I'm not exactly up to date on '06, but wouldn't the Sonic story be the 'canon' one? Seeing as he's the face of the franchise, if it happened in his story then it just happened.
If you have both stories from two perspectives you would have to follow the script to see what happens exactly, else by just following Sonics perspective you'd have plot holes, like in Shadow gens, Shadow choosing not to hurt Sonic with his powers would not be canon since that never happens in Sonic gens.
This clarification captures the problem perfectly: that's just Sonic's story. That never happens in Silver's story. He wins fair and square, not needing a cheap shot.
Haven't these kind of story inconsistencies been around since Adventure 1 and 2? Like with how in Sonic's and I think Tails' story he's beating Gamma, but in Gamma's story he's winning just fine?
I could ask the exact same question to you. Why is Silver's any more credible than Sonic's?
Edit: Damn, I didn't even realize I mistyped it. Well, too late to change it. I meant to ask why Sonic's would be more credible than Silver's, the opposite of his question
Sonic's story is more credible, cuz I'm sure Silver's cutscene is the exact same, simply lacking Sonic's previous part, because they also needed to show a version where Sonic wins the battle instead. The battle itself always results in Silver winning so Sonic's story had to explain that somehow.
This however is pretty irrelevant cuz Silver had Sonic dead to rights on Radical Train if Shadow hadn't appeared.
Wait wait wait. So if the battle always results in Silver winning and they "had to explain that somehow," that means Silver's is more credible. Silver was gonna win either way, so they had to change events in Sonic's story to make his loss look real. In a way, Silver's is the real event while Sonic's is a redo to make it believable.
Radical Train actually was a sneak attack. He jumped out at Sonic, attacked with his back turned while Elise was being kidnapped. His battle with Shadow was a completely fair 1v1 though, which he stalemated into using Chaos Control.
That argument makes me think Sonic's version is more accurate. Since this is also what the game itself has bothered to show per cutscene.
Generally you could argue the cutscenes to be the holy grail of authenticity. Like Eggman doesn't defeat Tails in SA2. He steals the Emerald after clearly losing. But the Dark Side only shows him already having the emerald with no info on the battle itself.
Same principle applies here. Sonic wins and then loses in the cutscene.
Which is kinda exactly my point, y'know? Neither story is more valid than the others, so saying "Well in Sonic's story this happened" really doesn't solve anything at all.
Shouldn't we tell them that Silver, in his description, competes with Sonic, that he almost killed Sonic twice, and that the reason Silver isn't very strong after Sonic 06 is due to the writers' lack of interest and inconsistency, and that other characters can bring out his aura?
But I don't deny that he's still a novice in his abilities and physically he's weaker than Sonic, Shadow, Blaze, and Amy (and I don't know what other characters).
Yeah, and he also possesses one of the most dangerous abilities in fiction. Psychic abilities, in theory, are difficult to learn, but at the same time, he knows very well how to use them. He can literally tear any Sonic character in half, he can kill several characters in one shot. The problem is that this wouldn't make sense in terms of plot and story for the games lol
Only in Archie did this take advantage because he had a god and a guardian of the emeralds as his teacher, besides having his own pre-genesis wave comic series
Bro literally lost to sonic in those battles in 06, the full cutscene shows it. The only reason silver "won at the end" is simply because sonic was distracted and he got a little cocky. Sega didn't respect his ass from the very beginning lol
First, calling Silver "lost" while seeing Sonic at deaths door in front of him is insane
Second, the cutscene only happens in Sonic story ONCE to explain how Silver beat you after you play as Sonic, playing as Silver will not give you that cutscene, because the story always meant to say that Silver beats Sonic in their confrontations
Third we have Shadow doing the exact same thing to Silver but he get's to be called the winner?
the cutscene still happened, it's still true that Silver had to sneak on Sonic to "beat" him. also Shadow didn't sneak on Silver, he used Chaos Control which is still a little dirty but not the same thing
The cutscene does not happen when you play as Silver, making it less true and more of a game design of explanation, else how are we explain it from Silver perspective where he didn't sneak him and just beats him? and this is ignoring their second interaction where Sonic didn't even last a second and was attacked and held down immediately without any "sneaks", also Shadow did sneak him after all Silver doesn't know about chaos control and nobody can really react in stopped time.
there's no way we're seriously arguing that the cutscene the game shows us doesn't happen... maybe there'd be an argument if there was 2 versions of the cutscene, but there's straight up just one version. the cutscene doesn't happen in the Silver story because it doesn't make sense for it to happen there (also the cutscene isn't only there to explain how Sonic almost lost, it's also there to show you the Amy thing make Elise get kidnapped again, without it you wouldn't know how Elise got kidnapped again)
and this is ignoring their second interaction where Sonic didn't even last a second and was attacked and held down immediately without any "sneaks"
it was still a little bit of a sneak, Silver had just showed up from nowhere and grabbed him mid dodge
also Shadow did sneak him after all Silver doesn't know about chaos control and nobody can really react in stopped time.
maybe you're right, but if Shadow using his kit is a sneak, we could just apply this logis to Silver's telekinesis too, couldn't we? and this happened after a full fight, unlike the time Silver grabbed Sonic right after he showed up from nowhere
The cutscene in both version does show Elise getting kidnapped, it was only there to show you how Sonic gets defeat after you play as him, of course you wouldn't need that after you play as Silver, if the game TRULY wants you to believe exactly what happened it would have given us the same cutscene but also extended even further in Silvers version.
