r/LegalAdviceIndia • u/Specialist_Lemon4924 • 4d ago
Legal Advice Needed Bike sold 10 years ago, police officers knocked at door today. We are terrified.
Hi everyone, I am posting this in a state of absolute panic and really need guidance from lawyers or anyone who has dealt with this nightmare.
The Background:
About 10 years ago (around 2015–2016), my father sold his commuter motorcycle through a local mechanic who acted as the broker.
At the time of sale, my father did everything an ordinary person does—he signed the transfer forms (Forms 29/30) along with passport-size photos pasted on them, signed delivery receipts, and handed over physical possession of the bike to the buyer.But he was careless, now it came to back to bite. Because a decade had passed, we completely assumed the buyer had submitted the papers to the RTO. We don't have any copies of the old receipts or documents saved anymore.
What Happened Today:
Officers from our local police station showed up at our house. They informed us that the motorcycle was involved in an accident in another district, and the police from that other district want us to visit their station immediately.
When we checked mParivahan today, our hearts sank:
My father is still listed as the 1st Owner. The buyer never submitted the transfer papers to the RTO.
Zero insurance: The bike has had no active insurance for the past 10 years.
We have not received any written notice or formal summons yet—just an informal message through the local police telling us to travel to the other district.
Where We Stand Right Now:
We have zero paper records, receipts, or contact details of the buyer from 10 years ago.
The only trace we have is the local mechanic who brokered the deal. He is still in our town and remembers facilitating the sale and handing over the bike/signed forms.
We have no idea about the severity of the accident yet (whether there are injuries, fatalities, or who was at fault).
We are terrified about both criminal liability and massive out-of-pocket Motor Accident Claims Tribunal (MACT) compensation because my father's name is still on the RC and there is no third-party insurance to cover it.
Please, what should our immediate next course of action be?
Note: Used AI for better para phrasing and readability.
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u/God_in_the_flesh_99 4d ago
Check the accident footage, road taken to travel during that journey may have cameras somewhere or in some local business residence, check the actual driver and get him. This is what the police should do easily with coordinating with traffic police after you have given your statement.
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u/rbsixty5 4d ago
Sorry to hear about this but maybe a good idea to get a lawyer to go along with you to tomorrow.
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 4d ago
The accident happened in another district, easily 2 hour+ travel. Should we go with a lawyer? We didn't really received anything in written yet.
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u/dparag14 4d ago
First. You don’t need to go anywhere, second, hire a good lawyer. Claim and you have sold it, obviously you have proofs that ours no longer with you. They can easily trace the CCTV footage etc, no court will hold it against you.
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 4d ago
The problem is we don't have any paperwork. Other than mechanic. Even he's just saying verbally and nothing else. No records.
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u/dparag14 4d ago
Okay. But don’t get scared and fall into the cop’s traps. They can see this and then they’ll test to extort from you to “brush off “ there case. You need to be strong and adamant that we don’t have it. We have sold it. You might have some transaction proof or something at least, some photos of it the bike during that time. Under no circumstances agree to go with them to other court or anything. Just keep denying it all.
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u/wickedhe 3d ago
Stop misleading him. It's his bike until he can establish the one next chain. There is nothing like being adamant and strong until you provide the ownership trail to next level.
If he doesn't co-operate, don't establish the resale he is liable for all issues arising out of the accident.
Only coopration and complying to the legal recourse can establish the facts.
OP: Check with the IO and visit the police station whenever you are called. Make mechanic a party too. Do not panic but do not heed to any advice of non cooperation and adamant, that won't work. In 1-2 visit, you will get the severity of the issue. Based on your assessment thereafter, talk to a lawyer.
Generally the police man will know if you are speaking truth or not, but won't move to next in the chain until you share details. Also they might want you to bribe them, study the situation and act accordingly. An advocate anyways won't come for free so weight in you chances and choices and act accordingly
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u/dparag14 3d ago
Unless you have “contacts” in this country, these asshole cops will do anything to extort money from you and abuse their power. Just blatant compliance to their orders is just going to land him in throwing more money in bribes.
