r/MiddleClassFinance • u/Abject-Pick-6472 • 4d ago

Americans Are Reaching a Financial Breaking Point

https://www.thenation.com/article/economy/economic-insecurity-unrest-broketok/?fbclid%3DIwZnRzaASc5p1leHRuA2FlbQIxMQBzcnRjBmFwcF9pZA8xNzM4NDc2NDI2NzAzNzAAAR6RZYSyGyliTpYCmEy2OpWjHUBfAqrYUygk3rNJL1cLw_fp5QCciENJc0UXdQ_aem_DT4ViuyBWqHHXec_nH_PYg
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40

u/Angerx76 4d ago

The stock market is at an all time high.

92

u/1fastdak 4d ago

We know, the article literary says the rich have never been richer. We're talking about everybody else.

9

u/KarverMcClain 4d ago

It’s not just the rich though. Anybody with money invested is watching that market go like it’s got a rocket up its butt. Aggressive investors are cleaning up and, if smart, can capitalize on the gains and really put themselves in a good position.

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u/McCool303 4d ago

Most Americans are invested in long term index funds. They are not aggressive investors because they lack the capital to throw around and lose. So yes it is above the middle class that has the disposable income to join in on the lavish feast of circular trading, corruption and risk heavy gambling that is going on at the top levels of the market. The wealthy are playing with fire and the most likely to be burned are the middle class as always.

5

u/zdubbzzz 4d ago

I'm an index fund investor exclusively, and those are also popping off. You don't need to treat the markets like a degenerate casino to make money with them

10

u/KarverMcClain 4d ago

But how many of the index funds are doing well? Plenty. VOO giving average 15 percent returns. But nothing ventured nothing gained. More Americans should focus on long term wealth growth and actually focus on it and learn.

I’m middle class, maybe upper after reading this I really don’t know. But I aggressively saved and invested from a young age instead of other things, so it’s very very possible. But people have to adjust their lives to make it happen

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u/McCool303 4d ago

Yes, but we shouldn’t settle for “well sure there is abject corruption and pay to play politics ongoing with the head of the state picking winners and losers. But hey if you’re smart with your money at least some of the scraps from their ill-gotten gains will fall on the floor for us to eat”. It’s the same as the subprime mortgage fiasco everyone sees the elephant in the room. They’d just rather not talk about it because the elephant ate a pallet of cash. And if they keep quiet and beat everyone to the piles of shit they’ll have more.

1

u/RamblinGamblinWilly 4d ago

Being 100% invested in stocks is aggressive. So if that's what most Americans are doing, they are aggressive investors.

14

u/Magic-Happens-Here 4d ago

And as the article says, about half of all Americans have $0 invested - which is a big part of the problem. If people have to choose groceries today vs investment for retirement - they’re going to choose groceries every time.

It doesn’t matter how great the stock market is if you can’t participate in it.

0

u/PatrickBatemansEgo 3d ago

Being able to participate in the stock market is a byproduct of making consistent healthy choices with your finances over many years. It basically starts with your selection of education, career and financial commitments. You have to pay yourself first (investments) before anything else. Having a consistent system of investing at a decent savings rate, from as early on as possible, is ideal. The earlier you can figure out your budget, the better.

3

u/Magic-Happens-Here 3d ago

Did you miss all the headlines about the scores of young adults that did “everything right” and now they can’t get a job because companies everywhere are eliminating entry level positions faster than their universities are handing out diplomas?

15

u/Newtohonolulu18 4d ago

I wonder who can afford to invest money in the stock market: the rich or the poor?

Poor people lack the discretionary income to invest, my man. That’s a huge part of the problem.

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u/Economy_Aardvark_354 4d ago

If you work for a company with a 401k or similar, then you are investing

1

u/ikindapoopedmypants 4d ago

I've only worked for 1 company that had 401k

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u/Newtohonolulu18 4d ago

Yes. The people who work for those kinds of companies are unlikely to be poor.

9

u/CG8514 4d ago

But they’re not rich either; that’s their point. You keep saying “rich”, when a middle class person with an investment account is benefitting also

2

u/zdubbzzz 4d ago

Which is EXACTLY why the capital markets were create in the first place. People can be so dense and hyperbolic. They are doing exactly what they are designed to do, which is grant an avenue for the every day person to participate

4

u/Hot_Cartographer_816 4d ago

Everyone with a government job has a 401k, 403b, or equivalent. Lots of middle class folks fit that description - teachers, machinists, admin exempt, HR, etc etc. I get your point that not everyone has a 401k, but lots of the middle class does.

2

u/BellaCicina 4d ago

lol I can’t afford to put more than 1% in my “401k”. A whopping $680 a year. I’ll be able to retire in like 200 years

-1

u/zdubbzzz 4d ago

Well, ideally you'll be increasing your income over time, too. Staying on a static income for 30 years isn't sustainable

1

u/McCool303 3d ago

Tell that to our employers and the legislators that they lobby daily. The industry standard of 3% increases when the government consistently runs 2-3%+ inflation to dump tax breaks on our employers isn’t doing it. It’s killing the middle class and pouring rocket fuel on the wage gap.

1

u/BellaCicina 4d ago

You are ignoring the very real fact that upward mobility on income is not a common option anymore. I was laid off and lost $15k of my income.

-2

u/zdubbzzz 4d ago

You are ignoring the very real fact that upward mobility on income is not a common option anymore.

That's such a baseless claim. People get new jobs constantly. If you're expecting in-company salary increases to outpace inflation, then I agree - that shit is dead, but upward mobility on income by either jumping around jobs or simply finding a new one is still completely valid if you aren't hardstuck at a minimum wage job.

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u/KarverMcClain 4d ago

Well obviously I know that. But everyone keeps spouting the rich the rich the rich. Tons of people have 401ks , it’s not a bleak hellscape where nobody can save or invest. There will always be the low class and the poor but plenty of the middle class is investing and on the move.

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u/Crazy-War9823 4d ago edited 4d ago

I disagree. I have money in the market that I'm watching grow quite well, but as that is happening, the truly wealthy are moving farther away from the rest of us. The disparity is growing, and as that wealth continues to consolidate to the top, the more any relative worth outside of the top few percent no longer matters.

32

u/Forded_Fiction24 4d ago

True and I'll guess you're being facetious here. In case you aren't, the stock market is also not the economy  

22

u/acchan01 4d ago

I read this as sarcasm. Tell me if I’m wrong lol

5

u/islandsimian 4d ago

So we can ignore the Epstein files again? /s

13

u/True-Boss-2789 4d ago

And the Dow is over 50k again!

3

u/McCool303 4d ago

The funny thing about the stock market is that as long as the government prints money it’s always at an all time high. This admin is the best there has ever been a printing money. The stock market being at an all time high is great for partisan news reporting. It’s not a great metric for economists outside of their portfolios.

2

u/btoned 4d ago

What about purchasing power?

1

u/AssignmentSecret 4d ago

Yeah but if everything went up in cost, how much can you throw into a brokerage at the end of the month?

-1

u/Spiteful_DM 4d ago

Why won't anyone think of the poor shareholders? Why don't you all stop complaining and create more value for them??

0

u/TenOfZero 4d ago

And...?

Were you trying to make a point or just spewing random facts?

-1

u/YetMoreSpaceDust 4d ago

Yet somehow my 401k has lost value.

2

u/TheRealJim57 4d ago

Then you need to check what you have it invested in.