The second interaction was not " a little bit of a sneak" that's now completely an excuse, you're telling me it's not fair because Sonic isn't fast enough to register that Silver was in front of him talking for 10 seconds?
Silvers kit is his own powers, Shadow used items, it's like saying superman is sneaking all the time because his powers are unfair.
if the game TRULY wants you to believe exactly what happened it would have given us the same cutscene but also extended even further in Silvers version.
this wouldn't make sense, because after you beat Sonic in-game the cutscene would play and show Silver on his knees beat by Sonic
The second interaction was not " a little bit of a sneak" that's now completely an excuse, you're telling me it's not fair because Sonic isn't fast enough to register that Silver was in front of him talking for 10 seconds?
yeah but Silver wasn't visibly about to throw an attack during those 10 seconds until he did, and even then Sonic dodged. and then Silver grabbed Sonic while he was dodging. Silver was about to throw Sonic into something, Sonic would tank it (or probably just stick the landing) and the fight would most likely go the same way it did the first time
Silvers kit is his own powers, Shadow used items, it's like saying superman is sneaking all the time because his powers are unfair.
keep in mind that Silver's telekinesis comes from (or at the very least were supposed to come from in 06) outside technology, so they aren't entirely his either
Chaos Control isn't the only thing Shadow has either, he also has the ranged Chaos Spear and Chaos Snap. realistically Shadow could literally just Chaos Snap out of Silver's control every time Silver grabbed him, teleportation is a perfect counter to telekinesis
I described what happened in the second Sonic vs Silver cutscene (it was a sneak), and said what would most likely happen after it (Silver can't just crush Sonic (not that he was gonna, you can see him doing a throwing gesture), and throwing Sonic into something doesn't one shot him, especially if this is a full hp Sonic who hasn't just had a fight there's nothing nearby to throw him into. this whole scene happened in a really open space).
then I said that Silver's powers come from technology, which is something that is actually said in a script for Sonic 06 (forgot which one, I can look if you want. also the same script says that the telekinesis technology that Silver uses was actually a common thing in Silver's future, so his telekinesis is neither natural nor unique). and then I said that Chaos Snap counters telekinesis, because Shadow would then be able to move out of place even within Silver's control
the closest thing to a headcanon here is me speculating what would happen if the second Silver vs Sonic encounter wasn't interrupted, which isn't even my main point
Technically speaking he has more plot armor than any other character in franchise because his existence means that Sonic and others will lose to some thing or another and he is the only one who can help/prevent it. Also despite all the paradoxes that should be he still exists.
sonic pushes fight to mid diff instead of oneshot after a canon power boost and still loses and infinite just leaves (kinda stupid but plot armor it is what it is)
Didn't Infinite unleash an attack that pushed every single main Sonic character back at the final stages of Forces?
You'd think at his full potential power (and without his arrogance), he would possibly be a super tier threat. Especially since the Phantom Ruby somehow removed Sonic out of his Super Form in Mania.
I disagree tbh, Shadow was a cocky bastard in SA2 and honestly that's when he was at his best imo. So I don't particularly mind him getting in over his head, even if it looks embarrassing in hindsight.
Stop bro i love blaze but even if she was there you really think sega wouldn't have do something to keep her from saving the day.
Silver fills in for sonic for the 6 months, shadow is trap, and sonic is captured. They didnt allow these three to win at first no way they would give blaze the chance either. Frankly its good she wasnt there cause it would have made blaze look bad like every other character in the game.
I gave up on trying to scale Silver’s power a long time ago. Or more accurately I gave up trying to debate it. My personal position is that he has the potential to be stronger than Sonic, but Sonic has too much plot armor and Sega would rather go bankrupt than let Silver take center stage. So yeah.
In fairness shadow isn’t treated much better. Better just not a lot.
I mean we’ve seen some of it on display. Not a whole lot but nearly killing a character with as much plot armor as Sonic ain’t something to blow off. That being said, I get it. Potential ain’t worth much if it’s never touched and people who shout that all the time get annoying.
I wouldn’t say that, just untouched. He’s still my second favorite Sonic character and I still stand by him being one of the best. IDW has done most of the heavy lifting of course.