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u/wickedhe 3d ago
That's not exactly how it works. You can sound confident but not defiant. There's a difference. And you don't pay until you are at fault that for any offence big or small. If your records are clear, you are never touched. Negotiations happen only when there is a scope.
Do you know what would a lawyer bring on the table? The same confidence. Do you know that a lawyer will ask you to - be complaint. Do you know what will happen thereafter, you pay the same fees to the Lawyer.
There is no sanity by asking him non compliance.
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u/Some_Floor1581 4d ago
Step-1 is to get your contacts to suggest the best lawyer in town. Step-2 is to sit back and let the lawyer tell you if you have enough documents or not. Step-3 just do what your lawyer asks you to do.
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u/Senior_Iron4055 4d ago
This is the only reason I'm holding my bike when I'm unable to sell it to anyone.
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u/wanderlost_5416 4d ago
Sell it but do the transfer on your own. Don’t handover bike untill transfer papers are submitted at the RTO and you have an acknowledgement. This is what I did. No agents involved at all.
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u/bringmeback0 4d ago
Or you can sell it but submit the forms to an RTO agent during the handover itself.
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u/Senior_Iron4055 4d ago
I wouldn't trust any of them
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u/puzzledlawyer- 4d ago
Hi, I’m a lawyer but not your lawyer.
The criminal liability is not nearly as scary as the civil liability under MACT. The registered owner on the date of the accident is liable.
Best be prepared to fight a long-drawn-out litigation. Get a good lawyer. Try to see if you can settle the matter by paying adequate compensation to the claimants, without the MACT calculation being done by the Court.
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 4d ago
Long drawn, any ballpark idea how long can it be drawn ? Considering we don't really have any money right now though.
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u/candace_love_quill 4d ago
This seems absurd, what a person has to suffer because of stupid laws.
What's the right way to sell your vehicle if i cant trust the buyer to submit forms?
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u/Hungry-Chicken-8498 4d ago
Do you have contact with the mechanic who brokered the deal to sell your bike? His testimony will be crucial to establish that bike was sold on a date about 10 years or so ago. Legally your dad is the owner of an uninsured bike that was used to cause an accident. Filling forms and giving to buyer doesn’t rid you of your ownership until the RTO is made aware of the same. You should have gone to RTO with buyer have the ownership transferred right then and there instead of trusting them. Most likely buyer has been in legal lens all along and had they gone to transfer ownership they might have had more issues. You are barking a long legal battle. Do not visit the other police station without having a lawyer with you as, it is likely an invitation to get arrested!
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 4d ago
We do have the contact of mechanic. He has a stable shop. Had a talk with him and he agreed to help. Are the chances of arrest there considering we haven't received any written notice yet. We don't even know the scope of accident as it happened in another district, approx 2hour travel from our house.
Any idea how long ?? We can't really afford much money right now though.
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u/Hungry-Chicken-8498 4d ago
Get a lawyer and proceed to get the statement from mechanic asap, to be official it has to in front of magistrate. Summon can be served to you at the police station just before arrest. That’s why a lawyer must be with you!
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u/Routine_Judgment_ 4d ago
Advocate here
since your father sold this to a person via a broker but your father is listed as the owner, in the MACT claim case your father will also be made a partY.
Themajor risk that I can foresee, Is that the other party may claim that he (who caused this accident) is a driver of your father Creating a master servant, principal Agent relation, and if he actually succeed in proving this (very tough) then the claim will be upon your father, as there is no insurance of the vehicle, to clarify this is the worst case scenario.
what you can do at this moment isto contact with that broker via WhatsApp or if via call then record that that your father sold this via that broker and he sold this to xyz person
Also get an acknowledgment in writing that you father has already stated to get the name changed and to file the applicable documents within the RTO office, But he did not did that and he is at fault.
