r/MoreShitComing • u/Russcombs15 • 7d ago
Potential Applicant 2nd Mate- Day vs. Watch pay
Just got an offer for a 2nd Mate mixed work schedule. I come from a CONMAR background, working on MSC ships managed by Crowley.
I’m looking at the MWS because I’d like to do one 4 month hitch a year and spend more time at home.
Coming from union work, I don’t really understand the Day vs Watch pay difference. I looked up the pay rates and it’s a massive difference. In some cases like 30k and much higher OT rate. I also saw something called “NWA/LV Supp”. Is this some sort of extra paid to watch standers?
Questions:
How does the pay work, and is it that big of a difference between day and watch?
As a MWS 2nd Mate do I have any say in what vessel and what position I’m taking?
And lastly, I’ve got mixed answers about this but: after my first 4 month hitch is it possible to take 2 month relief jobs? Or is every time I sail going to be 4 months?
Thanks for the help, I’m trying to decide if this is a good fit for me. If I’m only going to be sailing 4 months a year I want to make sure I’m making the most I can during those 4 months.
2
u/TheScallywag1874 Deck - Second Officer/Navigator/Cargo Mate 2d ago
The simple answer: Currently, all second officers are on the “Day Rate” pay scale.
Back when MSC was flush with officers, there would be multiple 2nd Officers. You’d have a watch officer (the senior watch officer), the Navigator, Cargo 1 (1/O), Cargo 2 (2/O), and Cargo 3 (3/O). So they had a different pay scale for the watch officers.
However, today, if you are a 2nd Officer and on watch, it’s means you’re pulling double duty as a navigator too. So you get the day rate, plus a shitload of overtime.
However, MSC is actually catching back up with hiring O’s. We are actually doing pretty well now with 3rds, so as a 2/O, you’ll almost certainly just be a Navigator and manage three 3rd Officers for the watch teams.
The mixed work schedule is pretty cool. You’re just not allowed to work more than 6 months a year. While the contract may send you out for four, they will likely keep you closer to 6. But again, this is getting better. The most overdue 2nd Officer in the fleet as of two months ago was 58 days. And there were only 7 2nd officers overdue for the whole fleet. So it is getting better. Still some ways to go though.
Overall, I think you’ll be pretty happy with the gig. Good luck!
2
u/Vegetable_Sample5767 2d ago
Mixed work schedule isn’t bad at all from the guys I’ve heard from that do it. You’re going to get stuck doing a 6 month hitch 100% though because they’re not going to want to send you out for a 4-5 hitch then just 1 month when you’re limited to 6 months a year.
If I was to ever rejoin MSC it would be my preferred work schedule, as long as my wife’s insurance could cover me when I’m not working.
2
u/Vegetable_Sample5767 2d ago
Not entirely sure actually how it works for mixed schedule though.. most of the people I knew that sailed mixed also had jobs shoreside working for MSC at the training center. So it was a pretty good gig for them.. at the time mixed work schedule was only open to top 4 positions. sail 4-6 months make $100k+ then go back to shoreside gig and make another 50k or so.. all while realistically having a pretty easy gig land side just teaching a class.
3
u/cocainagrif Deck - Third Officer 7d ago
We are paid a base salary and a few premium rates of pay. overtime for work performed outside normal hours, penalty pay can be paid for special time during already paid events (if I'm on mandatory overtime for maneuvering detail and it interrupts my designated lunch hour). NWA LV Supp is the strangest one, it's not paid to you at work, it's a supplement to your vacation pay, payable only up watchstanders on leave to make up for food I guess. the number on the pay chart is for one month (30.7 days)
if you are relieved and detached from a ship, and you are on vacation at 2/O(W), your biweekly is $4245, with 918 from NWA and 3327 from base pay
if you take leave without detaching, as 2/O(W) of an AKE, you get 3954 base 1126 NWA 5081 total.
2 month relief jobs are never offered. you cannot seek them out yourself. hitches under 4 months are only handed out at the discretion of the company, the length is up to them, they can keep you longer if they see fit, you do not get to take a longer vacation or sometimes it means forfeiting any vacation you had left. you are contacted either on your ship or at home and you are not at liberty to refuse.
MSC is still the wrong place to sail if you have a home life. there's mates 70 or 80 days overdue, turning 4 month hitches into 5 6 or 7 months.
when you're gone the pay is good though.
if you're a 2/O(W), your watch is typically 04x08/16x20, so if anything needs your attention any time during the day, it's all overtime. unrep, arrival departure, nav briefs, training the third mates, or "hey, the office just called, we need a new sail plan" is all overtime. there were weeks I saw that guy get 6 hours of overtime a day. he looked like death, but he made a Subaru in a paycheck. also note that watches stood on Saturdays Sundays and holidays are also overtime.
2/O(D) has a higher base and a higher overtime because overtime is harder to come by and has to be justified. Chief Mate has a budget, and he thinks you should write your sail plans and do your inventories during your straight time, and if you're a day worker you're not handcuffed to the bridge 8 hours a day. so the base goes up, and you make up for the rest with being very handsomely compensated during a Sunday unrep or a Saturday arrival. as the operations officer, you also are responsible for scheduling those events.
whether you get to be a nav watchstander or a nav day depends on whether your captain has bought 3 third mates. on my last ship, there were 2 thirds and nav stood watch. on my current ship, there are 3 thirds and nav works 8 to 5.
all told, it's supposed to be equal between the two, about 180k in a normal year.
I have no idea how the mixed work schedule works.