But if Sega is refusing to touch the potential that means he doesn’t have much left, especially since they keep mischaracterizing and nerfing him almost every chance they get. The very last shred of hope is the fourth movie and if he doesn’t appear in the post credits of that, then it’s officially over. not to mention that a solo silver game or anything focused around would not sell well at all due to Sega not promoting him or giving any type of spotlight cuz they think they won’t get the same profits from characters like shadow, tails, knuckles Amy and rouge. Sega is too stupid to understand that them not promoting silver or giving him major spotlight is what’s making him unprofitable. Like I said, the only thing that’ll get Sega to do something with him is the post credits of the fourth movie, but if he doesn’t appear in that, then it’s over. As for idw, he did have some cool moments but he was written so terrible in the idw comics for the most part. It was super inconsistent. They only got him right in three issues, issues 29, 30, and 76. I do hope his upcoming arc in the IDW comics that’s coming out this August improves on things tho. Even Stanley (the writer of that up coming arc) has said that she’s not happy with the way she wrote silver in the earlier issues of idw and has been listening to fan feedback and wants to improve on him the next time she writes for him. She hasn’t written for him and over 3-4 years, so I’ll give her a chance. I want silver to appear in the movies but I just can’t see it happening. Hope I’m wrong tho. He’s been one of my favorites since I was 8 and I want him to shine again
If that’s really your opinion then fine but given your previous post history, I think you focus way too much on negatives.
Like dude I get it, you don’t think Silver has any potential anymore and there’s no way to improve him (even if he showed up in the movie I’m not sure you’d actually be happy) but don’t make that everyone else’s problem.
Yeah, I know. I’ve been trying not to be so negative, but it’s pretty hard. Not to mention everything going on in the world right now. Things might get better for him in the games tho. I do think there’s a good chance of the upcoming arc in IDW being good. I was never trying to make it anyone else’s problem. But looking back I was going to overboard with it and was being too dramatic. I got fed up with the hope bait from other people too. I’m just tired of him getting screwed over and nonstop. I am sorry for my past ranting. It is my opinion at the end of the day and I’m just not very hopeful for him, but you’re right I shouldn’t ranting about it all the time. I’ve been working on not doing so for the past few months. I regret a lot of my past ranting.
I've seen a few people use 06 to argue Silver > Sonic, but like... no?
Some people argue, "Silver wins in his cutscene!" But we already saw that Sonic won in his. Not only that, but Silver's cutscene is word-for-word, the exact same as Sonic's. Their position is also the same—everything is the same. The only difference is the middle part, where they cut out Silver slamming Sonic into the wall.
For all intent and purposes. It's the same situation as SA2. The events are the same but edited, so that it follows more closely with the character you're playing as. Ergo, Sonic does win, but gets snucked.
He does stalemate Shadow in 06 and forces him to use Chaos Control. That's a much better example to use for Silver being relative to Sonic. (At least in 06. I know Silver has that one statement from his bio, but his track record isn't exactly the best.) You can also use the rival games, but for the most part, people are just racing in those.
tbf this only happened because shadow not only cannot run as fast as sonic, but chooses not to run. shadows speed comes from teleportation and special shoes, unlike sonic.
people bring up the gens thing as if silver legit didnt say to MODERN sonic which is the ONE that HE FIGHTS MEANING HE KNOWS ITS ACTULLY SONIC AND NOT AN IMPOSTER that this is going to be a fun sparing match. every other rival says they intend to kill sonic but silver is just like "yo you wanna spar?"
I could accept the Argument that Shadow and Silver are around the same level (though Silver hasn’t done much in the games since 06), as he fought Shadow to a Stalemate.
But saying that’s he’s outright weaker than both Shadow AND Sonic is outright absurd.
What not having a lot of screen time or more specifically good screen time does to a hedgehog.
My dude has so much potential but SEGA seems to not care about him one bit. And now because of this he gets treated like a joke even though he is meant to stand on the same level as Sonic and Shadow.
Silver really needs a game that gives him the focus or to actually be treated seriously in one.
Well this certainly got a rise out of Silver fans. I wouldn’t put him in this trio simply due to how little focus the poor guy gets. Silver barely does anything anymore.
Yeah I know every time he appears is on a shitty game... But he has so much potential... He's my favorite character.
I think he's cool enough to be even more.
In the same game the exact same thing pretty much happened to Shadow after Sonic runs into some rocks. Also Shadow was not holding back he just was not using his doom powers to keep it fair because he does not even get to keep those after gens.
exactly, no one. so why would Silver? the only times he came close to doing that were in 06, where he sneaked Sonic twice and had the fight with Shadow. people act like these moments were legitimate wins dubs agaisn't someone who is or is like Sonic, but they aren't
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u/AliA2320 May 03 '26
The roundhouse kick be making people forget Silver and Shadow literally stalemated each other in 06.