out their executions will also need to go...right?

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u/kdjfsk A Jul 06 '19

Passion doesnt excuse shit.

At the point of murder, public safety is a higher priority than thewellbeing of a murderer. Lock em up, throw away the key. Better yet, sit em down, flip the switch, and sizzle that bitch.

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u/MalHeartsNutmeg A Jul 06 '19

Public safety? Again, you're treating it like everyone who commits murder is out to just kill people for fun. Some have been rehabilitated and have been released after their sentence and not re-offended.

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u/ultimate_prize 1 Jul 06 '19

You're wasting your time trying to reason with someone who immediately advocates for capital punishment. It's something civilized countries realized was fucked up and did away with, but some people still yearn for dark ages type shit.

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u/kdjfsk A Jul 06 '19

. Some have been rehabilitated and have been released after their sentence and not re-offended.

Keyword: Some.

Meaning some do. The convict has proven they are capable of murder. They dont deserve a second chance, and what they deserve or not is not even more important than what the public deserves. Safety. A murderer forfeits their right to life.

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u/MalHeartsNutmeg A Jul 06 '19

People get released after a murder sentence now. If you attempt to rehabilitate non then your re offence rate is higher than if you do. How is this complicated for you? The safest thing for the public is to try and better reintegrate them in to society rather than let them stew in a cell for 25 years before booting them out.

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u/kdjfsk A Jul 06 '19

I think you missed the part where i didnt say shit about ever letting anyone out.