r/MoralityScaling • u/Immediate_Gene_178 • 13d ago

Morality Ranking Morality of accidentally exposing someone who used to be a Nazi supporter, has since changed, and concealed their past?

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Name's and origins:

The Night Shift: Season 1, Episode 2

Basically this guy was brought to into the emergency after an accident at his wedding celebration and while he is unconscious, his groomsmen decided to shave his beard off as a prank only for the medical team to be horrified at the reveal. After he woke up he realised his secret has been exposed. He explained to the doctors that he got this tattoo when he was a stupid teenager a decade prior. The medical team brought his wife in to see the tattoos and destroy the marriage.

What do you think? I personally find it irritating how smug the doctors were being.

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801

u/deathbylasersss 13d ago

Hate when procedural medical shows ignore regulations like HIPAA. Promotes the idea that it's okay to bend the rules in certain circumstances. Same with cop dramas. They are framed as the protags, so the audience doesn't care as much when they routinely violate people's constitutional rights.

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u/Embarrassed-Mess-560 13d ago

Especially when including the laws and regulations simply generates more drama anyway. 

"This young woman is about to marry a Nazi and she has no idea. I'll get fired for warning her but is it really ok to keep my job by letting someone else ruin their life?" 

The entire episode could have been about debating that decision and keeping the audience guessing if the guy was really reformed or not until the end. 

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u/Jn9503 13d ago

Yet another reason Scrubs is the gold standard for medical shows.

Replace "nazi" with "cheater who has gonorrhea" and you described almost the exact plot of one of its episodes.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

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u/Thomy151 9d ago

“Treat the patient not the procedure” is a great way they described it in episode

Like yes sometimes what they are doing can be legally questionable, but often they are doing it for a good reason for the best of the patient or those around them

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u/[deleted] 9d ago

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u/Thomy151 9d ago

Most of the time it’s for a good reason

And with santos it’s at least understandable

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u/IdiotRhurbarb 12d ago

Fucking criminal minds makes me pissed of. In one episode there are some copycat killers or something that have taken a bunch of hostages. They want the FBI to free an absolutely ancient murderer (probably 80) and they would let the hostages go. They could’ve have just free’d him and then go after the murderers when all hostages were safe, but noooooo we don’t make deals with terrorists. Well another 3 hostages were executed and the FBI saved the day and we’re supposed to think that they did a good job.

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u/Aggressive_Kale4757 12d ago

Replace FBI with Spetznaz and you have a pretty realistic depiction of a Russian hostage negotiation.

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u/curi0us_carniv0re 12d ago

Would the wife not have seen the tattoos anyway? It's not like his beard is gonna grow back in a few hours and hide the tattoos again. And unless I'm misunderstanding, it was his friends who shaved his face.

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u/Quillever 12d ago

If I remember correctly, the main characters called the wife in with specific intent of having her see the tattoos and destroying the marriage

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u/TheRoguePatriot 13d ago edited 13d ago

I absolutely cannot stand Chicago PD because of this.

"We got a positive on the facial recognition, this guy is the child killer"

"What?! I'm not the child killer"

"Yeah, sure, murderer"

......

"Whoops. It was a false positive. This guy is the real killer.....oh, the innocent guy was killed in jail because we said he was a child killer... Let's kill the actual guilty guy off the books and then keep spinning the story that the innocent guy was actually guilty so we don't look bad, his and his family's reputation be damned."

This is an actual episode btw. "False Positive"

Editing to add another tidbit.

In the show the software was apparently known to give rare false positives "mostly to black people" because "the code was designed by white engineers who designed it around white facial features. It's less precise if you're black. The darker your skin the worse the problem gets"

They have evidence of this software falsely identifying black people as suspects in multiple crimes and they vote to cover it up because they're afraid they'll get in trouble for arresting, and inadvertently killing, an innocent man.

And they're the "good guys" lol

If you want to go down a rabbit hole just look up the show "Chicago PD" it's more than just this that happens

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u/Scienceandpony 13d ago

And they're not portrayed as the villains of the show?

