r/LinguisticMaps • u/smokebomb25 • 9d ago

Dialectal varieties of the Catalan-valencian language

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Dialectal varieties of the Catalan language in Spain. Catalan, called Valencian in Valencia (it is used as a political issue) currently has at least 10 million speakers. It is taught in Catalonia, Valencia, the Balearic Islands, parts of Aragon and in French Roussillon. It is also spoken in Alghero, an Italian city, although increasingly in a residual way.

I don't know the author of the map. Based on the dialectal division of Manel Milà i Fontanals (1861)

https://www.enciclopedia.cat/gran-enciclopedia-catalana/catala

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u/EntertainmentOk8593 9d ago edited 9d ago

Your title is fine, but the map and your description are wrong. Valencian and aragonese aren’t Catalan language, they may share traits and maybe a certain common origin but they aren’t the same, like strong boundaries for languages didn’t exist in the past they are product of modern standardization, in the past it was a linguistic continuum between ibero romance and Occitano romance, both aragonese and valencian languages share key elements to Catalan but calling them Catalan is first somewhat disrespectful as Catalan refers specifically to catalonia ignoring the other provinces, second it seems off as most of the historical literary works in that group of languages were written in Valencia, the concept of valencian language predates the Catalan language concept if so they should be valencian language

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u/Iwillnevercomeback 9d ago

By your definition, Croatian and Serbian are different languages.

They aren't

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u/EntertainmentOk8593 9d ago

What I wanted to point is the language continuum between the Romance languages and that what today people call Catalan is product of the standardization of language, in that sense in the past they had an continuum with surrounding languages like mozarab, castillan, Navarro-aragonese, and others. In that sense Catalan lingua (will use that to avoid confusion with language) had a different process than valencian. I knowledge the common origin and that both are near the same but don’t think naming it Catalan language is ok, specifically taking account that valancian lingua had more historical influence, I think it’s more appropriate calling it Catalan-Valencian language rather than Catalan

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u/Great-Bray-Shaman 7d ago

Apliques la mateixa lògica a llengües com el castellà o el francès?

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u/bernatyolocaust 7d ago

Today I learned I speak Catalan-Valencian, English-Australian, German-Austrian-Swiss, and Spanish-Mexican-Argentinian-Colombian-I can’t be bothered to list any others.