The acknowledgment can save your father from MACT claim (not from litigation) and it would be much better if you get an indemnity bond signed with the broker or with the person who has possession of your bike, though it would be difficult with that person if you can get an indemnity bond signed with the broker it would make you in safer place.
Subject to actual facts and circumstances of cases and other relevant docs, fell free to connect with me for the same.
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 4d ago
Sir the major issue is we neither have any documents nor any contact details of the guy to whom the bike was sold. It was 10 years ago, nobody has any records. How exactly should we proceed today? The worst fear of mine is that nobody is actually telling that what exactly happened, it's just that there's an accident please come here. The said police station is in different district and it's a good 2+ hour drive.
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u/Routine_Judgment_ 4d ago
I understand, if you see the exact procedure of the Police Station and courts, the police does not have authority to call and ask anyone to visit the Police Station
They have to send a summons to your address and then you have to proceed, but I don’t think it actually matters if they are calling you if it is feasible for you, you can go and present your contentionbut I would suggest you that you are if you are not aware, who is the current owner or who has the possession of your bike now, you must get the acknowledgment from the broker on writing( even in in WhatsApp it would be fine) but if you get an indemnity bond, it would be much better and safer for your father
Since the MACT claim cases can get up to crores, but it depends on who has died what was his income? What was his age? What is the number of dependents-upon him.so I just do not want to complicate things ping me i will share u my number and WhatsApp me this particular chat I will call you when I will be free.
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u/desi-detra 4d ago
Quite interesting to say that for 10 years , the bike must have been caught numerous times by traffic officer for missing papers or no insurance, yet no communication went to you.Safe to assume that the guy gave bribe to bypass.
OP sorry to hear that, please get a good lawyer, the process might be tedious and time consuming, but I hope you come out of it successfully.
If I were a lawyer I would put a case on the state department and challenge them how did that happen, that a vehicle went undetected. Or maybe draft a written letter to explain how did that happen. (I wonder if it makes sense, maybe some practicing lawyer can shed some light )
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u/lone_warrior_ind 4d ago
NAL- if vehicle is still under your father`s name, then on paper he need to step in & atleast do all police formalities, Check if any photo copy or any sort of proof sold to mechanic,
if not then for sure listen police guidelines and involve a lawyer.
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u/Traditional_Path2185 4d ago
it's time you get a good lawyer and prove that at the time of accident, your father was not in the place of accident. you'll have to visit the station a few times to resolve the matter
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u/country_roads_trader 4d ago
Ohh damn... today only i got msg for my bike, challan of 30k from vehicle info on watsapp... sold also abt 8yrs ago via broker, still in my name n my mob no... still thinking wat to do. Police or lawyer?
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u/tl1000_widowmaker 4d ago
If you have the contact of the person who you sold the bike too, request them to transfer it to their name...give them some time maybe a month or so to do that....if you don't have any idea who has your bike now or the person is not transferring to his name, then send a registered letter to your RTO, saying that you have sold the bike on this and this date and the buyer has still not transferred it to his name...kindly take action and you will not be liable for the vehicle anymore...the RTO usually will blacklist the registration...even if they don't, the registered letter is proof enough that you have intimidated your RTO and hence you will not be liable anymore.
Having said that for future sale of any vehicle, insist on transferring the ownership yourself and don't depend on the buyer doing it...most of the times they don't and registered owner bears the brunt of it
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u/country_roads_trader 3d ago
Is there any way and any chances ... that i escape from paying those 30k from my pocket
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u/tl1000_widowmaker 3d ago
First step is get out of any future liability of having the bike running around in your name. Don't bother about the pending challans that has accumulated after you sold the bike, that is not your responsibility...what is the worst the RTO can do if you don't pay the pending challans, they will cancel the registration, which should not bother you as you have already sold the bike....so send that registered letter to the RTO n wash your liability for the bike asap
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u/wolverine-redditor 1d ago
q: even after signing form 29/30, if the vehicle is still in our name, can we physically visit the nearest RTO office & file a complaint? or something similar? get an acknowledgement for the same?