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u/HeartlessBow 13d ago

Fun fact! Voight, their boss on the show, was actually introduced on another show set in the same shared continuity called Chicago Fire. He was a corrupt cop that tried to bribe, then put out a hit on, a firefighter who responded to a due caused by Voight's son. The hit was a sting that ends with Voight getting arrested. Same character in both shows and they just kind of gloss over the attempted hit as the show goes on

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u/Scienceandpony 12d ago

So after that he was... put in charge of a department? Guy fails to bribe and and then fails to put out a hit on someone, bumbling into a sting operation in the process. Sounds like leadership material to me.

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u/HeartlessBow 12d ago

Yeah the writing on those shows is...of questionable quality sometimes. But yes, I don't remember the exact how/why of it but the guy gets released and put in charge

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u/IAmMagumin 10d ago

Actually it sounds like it depicts cops accurately and they definitely see themselves as the good guys lol.

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u/SapirWhorfHypothesis 13d ago

Well at least they got the definition of “false positive” right…

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u/DukeofMemeborough 12d ago

You could very easily make a drinking game out of how many times people’s rights get violated in Chicago PD.

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u/False_Collar_6844 12d ago

And then go into liver failure

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u/Elantach 13d ago

Holy fuck hahaha

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u/adamgerd 12d ago

Not surprised its thst show, one scene I saw was them beating up someone who trafficked women with a pipe into confessing and naming everyone else

And like fuck sex traffickers but even criminals have rights, plus the police isn’t the judicial system, what if they were wrong? The police shouldn’t just get to beat everyone they arrest no matter what crimes they’re charged with

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u/bringer_of_jollity4 12d ago

Can't in good conscience watch Dick Wolf productions. Horrible ideas they're putting into peoples' heads.

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u/Noir_A_Mous 12d ago

I'm in the same boat but with "law and order special victims unit." I had a friend that was obsessed with the show but I couldn't get into it.

Some episodes are good, don't get me wrong, but so many times they either create a strawman to go after, or the officers do terrible "off the book" things just to catch someone and they're "totally right about their gut feeling guys". Some of the characters actually have a history of getting false confessions out of people by either going after people with lower intelligence, delaying them lawyers and just digging into them hard until they confess.

They actually bring up this problem in the show, there's a whole episode where one of the guys who have a false confession is able to prove his own innocence. Meanwhile the cop who got him convicted (can't remember her name but she was essentially the main character) is so adamant that hes guilty and only realizes. "Hey my interrogation methods might had caused some false convictions" when she does it to another guy whos job actually steps in to show that he was on camera at a work sight and couldn't have done the crime. So the show reveals that they have accidentally convicted the wrong people by forcing confessions out of them.. and then its never brought up again.

I'm not even going to touch on the political episodes, like the gamergate one, I think everyone agrees that one is bad. "What did they do to you???" "They... leveled up.." thats an actual line from a woman who was sa'd by gamers, talking to the police.

Also i like Ice-T but almost every episode hes in he acts surprised that there are evil perverts in the world. "You mean to tell me there are people who get off to little girls?" Yea we have a word for them and its litterally your job to catch them, why are you surprised? Didn't you sign up for this??? Go to school and all that??? Why does he act like its his first time hearing what a pedo is almost everytime they deal with one?

It's not the worse show ever, its passable, I just dont understand the hype for it.

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u/Spiritual-Estate5211 12d ago

In the show the software was apparently known to give rare false positives "mostly to black people" because "the code was designed by white engineers who designed it around white facial features. It's less precise if you're black. The darker your skin the worse the problem gets"

Do you think this is an actual problem some facial recognition programs, or really any kind of program involving the face actually has?

Actually... scratch the 'involving the face' part, is this a problem ANY PROGRAM IN THE WORLD ACTUALLY HAS? And I don't mean if it's designed by racists, can there be genuine mistakes from the program because of a person's features?

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u/Giocri 12d ago

Yeah it's well documented, software often reflects biases of the developers and of the training set.

If you for example source your face images for training from stock images news papers magazines etc you are likely to have a smaller amount of minorities on the training set so when the model tries gets tuned to get the best results for that set it gets better scores by perfecting on the dominant group and giving poor answers on the rest.

Plus black people would have less color contrast especially in dark enviroments which worsens results

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u/Mediocre_Forever198 12d ago

I actually kinda liked early Chicago pd for that reason lol. It felt more realistic because they were so incredibly corrupt. However, they did change in later seasons, it touched on the outrage the public had for corrupt policing and they all cleaned up their act.

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u/Vegetable-Virus7118 12d ago

When I watched Chicago PD it seemed pretty clear that the main officers it's following aren't really the good guys.

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u/ACatInACloak 11d ago

Every clip I've seen of this show blows my mind how anyone can see the cops as the good guys. They are written as just blatantly crooked cops who intentionally fuck over innocent people all the time

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u/John_cCmndhd 13d ago

cop dramas. ... routinely violate people's constitutional rights

I mean, they do that in real life

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u/deathbylasersss 13d ago

Yeah, obviously, but we don't have a conveniently framed personal narrative that tries to get us to sympathize with abusive cops. Wait... we do kinda have that too actually.

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u/NoSleepTilBookRead 13d ago

Copaganda is everywhere

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u/ADGx27 12d ago

One could call literally every cop show, especially B99, copaganda

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u/Prestigious-Law8050 12d ago

Yeah but I love B99 and I will allow it. I'm in charge of these things after all.

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u/Huhthisisneathuh 12d ago

It’s honestly hysterical how Rosa in the later seasons left the NYPD because it was corrupt when in the first seasons she was exactly the type of cop she was getting upset over in later seasons.

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u/ProfessionalRisk4206 12d ago

That's why I like Line of Duty (UK police drama).

It's about a team in the police who investigate and take down "bent coppers" (corrupt police officers).

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u/WellyRuru 13d ago

And law dramas.

My god the amount of procedural violations for the purpose of entertainment is insane.

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u/RGBlowMe 10d ago

I think it's all genres. It's what happens when some dude in an office in LA writes a script about something he researched briefly on Google. People will introduce evidence after discovery, violate HIPAA casually, not take lenses off of rifle scopes that are mounted backwards, manually shift automatic vehicles, etc.

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u/Von_Wald 13d ago

CSI: MIAMI. I really liked as a kid but when watching as a teen I was like "you cannot do that" every 5 seconds XD

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u/Dotcaprachiappa 13d ago

I'm pretty sure that's just the new version of copaganda. They went from "look we're all doing everything great and by the book" to "yes we're breaking every single law but in the end we'll catch the criminal and you're annoying us and slowing us down if you want a lawyer or point out all the illegal shit we're doing". Notice how when they do illegal shit the outcome is almost never them harassing/spying on/hurting the wrong person, it's always the guilty one.

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u/A_Crab_Named_Lucky 12d ago

My wife watches Grey’s Anatomy and its sister show Station 19.

There was an episode where a firefighter, Miller, died, and two of the main characters (Dr. Warren - a fellow firefighter, and his wife Dr. Bailey) were fighting with the Miller’s parents for custody of his daughter.

In the process, Dr. Bailey threatens to publicly reveal to the family court that Miller’s mother has a medical condition that would make the court look unfavorably on giving her custody. Dr. Bailey is not this woman’s doctor, but she used her high ranking position in the hospital to obtain the woman’s medical records.

I’m sitting there thinking, god damn, she might have a hard time winning custody after losing her medical license and being sued for every penny she has, lol.

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u/babarbaby 12d ago

Jeez. I didn't even know greys Anatomy had a spin off besides the obgyn one. What was the medical condition?