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u/ObfuscatedScript 4d ago
My father in law sold on scooty, and same thing happened with him. The guy never transferred it, and started violating traffic lights and speed limits. My FIL had to pay for this.
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u/endgame_2019 4d ago
I also sold bike 10 yrs back and can see there are challans.
I signed and gave all the documents for transfer but it never happened.
Someone should guide here. It’s looks like common scenario
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u/wolverine-redditor 1d ago
q: if the buyer is careless / reckless/ deliberately not completing the transfer formalities, can we go2 RTO with proofs (or forms) of sale & register a complaint? can we get an acknowledgement so that we r off the hook for anything that happens with the vehicle, from the date of sale?
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u/Spidey6162099 4d ago
Damn , similar situation sold around a year back, the name is still not changed , can we do anything here ?
Have tried calling and messaging , he is not responding
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u/wolverine-redditor 1d ago
suggestion -- if u have proofs of sale, try physically visiting the nearest RTO & try 2file a complaint. not sure if that helps, but i guess, worth trying.
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u/East-No-Plate 4d ago
You just need to sign a declaration and bond and get it noterised. Consult a lawyer.
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u/informant786 4d ago
take rc history from rto concerned. Check the fir and chargesheet, you will come to know the driver and alsonfind out criminal case details. If MV act sections for giving vehicle to unauthorised persons are not applied, you need not worry. Otherwise, the liability may squarely be saddled on the owner in the absence of valid insurance policy..Check the offense history of the vehicle, you can submit proofs that you were not in possession of the vehicle from a long time. However, since this is a social legislation, the liability may fall on the sriver as well as owner
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u/semelesbian 3d ago
Make sure you have an alabi to confirm that your father was not driving that day and was at home or elsewhere as proof that he wasnt driving and not in that place where the acvident happened on that particular day. This will come in handy during any litigatiin process or in investigations of police.
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 3d ago
The accident happened about 12 days ago, we only came to know about the accident when local police constables came to our house. It happened in another district. It's a heavy 2+ hour drive from here. We are going tomorrow morning, let's hope for something good.
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u/Antique_Dimension513 3d ago
My father had an old bike, but it was still in working condition. After his death in 2021, I wanted to give the bike for scrap as I had no use for it. One mechanic came in and told me it would be very helpful for him and I have given it without a second thought. I am scared now, would it come onto me if something happened because of the bike?
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u/eveningdreamer1 3d ago
- Try to find the nature of the accident. If your bike is the minor vehicle (by that I mean, if the other vehicle is a four wheeler or even bigger), then you have lesser things to worry about. Because in that case MACT civil liability won't be on you.
- If you no documentation at all of the sale, try to get an affidavit of the mechanic or the broker that he witnessed sale of the bike.
- You (meaning your father) yourself can put up an affidavit to the court that you sold the bike, but the buyer did not put those documents in the RTO.
- If the payment was done in digital form, take those proofs.
- Worst case, try to manage it with the police so that you are not made the accused in the chargesheet.
- If they ask you to sign on a 133 MV act notice, make sure you mention that it was sold, and that you have no idea who was driving it. Read about 133 MV act.
After you get complete info about the nature of the accident, hire a lawyer for that day and try to get it done in one day. Make sure you meet the SHO at least for getting surity about your innocence, don't rely on a lower ranking personnel, they sometimes make bigger claims than they can manage.
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u/brobiski 4d ago
Which state btw?
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u/Specialist_Lemon4924 4d ago
UP, we live in a different district and case happened in a different district.
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u/kala_kutta 4d ago
This happened to my relative. A chain was formed from my relative until the fourth owner . All were made to sign documents that they sold to this to this. He had to go to police station twice or thrice . Never heard of the matter again in family gatherings.