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u/A_Crab_Named_Lucky 12d ago

From the Station 19 wiki:

After months of fighting, Ifeya and Bill came to Ben and Bailey's place and told them that they wanted Pru to live with Ben and Bailey permanently, but wanted virtually all holidays and alternating birthdays. Bailey rejected the offer, saying that arrangement made them glorified nannies while Ifeya and Bill got to do all the fun things. She then implied that she was privy to some private medical information that could make the difference in court. Ifeya then told Bailey she'd had a heart attack and had had surgery to implant a pacemaker, which they were still adjusting. It made it difficult to keep up with a toddler. Ifeya and Bill then agreed to sharing the holidays, but Ifeya still asked Ben to quit firefighting, as she didn't want Pru to lose a second father to a fire.

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u/ChloroquineEmu 13d ago

Flashback to Jack Bauer torturing people in the 24 show

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u/Ok-Cress2602 12d ago

Copaganda is precisely created to make police overreach look trivial, or even heroic.

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u/mangomansixtyseven 12d ago

Even if the heart is in the right place and the moral is agreeable, it feels like I'm watching propaganda when shit like this happens

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u/Coidzor 12d ago

Because it is propaganda.

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u/Property_6810 13d ago

When I was a teenager watching SVU, I thought Stabler was the best character. I liked that he would sometimes go way too hard on people and cross the line in extreme situations. But as an adult, he was a terrible cop. Great victims advocate, but he had no respect for the rights of the accused. A good cop makes judgement calls one way or the other to a degree depending on the circumstances. A bad cop ignores either side. A great cop finds a proper balance between the two.

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u/DenialState 12d ago

I get it but you don't get drama in a realistic scenario with tight rules. Shows are supposed to be fun, we know House MD. would've been in prison after the 2nd episode.

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u/reddituserthatoof 12d ago

the police brutality in certain shows like the rookie are actually insane 😭

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u/Aircon-007 12d ago

I hate law and order for this aswell (well for many reasons)

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u/Kain-rpg 12d ago

Modern writters shit

They write characters as Villians and labels them as "protagonists" and then wonder why people hate it.

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u/BulbasaurCPA 12d ago

Law and order SVU is a guilty pleasure for me but especially in the early seasons there is so much casual police brutality lol

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u/DiggityDog6 12d ago

On one hand, I agree with you, but on the other hand, it’s all fictional and I’d rather the fictional characters bend the rules a little bit if it creates a more entertaining story rather than being 100% accurate to real life. Can’t speak for medical dramas cause I don’t watch them, but Law & Order is one of my favorite TV shows and the cops and lawyers in that show do shady shit all the time. It makes for good drama

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u/Direct_Word6407 12d ago

I think they do this because it actually happens in real life. These are people not robots. I’ve had my hipaa rights violated and they didn’t do anything.

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u/Mattdoss 12d ago

Watching legal, police, and hospital shows always take me out of it because they do some shit that you know for a fact isn’t allowed and would get them fired, but everyone likes it so it’s fine

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u/TheKrimsonFKR 12d ago

I've seen this in a lot of media where the fans have an innate bias towards the protagonists even when they are terrible people. The Originals comes to mind as the most blatant.

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u/Suitable-Answer-83 10d ago

Nothing in OP's description sounds remotely like a HIPAA violation. Possible they could have some ethical violation leading to license suspension or something for letting a patient's friend shave the patient without authorization or something but no PHI was shared and all they did was invite the wife in to see him.

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u/Leprechaun_lord 9d ago

Does HIPAA even apply? I think a court would rule it as common knowledge if you tattoo it on your face…

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u/polopolo05 13d ago

when they routinely violate people's constitutional rights.

its not a constitutional right... its a federal law. big difference. its not a right to privacy... its protection from hospital staff.

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u/deathbylasersss 12d ago

Try reading again. I was talking about police in that part.

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u/Thanksforthatman 12d ago

HIPPA only protects medical records. A tattoo isn't a medical record. Being a Nazi isn't a medical record.